I think game stories are finally getting there...

Used to I thought that it was a real rarity for a game to have a great story, but now it actually seems like developers are realizing how important story is (hiring writers, etc.)

For example, I just finished Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package) of those two games. I had also finished Halo: Reach a couple months earlier and its story (especially the ending) were way about what I expected.

Am I just imagining this or are games really getting that much better? I feel like back in the day everything (that I ever played) was just like some fighting game or a platformer on the N64 with just enough of a "story" to give the game a background.

But the only problem I have with them is they are getting really really really short.

Used to I thought that it was a real rarity for a game to have a great story, but now it actually seems like developers are realizing how important story is (hiring writers, etc.)

For example, I just finished Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package) of those two games. I had also finished Halo: Reach a couple months earlier and its story (especially the ending) were way about what I expected.

Am I just imagining this or are games really getting that much better? I feel like back in the day everything (that I ever played) was just like some fighting game or a platformer on the N64 with just enough of a "story" to give the game a background.

wookieeassassin

[QUOTE="wookieeassassin"]

Used to I thought that it was a real rarity for a game to have a great story, but now it actually seems like developers are realizing how important story is (hiring writers, etc.)

For example, I just finished Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package) of those two games. I had also finished Halo: Reach a couple months earlier and its story (especially the ending) were way about what I expected.

Am I just imagining this or are games really getting that much better? I feel like back in the day everything (that I ever played) was just like some fighting game or a platformer on the N64 with just enough of a "story" to give the game a background.

edgewalker16

I've actually noticed a similar trend as well. There were definitely games with great stories in older generations (e.g., Chrono Trigger), but they were much fewer and far between, and were almost universally confined to the RPG genre. And some games that I remembered as having great stories (e.g., Final Fantasy VII) turned out not to be so hot when I went to replay them, and my memories were probably based on the comparative greatness when put beside other games of its time.

yea i agree games like Heavy rain mass, mass effect, red dead, and fps that you stated actually have a good story. Soon there going to be be on par or even go beyond movies some stories are way better than some movies.

It's bad news for the gaming industry when players start thinking that CoD games have good stories...edgewalker16

I don't know, I thought Modern Warfare had a great story. The scene where [spoiler] Sgt. Jackson dies in a nuclear blast [/spoiler] I thought was particularly impactful.

You don't have to be so elitist about Call of Duty Black Ops. I can say this without spoiling any of it: the story wasn't a philosophical one/one that had a lot of deep characters and touched on a lot of complex or moving issues, but it wasn't a bad story. It was a pretty good "action movie" and political thriller story. It actually kind of reminded me of what I remember about the Bourne movies.

I'm not saying that a lot of games have the best stories ever told, I'm saying that it seems like a lot of them have had way more effort put into them than in the past and that I think the industry is general is moving in the right direction (from my limited perspective, I haven't played everything after all)

There were plenty of good stories in the old days. They were just all RPGs.

Some games does have good stories but other games can not handle stories well with their set up. Most games still have the story then the game play and back ti story set up.

I'm not sure. The thing is that it's mostly the production values and the storytelling that get better and more professional over time. Not to mention that being a part of the action will always make it come across better than when you're watching it unfold on a screen without being able to control it. Yet if you look at what games like Call of Duty and really about 95% of the video games out there offer in terms of pure story, it consists of the same clichéd pulp as the action B-movies we've been watching since the seventies. Russian terrorists stole a warhead? Seriously, even Bond hardly gets away with stuff like that nowadays.

Really the only game I can think of that is on the same level as film and literature in terms of its story is Cryostasis - The Sleep of Reason. It's an extremely well-told, original story with a deeply philosophical undercurrent that creates a lot of room for different interpretations and discussion on its meaning. It's absolutely brilliant. So far it's the exception that confirms the rule, but seeing as it's a fairly new game, we might see more of this in the future.

Games will never meet the story telling of other like movies, book and so on. Like movies and books which are conflct focus, games are problem solving focus and there are some stories can not be told using problem solving.

I was never the one that like story all about deep things with a lame journy.

DraugenCP, you're right about most games for sure.

So you say Cryostasis has a really good story eh? I bought it last year I think but I haven't gotten around to playing it.

I actually really enjoyed the story in STALKER. There wasn't a whole lot of it and there were a couple notable cliches, but it was interesting. It had about 6 different endings I believe, and one or two of them were the "real" ones.

I'm not talking just about shooters and action games for this thread, I'm talking about games in general. Action heavy games are always going to have "B-list action movie" stories, or most of them. Of course, the story in an action game doesn't have to be all that in depth for it to be good/entertaining either.

I played Mass Effect 2 this year and while there were a handful of things in the main story that didn't make sense to me or I thought could have been done differently, the game world was so detailed and had so much information (history of races and events in the Codex, history of planets that you explore, etc.), it was great. I spent so long just exploring areas and learning about the universe.

