My declining interest in RPG's

Since the beginning of the gen, I abandoned RPG's and chose instead to play mostly action games. At the end of the 7th gen, disgusted with the gun obsession in the gaming industry, I decided to go back to RPG's. They should be a better alternative to stagnant shooters, but they simply aren't.

Most RPG's have issues that make it tough for me to be immersed in them (and as I got older, I became more aware of them).

First, is a matter of time. Most RPG's take upwards of 40 hours to beat, and that's way too long. They're a daunting task to replay especially if you have real life commitments and have other games on the backlogue. A 10 hour game, yeah. A 50 hour game, probably not.

Second, it's moreso how it gets to be so long. It's often due to repetition, backtracking and grinding. If RPG's had you doing something entirely different every half hour, I wouldn't mind. But it just feels diluted when you're playing a 50 hour game and only 20 of it could be considered new content. Optional grinding is good, but mandatory repetition is bad.

Third, the story. When I was 14, most RPG stories had me in tears and profound amazement. Now, most of them seem cliche. Such as the abdicated throne, war between heaven and hell, etc. That and modes are inappropriate. Serious stories can either get pretentiously serious or too goofy for their own good.

RPG is pretty much my favorite genre at the moment. I'm content with the ones I play.

BTW have you played Chrono Trigger, The LAst Story, Radiant Historia or Xenoblade? Those should pique your interest. Especially Xenoblade since it's a really long game (took me 75 hours) but to me and others it never felt like it was padded. It took so long to beat simply because exploring the world and doing side tasks was a lot of fun.

So... What you're saying is... the RPG genre is overrated?

lol i see what you did there, but no.

i'm saying that a 50-hour grindfest was a good formula for when i was a kid, but now it's not. i just dont have the time.

Really? You're going to complain about length? They haven't become any shorter or longer compared to earlier ones. FFX was hundreds of hours long depending on how deep you played it. Complaining about how long the game is silly especially when you have excellent games like Dragon Age: Origins, Mass Effect, Witcher, Ni No Kuni, Skyrim, etc. Giving games that are over 10 hours a fair shake is not the way to go man. You can't dismiss an entire genre just because of length. They are awesome games. Mass Effect trilogy is perhaps the greatest story of this generation and it's over 100 hours of contene and great storytelling depending how much of the dlc and sidequests you do.

What games have you been playing that do the same damn thing all the time? Are you also expecting something new round every corner like action or shooter games? Because you're not getting the entire genre then.

Again, have you played games that i mentioned?

A couple interesting things i saw you say were

"Most RPG's have issues that make it tough for me to be immersed in them (and as I got older, I became more aware of them)."

"Most RPG's take upwards of 40 hours to beat, and that's way too long"

"Third, the story. When I was 14, most RPG stories had me in tears and profound amazement."

I'd like to touch on that because, I actually made a similar transition away from RPGs way back in the day. I rarely can get into them these days. I think in my case which may be yours as well is a strong correlation between your free time and your interest in RPGs.

Working 40+ Hour weeks, Having a social life, Having a family, & many other things can make your free time way more valuable compared to when you were 14 having all the time in the world.

This can make you impatient and unwilling to let yourself be immersed into a quality RPG story due to the generally slow-paced style of the genre.

@drekula2: Check out The Last Story. It's 25 hours, with side content.

Also, Chrono Trigger? Again, about 25 hours, but there's a reason it's held in such high regards by most of those who have played it.

i used to hate a rpgs when i was younger in the 80s and 90s...never bought any of them....

it wasnt until recently when i started to give rpgs a chance and realized i missed out on some great games....rpg genre was a great innovation...

anyway....finishing them is the problem...i agree...they take long....lol...oh well try and find the time i guess.

Try some WRPGs instead of JRPGs. I basically can't play JRPGs anymore either: linear stories of teenagers in baggy pants and impossible hair saving the world from satan simply lost their appeal for me once I hit puberty, plus the mandatory level grinding is possibly the laziest and cheapest way to stretch a game i can think of: "The game is too short! Multiply the final boss' HP and damage tenfold. Click, done: 20 more hours of gameplay"

@Black_Knight_00: That's kind of generalizing. I've played quite a few JRPGs where grinding was kept to a minimum. Or, if there was grinding, it was mostly self imposed.

And you played 10 times as many where it was not

Yeah, I'd actually argue that most JRPGs from Final Fantasy VII onwards aren't too heavy on the grinding (a few prior to that, like Chrono Trigger). And then you a game like Chrono Cross that doesn't require it at all. If you're grinding heavily, you're probably playing an older JRPG or a JRPG whose fanbase enjoys grinding (i.e. Dragon Quest).

