my thoughts on the dreamcast

so I just got a dreamcast and while I havent played that many games (ive got Sonic Adventure, Shenmue, Crazi Taxi, Skies of Arcadia,RE2/3, Tomb Raider,among others)

ive managed to already conclude a few things

1)that the dreamcast is a great system.

2)that it should have been more successful

3)that I like my Sega Saturn more.

that last one will probably surprise most people. given the praise the DC gets, but I actually like the Saturn more, mainly because I believe the saturn has a somewhat more varied game library, and overall better games.

I actually thought the DC was gonna change my opinion of the Saturn.

im probably in the minority, but what are your opinions?

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

The fact that the Dreamcast doesn't have a sigle 2D side-scroller for example, was very regrettable.

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

Panzer_Zwei

and yet we are both gonna get people telling us how wrong we are and how the saturn is a worthless system and Ive played many more DC games then these, its just that it was at friend's houses or on different systems (RE:CV ,DOA2)Darkman2007

But what those forums Wizards will never be able to explain is how the Saturn that nobody owned or cared about and that was only successful in Japan had the biggest SEGA console library and the biggest third party support and also lived for longer than the Dreamcast.

I did however believed at the time that the Dreamcast was going to be way more successful than the Saturn. I don't know what the guys who designed the Saturn were thinking because it was totally the opposite to SEGA's intentions. The Dreamcast although also tech-wise inferior for its expecations took more advantage of the SEGA technology at the time. The Saturn being a 2D powerhouse didn't benefit SEGA developers in the least, in fact about 90% of first party games for the Saturn were 3D.

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

The fact that the Dreamcast doesn't have a sigle 2D side-scroller for example, was very regrettable.

Panzer_Zwei

What on Earth are you talking about? As a SHMUP veteran, you should have known about "Ikaruga" and "Bangai-O." But, you're talking about platformers right? Sega Smash Pack had some original sidescrollers on there. I can't think of any new exclusive to the Dreamcast though.

im not sure about tech specs, but I do know the saturn can do some really good 3D, contrary to popular opinion (games like dead or alive prove that)

of course it was a pain to achieve that 3D, which is one thing the DC does have over the saturn, its a more developer friendly design

What on Earth are you talking about? As a SHMUP veteran, you should have known about "Ikaruga" and "Bangai-O." But, you're talking about platformers right? Sega Smash Pack had some original sidescrollers on there. I can't think of any new exclusive to the Dreamcast though.

BanjoMumbo

But even in shooters, the Dreamcast was very lackluster compared to the Saturn.

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

The fact that the Dreamcast doesn't have a sigle 2D side-scroller for example, was very regrettable.

Panzer_Zwei

The DS one just ain't the same

Comparing the Dreamcast to the Saturn, I'd have to say that I enjoyed the Dreamcast more, but in the end it comes down to controller vs controller-and the controller for Saturn was pretty nifty, in my opinion.

Both the Saturn and Dreamcast are essential to own if you are a Japanophile, retro enthusiast or Sega fanatic.

I would say the Dreamcast wins when it comes to quirky, innovative titles that can be enjoyed in much the same way you could enjoy playing an Xbox 360 or Wii, but it also has its fair share of arcade shooters and JRPG's.

The Saturn is more strictly old school and will always have a more niche audience. It was sort of like the PlayStation, minus the big budget 3D games and plus some very nice Sega exclusives.

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

The fact that the Dreamcast doesn't have a sigle 2D side-scroller for example, was very regrettable.

gregbmil

The DS one just ain't the same

so I just got a dreamcast and while I havent played that many games (ive got Sonic Adventure, Shenmue, Crazi Taxi, Skies of Arcadia,RE2/3, Tomb Raider,among others)

ive managed to already conclude a few things

1)that the dreamcast is a great system.

2)that it should have been more successful

3)that I like my Sega Saturn more.

that last one will probably surprise most people. given the praise the DC gets, but I actually like the Saturn more, mainly because I believe the saturn has a somewhat more varied game library, and overall better games.

I actually thought the DC was gonna change my opinion of the Saturn.

im probably in the minority, but what are your opinions?

Darkman2007

The Dreamcast gets the praise it gets because when it was discontinued it became a "legendary" console for the most part.

