.:: 2009 Italian GP Thread ::.

2009 ITALIAN GP

Welcome to the 2009 Italian GP Thread. cjek and mjk1 will keep the thread updated with the latest times as they happen.

RANDOM FACT

Toro Rosso last year became the first non-Ferrari Italian-based team to win a GP since 1957.

POINTS OF DISCUSSION

1. After a stellar performance in Belgium, what are your expectations of Giancarlo Fisichella this weekend?
2. Do you believe Badoer in that he could've made the necessary improvements to his racing skills by the end of the season?
3. (As of writing, who is replacing Fisichella at Force India hasn't been announced yet) How well do you think Fisichella's replacement can do?
4. How can you see the title battle going? Will Button keep getting lucky, will his luck run out or will he step his game up at last?
5. And how well do you see Vettel going this weekend given his heroic performance here last year?

SCHEDULE FOR WEEKEND

Friday 11
First practice: 1000-1130 (0900-1030 BST)
Second practice: 1400-1530 (1300-1430 BST)

Saturday 12
Third practice: 1100-1200 (1000-1100 BST)
Qualifying: 1400 (1300 BST)

Sunday 13
Race: 1400 (1300 BST)

WEEKEND WEATHER

FRIDAY: Sunny, Max 24 deg. cent.
SATURDAY: Sunny, Max 24 deg. cent.
SUNDAY: Sunny, Max 25 deg. cent.

PRESS CONFERENCE SCHEDULE

THURSDAY: Rubens Barrichello (Brawn GP), Giancarlo Fisichella (Ferrari), Robert Kubica (BMW Sauber), Vitantonio Liuzzi (Force India) and Jarno Trulli (Toyota).

FRIDAY:Ross Brawn (Brawn GP), Aldo Costa (Ferrari), Vijay Mallya (Force India) and Franz Tost (Toro Rosso).

BBC PRESENTS THE ITALIAN GP

PREVIOUS SESSIONS
Friday Practice 1
Friday Practice 2
Qualifying
Race
Forum

Giancarlo I expect should do as well as the car, the Ferrari might not be good over the kerbs as it has been these last few years however the engine, KERS and aero effeciency should do the business he shouldn't be more than a few tenths off Kimi I imagine.

I don't think Badoer would have got better enough to really challenge with the Ferrari by the season end so it's probably a good thing he has been replaced.

Liuzzi should probably be the replacement, in which case I can see him being around Sutil's place, could be on for some points.

Button will only win the championship through his early dominance rather than a consistent title push as they have been won these last few years.

Vettel should be able to challenge the podium in the RBR depending on how well the KERS cars go.

Force India confirms Liuzzi in second car

The Force India team has confirmed reserve driver Vitantonio Liuzzi will replace Giancarlo Fisichella from the Italian Grand Prix this weekend.

Fisichella left the team last week to drive for Ferrari, and it was expected Liuzzi would take his compatriot's place at the Silverstone-based squad.

"I'm delighted to give Tonio the opportunity to get back into a race seat, which I know he has been itching to do for the past two years," said team boss Vijay Mallya.

"Force India is now in a very competitive position and we need a driver who can continue this momentum. This will be the chance for Tonio to demonstrate to both the team and the field that he has the commitment, speed and professionalism to perform and I am sure he will seize this opportunity."

Twenty-eight year-old Liuzzi last raced in Formula 1 at the end of the 2007 season, and has not tested grand prix machinery since November.

The Italian, however, is optimistic he will be able to do a good job to continue with Force India's impressive form.

"I can't wait to get back into the car in race trim, particularly at my home Grand Prix in Monza," he said. "I really appreciate the opportunity Vijay has given me, particularly now Force India has a great car that's performing very well.

"I am confident I can carry on our progress. I'm very motivated, I'm in good shape and hungry to get some more points on the board.

"Although it's unfortunate that this came about as an direct result of Felipe's accident, this is my opportunity to show people what I can do and I'm really looking forward to it."

Source: Autosport.com

Renault brings back KERS for Monza

The Renault team has decided to bring back its Kinetic Energy Recovery System (KERS) for this weekend's Italian Grand Prix.

Renault has not used KERS since the Spanish Grand Prix in May, having decided that it was not offering a sufficient advantage to justify its use.

However, with KERS-equipped cars having proved the benefits of the system in recent races, the French team has decided to re-introduce it at Monza.

The team's director of engineering Pat Symonds reckons KERS will be worth at least a quarter of a second per lap at the fast Italian tack.

"There are three aspects of KERS that need to be considered: laptime, the advantage it gives from the start, and the ability to assist overtaking," said Symonds.

