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Halo Composer Calls Destiny Activision Deal "Bad From The Start"

Former Bungie developer Martin O'Donnell makes a series of explosive claims in a new interview about what went wrong with Activision.

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Video game industry veteran Martin O'Donnell, who composed the music for Halo and was on Bungie's board of directors, has spoken very openly about the deal Bungie made with Activision and how it all fell apart. The long and short of it is that O'Donnell had a bad feeling about the deal for the Destiny series from the very beginning, but the whole story is like something out of a movie.

Speaking to YouTuber HiddenXperia, O'Donnell first clarified that it was Bungie's seven members of the board of directors that collectively made the decision to work with Activision. O'Donnell was a member, so he acknowledged his part in the decision. O'Donnell also continues to hold stock in Bungie.

Discussing the origins of the deal, O'Donnell said he had misgivings right away. "We knew it was a risk right from the get-go," he said. "It turned out to be exactly as bad as we thought it was going to be. Everybody who no longer works for Bungie is going to say, 'Yeah, it was bad from the start.'"

Higher-ups at Bungie who still work there won't acknowledge that it was a problematic deal from the start, O'Donnell said.

"If you still work for Bungie, you're going to be political and you're going to say all sorts of things like, 'Oh, we had a good partnership and blah blah blah we were able to build a wonderful thing. And the time came for us to go our separate ways because we each had different goals but we're happy and we love each other.' That's BS," O'Donnell said. "There are so many scripted answers out there that I hear."

O'Donnell's summary of the deal with Activision is that it was "not a marriage made in heaven at all."

Bungie decided to sign with Activision because the Call of Duty publisher was allowing Bungie to retain ownership of the Destiny IP. This came from Bungie's experience working with Microsoft. Bungie sold the Halo IP to Microsoft in 2000, and had needed to answer to Microsoft ever since. Bungie did not want to repeat this for its new deal for Destiny.

"The reason why we went with Activision was not just the money, but it was because as part of the contract--they didn't own the IP," O'Donnell said.

O'Donnell said it was a "non-negotiable" item for him in his discussions with the rest of Bungie's board before making the deal with Activision. And in a shocker of a revelation, O'Donnell also reveals that Bungie was "very close" to making a deal with Microsoft for Destiny before Activision won out. "We almost went back to Microsoft," O'Donnell said.

Also during the interview, O'Donnell alluded to one of the reasons why Bungie fired him. He suggested that some members of Bungie's leadership team wanted to give Activision more control of Destiny.

"Here's the spicy part. Activision not only didn't have the legal right to mess with the IP. But the only way they would be prevented from messing with the IP is if all the leadership at Bungie said you can't mess with the IP. And that's not what happened. And that's why they fired me," O'Donnell said.

"That was probably my biggest disappointment--we worked for a decade to make sure we could be in a position where we could stand up to the publisher and say, no, we own the IP--you can't mess with it. And I was overruled and eventually let go," he added.

One of the more chilling revelations from the interview is a story that O'Donnell shared about a dinner he had with Activision's executives just before the deal was done, including CEO Bobby Kotick and a CFO that O'Donnell referred to as an Austrian man from the "Vienna School of Economics." He never mentions a name, but Activision's former CFO was Thomas Tippl, an Austrian man who was involved in the deal to sign Bungie for Destiny.

O'Donnell shared that he has a saying, "be nice to the goose," which means you should be nice to the goose because that's where golden eggs come from. In this analogy, Bungie is the goose that lays the golden egg that is Destiny. This unnamed Austrian business executive told O'Donnell, "Yeah, I like that story ... golden eggs ... the goose. But sometimes there's nothing like a good Foie gras."

Foie gras is the French cuisine that is made from goose liver after the bird is fattened by forced feeding. O'Donnell was spooked that Activision saw Bungie as a goose to be fattened and then killed off, and today he wishes he had raised concerns to his colleagues.

"The red flag went off. I'm in the middle of sipping some wine and he says that, and I'm like, 'Oh my god.' I felt like I was in a Twilight Zone episode," he said. "What I should have done is stood up, flipped the table, and told all the other Bungie guys, 'We have to get away from here--now!' But that only happens in my dreams."

