Lotus to use Red Bull gearbox from 2011

The news follows on from the announcement that the team has ended its relationship with Cosworth. Lotus had used Xtrac gearboxes and hydraulics during its debut season in 2010.

"The announcement that we have reached a multi-year agreement with Red Bull Technology for the supply of our gearboxes and hydraulics from 2011 is obviously a massive step forward for us, both in engineering terms, and as an expression of our ambitions for next year and for future championships," said technical chief Mike Gascoyne.

"The gearbox / hydraulics package obviously plays a critical role in the performance of the car, not just on track but in design and packaging terms, and this deal gives our design and aero teams a very exciting platform to work with.

"The removal of the double diffusers in 2011 will allow the whole grid to tighten up the rear bodywork and mechanical structures around the gearbox, and this supply deal will allow us to capitalise on that with our 2011 car. Exciting times lie ahead."

Lotus is expected to make two further announcements this week, one of them expected to be a new deal to use Renault engines from next season.

The move would mean Lotus would use the same engine/gearbox combination as Red Bull Racing.

"We are very pleased about Lotus Racing's decision to use Red Bull Technology gearboxes and hydraulic systems from 2011," added Red Bull Racing boss Christian Horner.

"The fact that Red Bull Technology has been chosen to be a supplier to another team despite its short history demonstrates how much we have achieved since our first season. We very much look forward to working with Lotus Racing from 2011 onwards."

SOURCE: Autosport

This is interesting, With Renault engines, Red Bull Gear box and Hydraulics, All they need now is a good design of the car for next year and I reckon they can move up the field a fair bit :)

This is interesting, With Renault engines, Red Bull Gear box and Hydraulics, All they need now is a good design of the car for next year and I reckon they can move up the field a fair bit :)

kipi19

All they need now is the RBR chassis :P

Lotus are certainly serious about progress, I tip my fedora to them.KimisApprentice

I agree, its good to see they are trying to make progress. If only Virgin Racing and Hispania would shape up a bit. Although to be fair I feel Virgin are working better on their car than Hispania who seem to be just nowhere in pace terms.

[QUOTE="KimisApprentice"]Lotus are certainly serious about progress, I tip my fedora to them.Garfield360UK

I agree, its good to see they are trying to make progress. If only Virgin Racing and Hispania would shape up a bit. Although to be fair I feel Virgin are working better on their car than Hispania who seem to be just nowhere in pace terms.

Why aren't Virgin doing very good?
They are backed by Richard Branson who has tons of money.

Money is all well and good, BUT, you need to have the people, right rescouces, and the teamwork and drivers to pull the team forward.

Jarno and Heikki for lotus, both previous race winners no matter how you look at it, One rookie-ish and one veteran, both exactly what a new team need to progress further, plus a lot of ambition to make sure they succeed.

Timo and Lucas for Virgin? Time i've sometimes rated, but is never consistant and Lucas is a fresh rookie, not what I'd want, i'd want someone a lil more seasoned before a new team came in

And Hispania... need i say more really, Shoddy operation, Both drivers cannot do anything with their car, Both are highly rated drivers too, but are caught in a team where the car is worse handling than a puppy on a polished kitchen floor =/

Money is all well and good, BUT, you need to have the people, right rescouces, and the teamwork and drivers to pull the team forward.

Jarno and Heikki for lotus, both previous race winners no matter how you look at it, One rookie-ish and one veteran, both exactly what a new team need to progress further, plus a lot of ambition to make sure they succeed.

Timo and Lucas for Virgin? Time i've sometimes rated, but is never consistant and Lucas is a fresh rookie, not what I'd want, i'd want someone a lil more seasoned before a new team came in

And Hispania... need i say more really, Shoddy operation, Both drivers cannot do anything with their car, Both are highly rated drivers too, but are caught in a team where the car is worse handling than a puppy on a polished kitchen floor =/

kipi19

If the drivers are the problem, why not make a better car?

