Condescending Attitude Towards Girl Gamers

Sorry if this is a long read/rant. Just skip the first part if it's too much.

I was in Gamestop this morning picking up CoD:BlOps as a present for my niece. When I got to the register the Gamestop employee did the usual Edge card offer. I told the employee that I get my games from Steam, so the Edge card was useless to me. He's a PC gamer as well and that sparked a good conversation. About an hour later a couple of typical gaming nerds walked in. The employee and I were talking about Heroes of Stalingrad, I mentioned how I was looking forward to that game way more than Battlefield 3. One of the gaming nerds scoffed at me and started going off about how it was impossible that a game he never heard about could be better than the next BF:BC3. The employee and I both laughed at this. The other nerd walked over to the counter, looked at my purchase and said it was good to see a girl getting into a hardcore game. I told him I was buying it for a 17 year old girl and that I don't play the CoD series because I think the SP is weak. The first nerd dismissed me by saying "What do you know about gaming anyway? Girls don't know about hardcore gaming". I just laughed, exchanged numbers with the Gamestop employee and left.

Dealing with immature teenage boys online isn't something I get worked up about. They are teenager so what do you expect? What really ticks me off is the all to often disappointing behavior of many adult males. I get accused of screen watching or cheating anytime I'm doing well. If I'm having a bad gaming day then it's because "girls just don't know how to play". Unfortunately my conversation with the Gamestop employee was one of the few good conversation I've had with a male gamer outside my group of friends. He didn't spend the first 30 minutes trying to get over the fact that I am a girl that plays games. He didn't assume that I only played rhythm and puzzle games. He never implied that I a boyfriend that must have gotten me into gaming (my mom got me into gaming btw). He didn't try to make it appear that he knew more about gaming than I did. It was refreshing to be seen as just a fellow gamer.

I've been dealing with this attitude for over 20 years. My niece who is 10 years younger than me also has to deal with this as well. She's resolved to not use her mic online and won't tell males that she games because she is sick of dealing with their superiority complex. I want to know from a male gamers stand point what makes males have such a condescending attitude towards female gamers? I don't encounter this sort of thing at the comic book store or with sci fi nerds, so what makes male gamers different?

I think lots of girls are good at games. But stereotypes have speard that makes girls look like preps (which some of them are) who know nothing about games or gaming at all.

I can relate. Same boat for 20+ years. I have loved all kinds of games but my heart belongs to FPS's. Thankfully I had a bunch of great guy friends who were very supportive. Once I starting playing on-line I heard all kinds of grief. I found a good bunch of peeps on-line & joined a clan to make it less offensive and annoying. But why should I resort to playing with the same peeps because others just slam you if you do well or even if you have a bad round. Don't get me wrong, I'm not made of glass ... I'm not easily offended. Why the disrespect?

three words: Fragile Male Ego.

This discussion have been up a few times, and it is an interresting one to say the least, since I can not really understand the problem some people have.

I am (and know quite a few) who are of the understanding that when playing with or against other people online, only the skills and talents a player has really matters, we are all disembodied out there, so a persons sex is fairly irellevent.

besides, a girl WILL kill you out there :P through the scope of a high powered rifle, just as deadly and jsut as effecient as any male. (if it is thier hobby)

Yet when I play it really is true, as soon as a female player opens her mouth you begin to hear the slurs of the social rejects trying to belittle her, and it only gets worse if she proves to be good, and my conclusion usually ends in it being a society thing, that some people really still thinks that males are better at certain things that women are, gaming being one of those.

Surprisingly enough whenever this have been brought up, it is almsot surefire that some girl/woman will show up and accuse me of ignoring that they are females with this train of thoughts, so I do not know if they are offensive to some.

I quote Spike: "I love a woman who can kick my ass". I love girl gamers, whether they're good or bad. I don't mind playing with guys all the time online, but ya gotta mix it up once in awhile.

The average human being is not very smart. Gaming is now sufficiently mainstream that the pool of gamers has basically begun to include those average human beings. That's about it.