At the same time that Activision was making this deal with Bungie, Activision was in the midst of its tumultuous relationship with Call of Duty Modern Warfare developer Infinity Ward that saw the company fire founders Jason West and Vince Zampella for insubordination.

"They were eating the liver of Infinity Ward while I was sitting at that table," O'Donnell said. "I thought we were protected from them doing that [to us at Bungie], and I was wrong. My gut instinct was this is bad, we shouldn't do this. That's hindsight though."

In 2015, O'Donnell won his legal case against Bungie. A court-appointed arbitrator ruled that Bungie violated its contract with O'Donnell when it fired him "without cause" and made him give up his company stock and drop out of Bungie's profit-sharing plan.

O'Donnell later co-founded the independent game studio Highwire Games, which published the VR title Golem in late 2019. It was released exclusively for PS4.

As for Bungie, with Activision now out of the picture, Bungie is self-publishing the Destiny series. The studio has bold ambitions for the future of Destiny, including new expansions through 2022.

Additionally, Bungie received $100 million from Chinese company NetEase to make non-Destiny games.

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cboye18

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I knew it was going to be bad from the start the moment I've read that they want the game to reach the same heights as Star Wars and Lord of the Rings. https://www.gamespot.com/articles/bungie-says-destiny-can-sit-alongside-star-wars-lord-of-the-rings/1100-6413676/.

Looking back at Destiny and Destiny 2, it's safe to say that overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer.

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Jaxith

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That foie gras line really kinds drives home how evil and callous men think nothing of their own evil and callousness. He's talking about peoples work and livelihood like it's something to be abused and devoured, and apparently can't see the problem with that.

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PrpleTrtleBuBum

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something doesnt work. thry said they were tired of making halo and wanted a change. then they say they wanted tk keep the rights to destiny so they can make however many games of it. they expected to not get tired of it?

irony is that already players are tired of destiny. so even if bungie might try to keep it afloat, thry have a tough job ahead

on the other hand after very recent hali and destiny it might be hard to come up with yet another scifi epic idea that succeeds

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deactivated-64efdf49333c4

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And the moral of this story is...Activision is evil? No shit, sherlock.

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Crazy_sahara

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Edited By Crazy_sahara

Lol, couldn't see this one coming at speed of light travel, but I did. Shame on you bungie, shame on you.

The only good thing about destiny was the beta, the very first beta.

What is this city, why are we all up here, who or what is that thing in the distance, such s strange earth.

I want more.

Oh no the games worse then the beta it's nothing as expected.

Just like colonial marines.

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BasketballFan

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Its very simple:

"Games as a service" = Rip off. Lame euphemism. Detrimental to the entire industry. Unplanned, maybe not possible to plan. Spend real cash in the "game." STAY AWAY.

Games aren't a service. They are games.

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JustinGoSka

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@basketballfan: Warframe is pretty good.

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@basketballfan: Man, there are a whole lot of really popular games that would disagree. The biggest games in the world right now are all service games.

Fortunately, non-service games are still a thing as well, and they're still great.

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twztid13

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@mogan: they would disagree that they are a rip off? I doubt it, lol.

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deactivated-64efdf49333c4

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@mogan: He didn't say they were unpopular. He said they're a rip-off.

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@Barighm: The biggest service games wouldn’t have got so popular if their players didn’t think they were worth playing.

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jinzo9988

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@mogan: There's a reason for that. Non-service games aren't demanding that I play them for 8 hours a day, every day, for months if not years on end. It's not really much of a comparison. Doom Eternal was big time... but it was big time for a week or two and now nobody cares because we're all done the single player campaign and it's back to perpetual farming, grinding, copy-pasted busy-work, daily missions and random loot in live services.

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@jinzo9988: Yeah, the ongoing nature of service games is what keeps people playing them, but even Doom Eternal at its height during launch week didn't push CS:GO or DOTA2 concurrency numbers. Those are genuinely super popular games that have been able to maintain a huge audience for years. If they were just a bunch of boring grind with no rewards, they wouldn't be able to do that.

