The Greatest 10 Games of the Decade (with pics)

I'm sure there have been plenty of these threads already but... meh :P. Not necessarily favorites, but best... for example if it was favorites I'd be tempted to put Fallout 3, Rome: Total War, Hotel Dusk: Room 215, and Okami on here. They all deserve spots but... there's only 10.

10. Shadow of the Colossus

9. Warcraft 3

8. The Sims

7. Uncharted 2

6. Resident Evil 4

5. Halo: Combat Evolved

4. Mass Effect

3. World of Warcraft

2. Half Life 2

1. Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence

This is actually a decent list (unlike the crap GOTY awards we've seen this year). CE could arguably be higher up than HL2. I'm disappointed big name game critics didn't make any "best of the decade" lists. I'd make my own, but I'd have to think too hard and long.

Once again, no Metroid Prime on list = complete failure.

Automatic grade of F

AFBrat77

I probably would've had Prime on mine, but the list is good nevertheless.

I like pretty pictures. MGS3 at number one, I completely agree with this list. ^^b

1. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2003

Vice City simply goes beyond having an open-ended world and varied, superb gameplay - the amount of styIe Rockstar poured into this game is unmatched. Neon-lit art-deco 80's Miami, fantastic music, a plethora of colorful characters, a cIassic rise-to-power crime storyline, and finally a cool, no bull**** protagonist voiced by Ray Liotta. Vice City also sports the groundbreaking series' most engaging side-missions including masterminding a bank heist and managing a porn film studio.

2. Half-Life 2

• Publisher: Sierra Entertainment
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2004

From the opening Point Insertion level, I realized I have embarked on something truly unique - City 17 was a cold, uninviting place in which the easy-to-see-through propaganda of a puppet human government is brainwashing you from the very first few seconds of gameplay. The atmosphere is palpable, you can feel the misery of the people that surround you, and you fervently want to join in the revolt. There is something distinctly real and human about Half-Life 2 despite the fact that you're fighting off an alien invasion. One of the very few games in which the reason to fight is as important as the fight itself.

3. Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic

• Publisher: LucasArts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2003

BioWare managed to provide the most complete Star Wars experience with this RPG of epic proportions. Incredibly well-written staying true to its source material, it has some of the most interesting characters in the Star Wars universe, and it sports the best Star Wars storyline since the first three movies. On top of all that, you actually get to traverse through a massive Star Wars universe and decide its fate. Knight of the Old Republic is everything an RPG can possibly be.

4. The Longest Journey

• Publisher: Funcom
• Developer: Funcom
• 2000

This is the absolute pinnacle of adventure gaming and storytelling. The gameplay is exquisite, the puzzles are challenging and, more importantly, make sense. The writing is superb, you will not encounter better developed characters than this, and the voice acting is organic and natural. After playing through this game, I felt as if I knew April Ryan, as if she was someone I was once friends with. April Ryan's journey should not be missed.

5. Team Fortress 2

• Publisher: Valve Software
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2007

A multiplayer game that has it all - a wonderful art-styIe, awesome characters, insane amounts of polish and balance and--this is what it truly excels at--teamwork. The cIasses give loads of gameplay variety, the goal-oriented teamwork paves the way for awesome battle scenarios and the fantastic community provides a bottomless amount of maps, mods, servers and everything in-between.

6. Ninja Gaiden

• Publisher: Tecmo
• Developer: Team Ninja
• 2004

The guys over at Team Ninja are undeniably a sadistic bunch who managed to bring me to tears out of sheer frustration - this game is ****ing hard. I'm no fan of such punishment and if it were any other game, I'd quit in a heartbeat. But there was something about Ninja Gaiden that constantly kept me moving forward no matter how badly I got schooled by the AI - and to keep playing after enduring such punishment and ending up looking like a complete wuss to simple computer AI is Ninja Gaiden's greatest feat. Because the game is just so incredible you can't put it down no matter what.

7. Civilization IV

• Publsiher: 2K Games
• Developer: Firaxis Games
• 2005

Civilization IV elevated the venerable series' formula to unseen heights. The interface was streamlined in order to avoid unnecessary, boring micromanagement. It's also the most accessible game in the series providing lots of options and making the game faster. But most importantly, these changes were made without compromising the insane depth and scope old fans expected. Just the opposite, it has more features than ever such as the fantastic religion system.

8. Disciples II: Dark Prophecy

• Publisher: Strategy First
• Developer: Strategy First
• 2002

The easiest way to describe this game is to compare it to Heroes of Might and Magic. But you would be doing it a horrible diservice as well. Disciples II is as different from Heroes as it is similar to it. It's an absolutely brilliant turn-based strategy game with a compelling universe, deep tactical gameplay that is easy to learn but difficult to master and a fantastic art-styIe.

9. Grand Theft Auto IV

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2008

The game that took the series in a very different direction. It is a back-to-basics game showcasing Rockstar's incredible restraint and vision. Grand Theft Auto IV tells a dark New York immigrant story with believeable characters and great writing. It features one of the most amazing and detailed gameworlds ever created, stunning graphics, a great combat system, refined driving mechanics, competent AI. On top of all that, there's also the video editor and the fantastic Independence FM.

10. Dragon Age: Origins

• Publisher: Electronic Arts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2009

The best thing to say about Dragon Age is that nothing feels like an afterthought in this game. Everything, absolutely everything is well thought-out and deliberate. An incredibly detailed gameworld with rich culture and history, a teriffic cast of characters, insane amount of fully voiced NPC's and a deep tactical combat system that never gets repetetive.

1. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2003

Vice City simply goes beyond having an open-ended world and varied, superb gameplay - the amount of styIe Rockstar poured into this game is unmatched. Neon-lit art-deco 80's Miami, fantastic music, a plethora of colorful characters, a cIassic rise-to-power crime storyline, and finally a cool, no bull**** protagonist voiced by Ray Liotta. Vice City also sports the groundbreaking series' most engaging side-missions including masterminding a bank heist and managing a porn film studio.

2. Half-Life 2

• Publisher: Sierra Entertainment
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2004

From the opening Point Insertion level, I realized I have embarked on something truly unique - City 17 was a cold, uninviting place in which the easy-to-see-through propaganda of a puppet human government is brainwashing you from the very first few seconds of gameplay. The atmosphere is palpable, you can feel the misery of the people that surround you, and you fervently want to join in the revolt. There is something distinctly real and human about Half-Life 2 despite the fact that you're fighting off an alien invasion. One of the very few games in which the reason to fight is as important as the fight itself.

3. Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic

• Publisher: LucasArts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2003

BioWare managed to provide the most complete Star Wars experience with this RPG of epic proportions. Incredibly well-written staying true to its source material, it has some of the most interesting characters in the Star Wars universe, and it sports the best Star Wars storyline since the first three movies. On top of all that, you actually get to traverse through a massive Star Wars universe and decide its fate. Knight of the Old Republic is everything an RPG can possibly be.