The description of JRPG stories was also huge generalization.

While Black_Knight_00 is a good poster, I think he's being a bit too biased against JRPGs. Not that he has to like them (I can understand why they're not some people's cup of tea), but I don't think his assessment is very fair to the genre.

@Black_Knight_00: Again, a generalization. Looking at my collection of RPGs I have at this moment, I'd say most of them required only a little grinding or no grinding at all. At least on their standard difficulties.

Just to be clear, how are you defining grinding?

1) Being forced to level up for a couple hours in order to defeat a boss

2) Being forced to grind for hours in order to obtain a rare item with a low drop rate

As far as 1) is concerned, at a certain point during the PS1 era, JRPGs, with some exceptions, generally allowed for you to defeat bosses via normal leveling. It's mostly NES/SNES era RPGs that were very grindy.

As far as obtaining rate items is concerned, that's optional, so I don't really have an issue with that kind of grinding. And there are typically other ways to obtain rare items, some of them admittedly too convoluted.

I skipped the PS2 gen in terms of JRPGs, but more recently both FFXIII games require grinding to beat the final boss. Lost Odyssey requires grinding (though that's one of the few games where it's fun to do). The FFIV remake upped the ante considerably, forcing a lot of leveling. I hear the Persona games are grind-heavy as well.

Now, you may argue that i suck at JRPGs and I won't deny it, but I'm pretty sure the average gamer will have to stop at least once in most JRPGs

I play about 1 RPG per year, mainly because of time constraints: I just don't have enough free time. I like the genre, and there's a ton of RPGs I'd like to play, but it's just very hard for me to dedicate 50 hours to one game these days.

Also, let me take a second to add to the JRPG hate ITT.

There are definitely still grind-heavy JRPGs and admittedly most JRPGs require some form of grinding (tho I'd argue that WRPGs have a certain amount of grinding as well).I'm not denying that. I'm just saying that generally, the genre has eased up on the grinding considerably since the mid/late 90s.

FFIV is a remake of a retro game designed to be even more hardcore, so I'm not surprised it's really grindy.

Well, yeah, probably. At this rate that means that in the 2030s we will have no more JRPGs that stop you in your tracks to strecth the play time. Something to look forward to.

RPG is one of my favourite genres, along with action/adventure and platforming. I can very well see, though, that I'll be playing them less in the future once I take on real life commitments.

I agree they take a lot of time to finish and it could be a daunting task when you have other priorities but it is a fantastic genre and some of my favourite games are rpgs.

I'll usually play one or two a year and mix it up with the other games I have it.

@Black_Knight_00: You know, there ARE JRPGs that are always pushing you forward. Again, take Xenoblade. Any time you're not moving on with the main story is simply because you're stopping to explore or do side quests.

Yes, and there are non poisonous snakes as well, exceptions are always nice.

Though my enjoyment of the genre if often hampered upstream from there: I can tolerate grinding in a JRPG (thanks to my "watch a movie and mash A" technique) when the story is involving and the characters are relatable. Unfortunately the majority of japanese developers (possibly japanese culture at large) still retain the "games are for teens" mentality and very rarely offer characters that go beyond the 'hero's journey' and self-discovery narrative structures. A perfect example of this is Nier, which saw the protagonist changed from an aging man to a brooding teen in Japan to better please the teenage demographic. Call me old but formulaic and juvenile plots do very little for me and playing a JRPG with a dull plot feels like compiling a spreadsheet to me.

Lost Odyssey, Eternal Sonata, FFXIII (not XIII-2) and the aforementioned Nier were pleasant surprises in that regard. None of them had a particularly intresting stoty, but the characters were likable.

I should clarify that I don't mind long games. As long as the games constantly provide you with NEW CONTENT. If you're doing the same thing over and over again, I feel it to be a waste of time. And most RPG's do unfortunately.

@Black_Knight_00: Well, here I guess is where personal preference determines what's "good." I understand that a lot of JRPG plots are ultimately formulaic, but, to me, there's a ton of them that are really well executed, especially with their world crafting. It allows me to look beyond the ultimate formulaic nature of it. There's a lot of atmosphere to my favorite ones. Sure, strip that away and you have something insanely generic, but the same can be said about anything. Strip away all the meeting with characters and conflicts between them in RDR and what do you have? A damsel in distress story.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that a lot of really great JRPGs (from what I've seen) manage to take an established formula and apply it to a unique world and connect the characters into that world in a cool way. Of course, I don't play every JRPG for the story, either. I love the old school nature of the Dragon Quest games but the stories are about as basic as you can get.

