The sad truth about women portrayal in videogames

http://youtube.com/watch?v=j-rTuKFkHIc

I like the video and I agree. What's your say on this?

Of 2356746 female character in a videogame, 3 or 5 characters don't wear skimpy clothes.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=j-rTuKFkHIc

I like the video and I agree. What's your say on this?

Of 2356746 female character in a videogame, 3 or 5 characters don't wear skimpy clothes.

gamingqueen

I have a VERY hard time believing that. There are more than 3 to 5 NPC females that don't wear skimpy clothes in KOTOR alone.

I used the numbers for exaggeration... obviously! I mean few female characters look decent and normal in videogames.

I used the numbers for exaggeration... obviously! I mean few female characters look decent and normal in videogames.

gamingqueen

I didn't think it was that obvious. I've heard more seriously intended statements on boards like this with worse exaggerations.

Still, you have a point about characterizations (the unexaggerated part that is). I think the motivation for creating characters that fit a more realistic mold will come from a change to a more representative audience.

Interesting. :)

I usually take 2 or 3 years to heal enought to try to engage another woman after a rebukal. :P And as Cyrano speaks, you always try for what seem the brightest if you feel you will fail anyway. Which of course usually lead to another rebukal.

It bothers me. Videogames will always be viewed as being something for immature frat boys and junior high kids until we move past this. I think there will always be games that objectify women, and to a certain extent, it is, maybe not ok, but understandable. I really liked Elena from Uncharted because she seemed much more like a real woman than the usual big chested damsels in distress that are in most games.rragnaar

I can't believe that there's an audience for games like DOA extreme beach vollyball. There are many cool and creative concepts which could be made into videogames though the people who wrote those ideas don't get a chance to turn those ideas into games. I wonder how do they feel when they see games like that sell.

[QUOTE="rragnaar"]It bothers me. Videogames will always be viewed as being something for immature frat boys and junior high kids until we move past this. I think there will always be games that objectify women, and to a certain extent, it is, maybe not ok, but understandable. I really liked Elena from Uncharted because she seemed much more like a real woman than the usual big chested damsels in distress that are in most games.gamingqueen

I can't believe that there's an audience for games like DOA extreme beach vollyball. There are many cool and creative concepts which could be made into videogames though the people who wrote those ideas don't get a chance to turn those ideas into games. I wonder how do they feel when they see games like that sell.

Oddly enough, one of my friends, who is a girl, and her best friend, who is homosexual, both love DOA Volleyball to death. I could never figure that one out... but anyway. I think there will always be a market for games like that, but I hope we can get to a point where games that don't treat women like objects are way more common than the DOA Volleball kinds of games.

I say is it any different than any other form of entertainment?

While there are many female gamers (especially now with the Wii) the vast majority of gamers (and people who make games) are still men. So of course there will be plenty of games with women as eye candy.

That being said I think that it's becoming much less common these days. Sure there are games like DOA: Beash Vollyball and Rumble Roses but those aren't really games since looking at hot girls is the only real selling point. But those games are the miniority.

Most modren games are much more respectable to women. For example (off the top of my head) Alex Vance from HL2. She's smart, funny, and kicks combine ***. Valve could have gone the low road and made her a busty, skimpy armor wearing amazon like some games *coughs ninja gaiden* ahem excuse me.

Anyway my point is yeah woman are objectified in games but no more so than anywhere else.

I can't believe that there's an audience for games like DOA extreme beach vollyball. There are many cool and creative concepts which could be made into videogames though the people who wrote those ideas don't get a chance to turn those ideas into games. I wonder how do they feel when they see games like that sell.

gamingqueen

Well I certainly can believe that there is an audience for games like that. I don't think I would want the industry to go into the type of change that would exclude the possibility of sexually charged games from being made just because it offends some people. Instead, I'd just like to see more of a diversification.

An industry gets characterized by the wants of its audience. A more diversified audience will mean more diversified subject matter in many games. But it won't mean that subject matter that you personally disapprove of won't be made. In cases like that, you just don't buy those games, and the problem is solved.

I think when movies stop using an abundance of beautiful and attractive women, games will follow suit. However I don't see either happening anytime soon.

Movies are a more mainstream form of media and objectifying women is still in about 60% of movies.

I think when movies stop using an abundance of beautiful and attractive women, games will follow suit. However I don't see either happening anytime soon.

