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Game Of Thrones Has Truly Stopped Making Sense

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Spoilers for Game of Thrones Season 7, Episode 6, "Beyond the Wall," below

Things are not working out for our heroes on Game of Thrones, as Season 7, Episode 6, "Beyond the Wall," saw Jon, Dany, Sansa, and Arya all in precarious positions, teetering on the brink of total failure and major losses. It's just too bad so much of it barely makes sense.

The show has had trouble getting the details of timing, place, and motivations right ever since its first forays beyond the books on which it used to be based. Remember when Jon took on the mutineers at Craster's keep back in season 4, and not one person present mentioned that they'd recently had three children and a simple giant as house guests? That event, which had no analog in the source material, was the first of Game of Thrones' many major logical missteps. And it just peaked in "Beyond the Wall."

Forget, for a second, the absurdly convenient series of coincidences that somehow brought Jon Snow, Gendry, Jorah Mormont, the Hound, Beric Dondarrion, Thoros, and Davos together for one glorious suicide mission. The real problem is that their quest makes no sense, which they would have realized if the show had time for them to actually stop and think about anything.

Sure, it's easy to say in the bloody aftermath: Dany just lost a dragon, a devastating blow to the forces of life, and for what? So Jon could capture a wight and bring it King's Landing, to get Cersei on their side? But they should have realized even in the thick of it: There's truly no universe in which Cersei would ever team up with her Targaryen and Stark enemies.

Facts and evidence have no effect on Cersei's actions or positions. If she's going to remain at all consistent as a character, she'll come up with some justification for dismissing what's before her eyes, should the captured wight ever actually reach her. The plan was hopeless to begin with, as several of those involved--chiefly Tyrion--should have been prescient enough to realize.

The second massive problem: There are no rules to what makes you a wight, and the plot is suffering because of it. Is it dying beyond the wall that turns you into a frosty soldier? Do you have to get stabbed or bit by an existing ice zombie? Why do they need to find the actual forces of the dead to capture one of them, when Jon, at the very least, is aware that corpses in the North tend to turn on their own (which is why he burns Thoros's body)? Sure, it would have been out of character for him to coldly kill a guy ten feet past the wall to find out, but what about whoever got owned by that zombie bear? They could have turned around right then and avoided this whole travesty, if anyone (characters or the show's writers) was using their brains.

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That's not even getting into the minute-to-minute details this week. Why on earth did they undertake the journey north on foot, instead of horseback (besides the show's already strained budget)? Why did the Night's King let them sit on that rocky island for so long without even trying to send his extremely expendable forces across? If the narrative excuse is he was using them as bait, how could he possibly know that they had any connection with the dragon queen, or that she'd foolishly try to rescue them?

Just how long were they sitting there, anyway? Game of Thrones has become unbelievably sloppy with distances and timing, but the usual excuse of "they're just not showing the travel on-screen" really doesn't hold up here. Exact numbers don't exist, but there are easily thousands of miles between Dragonstone and the Wall, not to mention the distance the group might have traveled north of that. For Jon and co. to even reach Eastwatch should have taken far longer than this current war would allow, making the entire plan unworkable to begin with. Then for Gendry to jog back to the Wall, have a raven sent to Dany, and have Dany fly all the way back should have rightly taken weeks. Instead it all seems to happen in the space of a single day, or at most a few, which is simply complete and total nonsense.

More questions: Why did the Night's King throw his magic ice javelin at the dragon in the air, instead of the one right in front of him, which also had Dany on its back? Afterward, why didn't Dany turn Drogon around and roast his freezer-bitten butt, instead of letting him ready a second spear? How many times can Jon be rescued by convenient and predictable deus ex machina, a thing the show has relied on more and more in recent seasons, and what the heck was Benjen doing there at all? How was Jon able to drag himself up out of freezing water, onto ice, while wearing layers and pounds of water-soaked fur? Most importantly, why didn't Jon just get on the dang dragon when they told him to?

