If modern rap/pop music is considered art, the why aren't games?

I don't consider modern rap or pop art I consider it noise, and Gwen Stefani is more of a masterpiece on the eyes ;).

I do consider some games to be art however, how could you not say ico is art for example :).

:roll:

rap and hip hop is not art .. its crap..............besides the beastie boys.SuprLuigi

It's a lot more art than that metal garbage or 80's hari band crap.

depends. i would consider games like metroid prime, metal gear solid to be art.

but i would not consider halo to be art. well, maybe the first 2.

Again, people here make the biggest mistake: They think art is a measure of quality. It isn't. You can't say that "bad" music is art, and good music is. Music just *is* art. Some of it sucks, but that doesn't make it an inch "less" art then good music. That's why games, even crappy ones, is to be considered art. Jonas_81

I think an even bigger mistake is the idea that games have to be considered as art. Art does not have to be entertaining, you can have something really boring like Ulysses considered the greatest novel of all time. No matter how artistic a game can be, if it is not entertaining it is not a good game. But do I think that games can be considered art? Yes. Do I care what some old film critic thinks if they are? No.

Anyways if many games would be art they would be at the bottom of the scale when compared that of the high points of the other mediums, yes even Mass Effect and Bioshock. though I do think some older games like Grim Fandango and Planescape Torment are the closest to it.

There's nothing artistic about modern pop music. Its commercial crap designed to appeal to people who want to think they're cool and hip.

Rap is some homeboy with a mic, taking samples of someone else's music and lapping it over the same computerized beat for 5 minutes. Its more of a car vibrator than music. Hey, look at me....you can hear my car vibrate from 4 blocks away! Aren't I all cool and hardcore? Aren't I?

It amazes me that so many people fell for that.

What I was trying to say was, good rap conveys a message (Which in my opinion, makes it art) while bad rap does not (Solja boy).

Just like a good game is a combination of artistic elements (Visual design, music, story) that when put together well, can make the game itself art

Soulja Boy is not rap... its a reason to keep your kids off drugs.

Back to the topic, all video games are made with art and innovation; artists and developers.

Soulja Boy is not rap... its a reason to keep your kids off drugs.

Back to the topic, all video games are made with art and innovation; artists and developers.

SKaREO

Ok....if your going to pick a person to represent rap, you cant pick the worst one out there. The fact that you even said soulja boy, just shows you know nothing about rap. If you were going to pick someone, the list would be somthing like: Lil Wayne, Luda, Eminem, Young Jeezy, or TI. and as far as art goes, I consider them both art.

rap and hip hop is not art .. its crap..............besides the beastie boys.SuprLuigi

Rock and Video Games are not art..its crap..............besides the metroid series.

[QUOTE="SKaREO"]

Soulja Boy is not rap... its a reason to keep your kids off drugs.

Back to the topic, all video games are made with art and innovation; artists and developers.

Lord-Nerevar

Ok....if your going to pick a person to represent rap, you cant pick the worst one out there. The fact that you even said soulja boy, just shows you know nothing about rap. If you were going to pick someone, the list would be somthing like: Lil Wayne, Luda, Eminem, Young Jeezy, or TI. and as far as art goes, I consider them both art.

I think he meant the exact opposite (Soulja Boy is not rap). Young Weezy? TI? Lil Wayne? You're kidding right?

Bah. Mods please lock this topic, it will turn into the inevitable flame war, and the TC's question has been anwsered. There's no reason to keep this topic going anymore.

There's nothing artistic about modern pop music. Its commercial crap designed to appeal to people who want to think they're cool and hip.

Rap is some homeboy with a mic, taking samples of someone else's music and lapping it over the same computerized beat for 5 minutes. Its more of a car vibrator than music. Hey, look at me....you can hear my car vibrate from 4 blocks away! Aren't I all cool and hardcore? Aren't I?

It amazes me that so many people fell for that.

EdgecrusherAza

One of the most ignorant statements I has seen here in awhile.

Nice Work!!!

Possibly because videogames don't evoke such an emotional response in people? Isn't that what most great art does? Art is subjective, sure, but that is irrelevant to the people that are touched by it. Games don't nearly even approach any level of emotional response for me, with the exception of ICO and POP:TsoT, and that's from many, many years of gaming.

Games are entertaining, and some have astonishing technical merit, but a lot feel soulless.

not being racist or anything, but rap and hip hop are both created by black artists, and the media and government can't bash on a minority group's "art form."aching546

N.W.A.

not being racist or anything, but rap and hip hop are both created by black artists, and the media and government can't bash on a minority group's "art form." but since gamers consist mainly of kids, they can do whatever they want- bash games, ban games(GTA, Manhunt), and slander(Mass Effect).aching546

I get what you're saying but you can't really say numerous white critics consider rap art because they don't want to bash a minority, that may be the case for some of them but we don't have any hard evidence to say that is fact. Were you around during the 80's and 90's? There was and still is public stigma towards rap.

not being racist or anything, but rap and hip hop are both created by black artists, and the media and government can't bash on a minority group's "art form." but since gamers consist mainly of kids, they can do whatever they want- bash games, ban games(GTA, Manhunt), and slander(Mass Effect).aching546

Seriously man, were you just bron yesterday or are you just a shut in who only plays video games? Rap/Hip Hop has endured more media scrutiny and criticism than any other music form around. We have seen albums banned, retail chains refuse to carry certain records, artists sued and criminally proseuted.