Movies are a more mainstream form of media and objectifying women is still in about 60% of movies.

smerlus

We don't see eye to eye on much, but I am in complete agreement with you on this point. I'd also like to point out that guys in videogames tend to be idealized.

When I play a video game, I want the female character to be hot and wear very little.

If I'm playing a game to make a mundane reality for a short period of time fantasical, why the hell would I complain about that?

"It's a trap" :lol:

But yeah it is a pretty entertaining video. Personally I don't mind the skimpiness in videogames. I don't see it as a positive or a negative. I enjoy playing alongside Alyx in HL2 ep1 cause she is fun person to have around and I like Kasumi from the DoA series because she is hot even though I don't go searching for pixel girls or anything like that. I think that in the end let the characters be who they are whether it be sluts or conservative smart girls.

Well, it's a big part of the reason why gaming is seen as a hobby for the immature rather than a respected medium of entertainment by much of non gamers.

It's one of the few things that can make me feel genuinely embarrassed and childish while playing a video game. I almost turned my 360 off during the first DMC4 cutscene with gloria out of shame

Also, not to seem prejudiced, but it's interesting to note that a majority of those female characters in the video were from Japanese games

I thought the most interesting part of that video was when he pointed out that women seem to expect it just as much as men. It's something I hadn't thought about at all prior to this, but I think is completely true.

Why is that I wonder?

[QUOTE="gamingqueen"]

I used the numbers for exaggeration... obviously! I mean few female characters look decent and normal in videogames.

m0zart

I didn't think it was that obvious. I've heard more seriously intended statements on boards like this with worse exaggerations.

Still, you have a point about characterizations (the unexaggerated part that is). I think the motivation for creating characters that fit a more realistic mold will come from a change to a more representative audience.

It was very clear that she was exaggerating, the use of the made-up number '2356746' was a clear indication that she wasn't using real statistics.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=j-rTuKFkHIc

I like the video and I agree. What's your say on this?

Of 2356746 female character in a videogame, 3 or 5 characters don't wear skimpy clothes.

gamingqueen

My favorite heroine in games? Jade from Beyond Good & Evil. And she isn't pretty or half naked. She is just a strong believable character. :)

Commercial games are made for teenagers. Face it. And most teenagers live beneath the influence of certain standards of woman proportions. I've been a teenager like everyone, so I know how it felt when we saw Lara Croft's pyramidal breasts in 1996 Tomb Raider or Julie in 2000 Heavy Metal F.A.K.K 2. As a male with normal hormones, I find Kasumi attractive (although I often find myself speculating on the kind of surfaces they used to render her, more than imagining who knows what), yet I prefer games with 'underdog' and more discrete heroines that I can find attractive not just sexually, but mostly on behalf of their intellect and charisma, like Jade (BG&E), Kate Walker (Syberia), Victoria Mc Pherson (Still Life) -all french games... a coincidence-

The same goes with movie stars and real life girls. (a special prize to whoever guesses my all-time favourite actress).

This isn't sad why on earth would i want to play a game about an emotionless ugly fat woman.

When there is a woman in a game and she looks better ofcourse it will sell more bacause no one likes someone ugly fat emotionless and covered up.

Your theory is saying Tomb Raider should be fat, ugly, emotionless and covered up as a nun, no thanks.

Imagine the sales and what would be the goal of the game learn how to be a zombie?

I like the way women are already portrayed in video games: scantily clad and leaving little to the imagination, THANKYOU! Video-games are not meant to be taken seriously they never were and never will be. Why do people have to muck things up and make everything so politically correct? Screw that. Most of the "women" in that video are actually from fighting games, the other half are from comic books, which have always had scantily clad women in them.

Video games are the only media were the men/boys complain about the way women look. Seriously, WTF is wrong with you people? For example: Soul Calibur 4. I think you already know what I am talking about. This is also the only media where you will be ridiculed for finding virtual women attractive. Usually to the tune of, "Oh my god! Get a real girl."

Yes! I do find the women in video games attractive and yes their is a specially lady in my life (my fiance) but you know what, I am completely comfortable with it and not insecure about it.

