microsofts constant evolution of the 360......

as an owner i of a 360 i have to be honest with you....they are really angering me beyond words.

i bought the 360 premium less than a year ago. i have an hdtv....it would have been nice to get an hdmi port ...
its not like i bought it day one and i was early adopting i bought a year and some months into its life span. they kept saying how HDMI wasnt a necessary connectionand that they were going to fous soley on component hookups and that would achieve 1080p just fine......so now here we are....and they are releasing a system with the very same feature i wanted in the first place...one they said wasnt needed....i got shafted.

i also dont get the proper cooling heatsinks...those are for new customers.....i guess ill have to wait for mine to break.

the HD size thingdoesnt bother me....but it would have been nice if they took the route sony did, and allowed me to just upgrade the 360 with my own sata drive.

i guess what im saying is that i originally bought the premium becasue i didnt wanna buy the core and think hmm i shoulda just got the best version .....but now thanks to microsoft i have been moved down to the core against my will..... by them.

thoughts? am i alone in my irritation?

This is just another way M$ can keep milking it's customers over time. I can see them releasing yet another version in the near future with either a HD DVD or Blu-Ray that will have yet another console that the M$ community will be forced to purchase at that time.jimm895

I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.

Imma Sony fan and in a way i could kinda see how you'd be pissed but i honestly expected this from MS, their a pc primerialy company and we all know how fast pc upgrades are rushed to the market. At best I think u should just be glad ur not one of the "lucky" few who's 360 keeps breaking.

By the way does anyone know if there are any games on the 360 that were dev'd to 1080p or are they just upscaled from 720p-1080i. In reality that will be the true test cuz any one of us could play Return to Castle wolfenstien on our pc's at resolutions way higher then when the game came out but the textures ect. werent designed for those resolutions in mind. So although it may look "better",...if 1080p (compatible) 360 games were deved with 720p resolutions in mind then it doesn't really make a difference whether you have HDMI or component as to on the PS3.

[QUOTE="jimm895"]This is just another way M$ can keep milking it's customers over time. I can see them releasing yet another version in the near future with either a HD DVD or Blu-Ray that will have yet another console that the M$ community will be forced to purchase at that time.azad_champ

I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.

I'm sure they'll let them, as they'll be making money off of every PS3 and 360 game sold that use the format, plus it will be the final nail in the coffin for HDDVD, leading to a rather profitable future for them. Getting BR to be the standard for the next decade will likely be more profitable than the PS3 finishing first.

That said, there's nearly no chance the 360 will use anything other than DVD. Upgrading to a new format will essentially make their install base drop from 10 million to 0 and anger quite a few people.

I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.azad_champ

It might have just become possible recently to include HDMI at no extra cost. A year or so ago they could have included HDMI but it would have increased the cost of the 360.

I didn't get a PS2 until almost 2 years after its release. Soon after progressive scan came out then the slim PS2s, this happens with just about every console nowadays. Soon, when Sony releases the rumble SIXAXIS PS3 bundles you'll see PS3 owners "having a cow" (pun intended).

[QUOTE="azad_champ"]I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.Jonas_81

I was more thinking that Sony wouldn't allow MS to release blu-ray games on 360 and making it the standard 360 player.

It might have just become possible recently to include HDMI at no extra cost. A year or so ago they could have included HDMI but it would have increased the cost of the 360.

I didn't get a PS2 until almost 2 years after its release. Soon after progressive scan came out then the slim PS2s, this happens with just about every console nowadays. Soon, when Sony releases the rumble SIXAXIS PS3 bundles you'll see PS3 owners "having a cow" (pun intended).

cametall

the controller will most likely be sold seperately....big difference there

what irks me is how they evangelized we dont need storage space mare than dvd9.....then comes an hddvd attachment, and now rumors of a new version down the road with hddvd built in

they said there was no need this gen for HDMI...and yet here we are regretting that inclusion

at least my low end PS3 came with all i needed......

what happens to all those core owners if mirosoft introduces the HDDVD addon? and dont say they wont cause they prolly will....look at their track record.

not arguing with you, just saying......im irritated

Microsoft is so evil!!!! But I also have the Premium Xbox with just component output and no HDMI... I knew it didn't have HDMI so I'm not complaining.