But I mean srsly. If the thing was out for more than 2.5 years do you not think it's library would have been absolutely extraordinary? I mean it was already amazing as is.

The Dreamcast gets the praise it gets because when it was discontinued it became a "legendary" console for the most part.

But I mean srsly. If the thing was out for more than 2.5 years do you not think it's library would have been absolutely extraordinary? I mean it was already amazing as is.

treedoor

And I don't think it would have been "extraordinary" seeing as it seriously lacked third party support.

But you say that the Dreamcast was amazing, compared to what exactly?

While the Mega Drive and Saturn are relentlessly compared to their rival systems the SFC, PS, N64 etc. The Dreamcast for some reason is treated like it's on it's own league. I wanna hear people actually say why the system and it's games are better than the PS2,XBOX and GC.

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

The Dreamcast gets the praise it gets because when it was discontinued it became a "legendary" console for the most part.

But I mean srsly. If the thing was out for more than 2.5 years do you not think it's library would have been absolutely extraordinary? I mean it was already amazing as is.

Panzer_Zwei

And I don't think it would have been "extraordinary" seeing as it seriously lacked third party support.

But you say that the Dreamcast was amazing, compared to what exactly?

I wasn't implying USA mattered only. I was going by the fact that it was released in Nov 98, and it was about 2 and a half years after when support for it was coming to a close seeing as how it began getting discontinued in various regions at that point.

ANd I say it's amazing because the library of games were awesome.

Not really sure about it's lack of 3rd party support aside from EA though.

RE: Code Veronica

Marvel vs. Capcom 2

Ikaruga

Dead or Alive 2

Rayman 2

MDK2

Quake 3

Powerstone 2

Street Fighter III: Third Strike

Bangai-O

Guilty Gear X

Tony Hawks Pro Skater 2

Unreal Tournament

Grandia 2

Soul Calibur

All AMAZING 3rd party games.

Now lemme list the 1st party

We've got:

Sonic Adventure 1 & 2

Shenmue 1 & 2

Jet Grind Radio

Virtua Tennis

NFL 2k series

SKies of Arcadia

Crazy Taxi 1 & 2

Phantasy Star Online

Samba De Amigo

Chu Chu Rocket

Space Channel 5

These are all games worth buying the system for, and this isn't even a full list!

...

........

RE2 & 3

Rez

NBA 2k series

Racing games such as Test Drive, Sega GT, F355 challenge,Daytona USA

One of my personal favorites - Mr Driller

Typing of the Dead - It's actually good imo, and my friends really like it too

WOrms Armageddon

Pen Pen Trilcelon

Ooga Booga

Bomberman Online - I know this game doesn't evolve much multiplayer wise, but it's fun regardless.

K now I'll stop. I'm drooling a bit too much here, but seriously there are still games to list. I didn't mention some because they're part of some of the series of games mentioned.

More than half of those games are available on other systems and in many cases enhanced. So you really don't need the Dreamcast to play them.

But that wasn't what I was asking for. I mean I'm sure if you ask other posters they would also put a great list of PS2, GC and XBOX games.

So basically what I'm asking is that you think the DC gaming library is better than that of the PS2, XBOX or GC? That's what really matters.

Compare games in the same manner that Sonic games were compared to Super Mario World.

More than half of those games are available on other systems and in many cases enhanced. So you really don't need the Dreamcast to play them.

But that wasn't what I was asking for. I mean I'm sure if you ask other posters they would also put a great list of PS2, GC and XBOX games.

So basically what I'm asking is that you think the DC gaming library is better than that of the PS2, XBOX or GC?

Compare games in the same manner that Sonic games were compared to Super Mario World.

Panzer_Zwei

You're right.

Once the Dreamcast was discontinued support shifted so some of these games went to other platforms.

It's like saying the Super Nintendo isn't amazing because it's best games can be found on other systems nowadays. That's not really how it works. The Dreamcast was amazing for those few years.

And me personally? I never really found a taste for the PS2 library. I really liked the Xbox, and the Gamecube libraries, but I still like the Dreamcast's library more than both of them.

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

More than half of those games are available on other systems and in many cases enhanced. So you really don't need the Dreamcast to play them.

But that wasn't what I was asking for. I mean I'm sure if you ask other posters they would also put a great list of PS2, GC and XBOX games.