Different strokes I guess. There are a lot of JRPGs out there that don't do anything special and there are truly amazing ones, just like any genre in gaming.

@drekula2: Didn't you say you loved RDR? That game was nothing but a shooting gallery (when you weren't being forced to complete mundane tasks).

@turtlethetaffer:

Yes, it really comes down to personal preference. Me, I can excuse a dumb story on the merits of a fun game, and vice-versa: I believe that a great story can salvage even the worst games. When it comes to JRPGs though, I have very rarely found one that was fun to play, for me personally, pure subjective tastes. Unless they are action oriented like Nier and Secret of Mana, I generally find combat systems to be a chore, so the story and characters are pretty much paramount in order for the game to hold my interest.

It's a genre that has for the most part lost its grip on me many springs ago and I like to poke fun at it and all, but I really wish they targeted the mature audience a little more. I did like that Agni's Philosophy tech demo from a while ago, but I guess that's not going to be a game after all.

No, I said it was criminally overrated. It was good. Just not anything more than just-good.

It was way too predictable.

RPG is pretty much my favorite genre at the moment. I'm content with the ones I play.

Same for me! But I must admit I'm less captivated by the latest RPGs on next-gen consoles, they kind of lost lost the magic that once appealed me. There are no longer games with the same impact as let's say Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 6, Final Fantasy 7 or Xenogear (well, imo).

On the other hand I greatly enjoyed Ni No Kuni on PS3.

In Eternal Eden (mentioned in my signature below) there's no level grinding, once an enemy troop is defeated it never respawn again. It makes backtracking and solving puzzles very pleasant.

i try to play them when i have the motivation and when there is a good game out for it i like. Dragon Age and FFX are on my list for next year. It's going to be awesome to play that game again after a decade

RPG is my favorite game type but there are some problem with them.

There are problems coming from it. There has not be a well respected JRPG title on the consoles in a while and that overlooking the haters of JRPG comments.

WRPG have gone down hill in a few away. One of the main problem is that many are focusing on pretending to be the character instead of Role playing the character. The problem this has shifted the focus from the game being a game to the game being an interactive story.

Along with that there be a reducing the complexity in the level up system. With the more simple leveling system there is of how the player can affect the character(s' / 's) role. Then comes on of the worse thing to happen to RPG...the skill tree.

Game: "In order to get to the increase stealth damage you must pick a point in pickpocketing"

Player: "I don't want my assassin to be able to pickpocket. I want the increase stealth damage and place the other points into combat."

Game: "Too bad, you must put a point there there so you can open the path to the next point." Or "Too bad, you need to place some many points into the thieving to open up the next tiers."

Let face it most of the WRPG combat systems are not that good. With the amount that the player having less control over the character and the lacking combat system well RPG have been losing good game play.

edited to added:

Any one else getting tired of the "There too much grinding" as the best argument against RPG. The amount of grinding is not the same for every player.

Sadly, in most cases game companies exaggerate on grinding as a way to prolong the playtime of the game without adding real contents in the game. I love grinding when levels rise up smoothly, but there many games in which defeating troops seems an endless chore and the effects are hardly noticeable in the stats.

I have a problem with the ideal that game companies force you to grind. I find the ideal that game companies say "Hey Chuck is going to speed through the game so we should add in grinding." to be foolish. They are making a RPG system and game for a large number of player with just as many way they will play. I played 56 hours of a game and spent about an hour for grinding. While my brother played the game for 54 hours stated he spent 5 hours grinding.

First off what is grinding is not the for many gamers and they are not using metric to measure it. Just their gut.

Commonly, long play times is a trait of RPG's. I don't think I can remember any RPG's that are relatively short. My life isn't busy and have little problem with the fact RPG's can take up time to complete one game. For those who wish shorter completion times so they can cram more games in what little time they may have, it probably will not happen.

For your second point, repetition can be good or bad if the repeated game play is fun or not for you. Games are notorious for this, and it does not merely apply to RPG's. I see repetition in most games I have opportunity to play. This is one reason people like multiplayer games due to the human component throwing in curveballs at you. Even then, multiplayer can be repetitive to a degree. I suppose devs need to ask themselves if the repetitive tasks are fun to do all the time.

For your third point, when is a story not a cliche? Sure, when you're young, you don't have much experience and a lot of things seem new to you. After you grow older, that charm is lost because you've experienced more things. I never watch a TV show, or a movie, book, or video game without seeing elements of storytelling be repeated. Take SC: Blacklist, for example. How often has entertainment thrown out the "Stop the terrorists!" plot line in the last decade or two? For me, it's not about looking for a plot that's original, it's about the entire story being told and its quality. The journey instead of the destination, to put it another way.