I guess my xbox360 has 500+ hours on it so far, and it's still running great. It's almost dust free in my house with air-conditioning so it has no hardships on its hardware.

Mind you if it starts to act funny before my warranty runs out, i'll be sure to finish it off and get a new one.

[QUOTE="cametall"]

It might have just become possible recently to include HDMI at no extra cost. A year or so ago they could have included HDMI but it would have increased the cost of the 360.

I didn't get a PS2 until almost 2 years after its release. Soon after progressive scan came out then the slim PS2s, this happens with just about every console nowadays. Soon, when Sony releases the rumble SIXAXIS PS3 bundles you'll see PS3 owners "having a cow" (pun intended).

Escobahr

the controller will most likely be sold seperately....big difference there

what irks me is how they evangelized we dont need storage space mare than dvd9.....then comes an hddvd attachment, and now rumors of a new version down the road with hddvd built in

they said there was no need this gen for HDMI...and yet here we are regretting that inclusion

at least my low end PS3 came with all i needed......

what happens to all those core owners if mirosoft introduces the HDDVD addon? and dont say they wont cause they prolly will....look at their track record.

not arguing with you, just saying......im irritated

The HD-DVD attachment is only for movies, not games. So don't get all angry over them not using it for extra game space. Also, as parts become cheaper, they will upgrade them on the inside with new chip-sets, etc. I can see you being a bit upset over the HDMI, but it shouldn't be that large of an issue.

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Escobahr

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Escobahr

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

I didn't get a PS2 until almost 2 years after its release. Soon after progressive scan came out then the slim PS2s, this happens with just about every console nowadays. 

cametall

[QUOTE="Escobahr"]

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Archangel3371

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

well in my opinion game consoles quit being about "just games" after the PS2 and the Xbox. and what your really not thinking about is what if microsoft had created the 360 with the HD-DVD drive that would be used for games.....would we be seeing a new label for 360 games that says "HD required??......im just glad i didnt get a core...imagine if you found out you might need a HD to play some games.....

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

well a HD is necesarry according to some developer and even microsoft themselves....who have created the "HD required" logo...not to mention they are ompletely phasing out the core....so going forth all systems will have an HD.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

it's not about you telling people what they don't need...its about microsofts statements and then the obvious admission that not only are they wrong, but if you want what is considered to be the premium...your going to have to buy a whole new system from them.....kinda like hey! heres our best system.....ok now that youve bought that.....heres i best system buy this one instead.....oh and BTW...in few months after youve bought that one....there'll be another one.

and just to say this....i feel that HDMI is a big deal....im picky about visuals....so sue me. i still think my wants as a gamer are as valid as yours, and to be honest choosing to play your games with the root core configuration doesnt make you more or less a gamer as me...

[QUOTE="jimm895"]This is just another way M$ can keep milking it's customers over time. I can see them releasing yet another version in the near future with either a HD DVD or Blu-Ray that will have yet another console that the M$ community will be forced to purchase at that time.azad_champ

I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.

sony doesn't own bluray

[QUOTE="Escobahr"]

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Archangel3371

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

Flood, if you care so much about visuals, then why not direct your attention to Sony for putting out a console a full year after the 360, at 200 dollars more, and still managing to shove somany non-gaming related things into the package that the system is seemingly incapable of outdoing the 360 visually for games?

Sony, take that extra 200 for the blu-ray player and put it into areas (like the GPU) that are actually gaming related and beneficial. But of course, the PS3 will outsell the competition without any games. All they need is to get that blu-ray player into our homes ......

I think both systems have their faults, but be a little more even-minded and not so one-sided every time you decide to post a topic. Yes there are annoying things about the 360, but I'll be damned if anyone is going to act like it's any better on the Sony side of things.

[QUOTE="jimm895"]This is just another way M$ can keep milking it's customers over time. I can see them releasing yet another version in the near future with either a HD DVD or Blu-Ray that will have yet another console that the M$ community will be forced to purchase at that time.azad_champ

I don't think Sony will let them use Blu-ray since they are competing against each other.