I must admit that I find it a little ironic that, in a post in which you complain about the stereotyping of female gamers, you proceed to stereotype male gamers. :P

three words: Fragile Male Ego.

This discussion have been up a few times, and it is an interresting one to say the least, since I can not really understand the problem some people have.

I am (and know quite a few) who are of the understanding that when playing with or against other people online, only the skills and talents a player has really matters, we are all disembodied out there, so a persons sex is fairly irellevent.

besides, a girl WILL kill you out there :P through the scope of a high powered rifle, just as deadly and jsut as effecient as any male. (if it is thier hobby)

Yet when I play it really is true, as soon as a female player opens her mouth you begin to hear the slurs of the social rejects trying to belittle her, and it only gets worse if she proves to be good, and my conclusion usually ends in it being a society thing, that some people really still thinks that males are better at certain things that women are, gaming being one of those.

Surprisingly enough whenever this have been brought up, it is almsot surefire that some girl/woman will show up and accuse me of ignoring that they are females with this train of thoughts, so I do not know if they are offensive to some.

Maddie_Larkin

Exactly. It shouldn't be that way but lets face it - men these days are soft. And it's getting worse.

They rage quit, they whine, and they cry when they lose. They know it and they want to take it out on YOU. They're pathetic and I don't get along with those types either. All guys aren't like that but you're going to run into losers like that because they're everywhere. It's rampant in video games becuase there isn't much responsibility involoved.

If you take up say martial arts then you are completely responsible for everything that happens to you. You learn disipline and you learn to respect others. Or you get thrown into the ground repeatedly by people of varying races and genders until you figure it out. You don't have that in video games. You can blame lag, game design and all sorts of crap. This allows people to whine and comlplain when something goes wrong and take pride in anything they manage to do well. Just imagine the blow to the fragile ego when GamerGirl007 shows up and obviously doesn't have all of the self-esteem issues they do.

Like a rat in a corner they pounce and do whatever they can to feel adequate. And all you did was walk into the room. I say don't worry about it. Some people are just messed up and it's not worth wasting your time to worry about them. They'll get their culture shock sooner or later. Or maybe they already got it. At any rate I'm sure you wouldn't associate yourself with people like that for obvious reasons and the fact that they think alike should tell you a lot...

I'm sure that they are the minority of guy gamers though.

Cheers.

I mean it's different for different reasons. Overall, from my experience, girl gamers are pretty rare. I can only honestly think of three girls I know that game, and they don't do it regularly by any means, one doesn't even own any systems any more. So I mean, I've never encountered a hardcore girl gamer, but they definitely do exist. And I think guys just find it a mixture of exciting and/or intimidating when they meet a girl who games.

For me, I still find it exciting when I find out a girl games a little or is interested or is just pro-games (an ex of mine openly hated and bashed video games constantly) but it's not an earth-shattering event, it's just cool and kinda nice. So I would presume guys encounter a girl who's encroaching on their territory so to speak, and they try and trump themselves up and seem like the top-dog, which is just kinda childish.

Also I'm genuinely shocked at the behavior of the guys in the store, that's somewhat appalling that they would act like that, and therefore on behalf of all men gamers, and men in general, I do sincerely apologize. (And props for not liking CoD campaign, it's trash.)

I love the fact that my girl is a gamer..to show how much I respect her as a gamer I went and bought the new Bratz DS game! So cute :oops:

The ironic stereotyping of male gamers when this thread is about stereotyping being bad is ridiculous.

Youre going into what has predominantly been a male activity, get used to people giving you a hard time about it until more girls get in gaming.

Sex doesn't matter in game, its pretty much if you're good you're good, if you're bad then you're just bad. Although i never really cared much about who played, i do find it insulting the fact that something like gaming can be judged by people's appearance. Although I have never been "super good" at any game so I have avoided the "oh you look like this (pic of some nerd)".

I myself never really placed gender in the "gaming" situation and other things such as sports (even though I'm a guy) i just don't see it as a big deal". It all boils down to whether you're having fun with the person or not. This is probably due to the fact that my sisters both like to play games and i usually try to provoke other girls to get involved with video games

The average human being is not very smart. Gaming is now sufficiently mainstream that the pool of gamers has basically begun to include those average human beings. That's about it.