4. The Longest Journey

• Publisher: Funcom
• Developer: Funcom
• 2000

This is the absolute pinnacle of adventure gaming and storytelling. The gameplay is exquisite, the puzzles are challenging and, more importantly, make sense. The writing is superb, you will not encounter better developed characters than this, and the voice acting is organic and natural. After playing through this game, I felt as if I knew April Ryan, as if she was someone I was once friends with. April Ryan's journey should not be missed.

5. Team Fortress 2

• Publisher: Valve Software
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2007

A multiplayer game that has it all - a wonderful art-styIe, awesome characters, insane amounts of polish and balance and--this is what it truly excels at--teamwork. The cIasses give loads of gameplay variety, the goal-oriented teamwork paves the way for awesome battle scenarios and the fantastic community provides a bottomless amount of maps, mods, servers and everything in-between.

6. Ninja Gaiden

• Publisher: Tecmo
• Developer: Team Ninja
• 2004

The guys over at Team Ninja are undeniably a sadistic bunch who managed to bring me to tears out of sheer frustration - this game is ****ing hard. I'm no fan of such punishment and if it were any other game, I'd quit in a heartbeat. But there was something about Ninja Gaiden that constantly kept me moving forward no matter how badly I got schooled by the AI - and to keep playing after enduring such punishment and ending up looking like a complete wuss to simple computer AI is Ninja Gaiden's greatest feat. Because the game is just so incredible you can't put it down no matter what.

7. Civilization IV

• Publsiher: 2K Games
• Developer: Firaxis Games
• 2005

Civilization IV elevated the venerable series' formula to unseen heights. The interface was streamlined in order to avoid unnecessary, boring micromanagement. It's also the most accessible game in the series providing lots of options and making the game faster. But most importantly, these changes were made without compromising the insane depth and scope old fans expected. Just the opposite, it has more features than ever such as the fantastic religion system.

8. Disciples II: Dark Prophecy

• Publisher: Strategy First
• Developer: Strategy First
• 2002

The easiest way to describe this game is to compare it to Heroes of Might and Magic. But you would be doing it a horrible diservice as well. Disciples II is as different from Heroes as it is similar to it. It's an absolutely brilliant turn-based strategy game with a compelling universe, deep tactical gameplay that is easy to learn but difficult to master and a fantastic art-styIe.

9. Grand Theft Auto IV

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2008

The game that took the series in a very different direction. It is a back-to-basics game showcasing Rockstar's incredible restraint and vision. Grand Theft Auto IV tells a dark New York immigrant story with believeable characters and great writing. It features one of the most amazing and detailed gameworlds ever created, stunning graphics, a great combat system, refined driving mechanics, competent AI. On top of all that, there's also the video editor and the fantastic Independence FM.

10. Dragon Age: Origins

• Publisher: Electronic Arts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2009

The best thing to say about Dragon Age is that nothing feels like an afterthought in this game. Everything, absolutely everything is well thought-out and deliberate. An incredibly detailed gameworld with rich culture and history, a teriffic cast of characters, insane amount of fully voiced NPC's and a deep tactical combat system that never gets repetetive.

UpInFlames

Ouch, double whammy, no Metroid Prime, yet you have the far inferior (IMO) Longest Journey (most dissapointing PC game I've ever played, it had a few moments in the middle of the game) and its non-intuitive puzzles (ie that rubber duck puzzle).

Still, I respect your opinion and I think you have some good picks on there, though I probably like the games in the first post better.

Good job taking the time to lay it out for us why you like them.

My list would be something like this:

1. Metroid Prime
2. Half-Life 2 (in particular the expansions, PC version)
3. Deus Ex
4. Resident Evil 4 (GC version)
5. Dragon Age: Origins (PC)
6. Baldur's Gate 2: Shadows of Amn
7. Bioshock
8. Max Payne (I just bought the sequel so I'll see how that compares)
9. Eternal Darkness
10. Company of Heroes

...but there are PS2/PS3/XBox exclusives I haven't played to be honest

Once again, no Metroid Prime on list = complete failure.

Automatic grade of F

AFBrat77

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]

Once again, no Metroid Prime on list = complete failure.

Automatic grade of F

Glow-Stick

He can say whatever he wants to about my list.....no big deal to me.

I don't troll, I would not have that high of a GS rank if I did.

If it makes you feel better, I'll add IMO, so IMO Halo included and Prime excluded is a list I can't take seriously, there haven't been 10 better games than Metroid Prime all decade, thats for sure, well IMO and the critic collective known as GameRankings.

In no particular order:

Majora's Mask

Banjo-Tooie

Braid

Half-Life 2

Halo: CE

Metroid Prime

Uncharted 2

Resident Evil 4

Ninja Gaiden Black

Shadows of the Collosus

In no particular order:

Majora's Mask

Banjo-Tooie

Braid

Half-Life 2

Halo: CE

Metroid Prime

Uncharted 2

Resident Evil 4

Ninja Gaiden Black

Shadows of the Collosus

gamer_10001

nice list, i don't want to get off-topic but quick question:

how the heck do you save in Majora's Mask?

I have the Zelda Collector's Edition for the Gamecube.

1. Littlebigplanet - Four player co-op, a steady stream of great levels from the community, and a reasonably fast stream of content from Media Molecule which enables a lot of variety in the community levels. To top it off, even for those not inclined to build levels, the level creator is a wonderful playground.

2. Uncharted 2 - It hits the ground running, gives players a brief breather in the middle, then starts running again. There are so many incredible set pieces even the Metal Gear games are shamed (though ND doesn't quite have Kojima's touch when it comes to boss battles). The cast and the interaction between them is excellent, and its nice that the characters of the well, characters, are mostly conveyed during gameplay.

3. Valkyria Chronicles - Gorgeous graphics, amazing battle system (which reminds me a bit of X-com) and a smart leveling system (characters have personality traits/special abilities which impact battle performace, but one levels up ****s not individuals).

4. Final Fantasy 12 - Excellent battle system, superb localization, the byzantine plotline Matsuno fans know and love (with a Middle English localization just like Vagrant Story), no random encounters (and no separate battle screen, which meant one might wind up fighting several groups of enemies at the same time) and tons of content (I spent 140 hours with it and didn't see everything).

5. Demon's Souls - Great enemies, massive bosses, anawesome realtime battle system and a brilliantly innovative online system (hints and the odd helping hand or invasion link together different players). You can be a lightly armored thief who can be killed a by single solid blow and avoids attacks through dodges and the odd block (though they are so weak they can't block heavy blows), waiting for the moment where the enemy leaves themselves open and then stabbing them with your stilletto, or you can be a lumbering knight (who relishes toe to toe combat)or a mage (who likes to attack from afar) or somewhere inbetween.

