does the current zelda games have hand-holding in them?

theres a zelda thread on neogaf where some people complaing that the current( post OoT that is) zelda games have hold your hand. is that true and what does the game hold your hand? Never played them before so I wouldn't know if its true or not. the only thing I can think of is you have some annoying partner

Not more than the average modern game (haven't played Skyward Sword tho).

I can't speak for Skyward Sword, but I remember that the first few hours of Twilight Princess were like that. Basically, it felt that the game was teaching you all the basics of the game at the beginning instead of spreading it out more evenly, which destroyed the pacing. I would say that the DS games do as well, but at the same time they're different Zeldas in terms of mechanics, which I think pans them out differently than the others in terms of pacing/difficulty.

They have a disgusting amount of hand holding. Modern Nintendo games in general do, I'd say almost more than most modern games. Skyward Sword wasn't ruined by the motion controls (however awful they were), it was ruined by the continuous f*cking stream of tutorials and pointing out the obvious with text that moves at f*cking glacial speeds. I hate Fi, I hate her. The entire game, start to finish, she's pointing out the obvious and repeating things you can clearly see that other characters have already pointed out, all while giving you mandatory tutorials on things you've already learned 30 hours ago. She'll even solves puzzles for you before you even have a chance to try yourself. She'll also start beeping to tell you about the beeping that warns you when you're low on health. That's right, she'll literally beep a warning to you to warn you about a warning.

Then there's the fact that the game feels the need to give you a mandatory description of every item you pick up every single time you load up your save.

Majora's Mask has the least

Ocarina of Time is close after MM

WW starts to have more and is noticeable, but mostly good and well done

TP has too much at times, but is not always there

SS has it quite a bit, and it hurts the experience.

Yes. I imagine alot of people think about Fi when they mention it, as she is probably one of the easier examples of it. There's also Navi, who wouldn't pop up as frequently as Fi but had that annoying voice, which thankfully Fi didn't have. Never really found either that annoying TBH. I'm more annoyed at how SS and I think TP made it so you'd have to get item descriptions for ALL items you acquire everytime you started up your game again. Or even worse is the owl From OoT. I'm practically forced to read his BS everytime while I can atleast just quickly skim through Navi and Fi's BS.

Not any more than most games do. At the start of course and its definitely way more than Zelda games used to. But still you have people that get stuck all the time in these games. Solid cant even get past the first dungeon of TP, maybe he needs more handholding. :Pdvader654

Absolutely 0 handholding in the first 2 games, that's for sure.

[QUOTE="Blueresident87"]

[QUOTE="dvader654"]Not any more than most games do. At the start of course and its definitely way more than Zelda games used to. But still you have people that get stuck all the time in these games. Solid cant even get past the first dungeon of TP, maybe he needs more handholding. :Pdvader654

Absolutely 0 handholding in the first 2 games, that's for sure.

[QUOTE="1PMrFister"]

[QUOTE="dvader654"] I wish they would go back to that. dvader654

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="1PMrFister"] The "Discover things for yourself" part of no hand-holding, sure. The "You're either gonna have to be lucky or find a guide to figure out what to do next," part, not so much.

1PMrFister

I think Seasons is more complex and that is good and bad.  Ages is a bit more straightforward with only 2 versions of the world, rather than 4.  Both are awesome games.  

Yes. I imagine alot of people think about Fi when they mention it, as she is probably one of the easier examples of it. There's also Navi, who wouldn't pop up as frequently as Fi but had that annoying voice, which thankfully Fi didn't have. Never really found either that annoying TBH. I'm more annoyed at how SS and I think TP made it so you'd have to get item descriptions for ALL items you acquire everytime you started up your game again. Or even worse is the owl From OoT. I'm practically forced to read his BS everytime while I can atleast just quickly skim through Navi and Fi's BS.

DJ-Lafleur

I don't know why people find Navi so annoying.  I mean she is supposed to be slightly annoying, thats how fairies are :P.  But I like Navi.  Navi and Midna are the best partners in Zelda games.

[QUOTE="Blueresident87"]

[QUOTE="dvader654"]Not any more than most games do. At the start of course and its definitely way more than Zelda games used to. But still you have people that get stuck all the time in these games. Solid cant even get past the first dungeon of TP, maybe he needs more handholding. :Pdvader654

Absolutely 0 handholding in the first 2 games, that's for sure.

Yea, I agree with that sentiment. I'll admit that I was so freakin' lost the first time I played LoZ as a youngster, but that was part of what gave the game that 'mystical adventure' feeling.

I cannot wait to play through Seasons/Ages, as I just downloaded them on my 3DS, and I remember those games being pretty tough when I first played them. I just have to finish FE: Awakening first.