I must admit that I find it a little ironic that, in a post in which you complain about the stereotyping of female gamers, you proceed to stereotype male gamers. :PGabuEx

If it came off that I am stereotyping male gamers I didn't mean it that way. There are plenty of decent male gamers. Sadly I don't come across them to often in real world scenarios. It's strange because in all my other hobbies and interest (sci-fi, anime and comics) I don't come across this behavior from the males. Sometimes they get a bit creepy but that's it. I also do competitive shooting as a hobby. I've never had any issue with males at the range. If I out score a male on the range normally I get a slap on the back and the first round of drinks on them. Now beating a male on a video game normally results in rage quitting. In a way I am stereotyping male gamers, but it's from personal experience.

Good choice in games as well - Heroes of Stalingrad looks the goods, though I have to say that Battlefield 3 probably has me more interested at the moment. Sagacious_Tien

The ironic stereotyping of male gamers when this thread is about stereotyping being bad is ridiculous.

Youre going into what has predominantly been a male activity, get used to people giving you a hard time about it until more girls get in gaming.

WreckEm711

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

The average human being is not very smart. Gaming is now sufficiently mainstream that the pool of gamers has basically begun to include those average human beings. That's about it.

I must admit that I find it a little ironic that, in a post in which you complain about the stereotyping of female gamers, you proceed to stereotype male gamers. :PPeerbreed

If it came off that I am stereotyping male gamers I didn't mean it that way. There are plenty of decent male gamers. Sadly I don't come across them to often in real world scenarios. It's strange because in all my other hobbies and interest (sci-fi, anime and comics) I don't come across this behavior from the males. Sometimes they get a bit creepy but that's it. I also do competitive shooting as a hobby. I've never had any issue with males at the range. If I out score a male on the range normally I get a slap on the back and the first round of drinks on them. Now beating a male on a video game normally results in rage quitting. In a way I am stereotyping male gamers, but it's from personal experience.

Well I think one other difference between video games and all the other things you describe is what Penny Arcade described as the Greater Internet ****wad Theory (language warning, obviously).

I just chalk it up to makeup envy. =PAllicrombie

Envy? Yes I have seen how I look with mascara..and only one word comes to mind...delicious.

The female "gamers" that most of us are irritated by are the ones who claim to be really into gaming but couldn't tell you the difference between Mario and Master ChiefUT_Wrestler

Now imagine how we feel about them...

I've never come across what TC describes, thankfully, but that is probably becuase I never play multi-player FPS. I hardly ever play online except in MMOs, and there's a lot more females in them, so it's not as fantastic when a woman shows up in-game in one of them. I get a bit of a weird look in the local game store occasionally, but never from the employees. They're great, all of them. Especially the girls. ;)

I'm not sure what's worse. The guys who are rude or the guys who flirt constantly. I once had a guy recite poetry to me during L4D2. Way to ruin the game lol.Peerbreed

The ones who flirt are worse. If they're rude, you can get angry, and people get why you're angry. If they flirt, you get the "but it was a compliment", and no one understands why it's so @@##$%^*(())(*$W!@$#@#^$ annoying you want to reach through the voice chat and rip them to bits and pieces. ;)

I can see how it could be something annoying as a girl gamer. I certainly don't make a big deal out of it. I understand it's a primarily male dominated interest, but doesn't mean that there aren't plenty of girls who love it. I don't purposely talk to girl gamers just because they're girls and I don't look down upon them and automatically assume they know less about gaming. Hell if anything I assume that most teenage boys don't know a whole lot about gaming outside of COD. B

BTW I am a 16 yr old male, so not all teenagers are bad:P

[QUOTE="Allicrombie"]I just chalk it up to makeup envy. =PSacif

Envy? Yes I have seen how I look with mascara..and only one word comes to mind...delicious.

it's so @@##$%^*(())(*$W!@$#@#^$ annoying you want to reach through the voice chat and rip them to bits and pieces. ;)

ChiliDragon

I want the guys to continue being mean. It's the lesser evil :)Peerbreed

Ladies, I have the perfect page for you on which to copy and print out and post it somewhere where you can see it or take with you to show when you come upon the uneducated masses of male gamers that think gaming is dominated by them. Industry Facts from The Entertainment Software Association does show that women over 18 make up a larger portion of the gaming community compared to males 17 and under (33% to 20%) and make up 40% of all game players (you are right DDRMom).

