The state of gaming

well, just like the title says. could everyone give their opinion on where gaming is today.

what do they like about it, what do they not like, whatwould they change, do they likewhere gaming is going.pretty much anything they feel about gaming nowadays.

and no flaming other people's opinions, cause thats just immature, friendly disscusions are ok but flaming is stupid

what I like about gaming today:near fullmutiplayer is finally achieved on all platforms, game storylines finally maturing.

what I dont like about gaming : far, far too many FPS games less diversity then before, no exclusives, too much crapware (due to new audiences brought to gaming by the Wii), sometimes seems like graphics are all gamers and developers care about

so what are your thoughts??

>

^ Deus Ex has not been topped, let alone developed upon despite being a 2000 game. Pathetic.

(Thank goodness for the Total War series.)

Agreed. The majority of customers don't reward creativity and innovation, so we have an industry that doesn't value it. We have GDC talks about not innovating too much because you risk alienating players looking for familiarity. Hopefully we are reaching the point of stagnation so the industry will be forced to change or decline.

Well, one thing is for sure, while people keep buying the products that these companies produce the companies will keep producing them. Ever 3 or 4 years another generation of kids grows up to the age where they start owning enough money to buy a couple of games a year and these kids will always buy the latest final fantasy, pro evo or doom or whatever. It's essentially irrelevant whether they are better than the previous generations games because they are newer and shinier and therefore kids want them.

Gaming is better now than it has ever been though. Games look genuinely good on a decent computer (and presumably on next gen consoles as well). Sound effects and particularly music are really VERY good even when compared to non game music. Gameplay isn't necessarily getting worse either. There are still great games coming out in every genre. Particularly now that indie games are taking off at about the same level of complexity that games 10 years ago had. Maybe there will never be another cannon fodder (or ) but hey I can make do with Sacred 2.

That said, there are a few things that I would like to see seriously improved upon for the next generation of games.

1) Voice acting and dialogue. Frankly, it's atrocious. I have NEVER played a game with what I would consider good dialogue and acting. There are games where it is better than others, particularly games that don't try and take themselves seriously. But the majority of the time it sounds like something out of a school play.

2) Graphics. What? You mean you think that developers should spend time on graphics? Damn right I do. I have a very large collection of old DOS games that I used to love and I can barely play them any more. As graphics got better I found it harder and harder to enjoy the pixelated goodness from that era. The same should be true of todays games. Now I actually don't mean that I want higher resolution textures or more polygons in all my objects. I want games that experiment with graphics. Prince of Persia (the new one) is a great example. I want to see more games try out different things.

3) Controllers. With the Wii controller we as consumers were reminded of a technology that has been around for a fair while. There is no reason why it can't be improved to the point of being useful in all sorts of games. I think that this will be a direction that we take in the next 5 years and it should be a good ride.

One thing is for sure though, the gaming industry should stop trying to be the film industry. If that happens and games studios go back to letting game developers invent then gaming for the next few years will be brilliant.

Things I like?

I like where the gaming industry is headed, in all honesty. The Wii is a prime example of where gaming technology SHOULD be headed. If game developers keep making huge leaps like that, I definitely believe virual reality can be in our future. I also like how developers are making their games more cinematic. Resident Evil and Metal Gear Solid are prime examples. You can't ever let your guard down in RE5 cinematics, which draws you deeper into the game, as if you're actually there. And the gameplay/cinematic sequences in Metal Gear Solid 4 were absolutely brilliant.

As for fighting and sports games, there's only so much you can do there. But I do believe that they've gone as far as they can for now, until the motion detectin technology really makes some advancements.

Shooters...all I have to say is Killzone 2. Some of the multiplayer features are brilliant, imo. The gameplay is heavy and real. It's an amazing game. The Halo series is epic, with a story that actually connects you with their characters. When Sarg died, or when everyone thought Master Chief died, it was horrible. The situation was epic, the Flood was terrifying. GoW series has pretty much perfected 3rd person style shooting, and brings the grittiness of battle right to your home. And CoD: Modern Warfare? Easily the best "tactical" shooter of them all. Bullet penetration was brilliant. And he campaign, albiet short, was jaw-dropping. Not to mention the leveling system in online play is addicting and worth-while.