6. Persona 4 - Its a last gen party basedjrpg which contains the innovation similar games this gen have been sorely lacking. Persona 4 is an evolution of the revolutionary Persona 3, but I'm naming the best games, not the most innovative. The game offers a ton of stuff to do at any one time (do you want to try to save the person who currently needs saving, explore old dungeons hoping to mind a hidden boss, hang out with your buddies, date that cute girl you've had your eye on, study or play a sport?). Every decision impacts the strength of your character (relationships determine affinity with demons) and the localization is superb (Atlus never does anything less).

7. God of War 2 - Great battles (it starts off with one fighting a statue so big its clearly a homage to SoTC), massive enemies and the angriest man in gaming (his enemies die bad deaths), Ico ****puzzles (more on that later) and incredible level design make for a very enjoyable mix. Kind of like Uncharted 2, GoW2 is the type of game which makes me suspect that there are game designers out there out have a machine which lets them read my mind and give me everything I desire. Not particularly original, just plain awesome.

8. Zone of Enders 2 - The combat of the original wasgood (I'd say even before DMC ZOE was the first game to nail 3D action) but the combat of ZOE2 is amazing (the greater enemy variety and fewer penalties for collateral damage helped a lot). Targetting a bunch of far away enemies Panzer Dragoon **** then breaking out your sword and chopping into them when they get close (not to mention grabbing a guy and slamming him into a wall or another enemy, whichever is handier) is incredibly fun.

9. Ico - The first time I saw a kid leading a pretty girl, my mind was blown. Prior to Ico, games were always about getting to the princess, then they ended once you get to her, but in Ico, one pretty much started off with the princess and had to get away with her. Great puzzles (you see something, you are looking at the solution, there was no push the box or find the key nonsense), incredible environments (I've never forget the windmill on the lake) and wonderful characters (the first time I saw the Princess playing with the doves).

10. Warhawk -Its a perfectly balanced online only shooter (the titular Warhawk is the hardest vehicle in the game to use, but is the deadlist weapon in the game once mastered) in which the only difference between recruits and generals is skill. The presence of APCs, Warhawks, Tanks, Jeeps, backpacks (man, we infantry guys squealed like little girls when we first saw that trailer) and even the controversial dropship made the game much more interesting/epic than it would be if it was just combat between humans. Moderated, dedicated servers and a friendly community are the icing on a delicious cake.

[QUOTE="Glow-Stick"]

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]

Once again, no Metroid Prime on list = complete failure.

Automatic grade of F

AFBrat77

He can say whatever he wants to about my list.....no big deal to me.

I don't troll, I would not have that high of a GS rank if I did.

If it makes you feel better, I'll add IMO, so IMO Halo included and Prime excluded is a list I can't take seriously, there haven't been 10 better games than Metroid Prime all decade, thats for sure, well IMO and the critic collective known as GameRankings.

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime (it wasn't perfect, but it was a great fps and the most enjoyable co-op game since Ikari Warriors). Prime was a mostly enjoyable game up until the big key hunt (IIRC those keys went by the name of Chozo artifacts). The inability to customize controls was frustrating, and something not remedied by the Echoes despite the fact the developers were clearly aware of the issue (even a few journalists raised the issue with them in interviews).

Since you like talking about numbers, I'll mention some numbers. Its striking that MP2 sold fewer copies than the original when it arrived to a vastly larger userbase three years after the original. Despite its status among critics, the word of mouth (which determines the sales of sequels) of MP1 is clearly negative, and deservedly so.

1. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2003

Vice City simply goes beyond having an open-ended world and varied, superb gameplay - the amount of styIe Rockstar poured into this game is unmatched. Neon-lit art-deco 80's Miami, fantastic music, a plethora of colorful characters, a cIassic rise-to-power crime storyline, and finally a cool, no bull**** protagonist voiced by Ray Liotta. Vice City also sports the groundbreaking series' most engaging side-missions including masterminding a bank heist and managing a porn film studio.

2. Half-Life 2

• Publisher: Sierra Entertainment
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2004

From the opening Point Insertion level, I realized I have embarked on something truly unique - City 17 was a cold, uninviting place in which the easy-to-see-through propaganda of a puppet human government is brainwashing you from the very first few seconds of gameplay. The atmosphere is palpable, you can feel the misery of the people that surround you, and you fervently want to join in the revolt. There is something distinctly real and human about Half-Life 2 despite the fact that you're fighting off an alien invasion. One of the very few games in which the reason to fight is as important as the fight itself.

3. Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic

• Publisher: LucasArts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2003

BioWare managed to provide the most complete Star Wars experience with this RPG of epic proportions. Incredibly well-written staying true to its source material, it has some of the most interesting characters in the Star Wars universe, and it sports the best Star Wars storyline since the first three movies. On top of all that, you actually get to traverse through a massive Star Wars universe and decide its fate. Knight of the Old Republic is everything an RPG can possibly be.

4. The Longest Journey

• Publisher: Funcom
• Developer: Funcom
• 2000

This is the absolute pinnacle of adventure gaming and storytelling. The gameplay is exquisite, the puzzles are challenging and, more importantly, make sense. The writing is superb, you will not encounter better developed characters than this, and the voice acting is organic and natural. After playing through this game, I felt as if I knew April Ryan, as if she was someone I was once friends with. April Ryan's journey should not be missed.

5. Team Fortress 2

• Publisher: Valve Software
• Developer: Valve Software
• 2007

A multiplayer game that has it all - a wonderful art-styIe, awesome characters, insane amounts of polish and balance and--this is what it truly excels at--teamwork. The cIasses give loads of gameplay variety, the goal-oriented teamwork paves the way for awesome battle scenarios and the fantastic community provides a bottomless amount of maps, mods, servers and everything in-between.

6. Ninja Gaiden

• Publisher: Tecmo
• Developer: Team Ninja
• 2004

The guys over at Team Ninja are undeniably a sadistic bunch who managed to bring me to tears out of sheer frustration - this game is ****ing hard. I'm no fan of such punishment and if it were any other game, I'd quit in a heartbeat. But there was something about Ninja Gaiden that constantly kept me moving forward no matter how badly I got schooled by the AI - and to keep playing after enduring such punishment and ending up looking like a complete wuss to simple computer AI is Ninja Gaiden's greatest feat. Because the game is just so incredible you can't put it down no matter what.

7. Civilization IV

• Publsiher: 2K Games
• Developer: Firaxis Games
• 2005

Civilization IV elevated the venerable series' formula to unseen heights. The interface was streamlined in order to avoid unnecessary, boring micromanagement. It's also the most accessible game in the series providing lots of options and making the game faster. But most importantly, these changes were made without compromising the insane depth and scope old fans expected. Just the opposite, it has more features than ever such as the fantastic religion system.