Yeah, I understand that the NES/Atari generation would like video-games to be taken more seriously; with complicated story lines, mature content, deep game-play, blah, blah, blah, barf! I honestly just see it as a way for them to not feel so insecure about a hobby meant for children and teenagers. So maybe I've strayed a little in my rant. In the end, this video becomes a pathetic attempt at asking women to give the nerds who play video games a chance. :roll:

I don't have a problem with the industry using mainly attractive people for its stars. I do have a bit of a problem with this in movies, because there are plenty of talented actors and actresses who simply aren't that easy on the eye; it's sad that people with just as much or more talent have an uphill battle. But in videogames, because you're creating these characters from scratch, there aren't any virtual feelings you're going to hurt by excluding unattractive designs. ;)

However, I do find it annoying that so many game designers feel that we are only pleased by hyper-sexualized design. Giant breasts + unrealistic proportions + scant clothing = a successful character design. Yeah... right. It's actually embarassing. I've actually heard some female gamers pipe up and say they aren't offended; I understand, because you understand this is fantasy of female form, but we males are the ones being patronized. We're the ones that are supposed to be such slobbering degenerates, that we buy games based purely on the quantity and quality of these hyper-sexualized barbies. Honestly, male gamers have as much right to be insulted by this as female gamers.

But by all means, bring on the attractive people. There's nobody to slight, as there is with real-life actors, and I'm not going to deny that since this is entirely fantastical, I would prefer that the characters I'm looking at be attractive. They don't all have to be attractive the same way, though. Probably the best example is Beyond Good and Evil, Jade is attractive and charismatic without showing much skin, Pey'j and Double H are not attractive in the traditional sense, but they're certainly interesting to look at. It's not a game-breaking thing, but it's usually a good thing, unless it contradicts the themes of the story, to make everyone interesting to look at. Just don't patronize me in the process.

I'm not sure if I understood his video - he's cracking jokes and going into rants that I seem to have lost what his argument was about.

Female characters in video games aren't realistic and they're not meant to be. Look at the male characters in most video games - they're buff, chiseled, etc - not quite the realistic image of an average guy either. The real problem isn't how the video game industry or even other industries like movie and tv, portrays females or males it's how people (the audience) are dumb enough to actually think that these characters are somehow images of perfection.

For those who start blaming others for their own negative self image - GET OVER IT! Everyone looks different and that's what makes the world interesting. I'm sure that isn't the first or only time anyone has heard something like that, yet it seems most people don't really absorb that into their mind and way of thinking.

I also think that his diss on tomb raider is misguided. Sure the cover had an image of Lara with big breasts but did all those gamers buy it to stare at the cover. I think not. For me Tomb Raider offered a great adventure setting unlike anything I had seen before then, a completely 3d world where you climbed cliffs, jumped across ridges, went deep into caverns. If it was a male character I would've still been enthralled by it.

Female characters in video games aren't realistic and they're not meant to be. Look at the male characters in most video games - they're buff, chiseled, etc - not quite the realistic image of an average guy either. The real problem isn't how the video game industry or even other industries like movie and tv, portrays females or males it's how people (the audience) are dumb enough to actually think that these characters are somehow images of perfection.

wackoss

Did you miss his point about ugly male characters? Because it was definitely there, and he certainly has a point. Can you think of a single ugly female video game character? Sure, Jade isn't an underdressed bimbo, but calling her an ugly woman would be laughable. Even female villains are usually shockingly gorgeous, while sometimes male heroes can be scarred, mutated, bald, fat, or old. Did you not see the flying pictures of the Hulk, Shrek, Homer Simpson, and the Phantom of the Opera flying by?

Granted, in games you mostly see these imperfect male heroes in movie or comic carryovers, which is something to take into consideration, because on the whole movies are more imperfect female friendly than games as well.

[QUOTE="wackoss"]

Female characters in video games aren't realistic and they're not meant to be. Look at the male characters in most video games - they're buff, chiseled, etc - not quite the realistic image of an average guy either. The real problem isn't how the video game industry or even other industries like movie and tv, portrays females or males it's how people (the audience) are dumb enough to actually think that these characters are somehow images of perfection.

SophinaK

Did you miss his point about ugly male characters? Because it was definitely there, and he certainly has a point. Can you think of a single ugly female video game character? Sure, Jade isn't an underdressed bimbo, but calling her an ugly woman would be laughable. Even female villains are usually shockingly gorgeous, while sometimes male heroes can be scarred, mutated, bald, fat, or old. Did you not see the flying pictures of the Hulk, Shrek, Homer Simpson, and the Phantom of the Opera flying by?

Granted, in games you mostly see these imperfect male heroes in movie or comic carryovers, which is something to take into consideration, because on the whole movies are more imperfect female friendly than games as well.