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Elsewhere, why exactly is Arya so mad at Sansa? What has Bran been doing this whole time? Where is Ghost, or Theon? Why did Sansa send Brienne far away after being specifically advised to keep her close? There are discussions to be had and theories to debate about the characters' rationales and reasonings, but Game of Thrones, in its penultimate season, no longer has the time or the inclination to care about these details. The series that used to spend episodes and seasons laying groundwork for big pay-offs is now only interested in the latter, and it's suffering for it.

Without the A Song of Ice and Fire books on which to lean, Game of Thrones the show has trouble standing up under its own weight. It's flashy and full of fan service, and viewers (myself included) love it for that. Who among us doesn't, deep down, enjoy watching these plot threads finally, finally coalesce and resolve? It's all happening, from Jon and Dany's romance to the Starks' family reunion. It's just not making a whole lot of sense in the process, especially as Season 7 rockets toward its finale. And although it's painful to admit, Game of Thrones the show has proved a poor replacement for the thoughtfully crafted, exquisitely plotted, and painstakingly detailed books that have yet to be completed.

As always, George R.R. Martin can't write quickly enough. I'm eager to get back to the real thing.

Got a news tip or want to contact us directly? Email news@gamespot.com


mrougeau

Michael Rougeau

Mike Rougeau is GameSpot's Managing Editor of Entertainment, with over 10 years of pop culture journalism experience. He lives in Los Angeles with his wife and two dogs.

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Louis

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Edited By Louis

I don't believe any move or TV show would stand up to this scrutiny. But yes, as fans it's fun to over-analyze and want it to all work.

But the writers need to aim for the broad strokes. Being completely logical is boring, plus people don't work that way. In a sitcom, how come they are all so funny all the time, don't they have jobs to go to, who can hang around with friends that much...? ;-)

If these shows were closer to reality they'd be boring like our lives. Ha. Anyways, having said that, there is a limit to my suspension of disbelief, if it's really off the show won't work for me. In the case of GOT, I have no issue with it. It's good enough for me to love it. I thought this finale episode was excellent and a wonderful setup for the last season.

Now I just need to focus on staying healthy so I can live that long to watch it...

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shinycorey

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It's so funny because almost everything this article suggested problems with in its last three paragraphs were just about all proven wrong and all a product of narrow thinking by the finale episode ?

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NorthernDruid

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The entire treck beyond the wall felt like filler to me.

Like, the idea of showing Cersei a wight is an ok one. But the spectacle around it was incredibly silly. Also Jon should under no circumstances have been allowed to go on something so suicidically dangerous.

Such a really awful plan, sending the 2nd in command to the middle of the enemy main stronghold to see if sending the 1st in command of your allies on a suicide mission can potentially pan out to result in negotiations. And then hope that said negotiations doesn't just end up as a stupid trap.

To stop a war that you could win in the time it would take you to do all of this back-and-forth travelling of long distances.

Any sort of truce just gives the enemy the advantage, gives them time to build more anti-dragon siege equipment, gives them time to rebuild their armies, gives them time to scheme and plot.

And plot-wise, the real purpose was to have an episode with a crew of badasses fighting an undead horde and to have the dragon turned to create tension.

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the-games-masta

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Hey gamespot, this article demonstrates quite nicely why you should stop writing articles about TV/ movies - you suck at it.

Stick to games, yeah?

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Quidium

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I find most of your editorial weak and feel you need to be awarded your omnipotent participation trophy.

Your argument to the second massive problem – rules of a wight. You argue that there is plot problems. Name a character that would know the answer to your question. Find the ancient “rule book” in Old Town. The characters do not know and that is why there is no answer. It is not a plot hole. It is an unknown that drives the plot and drives conflict within the story and characters. Not knowing does not mean they cannot exist. Explain to me Jon can be resurrected or how the Bran can do what he does as the Three-Eyed Crow. Explain how Arya can change her face and voice. Magic…

You argue that they burn Thoros and not the wildlings killed by the polar bear. Did Star Trek have a funeral for every crew member in a red shirt? No, but they did for Spock. An un-named character does not require the effort, time, or expense.

You bring up the timeline and start with “Just how long were they sitting there, anyway?” Originally watching the episode I figured a day past while surrounded by the army of the dead. Gendry only had a few miles to go. The group only marched for one or two days north of the wall. They are rather close to Eastwatch. It could be ran by Gentry within the “timeline” of the episode. Ever hear of a place in Greece called Marathon?

