The Thumbs Down/Up Feature Needs Improvements

• Limit to how many "votes" you can do per day or week. This would cripple all users who are planning to vote down everything in a certain article, blog post or video comment box. It might even force more users to think before they vote if they're aware that they only have 3 votes they can use today.
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• Create an off/on switch for the thumbs in blog posts. Bloggers should at least have a chance to turn off the voting completely in their own profiles. A lot of users didn't ask for it or want it there in the first place. And this type of voting is often abused, there has actually been several cases where users (who have a grudge on a certain other members) have gone into their blogs and voted down every single comment in every blog. Meaningless but VERY annoying.
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• Remove the ability for comments to be closed if they have too many "thumbs downs". Some users will try and say otherwise, but this site really does have a good moderator system (remember, I said "good", not "perfect"). If a post needs to be removed then it should get reported so that a moderator can look at it, the moderator has the ability to remove the post permanently if it's offensive. If it only gets closed, getting 16-18 "thumb downs", it will remain on the site, hidden. Basically, the closing down of posts is making it harder to find all posts that need to be reported/deleted.
  Also, a LARGE majority of hidden posts aren't offensive, provocative or inflammatory in any way... a lot of them are getting closed down simply because they express an opinion that isn't shared by the majority. In a fanboy crowded site like this it often means: Unless you praise Sony under an article about the PS3, you WILL get closed down.
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• Put a minimum level on voting. (If the last point is taken care off, then this point can be ignored) Some time ago I came across a feature comment box (PS3 vs 360 graphics comparison) where all comments "praising the wrong console" or "insulting the wrong console" got either +11 votes or -11 votes. This was really suspicious. After looking at it for a few days I realized that it had to be the same user voting 11 times with the help of 10 alt accounts (most of them probably level 1-3)... never have I seen something so childish. But it worked, he was able "close down" dozens of comments this way. Many of the closed comments were pretty big, though-out and contributory, but this user obviously didn't care about that.
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• A tool that at least allows admins to see who voted. Moderators don't need to see it, most of the times we don't care about it. But in cases where voting is used as some prolonged kind of trolling/harassing... it would be nice if we could ask for some usernames sometimes. Right now, we have no way of stopping it and no way of contacting the user who's responsible.

I'd rather see them just get rid of the "Down" and just have users vote "Up" or not at all. No need for all that other stuff IMO fastesttruck

No, that's a bad idea. We need something to combat the "XBOX RULEZ GAYSTATION 3 IS TEH GAY comments you might see in articles.

I support all of this 100%. I Hate, with a capital H, the thumbs-up/thumbs-down system as it currently stands. For examples of its flagrant abuse, one can take a look at the comments from raahsnavj, favre4thewin, chicknfeet, and grigjd3 here - all are perfectly rational, contributory messages that are now hidden from view just for the crime of diverging from majority opinion. Mob mentality is never a good thing, and the system as it currently is practically encourages such behavior by giving a mob (or even a user with several alt accounts if he's really determined) the ability to hide basically any comment they want for any reason at all while simultaneously offering no accountability whatsoever to the person whose comment was hidden.

If anything truly needs to be hidden from view, that's what the reporting system is for.

Maybe i don't support this.

But i think the "message that cannot be displayed because don't meet display criteria" should be deleted. I mean you should show the message.

I support all of this 100%. I Hate, with a capital H, the thumbs-up/thumbs-down system as it currently stands. For examples of its flagrant abuse, one can take a look at the comments from raahsnavj, favre4thewin, chicknfeet, and grigjd3 here - all are perfectly rational, contributory messages that are now hidden from view just for the crime of diverging from majority opinion. Mob mentality is never a good thing, and the system as it currently is practically encourages such behavior by giving a mob (or even a user with several alt accounts if he's really determined) the ability to hide basically any comment they want for any reason at all while simultaneously offering no accountability whatsoever to the person whose comment was hidden.

If anything truly needs to be hidden from view, that's what the reporting system is for.

GabuEx

So, the conclusion is:

We mustn't make comments that diverge.

So, the conclusion is:

We mustn't make comments that diverge.

kono11

You know that's violating the right of free speech on liberal countries & on Internet.