I have seen guys treat women in a condescending manner, even on their own forums (Ubi's Frag Dolls forum) and in game too. I have had some of the most fun playing with girl gamers. R6 was a blast playing with the old Girls n Guns clan 11 years ago. When I hosted servers for RS and GR, I made sure everyone treated everyone respectfully no matter what sex they were and if someone talked trash to a female, they were booted pretty darn quick.

Peerbreed, thanks for the info on Heros of Stalingrad. I am gonna keep an eye out for it myself. I am still awaiting 1C's SOW:BOB, but Oleg has been working on that for years and who knows how long it will be before it is released.

It's true, it's still around today. i for one like having girl gamers. Makes it so that people playing female characters in games are actually females sometimes.

Of all the many times I have been to Gamestop, I have never been treated like that. And if I ever was, I could care less.

Funny story, my wife who I'm with now, I actually got to know her better because back in college I was always going over to her dorm to play her xbox. I thought it was really cool at the time that she was as into gaming as I was, and even though I wasn't really attracted to her at first (too skinny, too short), she gradually started to grow on me because we developed a deep emotional connection that started with a common interest.UT_Wrestler

Yeah there is something to be said for having common interests.

There just isn't that many core female gamers out there sadly. Video games are becoming more mainstream and accessible all the time though, so things are slowly becoming more open to everyone.

A lot of the core female gamers that do exist seem to try to over-compensate to deal with the hazing they get from some male gamers, and then most girls stick their noses up at just about anything gaming, so most guys don't know how to deal with female gamers in general.

those are usually the FPS fanboy that don't play anything but COD or Halo or any other FPS all the time and they thing they are better than every one else

they are unlike the real gamer have no respect whatsoever to other gamer

if a girl ( female ) kicked their ass they start all this stupid talk about how they are not hardcore and that they got luck and bla bla bla

if a boy ( male ) like me kicked their ass they start with your just a noob and start trash talking and sending hat massages

it doesn't matter for them if you are a boy or girl they will just find something bad to say about you so they can feel good about them selves and trying to find any stupid reason to why or to cover the fact that they found someone who plays better than them

There just isn't that many core female gamers out there sadly. Video games are becoming more mainstream and accessible all the time though, so things are slowly becoming more open to everyone.

A lot of the core female gamers that do exist seem to try to over-compensate to deal with the hazing they get from some male gamers, and then most girls stick their noses up at just about anything gaming, so most guys don't know how to deal with female gamers in general.

Bigboi500

What do you consider a core gamer? Just someone that plays an FPS? 40% is a large number of gamers, especially when the number of women gamers outnumber the gamers that are typically the ones spewing the vitriol towards the females.

those are usually the FPS fanboy that don't play anything but COD or Halo or any other FPS all the time and they thing they are better than every one else

they are unlike the real gamer have no respect whatsoever to other gamer

if a girl ( female ) kicked their ass they start all this stupid talk about how they are not hardcore and that they got luck and bla bla bla

if a boy ( male ) like me kicked their ass they start with your just a noob and start trash talking and sending hat massages

it doesn't matter for them if you are a boy or girl they will just find something bad to say about you so they can feel good about them selves and trying to find any stupid reason to why or to cover the fact that they found someone who plays better than them

TheGrudge13

Interesting because most of them reek of autoaim. :lol:

Sorry if this is a long read/rant. Just skip the first part if it's too much.