A raven is sent to Dany. Here I do agree that a raven would have taken, at most, a few days. It is about 1800 miles from Eastwatch to Dragonstone by the way the crow flies. According to Pigeon Control Resource Centre, pigeons have been recorded to fly as far as 600-700 miles in a day. Game of Thrones director Alan Taylor is not worried about raven flight issue either. We can hypothesize that a raven in GOT is stronger, special, faster, smarter, and can fly the distance faster than a pigeon would. It may also have magical attributes. I would like to add that the raven may have never gotten to Dany. Her puppy eyed heart for Jon Snow the last two episodes has established that she has feelings for him and are verified when he wakes up on the ship when they embrace and she tears up. Dany’s gut feeling was they were in danger and she chose to go help regardless of a raven from Eastwatch. She has character motivation to impulsively go aid Jon Snow even without a raven message.

The question is asked about why throw the javelin at Viserion and not Drogon. Watch the seen unfold and notice Viserion’s flight as the Night King stops. Viserion has turned his flight path directly to and above the Night King. Viserion presents a target of opportunity (Not to mention that George R.R. Martin would kill “Red Wedding” Dany, Drogon, Jon, and company). Dany does not turn Drogon. She is in shock about Viserion and concerned about Jon. The Night King is too far for a blast of fire for Drogon. Drogon could also be in pain over the death of Viserion. I like to think that the dragons are indeed self-aware creatures like humans.

Jon falls into the water and sinks. Does he drown? It may have drowned. Jon Snow and Dondarrion are the only two people have come back to life by the Lord of Light. Dondarrion has been revived six times. Jon either held his breath or drowned. If he held his breath he swam up and if he drowned, I argue the Lord of Light revived him and he got out of the water. If revived, it also helps explain that time may have pasted in the timeline. Watch the eyes of Longclaw when he surfaces. They go blue for a moment.

Benjen is the easiest to explain. Benjen is a direct servant to the three-eyed crow. Bran sent Benjen to be in a place ready to aid Jon long before the battle even started.

If you do not know why Arya and Sansa are arguing then it is evidence that you do not understand Game of Thrones. Arya is loyal to Jon. Sansa wants to be queen. Littlefinger is manipulating both of them. Sansa goes to Littlefinger for help. Sansa is afraid of the north turning against her. Etc. Etc. Etc.

Six books and hundreds of storylines and characters. Only so much can be placed into a TV episode. I would hate to see your review of Star Wars Ep. 7 and the questions not answered in that movie.

I can see it now. The preview for the season finale has everyone at one location… and it is the “next day!”

Alan Taylor Interview - http://time.com/4910483/game-of-thrones-timeline-ravens/

Pigeons - http://www.pigeoncontrolresourcecentre.org/html/about-pigeons.html#about1

GOT Map - http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--1iVkwJ4D--/18zjr1or4tg9wjpg.jpg

Distances for major locations in GOT pdf - https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KAqa9wwODqaFkegqf8Si6fmuE55-M-GMIj0ZmcKUFxs/edit

3 • 
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ibonedyourmom

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Edited By ibonedyourmom

@Quidium: Pretty sure most of the books were shorter than your post.

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Quidium

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@ibonedyourmom: LOL. That made my day. Yeah, I got fired up a little and purged. It happens when everyone I work with is a season behind and I can't talk about the current one. I am happy for the sense of humor. Cheers.

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the-games-masta

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@Quidium: woah

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CatAtomic999

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Yeah, the show has devolved into shallow TV melodrama at this point. Go back and watch season 1 and you'll be blown away by how thin and cheesy this current season seems.

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zintura

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The author makes deliberate twists in the story and try to connect it with the loose scenes from the past episodes making the audience look stupid when they cry out loud "Oh my god how could this happen" specially when they say "i could never have imagined that" LOL!. Nothing impressive seriously.

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Millionsedge

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My thought was that Brandon Stark sent the word to Dany. It's the only thing that can make the timeline make sense.