"Firstly, the gain in lap time of running KERS in Monza is likely to be around a quarter of a second and it's worth even more in qualifying as you can do one release before you start a timed lap and another release during the timed lap.

"In terms of the advantage at the start, it's a long way from the grid to the first corner in Monza and KERS will give an advantage of well over fifteen metres compared with non-KERS cars.

"For assisting overtaking, you have to remember that Monza is a circuit where it's very difficult to overtake, but running KERS certainly won't disadvantage us in that respect. All these factors combine to make Monza a very favourable circuit for KERS."

Source: Autosport.com

Renault with KERS just boosts the chances of a unknown winner up on the board... This weekend is just gonna be the pinnacle of the season so far, whatever happens here its going to have a massive impact on the title race. Qualifying will be the most important thing here, as with the 6 KERS drivers getting an extra 80hp on the way down to the chicane which in all fairness is a fair way away from the line, its gonna be more important than ever if Button wants to score decent points to try and secure his title as soon as possible.

Button just needs to go for it as hard as possible without hitting anyone or ditching his car, Rubens needs to hunt him down for everything he is worth and so do the Red Bulls.

If KERS is going to play an advantage here, Button will hope all of them beat him and his rivals to again shrink down his chances of losing points to his fellow championship rivals Barrichello, Vettel and Webber.

I can see this weekend a game of cat and mouse of who will chase the track for set-up and who will go with blind faith in the low downforce set up of the circuit and pray that it can work.

Watch the KERS cars using the boost at the two prime locations, coming out of the 2nd Lezmo to head down the straight to the Ascari Chicane, and after the Ascari Chicane. Anyone in front of a KERS car there I feel will be mince meat and will lose a place easily, I won't be surprised to see the top 10 to contain all if not 4-5 of the KERS cars.

One question I do pose is, With Lewis Hamilton with more or less no chance now mathmatically to win the title, would he help a fellow Brit out to win it? Or would he not get invovled? I find it hard, I mean, Would Barrichello block for Massa in a title situation? Would Heidfeld block For Rosberg in the same situation?

All I can say is i'm looking forward to this weekend with more anticipation than any other weekend for a long while, simply because so much depends on what happens here.

I hope you all can agree with me lol

Monza installs higher kerbs at chicanes

Formula 1 drivers will be discouraged from cutting the first and second chicanes at Monza this weekend following the installation of higher kerbs.

The problem of cars straight-lining the kerbs at Rettifilo and Roggia has been an issue at the Italian Grand Prix for several years, despite big efforts being made to find a solution that both the governing body and the drivers are happy with.

This year, the FIA has approved plans for high combination kerbs to be fitted at the apexes of the first and second chicanes - which should deter drivers from trying to cut the corners.

The combination kerb concept has already proved to be a big success after being fitted at the Veedol Chicane at the Nurburgring and the new Barcelona chicane.

Source: Autosport.com

1. Fisichella should be about as good as Kimi, but where the Ferrari will be in relation to everyone else is another question. We don't know who'll be on form here.

2. Definitely not. He's not a racing driver, and never has been. He's a loyal and consistent test driver.

3. Liuzzi hasn't been racing in F1 for a while, so it's hard to say where he'll be.

4. Button has had a combination of poor performance and bad luck. His qualifying form is the most concerning for him though, because with overtaking being so difficult on some of these circuits, he is being held back. One thing I will say about Button, is that he makes few mistakes for someone who's apparently struggling with the pressure. I think the bizarre, fluctuating form book is mostly the reason for his run of poorer results. And let's not forget, he's won six races, 4 more than anyone else, has had more poles, has scored in all but one race... not too bad, you have to say. He still looks to be on target for the title, but the car needs to be faster, and he needs to qualify better.

5. Again, we have no idea who'll be on form here. I guess Red Bull will come somewhere behind the KERS cars.

C-lassic GP's

1988 | 1990 | 1995 | 1999 | 2004

Monza weather update: Rain expected at weekend

Weather forecasters are predicting that, for the second year in succession, the Italian Grand Prix weekend could be affected by rain. Heavy showers are expected at Monza on Saturday with more, lighter rain on Sunday. In 2008, drivers had to cope with a wet track in both qualifying and the race.

The Italian Grand Prix marks the final European race of the season, with only four 'flyaways' then remaining in Singapore, Japan, Brazil and Abu Dhabi. Last year, Friday free practice proved a total washout in Italy, with McLaren coming off worse with a flooding garage.

For 2009, crowds are expected to enjoy blue skies and temperatures reaching a pleasant 25°C (77°F) for practice on Friday although the weekend's lowest figures are expected on Saturday, as well as heavy rain. Ambient temperatures are expected to rise to 24°C (75°F) on race day although light race is expected to see lower track surface temperatures than on Friday.