I was in Gamestop this morning picking up CoD:BlOps as a present for my niece. When I got to the register the Gamestop employee did the usual Edge card offer. I told the employee that I get my games from Steam, so the Edge card was useless to me. He's a PC gamer as well and that sparked a good conversation. About an hour later a couple of typical gaming nerds walked in. The employee and I were talking about Heroes of Stalingrad, I mentioned how I was looking forward to that game way more than Battlefield 3. One of the gaming nerds scoffed at me and started going off about how it was impossible that a game he never heard about could be better than the next BF:BC3. The employee and I both laughed at this. The other nerd walked over to the counter, looked at my purchase and said it was good to see a girl getting into a hardcore game. I told him I was buying it for a 17 year old girl and that I don't play the CoD series because I think the SP is weak. The first nerd dismissed me by saying "What do you know about gaming anyway? Girls don't know about hardcore gaming". I just laughed, exchanged numbers with the Gamestop employee and left.

Dealing with immature teenage boys online isn't something I get worked up about. They are teenager so what do you expect? What really ticks me off is the all to often disappointing behavior of many adult males. I get accused of screen watching or cheating anytime I'm doing well. If I'm having a bad gaming day then it's because "girls just don't know how to play". Unfortunately my conversation with the Gamestop employee was one of the few good conversation I've had with a male gamer outside my group of friends. He didn't spend the first 30 minutes trying to get over the fact that I am a girl that plays games. He didn't assume that I only played rhythm and puzzle games. He never implied that I a boyfriend that must have gotten me into gaming (my mom got me into gaming btw). He didn't try to make it appear that he knew more about gaming than I did. It was refreshing to be seen as just a fellow gamer.

I've been dealing with this attitude for over 20 years. My niece who is 10 years younger than me also has to deal with this as well. She's resolved to not use her mic online and won't tell males that she games because she is sick of dealing with their superiority complex. I want to know from a male gamers stand point what makes males have such a condescending attitude towards female gamers? I don't encounter this sort of thing at the comic book store or with sci fi nerds, so what makes male gamers different?

Peerbreed

Gamers are gamers just like how people are people.

Sorry if this is a long read/rant. Just skip the first part if it's too much.

I was in Gamestop this morning picking up CoD:BlOps as a present for my niece. When I got to the register the Gamestop employee did the usual Edge card offer. I told the employee that I get my games from Steam, so the Edge card was useless to me. He's a PC gamer as well and that sparked a good conversation. About an hour later a couple of typical gaming nerds walked in. The employee and I were talking about Heroes of Stalingrad, I mentioned how I was looking forward to that game way more than Battlefield 3. One of the gaming nerds scoffed at me and started going off about how it was impossible that a game he never heard about could be better than the next BF:BC3. The employee and I both laughed at this. The other nerd walked over to the counter, looked at my purchase and said it was good to see a girl getting into a hardcore game. I told him I was buying it for a 17 year old girl and that I don't play the CoD series because I think the SP is weak. The first nerd dismissed me by saying "What do you know about gaming anyway? Girls don't know about hardcore gaming". I just laughed, exchanged numbers with the Gamestop employee and left.

Dealing with immature teenage boys online isn't something I get worked up about. They are teenager so what do you expect? What really ticks me off is the all to often disappointing behavior of many adult males. I get accused of screen watching or cheating anytime I'm doing well. If I'm having a bad gaming day then it's because "girls just don't know how to play". Unfortunately my conversation with the Gamestop employee was one of the few good conversation I've had with a male gamer outside my group of friends. He didn't spend the first 30 minutes trying to get over the fact that I am a girl that plays games. He didn't assume that I only played rhythm and puzzle games. He never implied that I a boyfriend that must have gotten me into gaming (my mom got me into gaming btw). He didn't try to make it appear that he knew more about gaming than I did. It was refreshing to be seen as just a fellow gamer.

I've been dealing with this attitude for over 20 years. My niece who is 10 years younger than me also has to deal with this as well. She's resolved to not use her mic online and won't tell males that she games because she is sick of dealing with their superiority complex. I want to know from a male gamers stand point what makes males have such a condescending attitude towards female gamers? I don't encounter this sort of thing at the comic book store or with sci fi nerds, so what makes male gamers different?