8. Disciples II: Dark Prophecy

• Publisher: Strategy First
• Developer: Strategy First
• 2002

The easiest way to describe this game is to compare it to Heroes of Might and Magic. But you would be doing it a horrible diservice as well. Disciples II is as different from Heroes as it is similar to it. It's an absolutely brilliant turn-based strategy game with a compelling universe, deep tactical gameplay that is easy to learn but difficult to master and a fantastic art-styIe.

9. Grand Theft Auto IV

• Publisher: Rockstar Games
• Developer: Rockstar North
• 2008

The game that took the series in a very different direction. It is a back-to-basics game showcasing Rockstar's incredible restraint and vision. Grand Theft Auto IV tells a dark New York immigrant story with believeable characters and great writing. It features one of the most amazing and detailed gameworlds ever created, stunning graphics, a great combat system, refined driving mechanics, competent AI. On top of all that, there's also the video editor and the fantastic Independence FM.

10. Dragon Age: Origins

• Publisher: Electronic Arts
• Developer: BioWare
• 2009

The best thing to say about Dragon Age is that nothing feels like an afterthought in this game. Everything, absolutely everything is well thought-out and deliberate. An incredibly detailed gameworld with rich culture and history, a teriffic cast of characters, insane amount of fully voiced NPC's and a deep tactical combat system that never gets repetetive.

UpInFlames

I like this list a lot actually, despite how different it is from mine. I could tell there was a lot of thought put into it and you got some little known gems in there (Disciples 2) and games i tottally forgot about when making my list, i.e. Civ 4. Civ probably wouldn't have made my list anyway but I should've considered it. Also, I feel like I should have a GTA on my list but I don't want to take any of my other games off haha.

Carnageheart - a decent list even though I think all of them are PS exclusives haha.

Here's my list:

10. Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion

9. LittleBigPlanet

8. Sonic Unleashed

7. Jak and Daxter

6. Sonic Adventure 2

5. Tales of the Abyss

4. Tales of Symphonia

3. Dark Cloud 2

2. Sonic Adventure

And the best game of the decade is...

Tony Hawk's Underground for the PS2!

There was so much to do in this game, it kept me occupied for hours. It was also the first Tony Hawk game to feature a story.

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime (it wasn't perfect, but it was a great fps and the most enjoyable co-op game since Ikari Warriors). Prime was a mostly enjoyable game up until the big key hunt (IIRC those keys went by the name of Chozo artifacts). The inability to customize controls was frustrating, and something not remedied by the Echoes despite the fact the developers were clearly aware of the issue (even a few journalists raised the issue with them in interviews).

Since you like talking about numbers, I'll mention some numbers. Its striking that MP2 sold fewer copies than the original when it arrived to a vastly larger userbase three years after the original. Despite its status among critics, the word of mouth (which determines the sales of sequels) of MP1 is clearly negative, and deservedly so.

CarnageHeart

Echoes was less popular because, instead of most sequels, it was even darker and more inaccessible than its predecessor. For those who managed to pinch through the steep learning curve, though, it was an experience that pretty much eclipsed everything else on the market at the time, including the Halo franchise. Halo mostly optimalised existing FPS concepts, while Metroid Prime gave a completely different twist to the genre to the point where the label FPS just didn't suffice to describe the game anymore.

Moreover, its artistic design was absolutely through the roof. It managed to create a convincing sci-fi world that managed to avoid the oh so treacherous cheese factor in every way, something Halo obviously failed at. The lack of a dual analog control option was annoying, but not enough to have a considerable negative impact on the game (the issue was resolved in the Wii edition, by the way).

Halo was a great game. Metroid Prime, however, was a masterpiece.

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]

[QUOTE="Glow-Stick"]Its his opinion troll. How would you like it if I called your list terrible because it did not have Fallout 3 or some other game.Think before you post...

CarnageHeart

He can say whatever he wants to about my list.....no big deal to me.

I don't troll, I would not have that high of a GS rank if I did.

If it makes you feel better, I'll add IMO, so IMO Halo included and Prime excluded is a list I can't take seriously, there haven't been 10 better games than Metroid Prime all decade, thats for sure, well IMO and the critic collective known as GameRankings.

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime

I think its the exact opposite:

Metroid Prime >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Halo

co-op saves Halo from being merely average, Bungie's lazy level design was one of many reasons single-player was unbearably boring.

Still, as a PC gamer, Halo was clearly less than the best on the PC, its high ratings were mostly due to Microsoft's influence towards getting X-Box sales bolstered out the gate. Good game, but nothing special. The excitement was due to those on consoles who hadn't really experienced a FPS on the PC.

Metroid Prime is a Masterpiece from start to finish, far superior single-player to Halo, very well designed and there was nothing like it, a breath of fresh air. The hunt for artifacts near the end was not a big deal and didn't take away from the game in the least, several were easy to get to by middle of the game, and the game was so detailed and beautiful, you didn't mind taking the trip.

For that reason, years to come Metroid Prime will be looked on fondly as a classic, Halo will be looked on as the game that got the X-Box cruising, but was just another cog in the FPS-wheel.

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime (it wasn't perfect, but it was a great fps and the most enjoyable co-op game since Ikari Warriors). Prime was a mostly enjoyable game up until the big key hunt (IIRC those keys went by the name of Chozo artifacts). The inability to customize controls was frustrating, and something not remedied by the Echoes despite the fact the developers were clearly aware of the issue (even a few journalists raised the issue with them in interviews).

Since you like talking about numbers, I'll mention some numbers. Its striking that MP2 sold fewer copies than the original when it arrived to a vastly larger userbase three years after the original. Despite its status among critics, the word of mouth (which determines the sales of sequels) of MP1 is clearly negative, and deservedly so.

DraugenCP

Echoes was less popular because, instead of most sequels, it was even darker and more inaccessible than its predecessor. For those who managed to pinch through the steep learning curve, though, it was an experience that pretty much eclipsed everything else on the market at the time, including the Halo franchise. Halo mostly optimalised existing FPS concepts, while Metroid Prime gave a completely different twist to the genre to the point where the label FPS just didn't suffice to describe the game anymore.

Moreover, its artistic design was absolutely through the roof. It managed to create a convincing sci-fi world that managed to avoid the oh so treacherous cheese factor in every way, something Halo obviously failed at. The lack of a dual analog control option was annoying, but not enough to have a considerable negative impact on the game (the issue was resolved in the Wii edition, by the way).

Halo was a great game. Metroid Prime, however, was a masterpiece.

Loved Echoes as well, for me it was on par with the great original until around the time you had to go back and forth for the Screw attack, at that point it dropped a bit behind the original (for me) as the games pacing seemed to take a turn for the worse.

Both great though....I must confess, I haven't played the 3rd yet as I don't have Wii.