Jenson Button heads into the Italian meeting with a 16-point advantage over Brawn team-mate Rubens Barrichello in the Drivers' standings with the team leading Red Bull by 23.5 points for Constructors' honours.

Source: Gpupdate.net

2009 Italian Grand Prix- Monza- Friday Practice 1 RESULTS

McLaren look very strong already, and Force India also living up to their Monza expectations. Toyota = Epic fail.

2009 Italian Grand Prix- Monza- Friday Practice 2 RESULTS

2009 Italian Grand Prix- Monza- Saturday Practice RESULTS

2009 Italian Grand Prix- Monza- Qualifying RESULTS

Ooh. Nearly two poles for Force India.

Raikkonen starting near Sutil? How is Kimi going to ruin Sutil's chances this week, stay tuned.XSamFisherX

lol - I'd been thinking the same thing

But what will Fisi do? On the one hand he was a Force India driver, but now he is in a Ferrari, and therefore bound to take out a Force India car - what to do? :P

Post Qualifying Car Weights - Italy

Pos  Driver                             Weight (kg)
 1.  Hamilton     McLaren-Mercedes         653.5
 2.  Sutil        Force India-Mercedes     655.0
 3.  Raikkonen    Ferrari                  662.0
 4.  Kovalainen   McLaren-Mercedes         683.0
 5.  Barrichello  Brawn-Mercedes           688.5
 6.  Button       Brawn-Mercedes           687.0
 7.  Liuzzi       Force India-Mercedes     679.5
 8.  Alonso       Renault                  677.5
 9.  Vettel       Red Bull-Renault         682.0
10.  Webber       Red Bull-Renault         683.0
11.  Trulli       Toyota                   703.0*
12.  Grosjean     Renault                  699.8*
13.  Kubica       BMW-Sauber               697.5*
14.  Fisichella   Ferrari                  690.0*
15.  Heidfeld     BMW-Sauber               697.5*
16.  Glock        Toyota                   709.8*
17.  Nakajima     Williams-Toyota          706.2*
18.  Rosberg      Williams-Toyota          708.6*
19.  Buemi        Toro Rosso-Ferrari       706.0*
20.  Alguersuari  Toro Rosso-Ferrari       706.0*

* Declared weight

AUTOSPORT 

As posted in the thread on the GSUK board:

I'm not sure about the full list of car weights (ok now posted directly above :P ), but courtesy of the BBC

BBC Sport's full fuel-adjusted top 10, with predicted first pit stops, is as follows:

1 Kovalainen (lap 28 )
2 Rubens Barrichello +0.016secs (lap 30)
3 Lewis Hamilton +0.047secs (lap 16)
4 Jenson Button +0.073 (lap 29)
5 Adrian Sutil +0.200 (lap 17)
6 Kimi Raikkonen +0.266 (lap 19)
7 Vitantonio Liuzzi +0.296 (lap 27)
8 Sebastian Vettel +0.363 (lap 27)
9 Fernando Alonso +0.381 (lap 26)
10 Mark Webber +0.469 (lap 28 )

11 Jarno Trulli (lap 35)
12 Romain Grosjean (lap 33)
13 Robert Kubica (lap 31)
14 Giancarlo Fisichella (lap 28 )
15 Nick Heidfeld (lap 31)
16 Timo Glock (lap 37)
17 Kazuki Nakajima (lap 33)
18 Nico Rosberg (lap 34)
19 Sebastien Buemi (lap 34)
20 Jaime Alguersuari (lap 34)

It puts Brawn in a good position - being able to pit later than any of the other cars in the Top 10. I guess Ross knows they have a big fuel tank, and must have filled it before Q3. At 0.3-0.4 secs ahead of the Red Bulls, who it seems were also running nearly full cars, it puts Brawn in a good position for protecting both the drivers and constructor's championships.

Out of the Top 10 then it seems only Hamilton, Sutil and Raikonnen will be going for a different strategy, pitting around 10 laps earlier than the rest of the front runners

POSSIBLE GEARBOX CHANGE FOR BARRICHELLO

The Brawn team will decide tomorrow whether to replace Rubens Barrichello's gearbox after admitting there was a chance it might fail in the Italian Grand Prix.

"We are going to have a look at all the information and decide, but no decision yet," said team boss Ross Brawn after qualifying at Monza.

"Now we know the fuel weights, we now do all the calculations and see how the race would run, and then decide then. In the morning we will make a decision and sleep on it - there is nothing we can do tonight other than simulate and model."

He added: "There is an element of reliability risk and a question of balancing that against the very good qualifying position he has with the fuel on board, so we are just contemplating it at the moment."