DraugenCP, you're right about most games for sure.

So you say Cryostasis has a really good story eh? I bought it last year I think but I haven't gotten around to playing it.

I actually really enjoyed the story in STALKER. There wasn't a whole lot of it and there were a couple notable cliches, but it was interesting. It had about 6 different endings I believe, and one or two of them were the "real" ones.

I'm not talking just about shooters and action games for this thread, I'm talking about games in general. Action heavy games are always going to have "B-list action movie" stories, or most of them. Of course, the story in an action game doesn't have to be all that in depth for it to be good/entertaining either.

I played Mass Effect 2 this year and while there were a handful of things in the main story that didn't make sense to me or I thought could have been done differently, the game world was so detailed and had so much information (history of races and events in the Codex, history of planets that you explore, etc.), it was great. I spent so long just exploring areas and learning about the universe.

wookieeassassin

Yes, I've said on many occasions that Cryostasis makes BioShock look like a bedtime story, and I stand by that. Apart from the story itself being highly original and ambiguous, the game actually manages to bring gameplay and story together in a natural way. And that's something developers seem to have the most issues with.

I also thought STALKER had a very interesting story, at least Shadow of Chernobyl. The storytelling was a bit weird though. If you didn't pay careful attention and read all your PDA entries, you could beat the game without actually knowing what's going on. But once you got into it, it functioned really well as a science fiction story. I think the whole C-Conciousness conspiracy was extremely satisfying to uncover. STALKER does use a few clichés, such as the protagonist having amnesia, but I think they actually played out well within the context. The Stalker universe is very interesting as well.

As for action games, I fully agree they don't need to have high quality philosophical stories, and the stories they currently have are entertaining, but that doesn't mean that they aren't mostly horrible as soon as they're placed out of the context of a video game. I enjoyed Crysis's campaign, but the story was like a summary of every B-movie cliché out there. They're okay as long as they an come across as a bit believable for the moment and the writing is acceptable. As soon as the writing becomes awkward and the story stops making sense even within its limited parameters, it just becomes very annoying. Frontlines: Fuel of War is a great example of that happening.

I've yet to play ME2, but I'm always a sucker for a game with a rich universe.

• Mass Effect 1 & 2
• Red Dead Redemption
• Modern Warfare 1 & 2 and Black Ops
• Alan Wake
• Dragon Age
• Halo Reach & ODST
• Uncharted 2
• Blazblue Calamity Trigger & Continuum Shift
• Metal Gear Solid 4

Finally getting there... I wouldn't agree on that.

Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package)

wookieeassassin

Those games, quality stories... I also wouldn't agree.

#facepalm# You couldn't be more off. The truth is the old school games had it right with the stories and the newer games are hit and miss. Go play any FF from 4-10 including tactics, any other old school Squaresoft, Metal Gear solids, Half-Life, I can go on and on. Not only are the stories better but the gameplay is way better in old school titles like the Mario's, Zelda's, FF's, Metroids (Prime and 2D).

My MAJOR problem with stories is that it often destroys the replay value, because it will be the same thing, where as lots of older games never really gave you a direct direction on what you are doing, so you could use your imagination.

#facepalm# You couldn't be more off. The truth is the old school games had it right with the stories and the newer games are hit and miss. Go play any FF from 4-10 including tactics, any other old school Squaresoft, Metal Gear solids, Half-Life, I can go on and on. Not only are the stories better but the gameplay is way better in old school titles like the Mario's, Zelda's, FF's, Metroids (Prime and 2D).

Soko77788

Erm I think I'd have to disagree with you on that. I'll be honest I haven't extensively played many of the old games you listed, but I really don't feel from what I have played that the FF games had particularly great stories. Half-Life's story is also overrated, the franchise is based more around storytelling than the actual story. As for the gameplay, why are we bringing up gameplay in a thread centered around stories?

I still think the industry has a ways to improve, but they are getting better. I really did think the story in Red Dead Redemption was fantastic. There is something to be said for great storytelling too. Red Dead Redemption certainly did a good job with that as well.

I was thinking about movies and most movies really don't have all that great of stories either. Not even all of the good ones have crazy impressive stories. I was thinking about True Grit, the story is pretty simple a girl wants to avenge her father's death, but the move itself is pretty top notch due to the way the story is told coupled with great acting performances and scenery.

Having said that, I really want the gaming industry to get to the point where one to two games a year are released with Oscar-caliber meaning and story.

I think the one thing we have to give game developers credit for is that they are NOT set/costume designers, they're NOT actors or directors, and they didn't go to school for any of these roles essential to producing performance art and yet, when they go to design a game these days they tend to be asked to be all of these things in addition to being game developers. Making a game anymore requires the developer to draw from myriad disciplines that they've never been trained in. Quite frankly, it's amazing what these guys have accomplished.