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime (it wasn't perfect, but it was a great fps and the most enjoyable co-op game since Ikari Warriors). Prime was a mostly enjoyable game up until the big key hunt (IIRC those keys went by the name of Chozo artifacts). The inability to customize controls was frustrating, and something not remedied by the Echoes despite the fact the developers were clearly aware of the issue (even a few journalists raised the issue with them in interviews).

Since you like talking about numbers, I'll mention some numbers. Its striking that MP2 sold fewer copies than the original when it arrived to a vastly larger userbase three years after the original. Despite its status among critics, the word of mouth (which determines the sales of sequels) of MP1 is clearly negative, and deservedly so.

DraugenCP

Echoes was less popular because, instead of most sequels, it was even darker and more inaccessible than its predecessor. For those who managed to pinch through the steep learning curve, though, it was an experience that pretty much eclipsed everything else on the market at the time, including the Halo franchise. Halo mostly optimalised existing FPS concepts, while Metroid Prime gave a completely different twist to the genre to the point where the label FPS just didn't suffice to describe the game anymore.

Moreover, its artistic design was absolutely through the roof. It managed to create a convincing sci-fi world that managed to avoid the oh so treacherous cheese factor in every way, something Halo obviously failed at. The lack of a dual analog control option was annoying, but not enough to have a considerable negative impact on the game (the issue was resolved in the Wii edition, by the way).

Halo was a great game. Metroid Prime, however, was a masterpiece.

No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.

As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin.

Ouch, double whammy, no Metroid Prime, yet you have the far inferior (IMO) Longest Journey (most dissapointing PC game I've ever played, it had a few moments in the middle of the game) and its non-intuitive puzzles (ie that rubber duck puzzle).

Still, I respect your opinion and I think you have some good picks on there, though I probably like the games in the first post better.

Good job taking the time to lay it out for us why you like them.

My list would be something like this:

1. Metroid Prime
2. Half-Life 2 (in particular the expansions, PC version)
3. Deus Ex
4. Resident Evil 4 (GC version)
5. Dragon Age: Origins (PC)
6. Baldur's Gate 2: Shadows of Amn
7. Bioshock
8. Max Payne (I just bought the sequel so I'll see how that compares)
9. Eternal Darkness
10. Company of Heroes

...but there are PS2/PS3/XBox exclusives I haven't played to be honestAFBrat77

I've recently come to the realization that Metroid Prime fans later on became BioShock fans so I'm kind of glad I never played Metroid Prime. Also, the concept of playing a FPS with a single analog stick sounds horrible to me.

,

let me guess PlayStation fan boy i dont think any of them have been on xbox

Drweeden

[QUOTE="Drweeden"],

Ban me please!

Dr_Iggy_Houdini

Where did I say anything bad about the X360? A game not making my list doesn't imply dislike (I've enjoyed hundreds of games over the past decade, not ten).

So if your belief that I dislike Otogi 2, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Gears of War, Oblivion or multiplat games like the GTAs, The Orange Box (technically), SSX and Dead Space saddens you, rest easy, doctors :P.

No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.Grammaton-Cleric

I feel that this game would not have worked in third person. It's amazing in itself to see how a first-person game can include platforming without pulling a Turok. Even the great game that was Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath resorted to third person gameplay in those situations. Moreover, the first person perspective stressed the atmosphere of the game. In order for its sense of alienation to work as an atmospherical concept, the first person perspective is essential, as it truly made you feel like you were Samus.

"As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin."

I have no interest in what 'the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series' have to say, seeing as people like that are usually the first ones to resort to pointless melancholic perspectives by which they condemn great games because they didn't exactly fulfill their expectations. The people I've talked to usually either love the game, or were intimidated by the presence of a dark world (which is a rather common complaint if you read some of the mainstream reviews for it) and just say 'it wasn't for them'. None of them have called it a bad game by any standards, though, because it obviously isn't. Excessive fetch quests? I don't get why this is in plural form, as I assume you're referencing to getting the Sky Temple keys, which didn't take up that much time. And even then, similar quests were in Metroid Prime 1 & 3, so it's pointless to use this argument to call Echoes the worst in the trilogy.

As for fan worship, it's ironic that you should mention that, as Echoes is probably the game that definitely made me a Metroid fan. For me it was a game so solid and convincing that I hadn't played anything like it since maybe Majora's Mask (to which this game has often been compared, by the bye).

Metroid Prime was dark only by the disneyesque standards of Nintendo (and the Nintendo published Eternal Darkness was quite a bit darker). As for your claim MP was 'inaccessible' in what context are you using the word? The controls weren't especially complex, it was just frustrating how one couldn't configure the buttons.

The lack of direct controls over the shooting is something I see as a separate issue (I knew that was the case before I bought the game, so I wouldn't have bought MP if I couldn't live without direct control).CarnageHeart

I disagree. Metroid Prime was not dark in the sense of atmosphere or the maturity of the game in comparison to other Nintendo games: it was the contrast between being a powerful bounty hunter on one hand, and being alone on this huge planet filled with enormous creatures on the other. That was what made the game feel slightly eerie, making some parts feel wholly uncomfortable.

It's inaccessible in that, at the start, you have very little notion of what you can expect. Some people expected a linear FPS like there are so many, but actually being required to think in order to progress has set quite some people off. The backtracking element is another thing that scared a lot of gamers away, although you didn't actually have to do that much if you did it right.

"What I objected to (and what I suspect was the stumbling block for the many who bought MP1 but skipped 2) was all the backtracking/scanning one had to do for Chozo runes. For a while the pattern was 'Find a new area, beat an enemy, obtain a new weapon, use that weapon to get to a new area...' and that was great. Late in the game the rhythm was lost (for me the fun died) when the game told me I couldn't progress untilI found a couple different runes (or something)."

The whole abandoning of the linear gameplay that makes many games predictable is what made this game special, for me. With the exception of a few moments, the gameplay felt rather open-ended, with you only being hinted towards certain point at occasions. Of course, you still had to do a set number of things in a set order, but the whole process of thinking and investigating where you should go next gave me a feeling of excitement. The way in which the different areas were connected was truely genius, and highly preferable over the basic 'go from level to level' concept used in so many other games.

"MP went strong for a while, but the late game design decisions keep it from being classic, let alone a masterpiece. I skipped MP2 because Retro didn't care what those of us who wanted customizable controls and didn't want late game key hunts thought. Developers are free to ignore gamers, but when they do that, gamers tend to return the favor."

For what it's worth, you might be interested in knowing that the controls were altered in the Metroid Prime Trilogy in the game, so I'd definitely urge to give it a try if you get the chance. This package ironically is the ultimate fan service.

[QUOTE="CarnageHeart"]

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]

He can say whatever he wants to about my list.....no big deal to me.

I don't troll, I would not have that high of a GS rank if I did.