Barrichello's gearbox, in its second race out of the allocated four, was damaged at the end of the previous race in Belgium when his car suffered an oil leak and caught fire.

If the team decides to replace it, Barrichello will lose five places on the grid tomorrow.

The Brazilian was delighted after qualifying in fifth position, and admitted he did not want the gearbox replaced.

"I tell you I think it is a great, great place to be starting," he said. "Being fifth on the grid with possibly the heavy of the fuel loads, I cannot confirm that but hopefully that is the case. It was a hell of a good lap, I enjoy my time fully.

"There is a little bit of a conversation with the team about my gearbox, over the over-torque that happened in the last race, and I don't want it changed - some people want it – I don't want to be leading the race and have a failure, at the same time I have to fight for what I really can achieve which is winning tomorrow.

"It is almost like if you win tomorrow you have a penalty some other time, but it would also be silly to be leading and have a penalty, so I want to have a decision with the team and see what comes out. They are waiting for the fuel of everyone and then putting the plots and seeing what is what."

 AUTOSPORT

2009 Italian Grand Prix- Monza- Race RESULTS

Brawn back on top, but this race certainly had a surprise ending it has to be said. Red Bull will be crying themselves to sleep as their championship chances slip away.

DotD: Rubens Barrichello
SotD: Adrian Sutil

Barrichello had a strong race today, building and then keeping a safe gap to Button - a good drive. As for Sutil, just hanging on to the back of the Ferrari like he did today was pure brilliance and - at last - he finally has his first points finish (and yes, I am aware this is the 2nd time he's scored points).

DotD: Rubens Barrichello
SotD: Vitantonio Liuzzi

Barrichello didn't put a foot wrong, he just delivered today and made the most of an ambitious strategy. I've put Liuzzi as star of the day; slightly odd decision, but he had no control over his technical retirement. All weekend he's been surprisingly fast, considering the testing ban. He's jumped into what is basically an unfamiliar car, and despite the closeness of the field in qualifying, where a slight mistake here or there can put you 10 places down, he made it to Q3, qualified 7th, and drove superbly in the race, well within the points. Sutil also did great, and I'd love to put him here, but the whole 'straight in at the deep end' for Liuzzi was impressive.

ELIMINATED FROM 2009 DRIVERS CHAMPIONSHIP

Kimi Raikkonen (Ferrari) - Italy
Nico Rosberg (Williams) - Italy
Lewis Hamilton (McLaren) - Italy
Jarno Trulli (Toyota) - Italy
Vitantonio Liuzzi (Force India) - Italy
Felipe Massa (Ferrari) - Belgium
Heikki Kovalainen (McLaren) - Belgium
Timo Glock (Toyota) - Belgium
Fernando Alonso (Renault) - Belgium
Nick Heidfeld (BMW) - Europe
Sebastien Buemi (Toro Rosso) - Europe
Robert Kubica (BMW) - Europe
Sebastien Bourdais (Toro Rosso) - Europe
Giancarlo Fisichella (Force India) - Europe
Kazuki Nakajima (Williams) - Europe
Adrian Sutil (Force India) - Europe
Nelson Piquet Jnr. (Renault) - Europe
Jaime Alguersuari (Toro Rosso) - Europe
Romain Grosjean (Renault) - Europe
Luca Badoer (Ferrari) - Europe

ELIMINATED FROM 2009 CONSTRUCTORS CHAMPIONSHIP

Ferrari - Italy
McLaren - Italy
Toyota - Italy
Williams - Belgium
Renault - Europe
BMW-Sauber - Europe
Scuderia Toro Rosso - Europe
Force India - Europe

from BBC SPORT taking about Kimi's pitstop. 

We didn't get around to mentioning it on the telly, but I found out what caused that strange moment of hesitation when Kimi Raikkonen tried to pull away from his second stop.

It was a fail-safe system that kicked in to stop the car if the fuel hose is still attached.

This is a legacy of the pit-stop traffic-light system that effectively cost Felipe Massa the world championship at the Singapore Grand Prix last year when he pulled away from the pits with the fuel hose still attached.

After that, the FIA asked the teams to come up with an immobiliser that would keep the car in the box if the fuel hose were still attached, even if the driver tried to pull away.
Ferrari came up with the system and has been using it this season.

There is a sensor on the fuel coupling on the car. When the fuel nozzle pushes it in, it immobilises the car. When it pops out, after the nozzle comes off, the car can go.

In Kimi's case, the fuel hose was off, but only just, so the trigger sensor cut the engine revs to idle. Kimi tried again, and it worked. It lost Raikkonen a second or two, which could have lost a place to Sutil, had the Force India driver not been experiencing a troubled pit stop of his own.