[QUOTE="Archangel3371"][QUOTE="Escobahr"]

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

AlwaysSoft

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

Flood, if you care so much about visuals, then why not direct your attention to Sony for putting out a console a full year after the 360, at 200 dollars more, and still managing to shove so much non-gaming related things into the package that the system is seemingly incapable of outdoing the 360 visually for games.

Sony, take that extra 200 for the blu-ray player and put it into areas (like the GPU) that are actually gaming related and beneficial. But of course, the PS3 will outsell the competition without any games. All they need is to get that blu-ray player into our homes ......

I think both systems have their faults, but be a little more even-minded and not so one-sided every time you decide to post a topic. Yes there are annoying things about the 360, but I'll be damned if anyone is going to act like it's any better on the Sony side of things.

you know whats funny about these forums? the fact that if you even criticize any system at al whatsoever...your lableled a fanboy.

dont like mirosofts business model for the 360......he he well then you are obviously just a drastic fanboy of legensdary proportions....even though you own a 360 and over 50 games and play the 360 almost 4-5 days a week.

the reality is i have all next gen systems and can afford to have varied opinions. and unfortunately, right now my opinions about microsoft happen to be correct.

dont be so quick to throw around the fanboys label as well....next time i'll report you. leave the name calling at home...feel free to argue my ideas, but dont resort to cheap personal attacks.

[QUOTE="Archangel3371"][QUOTE="Escobahr"]

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Escobahr

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

1) well in my opinion game consoles quit being about "just games" after the PS2 and the Xbox. and what your really not thinking about is what if microsoft had created the 360 with the HD-DVD drive that would be used for games.....would we be seeing a new label for 360 games that says "HD required??......im just glad i didnt get a core...imagine if you found out you might need a HD to play some games.....

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

2) well a HD is necesarry according to some developer and even microsoft themselves....who have created the "HD required" logo...not to mention they are ompletely phasing out the core....so going forth all systems will have an HD.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

3) it's not about you telling people what they don't need...its about microsofts statements and then the obvious admission that not only are they wrong, 4) but if you want what is considered to be the premium...your going to have to buy a whole new system from them.....kinda like hey! heres our best system.....ok now that youve bought that.....heres i best system buy this one instead.....oh and BTW...in few months after youve bought that one....there'll be another one.

5) and just to say this....i feel that HDMI is a big deal....im picky about visuals....so sue me. i still think my wants as a gamer are as valid as yours, and to be honest choosing to play your games with the root core configuration doesnt make you more or less a gamer as me...

1) High capacity read only disks and hard drives bring very different things to the table, so I don't understand the basis of your argument that if the X360 had HD-DVD built in, than hard drives wouldn't be needed.

2) I agree with you that not packing in a hard drive with every console was a mistake.

3) Sony confidently stated a 600 dollar price tag wouldn't be a problem for most people. Clearly they were mistaken and are taking steps to correct the mistake (the same is also true of rumble). Are you going to attack them for inconsistency? I think its good that MS and Sony have been willing to acknowledge and correct mistakes.

4) Why are you so preoccupied about having the 'best' system? The Premium runs games just as well as the Elite (as does the Core, truth to tell). Companies always revise models. My launch PS2 stopped being the best PS2 when Sony introduced support for progressive scan, built in support for the remote and modems to later models but since I wasn't trying to keep up with the Jones and cared only about having fun, I was happy with its steady stream of kickbutt games.

5) Is a signal run through component/optical cables inferior toa signal run through HDMI? This is an honest question because I am a non-technie and my current tv is 720p/1080i.

[QUOTE="Archangel3371"][QUOTE="Escobahr"]

well the point i was trying to make with the hddvd player was..... they proslatized on how unecessary new gen storage mediums were.....how there was no reason to use anything other than dvd9....and then they pull a seg.

say what you want about sony...how they were more expensive....but in the long run the 360 is gonna cost way more than a ps3
for storage space,hookups and storage.