If it makes you feel better, I'll add IMO, so IMO Halo included and Prime excluded is a list I can't take seriously, there haven't been 10 better games than Metroid Prime all decade, thats for sure, well IMO and the critic collective known as GameRankings.

AFBrat77

Halo 1 was far, far, far, far better than Prime

I think its the exact opposite:

Metroid Prime >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Halo

co-op saves Halo from being merely average, Bungie's lazy level design was one of many reasons single-player was unbearably boring.

Still, as a PC gamer, Halo was clearly less than the best on the PC, its high ratings were mostly due to Microsoft's influence towards getting X-Box sales bolstered out the gate. Good game, but nothing special. The excitement was due to those on consoles who hadn't really experienced a FPS on the PC.

Metroid Prime is a Masterpiece from start to finish, far superior single-player to Halo, very well designed and there was nothing like it, a breath of fresh air. The hunt for artifacts near the end was not a big deal and didn't take away from the game in the least, several were easy to get to by middle of the game, and the game was so detailed and beautiful, you didn't mind taking the trip.

For that reason, years to come Metroid Prime will be looked on fondly as a classic, Halo will be looked on as the game that got the X-Box cruising, but was just another cog in the FPS-wheel.

I agree Halo wasn't as great as some of the PC first person shooters out there, but with the exception of the regrettable library level, its aquality game with fun levels and interesting enemies. Yes, it was more fun with co-op, but few games aren't. Also, building first person shooters for console is an art in and of itself. By building a quality fps for consoles, Bungie popularized first person shooters on consoles (now the best and the brightest fps designers focus on consoles).

Getting back to MP, if one searched every nook and cranny throughout the game as one progressed, then there would be no late game backtracking, butgiven thatthe importance of the runes wasn't made clear up until the 11th hour, its likely quite a few people had to backtrack.

As for what will happen in the future, I'm no prophet, but in the here and now, MP has had a lot less influence than Halo.

Once again, no Metroid Prime on list = complete failure.

Automatic grade of F

AFBrat77

I own prime and I wouldn't haveput it on my list, ever. Playing the game felt like a complete and utter chore.

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.DraugenCP

I feel that this game would not have worked in third person. It's amazing in itself to see how a first-person game can include platforming without pulling a Turok. Even the great game that was Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath resorted to third person gameplay in those situations. Moreover, the first person perspective stressed the atmosphere of the game. In order for its sense of alienation to work as an atmospherical concept, the first person perspective is essential, as it truly made you feel like you were Samus.

"As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin."

I have no interest in what 'the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series' have to say, seeing as people like that are usually the first ones to resort to pointless melancholic perspectives by which they condemn great games because they didn't exactly fulfill their expectations. The people I've talked to usually either love the game, or were intimidated by the presence of a dark world (which is a rather common complaint if you read some of the mainstream reviews for it) and just say 'it wasn't for them'. None of them have called it a bad game by any standards, though, because it obviously isn't. Excessive fetch quests? I don't get why this is in plural form, as I assume you're referencing to getting the Sky Temple keys, which didn't take up that much time. And even then, similar quests were in Metroid Prime 1 & 3, so it's pointless to use this argument to call Echoes the worst in the trilogy.

As for fan worship, it's ironic that you should mention that, as Echoes is probably the game that definitely made me a Metroid fan. For me it was a game so solid and convincing that I hadn't played anything like it since maybe Majora's Mask (to which this game has often been compared, by the bye).

Why would the game not worked in third-person? Would that have more to do with the hardware and controls?A game like Infamous basically showed a developer can integrate platforming and shooting in an open-world.

I'll just post what i did for my blog.

In no order:

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]Ouch, double whammy, no Metroid Prime, yet you have the far inferior (IMO) Longest Journey (most dissapointing PC game I've ever played, it had a few moments in the middle of the game) and its non-intuitive puzzles (ie that rubber duck puzzle).

Still, I respect your opinion and I think you have some good picks on there, though I probably like the games in the first post better.

Good job taking the time to lay it out for us why you like them.

My list would be something like this:

1. Metroid Prime
2. Half-Life 2 (in particular the expansions, PC version)
3. Deus Ex
4. Resident Evil 4 (GC version)
5. Dragon Age: Origins (PC)
6. Baldur's Gate 2: Shadows of Amn
7. Bioshock
8. Max Payne (I just bought the sequel so I'll see how that compares)
9. Eternal Darkness
10. Company of Heroes

...but there are PS2/PS3/XBox exclusives I haven't played to be honestUpInFlames

I've recently come to the realization that Metroid Prime fans later on became BioShock fans so I'm kind of glad I never played Metroid Prime. Also, the concept of playing a FPS with a single analog stick sounds horrible to me.

Yes, Bioshock was influenced by Metroid Prime, Deus Ex, and of course System Shock 2, three of the finest games ever.If you look closely you can see the influences on the game, Ken Levine was obviously pretty savvy with the clas*ics. Obviously I loved Bioshock (PC version), but I can see you didn't. I think the critics got it right, a Masterpiece.

For those putting down Metroid Prime, well, too bad you can't appreciate this Masterpiece, but to each his own.

Oh, and by the way, not to re-hash this subject again but Metroid Prime is not a FPS! Its an Action Adventure game in first person.

Quote from Greg Kasavin, reviewer at GS (one of the best ever IMO):

"Let's get right to the point: Metroid Prime is the best GameCube game to date. It's one of the best games on any platform this year, and, for good measure, it's also the best game yet in Nintendo's highly acclaimed Metroid series.This first-person action adventure gameis filled with so much detail, sty*e, and originality that literally every gamer should play it."

"It's not a first-person shooter. Metroid Prime doesn't play like any other game that's come before it, and it emphasizes exploration and investigation at least as much as pure action. So the pacing is deliberate at times, though the going is never slow."

I miss Greg Kasavin, he was a very good reviewer, very thorough and on-point.

Yes, Bioshock was influenced by Metroid Prime, Deus Ex, and of course System Shock 2, three of the finest games ever.If you look closely you can see the influences on the game, Ken Levine was obviously pretty savvy with the clas*ics. Obviously I loved Bioshock (PC version), but I can see you didn't. I think the critics got it right, a Masterpiece.

For those putting down Metroid Prime, well, too bad you can't appreciate this Masterpiece, but to each his own.

Oh, and by the way, not to re-hash this subject again but Metroid Prime is not a FPS! Its an Action Adventure game in first person.

Quote from Greg Kasavin, reviewer at GS (one of the best ever IMO):

"Let's get right to the point: Metroid Prime is the best GameCube game to date. It's one of the best games on any platform this year, and, for good measure, it's also the best game yet in Nintendo's highly acclaimed Metroid series.This first-person action adventure gameis filled with so much detail, sty*e, and originality that literally every gamer should play it."

"It's not a first-person shooter. Metroid Prime doesn't play like any other game that's come before it, and it emphasizes exploration and investigation at least as much as pure action. So the pacing is deliberate at times, though the going is never slow."