I mean, seeing as money's not a problem, why not hire Stephen Hawking? Or ressurect Albert Einstein?

*sigh*, Driver is as only as good as the car he is given, Sometimes drivers can excel in a not so great car, Schumacher did it with his Benneton in 1994, Same with 1995 when Damon never capatilised on his awesome Williams, Lewis did the same in his McLaren last year towards the end of the year.

Other instances can be found in the past, But more often than not, if the car is a dog, then the driver can only do so much to keep it on the straight and narrow.

*sigh*, Driver is as only as good as the car he is given, Sometimes drivers can excel in a not so great car, Schumacher did it with his Benneton in 1994, Same with 1995 when Damon never capatilised on his awesome Williams, Lewis did the same in his McLaren last year towards the end of the year.

Other instances can be found in the past, But more often than not, if the car is a dog, then the driver can only do so much to keep it on the straight and narrow.

kipi19

Why are you sighing for?
I just said why not make a better car, get Stephen Hawking to use his powers of physics to make an amazing car.

But to make a better car you need to have all the things working together in harmonous fashion, Car, Aero, The team, Updates, Pit Crew, Crew back at the factory. If its not all working... It'll just stall and the car is not gonna be as fast as the others.kipi19

To make a better car you need a genius :D
And make the pit crew robots (doesn't say in the rules that you can't do this)
Remember, this is Virgin, they have a **** load of money.

Virgin sponsor Manor Grand Prix I think, they don't actually own them but I may be wrong (there may be shares in the team but from a recent news post where Virgin were saying they were looking for more sponsorship). It depends on how much you want to spend, I mean realistically is there any point in the team spending more money as others ahead will just do the same to get ahead again so its a vicious cycle of spending to go nowhere. They need a bit of luck and a better car but without being a racing driver I cant say where they are loosing pace. They are maybe 10 seconds a lap down, but is that due to the car being too slow on the straights, needing to break a lot earlier for corners, a lot of understeer forcing you to be much slower around corners or maybe oversteer?

Only the drivers can answer that question and then what do you do from there as a new car design takes a lot of time and means you are spending less time working on next seasons car to fix a car that is already at the back of the field and a long way off scoring points consistently. Maybe Virgin Racing are happy where they are, they dont sound like they are going bankrupt but are just looking for cash to maybe get their car a bit faster. However do you need to be winning all the time to be in the sport?

Minardi did not win a single grand prix but they still lasted a heck of a long time in the sport by getting a point or two every two or three years. That was like winning a championship for that team as they had beaten teams with considerably larger budgets to theirs. This is why I back the under dog, beacuse I would like to see the smaller teams do well and want them to continue in the sport.

People, please. The easiest way to answer this question is by giving a one-word answer. One that proves money =/= success.

Toyota.

People, please. The easiest way to answer this question is by giving a one-word answer. One that proves money =/= success.

Toyota.

Redders1989

Yup that's what I was going to say if nobody brought it up :lol:

But if you haven't got the genius' to design your car, the right engine to get you moving, nor the right people to keep the car in tip top condition and updated to the maximum, its still all redundent no matter what money you have. :)kipi19

So why doesn't Virgin spend the money?

Virgin sponsor Manor Grand Prix I think, they don't actually own them but I may be wrong (there may be shares in the team but from a recent news post where Virgin were saying they were looking for more sponsorship). It depends on how much you want to spend, I mean realistically is there any point in the team spending more money as others ahead will just do the same to get ahead again so its a vicious cycle of spending to go nowhere. They need a bit of luck and a better car but without being a racing driver I cant say where they are loosing pace. They are maybe 10 seconds a lap down, but is that due to the car being too slow on the straights, needing to break a lot earlier for corners, a lot of understeer forcing you to be much slower around corners or maybe oversteer?

Only the drivers can answer that question and then what do you do from there as a new car design takes a lot of time and means you are spending less time working on next seasons car to fix a car that is already at the back of the field and a long way off scoring points consistently. Maybe Virgin Racing are happy where they are, they dont sound like they are going bankrupt but are just looking for cash to maybe get their car a bit faster. However do you need to be winning all the time to be in the sport?