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menashe

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In a series that has dragons, undead that wants to ruin the world and a dead man who was brought back to life by a witch; we still seek a logic reason how a chain pops up in the middle of nowhere...

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Zerohournow

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The episode was pretty nonsensical, but the author isn't saying he doesn't like it, he is just calling out some pretty weak stuff. The budding romance between Dany and Jon is particularly bad and poorly acted. All this stuff can add up into a problem for the show, fortunately they only got a handful of episodes left so they should be able to coast it into a decent ending.

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dussan2

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Good lord, I actually loved this episode. all my friends who watched it agreed it was among the best.

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Kc2tha

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I know one thing for sure this article is far worse than GoT Season 7 Episode 6.

"As always, George R.R. Martin can't write quickly enough. I'm eager to get back to the real thing."

Good luck with that.

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AutumnVarela

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I don't think it's a particularly great show, but your criticism is very petty. Dumb nit-picking like that can apply to any fantasy story.

"Why didn't that guy just do the really boring but tactically advantageous thing guys???" BECAUSE THAT'S REALLY FUCKING BORING. What next? "why doesnt bran just like tell everyone the end of the story cuz he can see the future??"

fucking relax pal.

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CatAtomic999

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Edited By CatAtomic999

@autumnvarela: Bullshit. The thing that's made the Song of Ice and Fire novels so popular is how seriously and realistically the setting is treated. There's not much traditional heroism, you rarely get anything approaching fan service or justice... it reads like history. It has an authenticity that isn't found in much fantasy.

Cheesy stories about swashbuckling Mary Sues who do it the exciting way because that's so awesome are a dime a dozen.

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babaelc

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A medieval version of the Godfather turned into WoW Wrath of the Lich King....

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Milknweed

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Edited By Milknweed

@babaelc: Yea GOT is basically what a high fantasy rpg would be if it was made into a series now. Main characters like jon snow have so much OBVIOUS plot armor its ridiculous at this point.

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AzatiS

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I really dont understand what do you dislike that much ... lol.

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vortec40

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First time I watched a episode and rolled my eyes and wished it over . Terrible

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endersdragon

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I think Dany rescuing them would have been fine... if they had just been hiding out in a cave. It would have called back to Alistar's words in season 1, and it would make sense that they could survive a week or two in a cave. Holding the cave might be another matter but maybe they created a cave in that the wights had a hard time unblocking, or the like. Just thinking out loud here, but seriously it shouldn't have been that big of an issue... but instead they had them hide out on a ice block which was just dumb...

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streamline

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Edited By streamline

I'm glad I'm not the only one disappointed in episode six, too. It is almost like, "2 eps left, better stuff plot points and major change in before the last ep." They should've wrapped up the war with Cersei this season and deal with invasion from the north in the final season. Very straightforward, but can be good if done correctly.

Though, Rougeau, I thought wightwalker magic turns them into wights, not just because they die north of the wall. If you leave someone there, the walkers will turn them like they did the dragon.

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adam42003

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All of this article's stupid points probably have in universe reasons we aren't aware of. The coincidence of them all being there together? Beric said it was the Lord of lights will. Maybe the Lord of light is real and he is manipulating events. The characters don't know how a wight is made. Why woukd they? Why would we? The show doesnt need to explain the delicacies of necromancy to us or anyone. The night king probably did set a trap. Maybe he can foresee the future? Bran can see all the past and maybe present. He can sense brans ravens spying on him so he knows about the three eyed raven. He knew to kill the original one before bran.

Just figure out the travel times yourself. That's why it showed gillys older child. That tells you years passed there. It gives you the clues to know. I'm sure we'd be complaining of it explained time too much.

We've reached the point where it's going to start be "cool" to dislike this massively popular show. Stupid internet people. I've got the better reason to hate this show! No, I Do! I hated it first! Etc etc

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Steamaddict

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Edited By Steamaddict

@adam42003: Bran is the night king...when he was seeing past visions when the children of the forest plunged that dragon glass into the human..that was bran..thats why he flinched so hard...(my opinion but i have convinced myself)

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FLOPPAGE_50

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All these idiots claiming they are "done with this stupid show" crack me up.


You'll be back.