I miss Greg Kasavin, he was a very good reviewer, very thorough and on-point.AFBrat77

Ok, it's an action/adventure game, but the point still stands. There's lots of shooting from a first-person perspective, right? And it's controlled by a single analog stick, right? To me, that spells horrible, tank controls.

As for the critics, GregK is a great dude and a great reviewer, but he also gave Halo: Combat Evolved a 9.7 (a painfully average and utterly boring FPS with horrible--read: nonexistant--level design) and he gave a laughable piece of trash like Perfect Dark Zero a 9.0. So he's hardly infallible.

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]Yes, Bioshock was influenced by Metroid Prime, Deus Ex, and of course System Shock 2, three of the finest games ever.If you look closely you can see the influences on the game, Ken Levine was obviously pretty savvy with the clas*ics. Obviously I loved Bioshock (PC version), but I can see you didn't. I think the critics got it right, a Masterpiece.

For those putting down Metroid Prime, well, too bad you can't appreciate this Masterpiece, but to each his own.

Oh, and by the way, not to re-hash this subject again but Metroid Prime is not a FPS! Its an Action Adventure game in first person.

Quote from Greg Kasavin, reviewer at GS (one of the best ever IMO):

"Let's get right to the point: Metroid Prime is the best GameCube game to date. It's one of the best games on any platform this year, and, for good measure, it's also the best game yet in Nintendo's highly acclaimed Metroid series.This first-person action adventure gameis filled with so much detail, sty*e, and originality that literally every gamer should play it."

"It's not a first-person shooter. Metroid Prime doesn't play like any other game that's come before it, and it emphasizes exploration and investigation at least as much as pure action. So the pacing is deliberate at times, though the going is never slow."

I miss Greg Kasavin, he was a very good reviewer, very thorough and on-point.UpInFlames

Ok, it's an action/adventure game, but the point still stands. There's lots of shooting from a first-person perspective, right? And it's controlled by a single analog stick, right? To me, that spells horrible, tank controls.

As for the critics, GregK is a great dude and a great reviewer, but he also gave Halo: Combat Evolved a 9.7 (a painfully average and utterly boring FPS with horrible--read: nonexistant--level design) and he gave a laughable piece of trash like Perfect Dark Zero a 9.0. So he's hardly infallible.

Greg Kasavin was not the reviewer for Halo (X-Box version), just looked it up. Some guy named Joe Fielder somehow gave Halo a 9.7. Guess he wasn't a PC Gaming guy.

As for Perfect Dark Zero, yeah, I heard Greg missed the ball on that one, I've never played that. I think GS was pushing for the 360 to have at least 1 game with a score of 9.0 or better with its initial launch ;).

The controls for Prime feel fine after a very short time, then it becomes second nature. The Bosses are some of the most memorable in gaming thats for sure.

Sure, there's shooting in Metroid Prime, but theres much more to the game than that. But I understand you weren't making a big deal of it being a FPS.

Anyhow, i don't want to get too far away from the topic.

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.EvilTaru

I feel that this game would not have worked in third person. It's amazing in itself to see how a first-person game can include platforming without pulling a Turok. Even the great game that was Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath resorted to third person gameplay in those situations. Moreover, the first person perspective stressed the atmosphere of the game. In order for its sense of alienation to work as an atmospherical concept, the first person perspective is essential, as it truly made you feel like you were Samus.

"As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin."

I have no interest in what 'the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series' have to say, seeing as people like that are usually the first ones to resort to pointless melancholic perspectives by which they condemn great games because they didn't exactly fulfill their expectations. The people I've talked to usually either love the game, or were intimidated by the presence of a dark world (which is a rather common complaint if you read some of the mainstream reviews for it) and just say 'it wasn't for them'. None of them have called it a bad game by any standards, though, because it obviously isn't. Excessive fetch quests? I don't get why this is in plural form, as I assume you're referencing to getting the Sky Temple keys, which didn't take up that much time. And even then, similar quests were in Metroid Prime 1 & 3, so it's pointless to use this argument to call Echoes the worst in the trilogy.

As for fan worship, it's ironic that you should mention that, as Echoes is probably the game that definitely made me a Metroid fan. For me it was a game so solid and convincing that I hadn't played anything like it since maybe Majora's Mask (to which this game has often been compared, by the bye).

Why would the game not worked in third-person? Would that have more to do with the hardware and controls?A game like Infamous basically showed a developer can integrate platforming and shooting in an open-world.

It had nothing to do with the hardware or controls. I don't know what you're getting at with that.

Like I explained, the first person fitted the nature of the game much better, as the atmosphere of the game was built around the sense of solitude on a huge planet, which is demonstrated by the lack of interaction between characters (you discovered more of the story by scanning logs), and the fact that there aren't even any friendly characters in the game to begin with. Seeing as the level design itself partly consisted of small corridors and rooms, and the gameplay revolved around spotting small details and looking for clues to aid you on your quest, first person was the obvious choice, and I think anyone who denies that it worked out great is out of their mind. I do think the game could have worked from third person perspective, but it'd make the whole experience considerably less compelling.

[QUOTE="EvilTaru"]

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.DraugenCP

I feel that this game would not have worked in third person. It's amazing in itself to see how a first-person game can include platforming without pulling a Turok. Even the great game that was Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath resorted to third person gameplay in those situations. Moreover, the first person perspective stressed the atmosphere of the game. In order for its sense of alienation to work as an atmospherical concept, the first person perspective is essential, as it truly made you feel like you were Samus.

"As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin."

I have no interest in what 'the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series' have to say, seeing as people like that are usually the first ones to resort to pointless melancholic perspectives by which they condemn great games because they didn't exactly fulfill their expectations. The people I've talked to usually either love the game, or were intimidated by the presence of a dark world (which is a rather common complaint if you read some of the mainstream reviews for it) and just say 'it wasn't for them'. None of them have called it a bad game by any standards, though, because it obviously isn't. Excessive fetch quests? I don't get why this is in plural form, as I assume you're referencing to getting the Sky Temple keys, which didn't take up that much time. And even then, similar quests were in Metroid Prime 1 & 3, so it's pointless to use this argument to call Echoes the worst in the trilogy.

As for fan worship, it's ironic that you should mention that, as Echoes is probably the game that definitely made me a Metroid fan. For me it was a game so solid and convincing that I hadn't played anything like it since maybe Majora's Mask (to which this game has often been compared, by the bye).

Why would the game not worked in third-person? Would that have more to do with the hardware and controls?A game like Infamous basically showed a developer can integrate platforming and shooting in an open-world.

It had nothing to do with the hardware or controls. I don't know what you're getting at with that.