So basically what I'm asking is that you think the DC gaming library is better than that of the PS2, XBOX or GC?

Compare games in the same manner that Sonic games were compared to Super Mario World.

treedoor

You're right.

Once the Dreamcast was discontinued support shifted so some of these games went to other platforms.

It's like saying the Super Nintendo isn't amazing because it's best games can be found on other systems nowadays. That's not really how it works. The Dreamcast was amazing for those few years.

And me personally? I never really found a taste for the PS2 library. I really liked the Xbox, and the Gamecube libraries, but I still like the Dreamcast's library more than both of them.

And "at the time" doesn't matter anymore. I doubt any SFC fan cares that the two year old Mega Drive had a more solid gaming library than the SFC when it was released. What they care about is the libraries they end up having.

I could also say that if the Saturn had lived for more than 6 years like the Playstation it would have been more amazing, but what's the point and merit of that?

The Dreamcast doesn't get any objective comparison. It's just an amazing system for most people. I mean they like it less than the PS2,Xbox and GC, and all of their DC games are pirated, but yeah, still amazing.

[QUOTE="gregbmil"]

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

The Saturn was the SEGA console with the biggest gaming library and the biggest amount of third party support. It had a whole more varied gaming library that the Dreamcast.

The fact that the Dreamcast doesn't have a sigle 2D side-scroller for example, was very regrettable.

Panzer_Zwei

The DS one just ain't the same

Hey, in my eyes it's an original and my favorite dreamcast game. Wait come to think of it I thought the 64 one only released in japan? If so no wonder I never heard of it

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

More than half of those games are available on other systems and in many cases enhanced. So you really don't need the Dreamcast to play them.

But that wasn't what I was asking for. I mean I'm sure if you ask other posters they would also put a great list of PS2, GC and XBOX games.

So basically what I'm asking is that you think the DC gaming library is better than that of the PS2, XBOX or GC?

Compare games in the same manner that Sonic games were compared to Super Mario World.

Panzer_Zwei

You're right.

Once the Dreamcast was discontinued support shifted so some of these games went to other platforms.

It's like saying the Super Nintendo isn't amazing because it's best games can be found on other systems nowadays. That's not really how it works. The Dreamcast was amazing for those few years.

And me personally? I never really found a taste for the PS2 library. I really liked the Xbox, and the Gamecube libraries, but I still like the Dreamcast's library more than both of them.

And "at the time" doesn't matter anymore. I doubt any SFC fan cares that the two year old Mega Drive had a more solid gaming library than the SFC when it was released. What they care about is the libraries they end up having.

I could also say that if the Saturn had lived for more than 6 years like the Playstation it would have been more amazing, but what's the point and merit of that?

The Dreamcast doesn't get any objective comparison. It's just an amazing system for most people. I mean they like it less than the PS2,Xbox and GC, and all of their DC games are pirated, but yeah, still amazing.

Basically, I'm sticking to what I said because when I look at the Dreamcast's library I don't say "Wow the Dreamcast might as well not be memorable for Space Channel 5, or Skies of Arcadia because I can play those on other systems"

And that's just that really. The Dreamcast brought to light some magnificent franchises, and had the best versions of arcade games, and other various ports.

People look at the PS1 and see games like MGS, FF, and RE regardless of the fact that other systems had these games. The PS1 brought them to light, and the PS1 is where everyone's memories with those games lie. (in b4 FF was on Nintendo first because I KNOW).

Well, when I look at the Dreamcast, and see those games I listed I don't go looking for an excuse to downplay the Dreamcast's library, and that's why I'll forever think it's an amazing system. I like it more than the Xbox, GC, and PS2, but I actually thought the Xbox and Gamecube had the best multiplayer games of all last gen. I don't pirate my games either :cry:

Eh, I love my DC and all (one of my favorite systems) but I preferred Saturn as well (That is if you take non US games into account).

Basically, I'm sticking to what I said because when I look at the Dreamcast's library I don't say "Wow the Dreamcast might as well not be memorable for Space Channel 5, or Skies of Arcadia because I can play those on other systems"

And that's just that really. The Dreamcast brought to light some magnificent franchises, and had the best versions of arcade games, and other various ports.

