Condemned 2 already being affected by the Manhunt 2 ESRB Decision

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When asked iF the Manhunt 2 ESRB Ruling made them think twice on the game:

"Absolutely it did," he told CVG. "And one of the things I want to make clear is that this does not take place in the real world. This is a fictional universe. That said we're pretty cognisant of the ESRB and the Manhunt thing."

Hantzopoulos has been on the wrong end of the ESRB in the past. "I worked on Fahrenheit (known as Indigo Prophecy in the States) and had to cut the sex scenes out of the game for the US. Yes, I was the guy that did that. It sucked because I don't believe in that, right. But you've got to do what you've got to do. We're working closely with the ESRB to make sure everything goes through okay but there's stuff we've cut already. There were things we were doing that even I couldn't believe we were going to those places."

When asked for examples of what we might now never see in a game again, we were told, "An example of what we cut would be putting someone's head in a vice. That was too much, you know. There are also some decapitations we've lost. But this is more Sin City than it is real world and we want people to know that this is not a real world.

"Manhunt kind of takes place in a real world where you're killing prisoners and people. This is a sensitive subject and we'll pull back if we need to. If someone says we can't that, we'll pull back a little. We're actually in pretty good shape. Putting someone in a dumpster is comical, it's funny. But putting someone through a TV set..."

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Gah blame the big three for controlling our content.

If I'm paying $600 to see heads in vices, I deserve that. Anyone who objects has the CHOICE of not buying the game.

So let me get this straight...

I'll probably never see an animated man have his head squashed by a vice in a videogame. Stores would refuse to sell it and Sony would not allow it on the PS3.

But for the last 3 months, 4 or 5 times a day, I could see a movie on HBO where a (real) woman is raped and murdered while her infant is held at gunpoint. I can even pick up the "unrated" DVD from Walmart and watch that scene over and over again on a PS3.

::shrug::

waits for video games to go "unrated".

I should also add that the ESRB is not in any, way, shape, or form a government body (you'd be surprised at how many people don't know this).

Where does this leave Suda 51 and No More Heroes? Last time I read in IGN, Suda claimed that his goal was to make his game more violent than Manhunt 2...but I think he was joking. ASK_Story

Cel-shading will protect him.

waits for video games to go "unrated".

I should also add that the ESRB is not in any, way, shape, or form a government body (you'd be surprised at how many people don't know this).

jrhawk42

My guess is that unrated games wiould get the same treatment as AO games.

I'd say that really violent games like these are part of a niche market and as such would benefit from internet distribution rather than physical (bulk) store sales. Just insert age verification to keep the regulators off their backs and they'd be in business.Eldramesha

No. Condemned was not a niche game. There was a good chuink of people that bought that game and I personally always want a hard copy of whatever I own. Not to mention it would take up too much space on the 360 if it were only released over live.

Stuff like this will keep happening as long as authorities stubbornly consider videogames to be something for children, rather than a medium that can be enjoyed by people of all ages. A movie like Hostel 2, which has very realistic gore and violence has no problem getting into theatres but a game with clearly visible polygons, low resolution textures and unrealistic character animation gets banned? What kind of double standard is this? In Saw 3 there's a guy who gets all of his joints completely twisted so you can see the blood and cracked bones sticking out of this legs and arms, when was the last time you saw THAT in a videogame?Gencoil

Exactly. I agree that videogames can be more influential than movies, just because they're interactive, but ppl need to realize that they are not trgeted at children any more.

"Putting someone in a dumpster is comical, it's funny. But putting someone through a TV set..."

:| I might be semi-sosiopathic but that makes no sense to me at all. I don't see the difference, if both are attemps at murder... wtf?

[spoiler] because there was pr0n on the TV, maybe? -_- | there is something deeply wrong with the world! [/spoiler]

"Putting someone in a dumpster is comical, it's funny. But putting someone through a TV set..."

:| I might be semi-sosiopathic but that makes no sense to me at all. I don't see the difference, if both are attemps at murder... wtf?

[spoiler] because there was pr0n on the TV, maybe? -_- | there is something deeply wrong with the world! [/spoiler]

toment

Yeah it's stoopid. They should go all Ichi the Killer on them and do the mans head stuffed in a TV like that. :P

[QUOTE="jrhawk42"]

waits for video games to go "unrated".

I should also add that the ESRB is not in any, way, shape, or form a government body (you'd be surprised at how many people don't know this).

H3LLRaiseR

My guess is that unrated games wiould get the same treatment as AO games.

They already do. Just about any store that refuses to sell AO games will also refuse to sell unrated games (except in the case of preorders), which is a bs double standard considering you can buy unrated movies at those exact same stores.

Gah blame the big three for controlling our content.

If I'm paying $600 to see heads in vices, I deserve that. Anyone who objects has the CHOICE of not buying the game.

Revelade

+1. I want heads in vices!

[QUOTE="ASK_Story"]Where does this leave Suda 51 and No More Heroes? Last time I read in IGN, Suda claimed that his goal was to make his game more violent than Manhunt 2...but I think he was joking. gaminggeek

That's right. The good ol` cell-shading trick...although there are some people who take anime quite seriously, if you know what I mean.