Like I explained, the first person fitted the nature of the game much better, as the atmosphere of the game was built around the sense of solitude on a huge planet, which is demonstrated by the lack of interaction between characters (you discovered more of the story by scanning logs), and the fact that there aren't even any friendly characters in the game to begin with. Seeing as the level design itself partly consisted of small corridors and rooms, and the gameplay revolved around spotting small details and looking for clues to aid you on your quest, first person was the obvious choice, and I think anyone who denies that it worked out great is out of their mind. I do think the game could have worked from third person perspective, but it'd make the whole experience considerably less compelling.

I think Retro nailed it, they wanted the person to have the experience of actually walking in Samus' shoes. First person was the right call, and the Atmosphere of the game was off the charts.

(sorry, no pics:()

6.mmmm...to be continued.

5. DMC3/4

4. RE4

3. MGS2

2. MGS3

1. MGS4

[QUOTE="EvilTaru"]

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

[QUOTE="Grammaton-Cleric"]No, Super Metroid is the true masterpiece in this franchise. Metroid Prime is a great game that manages, from time to time, to feel like a Metroid game while more often than not looking and playing like a stripped down FPS. The truly sublime moments in Prime come from the exploration and the ball mode, where the game reverts to a third person perspective. The forced first person perspective foisted on the remainder of the experiencerobs these games of their identity.DraugenCP

I feel that this game would not have worked in third person. It's amazing in itself to see how a first-person game can include platforming without pulling a Turok. Even the great game that was Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath resorted to third person gameplay in those situations. Moreover, the first person perspective stressed the atmosphere of the game. In order for its sense of alienation to work as an atmospherical concept, the first person perspective is essential, as it truly made you feel like you were Samus.

"As to Echoes, even the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series found it to be tedious;largely ruined by the excessive fetch quests. The notion that it offered an unequaled experience is hyperbole and fan worship; Echoes isn't a classic nor will it ever be embraced as such because it's the weakest of the trilogy by a significant margin."

I have no interest in what 'the most hardcore and passionate advocates of this series' have to say, seeing as people like that are usually the first ones to resort to pointless melancholic perspectives by which they condemn great games because they didn't exactly fulfill their expectations. The people I've talked to usually either love the game, or were intimidated by the presence of a dark world (which is a rather common complaint if you read some of the mainstream reviews for it) and just say 'it wasn't for them'. None of them have called it a bad game by any standards, though, because it obviously isn't. Excessive fetch quests? I don't get why this is in plural form, as I assume you're referencing to getting the Sky Temple keys, which didn't take up that much time. And even then, similar quests were in Metroid Prime 1 & 3, so it's pointless to use this argument to call Echoes the worst in the trilogy.

As for fan worship, it's ironic that you should mention that, as Echoes is probably the game that definitely made me a Metroid fan. For me it was a game so solid and convincing that I hadn't played anything like it since maybe Majora's Mask (to which this game has often been compared, by the bye).

Why would the game not worked in third-person? Would that have more to do with the hardware and controls?A game like Infamous basically showed a developer can integrate platforming and shooting in an open-world.

It had nothing to do with the hardware or controls. I don't know what you're getting at with that.

Like I explained, the first person fitted the nature of the game much better, as the atmosphere of the game was built around the sense of solitude on a huge planet, which is demonstrated by the lack of interaction between characters (you discovered more of the story by scanning logs), and the fact that there aren't even any friendly characters in the game to begin with. Seeing as the level design itself partly consisted of small corridors and rooms, and the gameplay revolved around spotting small details and looking for clues to aid you on your quest, first person was the obvious choice, and I think anyone who denies that it worked out great is out of their mind. I do think the game could have worked from third person perspective, but it'd make the whole experience considerably less compelling.

Who's saying it didn't work out well? I do think the platforming would have worked better in third-person, not third-person controls like gears or RE4, but controls like Infamous where you have third-person action controls, and holding L1 would automatically allow the player to use behind the back aiming towards whatever the camera is aiming at. Soul Reaver had a ton of atmosphere and involved puzzle solving and platforming as well and it had third-person action controls, the game would have been just as atmospheric if not more, because being able to see the character relative to the game world would convey a sense of scale that sometimes not possible in first-person, the problem is third-person action controls in games like Infamous involve active manipulation with the camera and in a way, "pre-aiming" in combat before even pushing L1 to keep enemies in front of you, as well as being able to detach camera view with character movement, and that requires a right analog stick, it simply wouldn't work on the GC or any console without a properright analog stick.

Great list TC, mine would be

10. GoW

9. Demon Souls

8. Mass Effect

7. MGS4

6. Elder Scrolls Morrowind

5. Zelda Twlp

4. Uncharted 2

3. RE4

2. Diablo 3 LoD

1. Warcraft 3

[QUOTE="AFBrat77"]Yes, Bioshock was influenced by Metroid Prime, Deus Ex, and of course System Shock 2, three of the finest games ever.If you look closely you can see the influences on the game, Ken Levine was obviously pretty savvy with the clas*ics. Obviously I loved Bioshock (PC version), but I can see you didn't. I think the critics got it right, a Masterpiece.

For those putting down Metroid Prime, well, too bad you can't appreciate this Masterpiece, but to each his own.

Oh, and by the way, not to re-hash this subject again but Metroid Prime is not a FPS! Its an Action Adventure game in first person.

Quote from Greg Kasavin, reviewer at GS (one of the best ever IMO):

"Let's get right to the point: Metroid Prime is the best GameCube game to date. It's one of the best games on any platform this year, and, for good measure, it's also the best game yet in Nintendo's highly acclaimed Metroid series.This first-person action adventure gameis filled with so much detail, sty*e, and originality that literally every gamer should play it."

"It's not a first-person shooter. Metroid Prime doesn't play like any other game that's come before it, and it emphasizes exploration and investigation at least as much as pure action. So the pacing is deliberate at times, though the going is never slow."

I miss Greg Kasavin, he was a very good reviewer, very thorough and on-point.UpInFlames

Ok, it's an action/adventure game, but the point still stands. There's lots of shooting from a first-person perspective, right? And it's controlled by a single analog stick, right? To me, that spells horrible, tank controls.

As for the critics, GregK is a great dude and a great reviewer, but he also gave Halo: Combat Evolved a 9.7 (a painfully average and utterly boring FPS with horrible--read: nonexistant--level design) and he gave a laughable piece of trash like Perfect Dark Zero a 9.0. So he's hardly infallible.

I can never understand why people defendclunky control schemes when it comes to shooting, there are usuallya fewreasons why the shooting controls are bad:

1) The hardware simply doesn't allow it, in Metroid Prime's case the GC doesn't have a goodright analog stick, there's really no point in making the player use the c-stick, lock-on is the only other option. Same thing with RE4.

2) The developer simply has no bloodyclue why dual-analog controls would work better, they just don't get it, like Capcom with RE5.

Wow, Greg did give Perfect Dark Zero a 9.0, like wtf Greg.