People look at the PS1 and see games like MGS, FF, and RE regardless of the fact that other systems had these games. The PS1 brought them to light, and the PS1 is where everyone's memories with those games lie. (in b4 FF was on Nintendo first because I KNOW).

Well, when I look at the Dreamcast, and see those games I listed I don't go looking for an excuse to downplay the Dreamcast's library, and that's why I'll forever think it's an amazing system. I like it more than the Xbox, GC, and PS2, but I actually thought the Xbox and Gamecube had the best multiplayer games of all last gen. I don't pirate my games either :cry:

treedoor

Metal Gear Solid wasn't on any other rival console on it's generation, same with FFVII,VIII,IX so none of what you're saying applies.

It would've made a world of difference if Chrono Trigger had been released for the Mega Drive (a direct rival console) than when it was released for the Playstation and the Nintendo DS. You wouldn't had needed a SFC to play the game "on it's time" and that's a world of difference. Same if MGS had been released for the SS and N64. Owners of those system wouldn't had needed to buy a PS to play the game,.

However games like Eternal Arcadia, Special Channel 5, Bio Hazard: Code Veronica, and nearly half the DC library are available on other consoles of the same generation. So many consumers never needed to buy a Dreamcast to play them. And since you're probably most likely unaware, games like REZ and Space Channel 5 Part 2 weren't even exclusive to the Dreamcast to begin with. They were multi-plats, with both the DC and PS2 verisions released the same day. And guess what? They were better on the PS2.

Relax dude, I was not even aware of the N64 version before I started playing the one on Dreamcast. And just because it's an enhanced version of the 64 one means there's something wrong with it?

Hey, in my eyes it's an original and my favorite dreamcast game. Wait come to think of it I thought the 64 one only released in japan? If so no wonder I never heard of it

gregbmil

My point was that the DC doesn't have a single action side-scrolling game, like the Saturn and Playstation had Silhouette Mirage, Rockman 8 and countless others. Hell even the N64 had some.

But yes, the N64 edtion was only released in Japan and in very small quantities I believe. I have it (alongside the two other Treasure games for the system) And basically the DC has sharper image and no slowdown (N64 was plagued by it). A new combo system, more bosses, and in general more stuff, so yes, the DC version is vastly superior

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

Panzer_Zwei

Metal Gear Solid wasn't on any other rival console on it's generation, same with FFVII,VIII,IX so none of what you're saying applies.

It would've made a world of difference if Chrono Trigger had been released for the Mega Drive (a direct rival console) than when it was released for the Playstation and the Nintendo DS. You wouldn't had needed a SFC to play the game "on it's time" and that's a world of difference. Same if MGS had been released for the SS and N64. Owners of those system wouldn't had needed to buy a PS to play the game,.

However games like Eternal Arcadia, Special Channel 5, Bio Hazard: Code Veronica, and nearly half the DC library are available on other consoles of the same generation. So many consumers never needed to buy a Dreamcast to play them. And since you're probably most likely unaware, games like REZ and Space Channel 5 Part 2 weren't even exclusive to the Dreamcast to begin with. They were multi-plats, with both the DC and PS2 verisions released the same day. And guess what? They were better on the PS2.

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

Basically, I'm sticking to what I said because when I look at the Dreamcast's library I don't say "Wow the Dreamcast might as well not be memorable for Space Channel 5, or Skies of Arcadia because I can play those on other systems"

And that's just that really. The Dreamcast brought to light some magnificent franchises, and had the best versions of arcade games, and other various ports.

People look at the PS1 and see games like MGS, FF, and RE regardless of the fact that other systems had these games. The PS1 brought them to light, and the PS1 is where everyone's memories with those games lie. (in b4 FF was on Nintendo first because I KNOW).

Well, when I look at the Dreamcast, and see those games I listed I don't go looking for an excuse to downplay the Dreamcast's library, and that's why I'll forever think it's an amazing system. I like it more than the Xbox, GC, and PS2, but I actually thought the Xbox and Gamecube had the best multiplayer games of all last gen. I don't pirate my games either :cry:

Panzer_Zwei

Metal Gear Solid wasn't on any other rival console on it's generation, same with FFVII,VIII,IX so none of what you're saying applies.

It would've made a world of difference if Chrono Trigger had been released for the Mega Drive (a direct rival console) than when it was released for the Playstation and the Nintendo DS. You wouldn't had needed a SFC to play the game "on it's time" and that's a world of difference. Same if MGS had been released for the SS and N64. Owners of those system wouldn't had needed to buy a PS to play the game,.