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TAracer

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Edited By TAracer

Agree 100% bringing a wight back for Cersei is stupid. However there is much you are missing:

1) Bran can see all and sent Benjan there to save John

2) Sansa wrote the letter calling her fater a traitor.

3) Bran is immobile seeing stuff

4) Maybe horses couldn't survive cold.

5) Jon was protecting the others getting on dragon

6) Jon pulling self out of water, distances not a big deal

You do raise other good points. Don't hold your breath for books to finish. I've read Martin is bored with them since HBO is finishing the story.

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streamline

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@TAracer: I can imagine the show now hindering Martin's creative flow. Too much stress to line it up.

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nigelholden

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@streamline: I sort of agree, but in a way, he has free licence to deviate from the series at this point. Having a totally different story would help draw people from the show back to the books. But yeah, just having the show out there would screw with most writers head. Audience expectations can damper the process. So either he finishes the next one and sort of just peters out before starting the last book or somehow gets a renewed spark. It just may take even more time in between books.

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PSR8000

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I thought this episode was amazing! Can't wait to see what happens next!

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megawavez

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Hollywoodized -

- Insta-travel

- overly dramatic plot points

- loss of subtlety

- weird meandering speeches

- 1 dimensional characters

- Quick solutions to dilemnas

Still gonna watch the rest, but lacks the Martin subtleties.

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FLOPPAGE_50

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@megawavez: I don't understand this instant travel argument, didn't they spend the entire night sorrounded?

I mean, they fell asleep.. that could've been an easily 12 hours.


We've seen the 3 eye raven flock fly and they fly fast af

Also, the Night King is not afraid of dragons, he did target the party but the killing of the other dragon was basically a /flex

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HenrySix

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@FLOPPAGE_50: instant traveling has been an issue with GoT since forever bruh. dunno where you have been.

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FLOPPAGE_50

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@HenrySix: no shit I was defening the episode with some logic because people are butthurt

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Bukmeikara

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Edited By Bukmeikara

@FLOPPAGE_50:

From Dragon Stone to East Watch Stanis needed weeks to reach there with ships! So:

1. Gendry had to run a distance for which they needed a day to walk off + this is the first time he is seen snow and this kind of cold weather. Normaly he should be dead after 5 minutes.

2. The raven needed to reach Dragon Stone. Certanly wont be few weeks like Stannis but still 2-3-4 days.

3. Danny needed to travel to East Watch, again at least few days. And she didnt had any food or water with her.

4. Danny somehow needs to find the exact spot of the East Watch. After that she is blind, did they went right, left or forward ?!

Apart from the fact that they should be dead before the first hour ends, realisticaly speaking Danny needs at least 3 weeks to find them

All of this could have been avoived if they just send Danneris with them at first place...

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tabyrd32

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@megawavez: I mean... we are reaching the climax.

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tabyrd32

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Maybe stick to writing about games instead of jumping on the imbecilic bandwagon? All of the problems with the show that people are whining about are easily justified to anyone with common logic.

The group waited long enough for Dany to receive a raven, ravens are fast, then rode her dragon, dragons are faster. If you estimate the mileage and estimate how fast a raven or dragon (hard to guestimate on a mythical beast, but I'd guess very fast), then it makes sense since it shows that the group waited over a day.

Why did the Night King target the dragon actively melting his army instead of the one that wasn't flying around melting his army? Do I really need to answer that? Doesn't take a brilliant strategist to come up with the answer as to why he'd save the easier more docile target for last, since the dragon was on the ground not yet taking off.

you also gonna cry about the chains that the wilding zombies retrieved from the wildings? the same kind of chains the wildlings used to attack castle black?

yes, things are unfortunately rushed. Yes, the writing isn't perfect, but it's still far better than any other TV show, and everything is still justifiable and still makes since. This is a garbage article.