Your statement of flat out rediculous. If you just want to throw unintelligent garbage up on the wall please keep it to the confines of your trailer.

[QUOTE="aching546"]not being racist or anything, but rap and hip hop are both created by black artists, and the media and government can't bash on a minority group's "art form." but since gamers consist mainly of kids, they can do whatever they want- bash games, ban games(GTA, Manhunt), and slander(Mass Effect).greenghost123

I get what you're saying but you can't really say numerous white critics consider rap art because they don't want to bash a minority, that may be the case for some of them but we don't have any hard evidence to say that is fact. Were you around during the 80's and 90's? There was and still is public stigma towards rap.

No his statment was pure idiocy please don't lend it any credence.

Well I certainly have a higher respect level for those that make games than I do for those that rap.

I remember a day when true artists wrote their own music, played their own music, and even sang their own music. That takes quite a bit of talent. Nowadays they have some 40 year old white guy make a repetitive, somewhat catchy melody on his computer (9 times out of 10 it's stolen from some hit in the 70s/80s) , and then have some other guy speak some words in a microphone and all of a sudden the guy on the mic is expected to be considered an artist?

That's the same crap Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera do. The only difference is they at least have an inkling of vocal talent required to actually sing the song. A rapper does not need any talent whatsoever. He doesn't have to know how to play an instrument, He doesn't have to know how to write the music, and he doesn't even have to be a good singer. He just has to be shouting some profanity into a mic with some background track playing that was pre-recorded for him. The most he needs to know how to do is rhyme words together.

A single programmer on a game development team has more brains and talent in his pinky than these guys that are making millions rapping.

Well I certainly have a higher respect level for those that make games than I do for those that rap.

I remember a day when true artists wrote their own music, played their own music, and even sang their own music. That takes quite a bit of talent. Nowadays they have some 40 year old white guy make a repetitive, somewhat catchy melody on his computer (9 times out of 10 it's stolen from some hit in the 70s/80s) , and then have some other guy speak some words in a microphone and all of a sudden the guy on the mic is expected to be considered an artist?

That's the same crap Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera do. The only difference is they at least have an inkling of vocal talent required to actually sing the song. A rapper does not need any talent whatsoever. He doesn't have to know how to play an instrument, He doesn't have to know how to write the music, and he doesn't even have to be a good singer. He just has to be shouting some profanity into a mic with some background track playing that was pre-recorded for him. The most he needs to know how to do is rhyme words together.

A single programmer on a game development team has more brains and talent in his pinky than these guys that are making millions rapping.

Mash_Affect

That would apply to modern one-hit wonder rapper, but guys like K-Os and Beastie Boys would burn your house down if they knew what you were writing. Real rappers write their own songs, and often times, they have rhymes that are as complex as anything out there. Sure, rappers may not make their own original beats, but they make it up with internal rhymes and complex lyrics.

PS- I don't even know why I even replied to this post. It's an ignorant post and I hope you seriously do some research before you argue.

All this rap hate is ironic.

Musical complexity does not equal art. Good technique has NEVER been considered high art and hopefully never will be.*

*obviously it's considered art with expression or whatever but just alone it's not art.

All this rap hate is ironic.

Musical complexity does not equal art. Good technique has NEVER been considered high art and hopefully never will be.*

*obviously it's considered art with expression or whatever but just alone it's not art.

Foolz3h

People tend to think that if it was hard to make, it is good. I guess I made something good when I was in the toilet just now, I can tell you it wasn't easy. Seriously, I don't expect these rock elitists to like rap, or stop hating rap. Their stubborn, most of us are, what amazes me is that they seem to have forgotten that the very same criticisms they are throwing around 'offensive lyrics, suggestive dancing, profanity, unoriginal, screaming' were the same criticisms that were used years ago with rock/metal. For every criticism that is thrown at rap, there is a counterpart in rap. Drugs you say?

screaming non-sensibly gibberish onto the mic about partying, soliciting woman, and doing drugs?

I could go on. I really could, but that won't put a dent to a rock elitists ego. Once again, mods lock this topic, the inevitable flame war is on the horizon.

Pop can't be considered art. Modern day rap is really bad and the only stuff in the rap genre i enjoy is Australian Hip Hop and some Classic Rap because they both can have really good meaning to there songs not all this ,money,chicks and drugs crap.And i know alot of other genres talk about drugs and all as well, but its the way its presented which really makes a difference.

And games well its the same situation as music ,although they can be really good i don't consider games as art anyway, i seem them as pure enjoyment.

Art: "the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power."

I'm surprised to hear people say some genres of music are art and some are not...if you consider classical or jazz music art, then hip-hop music is also art because you consider music art. Art can be good or bad...just because something is bad art does not make it something else. It's like saying platformers are art but first-person shooters are not.

As far as video games go...i know most gamers would consider them art, but i wouldn't. If you use the definition above, I'd say most gamers do not use video games primarily for their beauty or emotional power...they play them because they are fun. In that way they are analygous to a toy, whose definition is "an object, a gadget, or a machine regarded as providing amusement for an adult."

when you make games like hideo kojima

there no way you can look at a game like its art

unless you consider looking at yourself as art

damn something like that,not trying to sound all poetic