Escobahr

What? Seriously the HD-DVD add-on has nothing to do with games it's a movie only device so there really is no point to be made at all about it.

well in my opinion game consoles quit being about "just games" after the PS2 and the Xbox. and what your really not thinking about is what if microsoft had created the 360 with the HD-DVD drive that would be used for games.....would we be seeing a new label for 360 games that says "HD required??......im just glad i didnt get a core...imagine if you found out you might need a HD to play some games.....

Um you mentioned storage twice. The 360 is only going to cost as much as the individual wants or needs out of it. Not all of these extra hookups and additions are necessary, it's all up to individual. So to say it's going to cost more in the long run is erroneous.

well a HD is necesarry according to some developer and even microsoft themselves....who have created the "HD required" logo...not to mention they are ompletely phasing out the core....so going forth all systems will have an HD.

As for the HDMI port I hardly see that as a big deal. Other systems have come out with additions to them in the past and others will do so in the future.

it's not about you telling people what they don't need...its about microsofts statements and then the obvious admission that not only are they wrong, but if you want what is considered to be the premium...your going to have to buy a whole new system from them.....kinda like hey! heres our best system.....ok now that youve bought that.....heres i best system buy this one instead.....oh and BTW...in few months after youve bought that one....there'll be another one.

and just to say this....i feel that HDMI is a big deal....im picky about visuals....so sue me. i still think my wants as a gamer are as valid as yours, and to be honest choosing to play your games with the root core configuration doesnt make you more or less a gamer as me...

1) Well I find it odd that whenever a site like Kotaku publishes some rumour or speculation about something to do with the PS3 you're all over it claiming how damaging it is to gamers and gaming and you've also posted in the past how how sites over-analyse the systems and it should be all about the games. However now you're saying that the consoles are more then just games and now you're going to "what if" on the 360. I'm sorry but that doesn't really make sense.

2) Yeah I think it's a better deal to get the Premium since it has the HDD but it's still that's really just one piece and ultimately it's all up to each individual on how much a 360 will cost them in the long run. For example I don't use wireless for my internet so a Wi-Fi adapter isn't something that will factor into the overall cost of the 360 for me.

As far as MS phasing out the Core package I wasn't aware that they were doing that.

3) Wow you sure did draw alot from my one simple statement. Not once did I ever infer to tell people what they don't need nor did I say you're opinions are invalid or say that what configuration of 360 you play on makes anyone more or less of a gamer so you can drop that kind of garbage rhetoric right now. I simply gave my opinion that I didn't see the inclusion of an HDMI port as being that big of a deal of which I don't.

as an owner i of a 360 i have to be honest with you....they are really angering me beyond words.

i bought the 360 premium less than a year ago. i have an hdtv....it would have been nice to get an hdmi port ...
its not like i bought it day one and i was early adopting i bought a year and some months into its life span. they kept saying how HDMI wasnt a necessary connectionand that they were going to fous soley on component hookups and that would achieve 1080p just fine......so now here we are....and they are releasing a system with the very same feature i wanted in the first place...one they said wasnt needed....i got shafted.

i also dont get the proper cooling heatsinks...those are for new customers.....i guess ill have to wait for mine to break.

the HD size thingdoesnt bother me....but it would have been nice if they took the route sony did, and allowed me to just upgrade the 360 with my own sata drive.

i guess what im saying is that i originally bought the premium becasue i didnt wanna buy the core and think hmm i shoulda just got the best version .....but now thanks to microsoft i have been moved down to the core against my will..... by them.

thoughts? am i alone in my irritation?

Escobahr

You do realize that you can get 1080p output through component cables right? Not only that, you'll need at least a 50" TV to see the difference between 720P and 1080P resolution.

Its funny that you mention it, but apparently you want to have the "best" version available of the 360, yet you decided to go with 20GB PS3 in the first place according to your posts...

Consoles have been getting internal hardware uppgrades (look into the PS2) as manufacturing costs go down and more efficient chips are introduced.

Yes the HDD and the accessories are overpriced, but with 20GB Hdd is more than enough to satisfy your gaming needs( though you can't have the luxury of keeping a bunch of game demos or HD movies stored in you HDD)

I guess I should complain about Sony introducing a better SKU, the 80GB model right? Once again expecting criticism from you towards Sony is like expecting Halo 3 on the PS3 right flood? or should I say Escobahr.