Minardi did not win a single grand prix but they still lasted a heck of a long time in the sport by getting a point or two every two or three years. That was like winning a championship for that team as they had beaten teams with considerably larger budgets to theirs. This is why I back the under dog, beacuse I would like to see the smaller teams do well and want them to continue in the sport.

Garfield360UK

Yeah but how many Stephen Hawkings are in the world :P

People, please. The easiest way to answer this question is by giving a one-word answer. One that proves money =/= success.

Toyota.

Redders1989

Pardon me but, what does "=/=" mean?

I think Redders just droped a touchdown there. Good answer, Toyota spending silly ammounts of cash to really stay midfield. To be fair they got a few front row starts I think but they never got qualifying form into pure race pace.

[QUOTE="Redders1989"]

People, please. The easiest way to answer this question is by giving a one-word answer. One that proves money =/= success.

Toyota.

dabest2500

Pardon me but, what does "=/=" mean?

Does not equal.

[QUOTE="dabest2500"][QUOTE="Redders1989"]

People, please. The easiest way to answer this question is by giving a one-word answer. One that proves money =/= success.

Toyota.

Redders1989

Pardon me but, what does "=/=" mean?

Does not equal.

OH!

It's supposed to be one "=" with a line in the middle.
Am I right in saying this?

It's supposed to be one "=" with a line in the middle.
Am I right in saying this?dabest2500

Indeed you are.

[QUOTE="dabest2500"]It's supposed to be one "=" with a line in the middle.
Am I right in saying this?Redders1989

Indeed you are.

Thank yoop :D

I should also point out that the Virgin car was designed entirely in CFD with no wind tunnel testing as is Wurth's philosophy. The problem being CFD isn't at a level that correlates 100% with the real world whereas a correctly calibrated wind tunnel is VERY close to replicating the real world airflow over the car.

At present they use the exact same drivetrain - engine + gearbox as Lotus and Hispania so the major differentiators between these cars then are down to aero + suspension + drivers and even then the cars will have to have reasonably similar rear suspension as I believe the Xtrac gearbox is a spec part and so a number of rear suspension parts must anchor onto the gearbox in the same way. Lotus currently do far better, and that is largely because they have the people - Mike Gascoyne in particular has experience in designing an entire contemporary F1 car on his own unlike guys like Geoff Willis and Wurth of HRT and Virgin respectively.

Toyota's example proves what I did say though :P, No matter how much money you throw at it, you have to have the people and the resources on the track, in the pits and back at the factories working harmoniously, otherwise its all redundant :)kipi19

All money but no action?
(Need to think of a better way of saying that :P)

[QUOTE="kipi19"]Toyota's example proves what I did say though :P, No matter how much money you throw at it, you have to have the people and the resources on the track, in the pits and back at the factories working harmoniously, otherwise its all redundant :)dabest2500

All money but no action?
(Need to think of a better way of saying that :P)

Yeah, kipi's right, if you are completely useless at management, your team will suck.

Yeah there were issues with constant changing of team managers etc. They had the grounds of being an excellent team but infighting caused big problems. It was sad that both they and Honda have pulled out of the sport as they offered quite a lot to it in history.Garfield360UK

And Honda winning at Suzuka and Toyota winning at Fuji would have really been something...

As the old saying goes, money won't buy you happiness....or in this case a winning F1 team.

Actually it really would have been something if Toyota won at Suzuka and Honda at Fuji :lol:

As the old saying goes, money won't buy you happiness....or in this case a winning F1 team.

Actually it really would have been something if Toyota won at Suzuka and Honda at Fuji :lol:

SchumiF1

Money won't buy you happiness, but it can buy you McLaren!

How do you make a small fortune racing?

Start with a large one.
KimisApprentice

And that's what Eddie Jordan said.