Secondly, gaming as a story telling medium is very young by comparison. We're still exploring the ways in which the medium facilitates story telling. Expecting what we have now to be as good as what other mediums have had decades and, in the case of books, millenia to refine is just unfair.

I think gaming has amazing potential as a story telling medium, but sometimes we hamstring our own efforts by insisting on falling back on movie making conventions to tell a story in a game rather than innovating ways of telling a story that are unique to gaming. And that would be my one complaint about our efforst thus far - too many cutscenes and not enough exploring the ways we can tell stories in real time...because having a story unfold before you with the controller still in your hands is an experience that no other medium can simulate, yet there's so few games that even attempt to tap into this.

I think the one thing we have to give game developers credit for is that they are NOT set/costume designers, they're NOT actors or directors, and they didn't go to school for any of these roles essential to producing performance art and yet, when they go to design a game these days they tend to be asked to be all of these things in addition to being game developers. Making a game anymore requires the developer to draw from myriad disciplines that they've never been trained in. Quite frankly, it's amazing what these guys have accomplished.

Secondly, gaming as a story telling medium is very young by comparison. We're still exploring the ways in which the medium facilitates story telling. Expecting what we have now to be as good as what other mediums have had decades and, in the case of books, millenia to refine is just unfair.

I think gaming has amazing potential as a story telling medium, but sometimes we hamstring our own efforts by insisting on falling back on movie making conventions to tell a story in a game rather than innovating ways of telling a story that are unique to gaming. And that would be my one complaint about our efforst thus far - too many cutscenes and not enough exploring the ways we can tell stories in real time...because having a story unfold before you with the controller still in your hands is an experience that no other medium can simulate, yet there's so few games that even attempt to tap into this.

Ish_basic

Only problem with this is that, if gaming gets too focused on online (like it kind of is right now, but not too much) then who will need stories? or even single player, if the world will buy it to play online?

Yeah I pretty much prefer single player experiences with story elements over multiplayer.

Even Metal Gear Solid 4 had weird story elements and some melodrama/some overly emotional character interactions it still had a lot of story elements that were interesting.

You can argue with me all day about Black Ops, but it did have a decent political thriller/action movie plot. I've already gone over this.

Also, you have to realize that a lot of movies don't have great stories either, but there are still more movies that end up with award winning quality stories than video games. Also, not everything has a deep philosophical meaning or has extremely deep characters. Also, most stories are not that original in their base form. Anyone ever heard of the 7 stories? There are really only 7 different types of stories out there, and anything that has a story is one of those or a combination of those. Look them up. A lot of the time what is important to a story is its execution, not just its base idea.

Used to I thought that it was a real rarity for a game to have a great story, but now it actually seems like developers are realizing how important story is (hiring writers, etc.)

For example, I just finished Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package) of those two games. I had also finished Halo: Reach a couple months earlier and its story (especially the ending) were way about what I expected.

Am I just imagining this or are games really getting that much better? I feel like back in the day everything (that I ever played) was just like some fighting game or a platformer on the N64 with just enough of a "story" to give the game a background.

wookieeassassin

I disagree. Just because a game has a story doesn't make it good. I saw the twist at the end of Black Ops coming a mile away.

I think storytelling and presentation overall is better. But I wouldnt call many ideas, concepts stories actually 'good' - like say the overall plot to Assasssins Creed 2 or Mass Effect... There have been good stories told quite poorly though eg. The Witcher, Cryostasis, Overclocked, Stalker:SoC (whether or not this is a translation problem is questionable). But there have been games like Bioshock, Braid, Hotel Dusk, Odin Sphere, Dreamfall that are strong in both its plot and storytelling.illmatic87

I thought the storytelling in Cryostasis was excellent. It is one of the only games that manages to tell the story through the gameplay. Only the voice acting is a bit off in the English version, but that didn't matter much to the overall quality of the story.

I think people don't get that video games are just starting out. They are what 30 years old? Compare it with cinema in the early 20's. There is no comparison. Before you know it, 20-30 years from now, video games will tell oscar winning movie like story's.

[QUOTE="wookieeassassin"]

Used to I thought that it was a real rarity for a game to have a great story, but now it actually seems like developers are realizing how important story is (hiring writers, etc.)

For example, I just finished Metal Gear Solid 4 and Call of Duty Black Ops recently and I was extremely surprised at the level of quality (not just the story, the whole package) of those two games. I had also finished Halo: Reach a couple months earlier and its story (especially the ending) were way about what I expected.

Am I just imagining this or are games really getting that much better? I feel like back in the day everything (that I ever played) was just like some fighting game or a platformer on the N64 with just enough of a "story" to give the game a background.

edgewalker16

Agreed.