About the topic, I do agree on everything posted here. Another alternative would be to limit "thumb voting" for moderators & veteran users with a great reputation. That way, NO SINGLE FLAMER, SPAMMER, TROLL, etc. would be allowed to "thumb vote". But that would also limit the freedom of speech here.

[QUOTE="kono11"] So, the conclusion is:

We mustn't make comments that diverge.

DragonxanderPR

You know that's violating the right of free speech on liberal countries & on Internet.

About the topic, I do agree on everything posted here. Another alternative would be to limit "thumb voting" for moderators & veteran users with a great reputation. That way, NO SINGLE FLAMER, SPAMMER, TROLL, etc. would be allowed to "thumb vote". But that would also limit the freedom of speech here.

I also agree that the simplest solution would be to just remove the Thumbs Down option.

In the player reviews, the Thumbs are supposed to indicate Helpful/Not Helpful. But far too many readers view them as Agree/Disagree. If I read a review, and I choose NOT to give it a Thumbs Up, doesn't that already imply that I didn't find the review Helpful? I don't feel any need to 'bash' someone else's contribution beyond that. (The only exception would be the rare review that provides so much erroneous information, or spoilers, that it would tend to mislead the reader, or ruin the game for them.)

I'm not sure if the Thumbs option in the Comments section of blogs or articles indicates Helpful/Not Helpful, but even if it's intended to indicate Agree/Disagree, the same logic still applies. If I agree with a particular comment, then giving it a Thumbs Up means I don't need to reiterate what the poster said by creating yet another post. If I don't give it a Thumbs Up, then it already implies that I don't agree.

If I actually strongly DISagree with the comment, then I should be obligated post a counter-argument explaining the reasons I disagree, rather than just giving the poster a slap-in-the-face with a Thumbs Down icon.

Along these lines, I'd also like to see some kind of comment option added to the player reviews, so I can elaborate on what I found Helpful or Not Helpful in any player reviews. I would sure appreciate that kind of feedback on MY reviews.

I also agree that the simplest solution would be to just remove the Thumbs Down option.

In the player reviews, the Thumbs are supposed to indicate Helpful/Not Helpful. But far too many readers view them as Agree/Disagree. If I read a review, and I choose NOT to give it a Thumbs Up, doesn't that already imply that I didn't find the review Helpful? I don't feel any need to 'bash' someone else's contribution beyond that. (The only exception would be the rare review that provides so much erroneous information, or spoilers, that it would tend to mislead the reader, or ruin the game for them.)

I'm not sure if the Thumbs option in the Comments section of blogs or articles indicates Helpful/Not Helpful, but even if it's intended to indicate Agree/Disagree, the same logic still applies. If I agree with a particular comment, then giving it a Thumbs Up means I don't need to reiterate what the poster said by creating yet another post. If I don't give it a Thumbs Up, then it already implies that I don't agree.

If I actually strongly DISagree with the comment, then I should be obligated post a counter-argument explaining the reasons I disagree, rather than just giving the poster a slap-in-the-face with a Thumbs Down icon.

Along these lines, I'd also like to see some kind of comment option added to the player reviews, so I can elaborate on what I found Helpful or Not Helpful in any player reviews. I would sure appreciate that kind of feedback on MY reviews.

ziegd

That's implying that we know how many people have read our reviews, and that all of them have read the entire review, even though the case is often a few people who just get pissed off that you used the summary part to tell people how exactly FF7 isn't the BEST GAME EVAR.

[QUOTE="kono11"] So, the conclusion is:

We mustn't make comments that diverge.

DragonxanderPR

You know that's violating the right of free speech on liberal countries & on Internet.

About the topic, I do agree on everything posted here. Another alternative would be to limit "thumb voting" for moderators & veteran users with a great reputation. That way, NO SINGLE FLAMER, SPAMMER, TROLL, etc. would be allowed to "thumb vote". But that would also limit the freedom of speech here.

But there's a spammer and troll and also flamers. So they must have the thing also.

They must be get special treatment.