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twztid13

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Edited By twztid13

@mogan: see that thing waaaay up there? That's the point you're missing (maybe purposefully?). Straw man ftl.

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santinegrete

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And the only winner is Activision, because if you think the Destiny blueprint helped the industry (the raise of imitators chasing for it's cash) you're not tired of Destiny yet or just delusional. Man, it was just a promise, so mad that good gunplay is wasted.

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nintendians

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well can't blame the publisher much as blaming yourself, bungie or former bungie employee.

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Laurenriley3332

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It is not really Activision's fault in this case. Everyone at Bungie was not on the same page as one another. When your team is scattered on how to handle the game that is developed, then things will not go well. None of this is Activision's fault. Bungie was not clear about what it wanted and things ended up not going well. Bungie's team should be more clear about what it wants when developing its next project.

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twztid13

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@laurenriley3332: Activision know this tho, & they count on & prey on this from companies they buy out. You're correct, but that context needed to be added imho.

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sirk1264

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Everyone but Bungie saw how bad it was going to be. Now some are just realizing it. Don’t feel bad for them at all.

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Thelostscribe

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@sirk1264: Activision already had a history of clearly exploiting popular IP's before COD. All they had to do is look at THPS and Guitar Hero. You can see here though that Bungie felt like they had outsmarted Activision and they did to some degree, breaking out of the deal and still owning Destiny.

Shame that Xbox and Bungie fell apart, it has had pretty huge ramifications for Xbox.

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phili878

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Edited By phili878

Activision, another company that used to be great and that went down the shite. They made MW games and Interstate 76 and now they're involved with mainly garbage “AAA” projects. What the hell is happening with the gaming industry, man.

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Thelostscribe

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@phili878: It turned into big money. Don't get me wrong, Video games have always made money, but once they reached mainstream audiences, during the 360 and PS3 generation, AAA became a massive thing. Game development teams swelling to over a hundred people per team, studio execs not really knowing the people working for them. You can really see what games used to be to what they are now.

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phili878

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Edited By phili878

@thelostscribe: good lord I have 3 retro PCs still that are up and running. Today's shit is really depressing. Sure, there is promise from time to time (cyberpunk, witcher games etc), but man.... like 1 in 100. Back in the day even the crappier games had their replay values. I'd rather play G-Police 100x than Titanfall twice for instance.

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Thelostscribe

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@phili878: Games are more like movies these days than games. Some of that is good and some of that is bad. There is definitely a wonkiness to older video games I kind of miss. Seemed like there was more personality in them.

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hardwenzen

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If Activision ate the liver, Tencent will devour it raw. And be ready for a Trojan bundled in for free just like Valorant.

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lonewolf1044

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Edited By lonewolf1044

Of course when you sign over the IP to the parent company it is your fault for if the parent company see an good thing and get their claws into it they do not always want to give it back. So you take your lost and move which they did and was smart the second time around. So I do not blame MS for keeping the IP.

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BDRTFM

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Edited By BDRTFM

They went from one problematic publisher to an even worse one. Pretty sure Microsoft would have allowed them to retain ownership of the IP eventually. And after Activision ate their liver, they jumped in bed with another investor/mega publisher. Seems there are a few people at the top who just can't seem to learn a lesson. Activision doesn't see Destiny as a huge moneymaker anymore. Otherwise they would have done everything they could to hang on to it. There was a time when every gamer I knew was playing Destiny. Now I don't know a single person who is. The game is the mother of all money pits.

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Thelostscribe

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@bdrtfm: I dropped Destiny when they started putting out $40 expansions that added almost nothing to the experience. I further swore off of Destiny when Bungie told fans to suck it up about the expansions and prices.

It's very clear the Bungie that made Halo isn't the one that currently exists. I remember all the cool vidocs they would do and all mysticism around symbols and names in Halo. Seems like non of that has carried over since they left MS. To be fair, I haven't followed them closely, so they may still be doing it, but it never seemed apparent in Destiny.