Cel-shading will protect him.

[QUOTE="Revelade"]

Gah blame the big three for controlling our content.

If I'm paying $600 to see heads in vices, I deserve that. Anyone who objects has the CHOICE of not buying the game.

MyopicCanadian

+1. I want heads in vices!

Ichi was a lousy movie btw. not extreme enough to be really shocking and when all the production effort has gone into making it that way you are left with nothing. Like a wet slice of bread. With nothing on.toment

Wrong again. Just like Jennifer Connely in every movie she does :P The Rocketeer!

I'd be better off not reading this stuff at all - it saddens and frustrates me to no end. "Working closely" with the ESRB is the last thing developers should be doing. It's censorship, pure and simple. I hate this guy, he's got his head so far up the ESRB's ass that it just sickens me. I just love how he's so quick to point out that Condemned 2 takes place in a fictional universe. The sad thing is, the whole industry is like that - complacent and obedient. Rock and roll and hip-hop won over because they stubbornly defied prejudice and hypocrisy. If some of these developers don't show that they've got balls and make a stand for what they believe in, video games will always be percieved as entertainment for children.

In the immortal words of GodModeEnabled - I love Manhunt, **** the ESRB.

I'd be better off not reading this stuff at all - it saddens and frustrates me to no end. "Working closely" with the ESRB is the last thing developers should be doing. It's censorship, pure and simple. I hate this guy, he's got his head so far up the ESRB's as-s that it just sickens me. I just love how he's so quick to point out that Condemned 2 takes place in a fictional universe. The sad thing is, the whole industry is like that - complacent and obedient. Rock and roll and hip-hop won over because they stubbornly defied prejudice and hypocrisy. If some of these developers don't show that they've got balls and make a stand for what they believe in, video games will always be percieved as entertainment for children.

In the immortal words of GodModeEnabled - I love Manhunt, **** the ESRB.

UpInFlames

This expresses my feelings on the matter completely. What a tool that guy is. I so regret buying the first Condemned. Couldn't stand how he kept saying Condemned is a ficticious universe whereas Manhunt was the real world as though he almost believed it. It's like how when the Danish newspaper published the Mohammad cartoons and then after the Muslim outcry every journalist, newspaper, and government instead of printing them themselves as a show of solidarity they were **** and distancing themselves...

It sickens me how easily people surrender their freedom for some cash and the illusion of safety.

edit: so funny how the autocensor on here picked out **** (mod note: If something is censored, even in this manner, please don't bypass the censor).

[QUOTE="UpInFlames"]

I'd be better off not reading this stuff at all - it saddens and frustrates me to no end. "Working closely" with the ESRB is the last thing developers should be doing. It's censorship, pure and simple. I hate this guy, he's got his head so far up the ESRB's as-s that it just sickens me. I just love how he's so quick to point out that Condemned 2 takes place in a fictional universe. The sad thing is, the whole industry is like that - complacent and obedient. Rock and roll and hip-hop won over because they stubbornly defied prejudice and hypocrisy. If some of these developers don't show that they've got balls and make a stand for what they believe in, video games will always be percieved as entertainment for children.

In the immortal words of GodModeEnabled - I love Manhunt, **** the ESRB.

bugsonglass

This expresses my feelings on the matter completely. What a tool that guy is. I so regret buying the first Condemned. Couldn't stand how he kept saying Condemned is a ficticious universe whereas Manhunt was the real world as though he almost believed it. It's like how when the Danish newspaper published the Mohammad cartoons and then after the Muslim outcry every journalist, newspaper, and government instead of printing them themselves as a show of solidarity they were **** and distancing themselves...

It sickens me how easily people surrender their freedom for some cash and the illusion of safety.

edit: so funny how the autocensor on here picked out pus-syfooting

what these two guys said

Ugh. It seems that whether we like it or not, the Manhunt 2 issue did set a precedent, both for developers and for the ESRB, and instead of witnessing a strong response from devs towards the ESRB, we will watch how more and more of them try to cater to the ESRB's cryptic guidelines and decency standards, in order to avoid that AO-disguised ban.

Welcome to nineteen eightyfour.

Working together with the ESRB? :|

Talk about kissing the ESRB's...... Is this guy for real? Many ideas they had store for this anticipated sequel will be removed out of the gate, before taking the risk of what they intended for the game.

Talk about surrendering to the ESRB. Man this is irritating. *kicks a 20yd FG, oh waitit was theneighbor's puppy* :P

I'd be better off not reading this stuff at all - it saddens and frustrates me to no end. "Working closely" with the ESRB is the last thing developers should be doing. It's censorship, pure and simple. I hate this guy, he's got his head so far up the ESRB's ass that it just sickens me. I just love how he's so quick to point out that Condemned 2 takes place in a fictional universe. The sad thing is, the whole industry is like that - complacent and obedient. Rock and roll and hip-hop won over because they stubbornly defied prejudice and hypocrisy. If some of these developers don't show that they've got balls and make a stand for what they believe in, video games will always be percieved as entertainment for children.

In the immortal words of GodModeEnabled - I love Manhunt, **** the ESRB.

UpInFlames

Kinda reminds me of this one...