"That's implying that we know how many people have read our reviews, and that all of them have read the entire review, even though the case is often a few people who just get pissed off that you used the summary part to tell people how exactly FF7 isn't the BEST GAME EVAR. "

Just replace the Thumbs Down with some kind of counter...lets you know how many people opened your review to read it. That would be better for a couple of reasons.

1)Eliminates those who give an 'auto-Thumbs Down' just because they didn't like your rating or opening remarks.
2)Lets you know how many people are actually reading your review. A lot of folks may glance over a review and exit without giving a recommendation either way. A counter would at least let us know that people might be looking at our submissions, but not recommending them (which is in itself good info...I'd rather have that than the Thumbs Down that might have just been the result of some fanboy disliking the fact that I didn't give their favorite game a 10).

Getting a Thumbs Down is by no means an indication that someone actually read your review. In fact, I'd guess that it more often comes from someone who DIDN'T even open the review, but just looked at the score and remarks. A counter that registers how many people actually opened your review doesn't gaurantee how many people actually read it either, but at least you would know how many people 'looked it over'. If you were getting a lot of people looking, but few recommendations, you could decide how to change your writing to grab their attention better. If you're not getting any lookers, then you could shamelessly ask your friends to help you out and at least READ the damn things :P

I'm sorry, but I just don't see where the Thumbs Down serves any real purpose. Since there's no "why?" associated with it, it doesn't tell the poster anything useful. It's too easy for mean-spirited people to abuse it, and even if someone uses it legitimately, there is no option for WHY the person gave your comment or review a black eye. And TBH, when I get one, I usually chalk it up to vindictive behaviour, rather than assuming it's legit (gotta protect my fragile ego :P )

Get rid of it and replace it with a counter of some sort.

"That's implying that we know how many people have read our reviews, and that all of them have read the entire review, even though the case is often a few people who just get pissed off that you used the summary part to tell people how exactly FF7 isn't the BEST GAME EVAR. "

Just replace the Thumbs Down with some kind of counter...lets you know how many people opened your review to read it. That would be better for a couple of reasons.

1)Eliminates those who give an 'auto-Thumbs Down' just because they didn't like your rating or opening remarks.
2)Lets you know how many people are actually reading your review. A lot of folks may glance over a review and exit without giving a recommendation either way. A counter would at least let us know that people might be looking at our submissions, but not recommending them (which is in itself good info...I'd rather have that than the Thumbs Down that might have just been the result of some fanboy disliking the fact that I didn't give their favorite game a 10).

Getting a Thumbs Down is by no means an indication that someone actually read your review. In fact, I'd guess that it more often comes from someone who DIDN'T even open the review, but just looked at the score and remarks. A counter that registers how many people actually opened your review doesn't gaurantee how many people actually read it either, but at least you would know how many people 'looked it over'. If you were getting a lot of people looking, but few recommendations, you could decide how to change your writing to grab their attention better. If you're not getting any lookers, then you could shamelessly ask your friends to help you out and at least READ the damn things :P

I'm sorry, but I just don't see where the Thumbs Down serves any real purpose. Since there's no "why?" associated with it, it doesn't tell the poster anything useful. It's too easy for mean-spirited people to abuse it, and even if someone uses it legitimately, there is no option for WHY the person gave your comment or review a black eye. And TBH, when I get one, I usually chalk it up to vindictive behaviour, rather than assuming it's legit (gotta protect my fragile ego :P )

Get rid of it and replace it with a counter of some sort.

ziegd

Still, I like the idea of a thumbs up/down system. It means that I can maybe use it to improve my writing flyle. The execution needs a major overhaul, but the idea is good enough.

Well, I discovered that staff comments don't have those thumbs up/down options. That kinda ticks me off. So just because they're staff, they're immune to thumbs down abuse... Well GS, how about you give the rest of us that option as well, huh? I have someone obsessing over me and they thumb down every single comment in my blogs, and they've been doing things for almost two months. I WANT the option to turn this stupid system off! JustPlainLucas

They must of just added this, because I know that staff comments used to have the options. I remember Lark Anderson making a few comments on the OTS page that received so many thumbs down, that his comment was hidden. So maybe that's a reason why.