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arc_salvo

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@bdrtfm:

I agree. I used to play Destiny 2 for a while, but lately it's evolved into some odd FOMO (fear of missing out) grind, and I have to say that playing the game just to play it for fun isn't something I can really do much anymore. The gameplay and the engine limitations are kind of wearing thin, and I honestly feel like they should have been working on a sequel at this point, but it seems like they're just going to milk Destiny 2 and stretch it on as long as they can due to a lack of resources. Especially money.

Anyhow, Bungie sure isn't what it used to be, just like Bioware, and Infinity Ward. Seems like greed and deals with the devil are killing many formerly great companies. Kind of like with Blizzard after it partnered with Activision.

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hardwenzen

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And now Bungie signed with Tencent 😂

This company is braindead.

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deactivated-64efdf49333c4

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@hardwenzen: Netease is Tencent?

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hardwenzen

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@Barighm said:

@hardwenzen: Netease is Tencent?

Nope, but try to find a difference. Good luck.

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Crazy_sahara

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Edited By Crazy_sahara

@hardwenzen: Actually tencent is big, bigger then EA, just not to Western audiences.

What tencent accomplished for the mobile hand held with:

Call of duty original, call of duty: death match, 1 on 1, capture the flag, free for all, all your favourite old maps, crazy amount of new and old guns, crazy kill perks, zombies, gulag, snipers Vs snipers, sky scrapers sniper Vs sniper, hand gun Vs hand gun, gun Vs gun, knife Vs knife, infection Vs humans, and lastly battle royale huge ass map that has tanks, choppers, bikes, vehicles, is crazy amazing.

All that free for a mobile game, at your own sheer desire to play when ever, how ever at what time you like.

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jinzo9988

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@hardwenzen: All the people that had sense enough to see that signing with Activision would be cancer probably left that company already so they're stuck with the braindead people and they're going to continue to make braindead decisions.

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hardwenzen

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@jinzo9988 said:

@hardwenzen: All the people that had sense enough to see that signing with Activision would be cancer probably left that company already so they're stuck with the braindead people and they're going to continue to make braindead decisions.

lol u got that right

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sladakrobot

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Bungie,come back to mama

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CashPrizes

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Not to defend Activision, who are historically awful, but O'Donnell is a kook. If he really attributes part of the blame to Activision for why he was pushed out of Bungie, of course he is not going to speak well of them.

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BloodMist

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@CashPrizes: actually you are essentially defending them completely, genius.

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Edited By Goldenageplayer

@CashPrizes: I think you got a point about the guy. Great music composer in my opinion but we all knew how crappy craptivision is now and even back then. Marty still went along with it though didn't he smh...

Also seeing him do interviews with 343 shill youtubers who are totally fanboying up and downplaying 343 micro transaction greed while hyping up halo infinite like it's going to be the greatest thing ever even though the creators said it would have micro transactions and we haven't even seen gameplay but okay lol... Not very kool in my opinion but whatever...

It's just kind of sad that the most popular halo youtubers are pretty much all fanboys, shills, alt right kids, and in the case of halo follower... People who scam their workers. So yeah... Halo is sooo tarnished lol. Not just because of 343 but also because of those "fans" milking it. And many of these "fans" are super buddy buddy with each other meaning they are kool with the crap behavior they keep displaying.

Also when is that indie game he's working on coming along. Golem was it? Does anyone care? Did it get cancelled? Has it come out already? It looked lame lol.

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lonewolf1044

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@goldenageplayer: Activision was not always crappy like EA as both are very old corporations, The only thing that can change an corporation path is the people in the corporation. The newer generation does or may not share the same philosophy as the old generation and just want to make money but do not care about the quality of the game.

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BloodMist

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@goldenageplayer: wow, you sure did go off on an unrelated tangent there.

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xNSHD

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@goldenageplayer: and you don't think there are playstation themed channels that are complete fanboys? there is fanboys on either side, you dare say anything about the last of us 2 on a playstation themed channel and my god the comments you get are glorious.

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firedrakes

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you know b a seen a dumpster fire... when they cancel the contract with bungie

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