I think the best thing to do generally, like me, is to enjoy a breadth of genres that you can bounce around with. If you play too much of just one thing, it can get tired and boring. If you throw variety into the mix, it can help to keep the experience interesting. Perhaps you should consider any genres you have hardly played and give those a try.

I'm finding myself in the same situation as of late too. Don't get me wrong, I love me a good rpg from time to time (Ni No Kuni/ Tales) but I don't have as much patience as I used to during the ps1/ps2 days.

I'm finding that I like the action adventure/stealth/ 3rd + some fps/ some platformers genres lately. (Darksiders games, Dues Ex, Rage, Guacamelee ect.)

Some unique games like Minecraft and Terraria are really good too.

Games that last between the 15-20-25 hour marks seem about right (depending on the genre of course)

I myself got into action games/hack and slash/beat 'em up. Any of those three except FPS, I suck at FPS though I play single player FPS.

ARPGs are one of my favorite genre on mobile. And I've been addicted to them.

I can't speak for the rest of the series, but I recently finished Persona 4 Golden and didn't grind at all. Perhaps the harder difficulties require it, but normal didn't.

Dark Souls had been my favorite RPG this whole generation. Everything else I played is seriously flawed in some way. Elder Scrolls, Witcher, Mass Effect, Divinity 2, Risen, Gothic, Sacred 2, Kingdoms of Amalur, Tales, Diablo... Either the story sucks, gameplay sucks, progression sucks, or it's a grindfest...

In my opinion, Dark Souls is so close to a perfect RPG. Some shitty graphics and framerate, but can be overlooked.

I get what you're saying though. I agree completely. I love RPG's, but a lot of them have very serious problems.

@Shmiity: Dark Souls is the only RPG that I quit because of how much I did not like it and I played a large number of RPG.

I really don't see the point in complaining about a genre simply because they no longer fit your schedule.

Life happens, dude. Get over it.

As busy as I am these days, I still enjoy a good JRPG now and again. I don't really care if it takes me a few months to finish a 40 hour game as long it keeps me engrossed from start to finish.

I would also like an 'easy' and 'hardcore' mode in RPG's. I don't have the time or patience anymore to grind for hours on end, it's just not fun, it's a bore and it doesn't have anything to with challenge. If RPG's have an easy mode in which the bosses are challenging but doable without hours of grinding, that would be nice. For the people with more time on their hands, they could choose to play in hardcore mode. A 20-25 hour experience from a RPG is enough for me.

An easy mode well I would say that is the normal mode of most RPG I have played. I normally do not grind in most RPG that I play and even then they still takes about 40 hours to finish and only 2 hours of grinding.

at the OP:

Try out Bioshock Infinite I really liked the game ( and I normally stay away from shooters), it had a great story .

Also try Mass Effect 1 and maybe 2, if you value your sanity stay away from 3 it doesn't end well on all levels.

The Witcher 2 is also a great choice altough not very accesible.

I would not reccommend Skyrim since it is very boring long and has much grinding it is basically a singleplayer MMO, the second assassins creed and the Kotor games are however great games

I agree with a couple of others here that you shouldn't judge a game because of its length.

That has more to do with the fact that you were 14 than the games themselves.

Never been a fan of RPG's to be honest with you, I find them boring. I however loved Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic for Xbox. One of my favorite games actually.

What the crap, dude. You make it sound like there's no such thing as a 'save function'. Everyone else in here has their day-to-day the same as you and we're all still playing RPGs, regardless of how many hours we put into them.

I think you're issue is you are telling yourself you "don't have the time"---when in fact, you do, you just don't to make time for them anymore. Which is fine. You're burnt out the same as you are with shooters? Mmmkay.

If you ever come back to them I highly suggest Diablo III. Maybe even wait for the complete edition with D3: Reaper Of Souls on PS4 when it's finally out. Shit is fantastic. ^_^

@DuaIFace: One of my pet hates. "I don't have time for X game, its too long. I lead a busy lifestyle [insert more nonsense]. You can play an RPG for 1 hour a day for two months, and you'd have plenty of time to enjoy all that it has to offer.

No one says you have to sit down for 8 hours a day and play games. "Oh but I want to play all these other games". Ok, so prioritize what matters more to you. RPGs or sports games or whatever. The length of the game itself is almost always irrelevant in people's grievances.