TP and SS are the biggest culprits in my opinion. TP starts of reeaaallly slow, but there's some good challenge towards the end. SS is just easy all the way through. I never had any trouble with the dungeons save for maybe a brain fart in the second to last dungeon.

I like what you guys said about older Zeldas and games from that time period. Think of something like Super Metroid. Once the intro's over, you land on a planet. Boom. That's it. Nothing else. All up to you now.

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="1PMrFister"] The "Discover things for yourself" part of no hand-holding, sure. The "You're either gonna have to be lucky or find a guide to figure out what to do next," part, not so much.

1PMrFister

Eh, I found Seasons to be better than Ages. I enjoyed exploring Season's worlds more than Ages, and I liked the dungeons a bit more.

Ages is still great though.

I can't stand playing Zelda games because they insist on treating me like an idiot.  I just don't want to spend the opening 2-3 hours of each Zelda hitting strawman figures with my wooden sword or chasing sheep around with my horse, or running numerous errands for everyone around the kiddy safe village to get me used to such rudimentary mechanics that I can remember after using once.

Until Zelda returns to the days of AlttP style openings, right into the action, I'm not interested.  They are boring chores to sit through for the first few hours, so no more.  Miyamoto said himself that the first 10 minutes of a game were the most crucial in getting peoples' attention, and he's right.  I hope one day Zelda remembers this fact. 

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="Blueresident87"]

Absolutely 0 handholding in the first 2 games, that's for sure.

Blueresident87

Yea, I agree with that sentiment. I'll admit that I was so freakin' lost the first time I played LoZ as a youngster, but that was part of what gave the game that 'mystical adventure' feeling.

lol this is so true!  i remember renting it and my and my bro being like...woah we got the first jewel and we are in this town (kakariko village)...we must be really far! 

My friends wife just bought a 3DS (loves it) and got OoT 3DS in addition to other games.  she started it and is too lost to get the sword and such :P.  I can see why it would be a tad confusing, especially for noobs such as herself lol, but I really like it.  I think OoT kept it small enough in the beginning to make you feel like it wasnt so confusing.  MM just throws you into it :P.  That game was actually very confusing for me in the beginning, OoT wasnt bad if memory serves.  Anyway, she really likes her hand held (figuratively lol) in games and isnt much for combat and difficulty, so i can see why she is annoyed by the begining, but i think OoT is a bit more obvious as what to do after that...for the most part. 

Bottom line is I hate starting Zelda and having a 10 hour tutorial where you feel like you are just running around doing stupid crap and the game almost plays itself.  I miss the mystery.

I can't stand playing Zelda games because they insist on treating me like an idiot.  I just don't want to spend the opening 2-3 hours of each Zelda hitting strawman figures with my wooden sword or chasing sheep around with my horse, or running numerous errands for everyone around the kiddy safe village to get me used to such rudimentary mechanics that I can remember after using once.

Until Zelda returns to the days of AlttP style openings, right into the action, I'm not interested.  They are boring chores to sit through for the first few hours, so no more.  Miyamoto said himself that the first 10 minutes of a game were the most crucial in getting peoples' attention, and he's right.  I hope one day Zelda remembers this fact. 

MirkoS77

Did you play OoT and MM.  those games are much better about that.  I agree i hate the openings to TP and SS.  WW aint so bad, as its less drawn out and more interesting.

Not more than the average modern game (haven't played Skyward Sword tho).

ReddestSkies

[QUOTE="1PMrFister"]

[QUOTE="dvader654"] I wish they would go back to that. dvader654

I don't know why people find Navi so annoying.  I mean she is supposed to be slightly annoyingNaveedLife

She's annoying because she's constantly yelling for attention to tell you what you already know, and in the 3DS remake they upped the frequency that she's screeching for attention because now she'll regularly tell you to take a break from playing and will insinuate you're an idiot the entire time you're doing dungeons.

[QUOTE="NaveedLife"]I don't know why people find Navi so annoying.  I mean she is supposed to be slightly annoyingPffrbt

She's annoying because she's constantly yelling for attention to tell you what you already know, and in the 3DS remake they upped the frequency that she's screeching for attention because now she'll regularly tell you to take a break from playing and will insinuate you're an idiot the entire time you're doing dungeons.

I still dont get this.  i never ever even noticed that.  I forget she is there most of the time lol.  she really only annoys you if you decide to talk to her.

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="1PMrFister"] The "Discover things for yourself" part of no hand-holding, sure. The "You're either gonna have to be lucky or find a guide to figure out what to do next," part, not so much.

JordanElek

They certainly are nto the easiest Zelda games in the world.  Matter of fact, those may be one of the hardest.  Majora's Mask is the hardest 3D and oracles are probably the hardest 2D.