Peerbreed

The unfortunate truth is that alot of the "hardcore gaming" community are still insecure nerds who are scared of women. If I were you, I would've told them to shut the **** up and go back to their parents basement. I like when I see women gaming -- not because I'm some horny desperate nerd who wants to meet a gamergirl, but because it's good to see a wider variety of people enjoying a truly enjoyable hobby. Sorry if this left a bad taste in your mouth. Since the online community at large is still quite pathetic and immature, maybe you could have your niece focus on Single-Player games. Hell, I'm a 32 year old man who isn't offended by anything, and I still can't stand the online community (or most gamers, for that matter).

Best of luck in any case. :)

Hell, I'm a 32 year old man who isn't offended by anything, and I still can't stand the online community (or most gamers, for that matter).

Jbul

I am friends with a few girl gamers as my ex worked in a game store and her friends play, and most of them only talk to people they know otherwise they get zeroed out by wankers. No idea why.AzelKosMos

[QUOTE="AzelKosMos"]I am friends with a few girl gamers as my ex worked in a game store and her friends play, and most of them only talk to people they know otherwise they get zeroed out by wankers. No idea why.Peerbreed

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

There just isn't that many core female gamers out there sadly. Video games are becoming more mainstream and accessible all the time though, so things are slowly becoming more open to everyone.

A lot of the core female gamers that do exist seem to try to over-compensate to deal with the hazing they get from some male gamers, and then most girls stick their noses up at just about anything gaming, so most guys don't know how to deal with female gamers in general.

WhiteKnight77

What do you consider a core gamer? Just someone that plays an FPS? 40% is a large number of gamers, especially when the number of women gamers outnumber the gamers that are typically the ones spewing the vitriol towards the females.

My mother games pretty hard, I got her playing Tales of Vesperia now, but my fiance doesn't play anything but farmville and the occasional fighting game casually.

You forgot Jews, blacks, children, homosexuals, people with motor problems and speech impediments, and basically every group that ever existed. Don't think you are special.

I can think of 2 reasons why you were treated like that

1. Gaming is generally considered a heavily male dominant hobby (around 30% are females and 70% are males with the female percentage increasing atm so that is not entirely true anymore). As a result, when a male gamers may sometimes be surprised when he sees a female gamer. Back like 5 years ago where I lived gaming was considered a hobby only for children and as a result, when an adult played games he was being looked at funny "arent you a bit too old to play games?". Female Gamers are unfortunately being stereotyped as "ignorant and bad players", and as a result being beaten by them is something that would make them "look bad", and in order to cover up for their defeat they will attempt to accuse the opponent of cheating or just being lucky.
2. Second is the fact that people like feeling superior to other people (whether it is justified or not). It spans not only across genders, but also ethnicities, religious beliefs, nationalities and even neurolical physical features. Since it is easy to say someone is wrong and use any of the above mentioned things as an excuse to why he is wrong is a lot easier than giving an intelligent reason why he is wrong. As for people accusing you of cheating when you are doing well, that has to do with this as well to an extent, since they see themselves as the superior person and getting beaten by a woman would reduce their ego.

Oh yeah, I think you are doing a good choice choosing Red Orchestra: Heroes of Stalingrad over Battlefield 3. Looks like a much better game anyway.

Also, some of the best players out there are female, have you heard of ToSsGirL? She is one of the best starcraft players in the world.

[QUOTE="Jbul"] Hell, I'm a 32 year old man who isn't offended by anything, and I still can't stand the online community (or most gamers, for that matter).

AzelKosMos

Best thing I ever did.

Xbox Live, Privacy Settings, Voice Communication/Messages, Friends Only

[QUOTE="AzelKosMos"]

[QUOTE="Jbul"] Hell, I'm a 32 year old man who isn't offended by anything, and I still can't stand the online community (or most gamers, for that matter).

Jbul

Best thing I ever did.

Xbox Live, Privacy Settings, Voice Communication/Messages, Friends Only