However games like Eternal Arcadia, Special Channel 5, Bio Hazard: Code Veronica, and nearly half the DC library are available on other consoles of the same generation. So many consumers never needed to buy a Dreamcast to play them. And since you're probably most likely unaware, games like REZ and Space Channel 5 Part 2 weren't even exclusive to the Dreamcast to begin with. They were multi-plats, with both the DC and PS2 verisions released the same day. And guess what? They were better on the PS2.

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

Basically, I'm sticking to what I said because when I look at the Dreamcast's library I don't say "Wow the Dreamcast might as well not be memorable for Space Channel 5, or Skies of Arcadia because I can play those on other systems"

And that's just that really. The Dreamcast brought to light some magnificent franchises, and had the best versions of arcade games, and other various ports.

People look at the PS1 and see games like MGS, FF, and RE regardless of the fact that other systems had these games. The PS1 brought them to light, and the PS1 is where everyone's memories with those games lie. (in b4 FF was on Nintendo first because I KNOW).

Well, when I look at the Dreamcast, and see those games I listed I don't go looking for an excuse to downplay the Dreamcast's library, and that's why I'll forever think it's an amazing system. I like it more than the Xbox, GC, and PS2, but I actually thought the Xbox and Gamecube had the best multiplayer games of all last gen. I don't pirate my games either :cry:

SilentEchoes08

Metal Gear Solid wasn't on any other rival console on it's generation, same with FFVII,VIII,IX so none of what you're saying applies.

It would've made a world of difference if Chrono Trigger had been released for the Mega Drive (a direct rival console) than when it was released for the Playstation and the Nintendo DS. You wouldn't had needed a SFC to play the game "on it's time" and that's a world of difference. Same if MGS had been released for the SS and N64. Owners of those system wouldn't had needed to buy a PS to play the game,.

However games like Eternal Arcadia, Special Channel 5, Bio Hazard: Code Veronica, and nearly half the DC library are available on other consoles of the same generation. So many consumers never needed to buy a Dreamcast to play them. And since you're probably most likely unaware, games like REZ and Space Channel 5 Part 2 weren't even exclusive to the Dreamcast to begin with. They were multi-plats, with both the DC and PS2 verisions released the same day. And guess what? They were better on the PS2.

The Super Famicom was released two years after the Mega Drive. The N64 was released two years after the SEGA Saturn and Playstation, and the Playstation was by much the most successful. Were those systems considered a gen apart? No. They are cla$$ified within the same generation and are compared as such. The Dreamcast is within the same generation than the PS2/XBOX/GC. It just came out first, someone had to.

Also Crazy Taxi is available on the PS2. Sonic Adventure I&II for the GC and Shenmue II on the Xbox, as well as Crazy Taxi 1&2 are available on Crazy Taxi 3 for the Xbox.

And did people that bought Grandia and the Lunar games for the Playstation cared that the Saturn gave light to those games? I bet most of them didn't even knew. They would've cared more about its originins it they hadn't been released for the Playstation, but they were.

[QUOTE="Panzer_Zwei"]

[QUOTE="treedoor"]

AcidSoldner

Metal Gear Solid wasn't on any other rival console on it's generation, same with FFVII,VIII,IX so none of what you're saying applies.

It would've made a world of difference if Chrono Trigger had been released for the Mega Drive (a direct rival console) than when it was released for the Playstation and the Nintendo DS. You wouldn't had needed a SFC to play the game "on it's time" and that's a world of difference. Same if MGS had been released for the SS and N64. Owners of those system wouldn't had needed to buy a PS to play the game,.

However games like Eternal Arcadia, Special Channel 5, Bio Hazard: Code Veronica, and nearly half the DC library are available on other consoles of the same generation. So many consumers never needed to buy a Dreamcast to play them. And since you're probably most likely unaware, games like REZ and Space Channel 5 Part 2 weren't even exclusive to the Dreamcast to begin with. They were multi-plats, with both the DC and PS2 verisions released the same day. And guess what? They were better on the PS2.

Even SEGA released some of their Saturn exclusive games for PC themselves. If your logic applied, they would've competed against themselves.