In most of those cases though even the disfigured males are molded as such to have a cool-appeal that no person in real life would be enigmatic enough possess.

You can't really make a female villian cool without making her attractive, or not very often anyway. That's not an issue with videogames, it's an issue with women and how they choose to portray themselves *rotates finger in circular gesture*

[QUOTE="wackoss"]

Female characters in video games aren't realistic and they're not meant to be. Look at the male characters in most video games - they're buff, chiseled, etc - not quite the realistic image of an average guy either. The real problem isn't how the video game industry or even other industries like movie and tv, portrays females or males it's how people (the audience) are dumb enough to actually think that these characters are somehow images of perfection.

SophinaK

Did you miss his point about ugly male characters? Because it was definitely there, and he certainly has a point. Can you think of a single ugly female video game character? Sure, Jade isn't an underdressed bimbo, but calling her an ugly woman would be laughable. Even female villains are usually shockingly gorgeous, while sometimes male heroes can be scarred, mutated, bald, fat, or old. Did you not see the flying pictures of the Hulk, Shrek, Homer Simpson, and the Phantom of the Opera flying by?

Granted, in games you mostly see these imperfect male heroes in movie or comic carryovers, which is something to take into consideration, because on the whole movies are more imperfect female friendly than games as well.

Hulk and Shrek are both monsters, if we're including monsters I can name ugly female characters all day long. I'm not sure the Simpsons has *any* attractive characters. And I don't think the Phantom of the Opera is a good choice since modern portryals mostly have a Phantom who is good looking but hides the part of his face that is disfigured.While you can definitely find some exceptions, I think that males are definitely getting this treatment as well.

In just about all of these games where you find the "over sexed" female characters, you'll also find similar portryals of men. That is especially true when you look at the Japanese market.

Objectifying women reflects the market/audience...if there are no consumers, why would the devs make it ?

Becasue there is a rule in business that says "Sex sells anything"...when you encounter this, most often you can conclude that the creators were unsure of their work and had to resort to sex/nudity for that wow factor to make their product sell.

I guess its a natural/psychological thing with men (me included) that we cant help ourselves not think about sex when we see a woman :P...When someone sees anything, say a car associated with a hot girl in skimpy clothes giving a I-wanna-do-you-now look , that person (most probably a guy) will be tempted and his mind will associate buying of the car to be the key to getting the girl....The sad thing is it works so we as a consumer are also equally responsible for objectifying women.

I can understand the women getting angry/frustrated/offended with this portrayal....but I do have a question for them. With all due respect, "Do you deep down really care about this ? I mean dont you want to be an object of desire sometimes ? "

[QUOTE="SophinaK"][QUOTE="wackoss"]

Female characters in video games aren't realistic and they're not meant to be. Look at the male characters in most video games - they're buff, chiseled, etc - not quite the realistic image of an average guy either. The real problem isn't how the video game industry or even other industries like movie and tv, portrays females or males it's how people (the audience) are dumb enough to actually think that these characters are somehow images of perfection.

H3LLRaiseR

Did you miss his point about ugly male characters? Because it was definitely there, and he certainly has a point. Can you think of a single ugly female video game character? Sure, Jade isn't an underdressed bimbo, but calling her an ugly woman would be laughable. Even female villains are usually shockingly gorgeous, while sometimes male heroes can be scarred, mutated, bald, fat, or old. Did you not see the flying pictures of the Hulk, Shrek, Homer Simpson, and the Phantom of the Opera flying by?

Granted, in games you mostly see these imperfect male heroes in movie or comic carryovers, which is something to take into consideration, because on the whole movies are more imperfect female friendly than games as well.

Hulk and Shrek are both monsters, if we're including monsters I can name ugly female characters all day long. I'm not sure the Simpsons has *any* attractive characters. And I don't think the Phantom of the Opera is a good choice since modern portryals mostly have a Phantom who is good looking but hides the part of his face that is disfigured.While you can definitely find some exceptions, I think that males are definitely getting this treatment as well.

In just about all of these games where you find the "over sexed" female characters, you'll also find similar portryals of men. That is especially true when you look at the Japanese market.