Well, I discovered that staff comments don't have those thumbs up/down options. That kinda ticks me off. So just because they're staff, they're immune to thumbs down abuse... Well GS, how about you give the rest of us that option as well, huh? I have someone obsessing over me and they thumb down every single comment in my blogs, and they've been doing things for almost two months. I WANT the option to turn this stupid system off! JustPlainLucas

The staff gets all the benefits, like HTML not telling them to sod off (loses its power when you're American), or not being forced to use those absolutely crap pure text boxes for their reviews. Why not give us auto-formatting boxes, like Giant Bomb? *continues to complain*

Remove the ability for comments to be closed if they have too many "thumbs downs". Some users will try and say otherwise, but this site really does have a good moderator system (remember, I said "good", not "perfect"). If a post needs to be removed then it should get reported so that a moderator can look at it, the moderator has the ability to remove the post permanently if it's offensive. If it only gets closed, getting 16-18 "thumb downs", it will remain on the site, hidden. Basically, the closing down of posts is making it harder to find all posts that need to be reported/deleted. Also, a LARGE majority of hidden posts aren't offensive, provocative or inflammatory in any way... a lot of them are getting closed down simply because they express an opinion that isn't shared by the majority. In a fanboy crowded site like this it often means: Unless you praise Sony under an article about the PS3, you WILL get closed down.

Dudes I thought u americans had that FIRST AMENDMENT ?! Everybody is / "should be" free to say or vote how he pleases.AOldDog

"Still, I like the idea of a thumbs up/down system. It means that I can maybe use it to improve my writing flyle. The execution needs a major overhaul, but the idea is good enough."

I think we're both basically on the same page on this one. I am also interested in some feedback system that could ultimately help me improve my writing skills. I'd keep the Thumbs Up, but I just don't think the Thumbs Down aspect is the way to go for 2 reasons:
1) It's easily abused by people who aren't even actually READING my comment or review, but are just being jackasses.
2) Even when/if it's a legitimate opinion, it tells me nothing about the WHY, which I need to know if I want to improve.

Regardless, I still like the idea of a counter as well...knowing that 20 people read my review but didn't take ANY action tells me something. (So does knowing if NO ONE at all bothered to read it :P )

[QUOTE="AOldDog"]Dudes I thought u americans had that FIRST AMENDMENT ?! Everybody is / "should be" free to say or vote how he pleases.spazzx625

[QUOTE="spazzx625"][QUOTE="AOldDog"]Dudes I thought u americans had that FIRST AMENDMENT ?! Everybody is / "should be" free to say or vote how he pleases.Legolas_Katarn

That brings up a major question: is there a universal set of laws for the Internet?

That brings up a major question: is there a universal set of laws for the Internet?Video_Game_King

[QUOTE="spazzx625"][QUOTE="AOldDog"]Dudes I thought u americans had that FIRST AMENDMENT ?! Everybody is / "should be" free to say or vote how he pleases.Legolas_Katarn

But the site is made.....IN AMERICA!

lol...I love these "Freedom of Speech" topics...

What people have to remember is that the First Amendment is not a carte-blanche to say whatever you want to say...even IT has some restrictions. You can't slander or libel anybody...you can't actively promote race-hatred, or violence towards others for any reason...you can't promote civil disobedience or rioting...

The ToU just has it's own variations on these restrictions, and while I agree that sometimes some moderators seem to go a bit over-board on enforcing them, the whole "Freedom of Speech" defense for violations just doesn't hold water.

I don't support this. Keep it how it is. With those restrictions, the comment system would feel too, er, restricted. How digg does its comments is just fine, in my opinion. People down vote what they don't like and they up vote what they do like with an unlimited number of votes per day. Sure, there are the occasional bury brigades (with the exception of XKCD, where every comment thread for those stories are buried to hell) but those don't happen enough to be a problem (if somebody wants to view all the comments in a thread, he can just click on 'expand all' which will expand all buried posts).

Only restriction I'd like to see is a one second delay between votes.

[QUOTE="fastesttruck"] I'd rather see them just get rid of the "Down" and just have users vote "Up" or not at all. No need for all that other stuff IMO Video_Game_King

No, that's a bad idea. We need something to combat the "XBOX RULEZ GAYSTATION 3 IS TEH GAY comments you might see in articles.