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Mattstar_beret

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@tabyrd32: Im with you on this... who gives a f**k if its a bit rushed... I'd struggle to find any show that stands up to the joy that GoT has given me over the years. Somebody mentioned something about one dimensional characters earlier... this show has been developing their characters for 7 seasons! As for the characters going North to do a stupid mission, lets face it... Jon Snow and his merry band of nutters arent exactly geniuses.. I'm sure there were plenty of ways to convince Daenerys that the White Walkers were coming!! Unless of course your a bunch of blokes with very little education who have been brought up to beat people over the head with swords... then trudging around in the snow looking for someone to beat up is probably the best solution. In fact Daenerys says that the heroes in the show are morons for doing heroic things and they should be more like Tyrion.

Also I think it was pretty clear at the end of season 5 that the White Walkers create the Wights using magic, this can be seen as Jon and the other nutters are leaving on the boat after the Battle of Hardhome (season 5 episode 8).

Now! no more bashing GoT, lest you be cast back in time before Peter Jackson had created his version of Lord of the Rings and ye shall be forced to watch an infinite loop of well, erm everything that was on TV!!!!!!!!!!!! x

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spectreSE7EN

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Edited By spectreSE7EN

The problem lies with Martin's inability to finish this saga himself. HBO had a 4 book cushion when they started filming GOT season 1 and HBO quickly caught up to the Author's latest book 5. So unless HBO wanted to wait another 10-15 years for Martin to release his last 2 books, they were forced to guess how they think the saga should end. It's become a mess for that reason. HBO had to go off the rails because Martin can't build the rails fast enough. HBO would have been wiser to hold off on GOT season 1 until Martin had released book 6....and maybe by the end of 7 years of production...he'd be nearly finished with his final book or had enough written to end the show properly.

I sill love the show and it's very entertaining for me. I had to suspend reality A LOT for this last episode and just accept the major holes because I've loved this series for so long. It's just a shame that HBO seems to be rushing through the last 2 seasons...like they just want to be done with it no matter how illogical and silly it becomes. It's sad...they've slowly built up to this moment for 6 seasons only to put everything on turbo....with a 7 episode season 7 and a season 8 that will be even shorter. Just crazy to me. What's the rush? it's by far one of the most popular shows in the world and they're speeding through the finish line without a thought to have anything make sense.

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soul_starter

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Like I said as the show started diverging more and more from the book series...it can only end badly. NOw dont get me worng, I love the spectacle and Ill take this over the overly boring season 6 but its nowhere near the height of s1-4.

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burnettaj

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If there is one thing I have learned in life, people will complain about anything and all things, good or bad. Just enjoy the show or don't watch the show. Its really that simple. Lets move on now...

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shade8nj

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The show is total Hollywood now. It's replaced story with spectacle. It's still entertaining but the tone is completely different. Take the montage where Sam is emptying sh!t over and over. There was nothing that ridiculous in the first 4 seasons

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CatAtomic999

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Edited By CatAtomic999

@shade8nj: I honestly thought they were setting him as some sort of Typhoid Mary figure with that montage. I figured he'd risk the dangerous greyscale treatment, become infected himself, and spread it through the Citadel because he's in physical contact with everyone in one way or another. That seemed like something GRRM might do... one of those trope-smashing things. People who take big, heroic risks tend to screw up everyone's lives in his books.

Nooope. Just a montage for fun, I guess. :/

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streamline

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@shade8nj: now that I think of it, people disappointed with the show can call the shit scenes allegory.

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mohabnoto

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King robert basterd made it to the wall by feet in less than 10 minutes, and they say white walker are bad ass, they are marching since season 1 didn, t even saw the wall yet

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streamline

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@mohabnoto: maybe they were walking around gathering more dead for their army.

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adam42003

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@mohabnoto: yes, because it took 10 minutes of OUR time, it took 10 minutes in the show. /facepalm

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Ares_hot

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Edited By Ares_hot

I feel like this show has gotten way too conventional. Remember when anyone could die? Remember when everything didn't feel like it was forced together and flowed way more naturally? Still a great show but damn it's annoying when stuff like this happens.

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njs72

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Edited By njs72

Seeing Ed Sheeran in it is enough to relise the director has gone off the rails. Still fun though i enjoyed episode 4 s7 the most so far. I did find myself thinking all those thing stated above when watching it but because its Game of Thrones i didnt care one bit. . I would feel very differently if this was in say, a Lord of the Rings movie.

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