But not in the same amount of over sexed female characters in games no. Shrek and Hulk might be monsters but they are lead characters. There are no ugly and fat female lead characters. Another point which is, most "attractive" male characters don't really appeal to women. Who said having an insensitive bulky guy with a foul mouth appeals to women? This shows how the industry still look at gamers as pathetic 13 14 year old male antisocials. The women who end up with those bulky and ugly guys are either "beauty queens" or "super models" beautiful and they're just normal people in the plot of the videogame which is just ridiculous because normal people don't have to be good looking all the time! This destroys any female teenager's self esteem. Being beautiful or attractive doesn't only mean being physically attractive. Then what about videogames that shows that being physically attractive means being slutty and act like a pro hoe! Sorry for the language but it's so immature and I agree with Oilers, this is like an insult to male gamers.

Objectifying women reflects the market/audience...if there are no consumers, why would the devs make it ?

Becasue there is a rule in business that says "Sex sells anything"...when you encounter this, most often you can conclude that the creators were unsure of their work and had to resort to sex/nudity for that wow factor to make their product sell.

I guess its a natural/psychological thing with men (me included) that we cant help ourselves not think about sex when we see a woman :P...When someone sees anything, say a car associated with a hot girl in skimpy clothes giving a I-wanna-do-you-now look , that person (most probably a guy) will be tempted and his mind will associate buying of the car to be the key to getting the girl....The sad thing is it works so we as a consumer are also equally responsible for objectifying women.

I can understand the women getting angry/frustrated/offended with this portrayal....but I do have a question for them. With all due respect, "Do you deep down really care about this ? I mean dont you want to be an object of desire sometimes ? "

gm84

I thought the most interesting part of that video was when he pointed out that women seem to expect it just as much as men. It's something I hadn't thought about at all prior to this, but I think is completely true.

Why is that I wonder?SophinaK

It's simple, our society places much more importance of women's appearance than men's. Women are simply more attractive and more pleasing to look at - for everyone. When an attractive couple walks in, everyone will check out the woman - straight men, straight women, gay men, gay women. Women find other women attractive and they will openly acknowledge it. Straight men will not check out another man, they will not find him attractive and they will certainly not say anything like that - and no, it has nothing to do with being homophobic. We simply don't care.

There is an entire multi-billion dollar industry dedicated solely to making women look good. And women embrace it. When going to dinner, a guy can get ready in 10 minutes, a girl...forget about it. You might as well watch a movie or something before she is actually finished. Everyone cares how women look like, not nearly as much as how men do.

Anyway, I can't say I'm much of a fan of the 'objectifying women' spiel. As for the video, the guy had Dead or Alive footage on repeat for about 10 minutes...hardly representative. There are many lead game characters who look 'down to Earth', if you will. It's not my fault you guys don't play adventure games.

[QUOTE="gm84"]

Objectifying women reflects the market/audience...if there are no consumers, why would the devs make it ?

Becasue there is a rule in business that says "Sex sells anything"...when you encounter this, most often you can conclude that the creators were unsure of their work and had to resort to sex/nudity for that wow factor to make their product sell.

I guess its a natural/psychological thing with men (me included) that we cant help ourselves not think about sex when we see a woman :P...When someone sees anything, say a car associated with a hot girl in skimpy clothes giving a I-wanna-do-you-now look , that person (most probably a guy) will be tempted and his mind will associate buying of the car to be the key to getting the girl....The sad thing is it works so we as a consumer are also equally responsible for objectifying women.

I can understand the women getting angry/frustrated/offended with this portrayal....but I do have a question for them. With all due respect, "Do you deep down really care about this ? I mean dont you want to be an object of desire sometimes ? "

gamingqueen

Do they rely on naked men to sell products AS MUCH as they do with women? No. Is there a game with an adult content like playboy or a game which is specifically designed for that sort thing for the female audience? No! *and no I don't want one thanks!*

Well there you go. The reason there isn't is as he said; it reflects the market. You don't want it, so you're not sold it.

Vin Diesel shouldn't be allowed to do movies, because he makes skinny people like me feel bad.
syztem

Yeah. I could never pull that off or even this... http://youtube.com/watch?v=4JMOh-cul6M

http://youtube.com/watch?v=j-rTuKFkHIc

I like the video and I agree. What's your say on this?

Of 2356746 female character in a videogame, 3 or 5 characters don't wear skimpy clothes.

gamingqueen

As a side note, I must mention that some female characters that have never been considered as sex symbols to begin with, are starting to be sexed up by the companies that created them in the first place. If you need proof, that is why I felt compelled to do this: (insert shameless self promotion here)

Yes, Nintendo gave her a skin tight jumpsuit and yes, she does do that in the game and more than one Nintendo fan must be happy for it!