And RPG's? Bethesda has proved that the old-school RPG's are a dying trend. Oblivion/Fallout style RPG's are where it's at. Unlimited options, expansive and almost limitless world to explore, endless hours of gameplay, deep and intense character customization, and countless ways of going about quests is where the RPG's of today are headed. And, imo, that's great. As much as I enjoyed the old-school Suikoden, Final Fantasy style RPG's, they indeed are a dying breed.

Things I think developers could work on?

Longer games. You need to have longer games. And I don't mean 30hr games. I mean, something longer than an 8 hr play. If you REALLY want people to connect with your characters, or care in the slightest bit about what's going on in that little universe of yours, then it needs to be longer. 16-20 hrs would be optimal.

Survival-Horror games are a mess right now. Dead Space was a diamond in the rough. RE5 was WAY more of a shooter than being anything scary. F.E.A.R. 2? You're not serous. Were there any other good survival horror games in the recent year? Even two? Forget the games even being GOOD, just let me know of another recent survival-horror game besides Left 4 Dead (if you can even call that "survival-horror"). I've heard of a release of a new Fatal Frame in the future. All I have to say, is it better be damn good.

Anyways, with games becoming more motion-oriented, game types like shooters and racing are going to flourish in the very near future. Now...incorporating that with different style games is going to be interesting to watch.

Let's see if any good can come of it. And PRAY that the consoles of the future won't be plagued by the games that plague the Wii now.

[QUOTE="Master_Perry"]

stuff

SEANMCAD

1. I personally hate the cinematic trend. I prefer Will Wrights vision of giving the player the power and control to build and explore.

2. Frankly 20 hours of a game is short. I prefer massively ridiculously epic games that are more hobbies than a casual pastime.

3. Just an FYI, Morrowind is larger and more free form than Fallout or Oblivion. Plus in my personal view the graphics are more pleasing.

As a side note, when the original Pen and Paper D&D came my way I felt that the home PC (also very new at the time) would work perfectly with that style of gaming.

After almost 30 years later the only game that really is in that spirit is NeverWinter Nights. Why? Because world content creation possible from players.

There's a lot of content for TES/F3 games also. But still I agree rpgs are kinda dissapointing.

It's an industry that has no vision. They keep wanting to say that they're important entertainment, the way film and music are, but they're not. And they keep trying to sell a more polished Zelda or Final Fantasy clone as art, because the writing is a bit better now, or something like that. Everyone knows how to make an entertaining game at this point. Everyone knows how to have fun. But collectively, the pursuit of fun has left the industry creatively exhausted; there's only so much you can do when you feel morally obligated to entertain, and only entertain, the player at the expense of other goals.Oilers99

i find it annoying that the people with all the power to change things, bore me; developers like peter molyneux and david braben. they're all hot air. in an interview on 'the future of gaming', all they really talked about was a very specific type of stoytelling taken from films. they, along with rockstar, just want to make the game equivalent of the godfather. they're more interested in making interactive cinema, than they are serious game design.

but as a contrast, "well, it's just meant to be fun" isn't really an excuse anymore either. everything will become meaningless and arbitrary and thrown together if it's all about 'fun' in the 'laugh-out-loud /extreme awesomeness' sense.

none of these ideologies are very progressive or helpful to the growth of the medium, if so much time is spent on them or a large proportion of developers are all doing it.

It's an industry that has no vision. They keep wanting to say that they're important entertainment, the way film and music are, but they're not. And they keep trying to sell a more polished Zelda or Final Fantasy clone as art, because the writing is a bit better now, or something like that. Everyone knows how to make an entertaining game at this point. Everyone knows how to have fun. But collectively, the pursuit of fun has left the industry creatively exhausted; there's only so much you can do when you feel morally obligated to entertain, and only entertain, the player at the expense of other goals.Oilers99

Agreed. The majority of customers don't reward creativity and innovation, so we have an industry that doesn't value it. We have GDC talks about not innovating too much because you risk alienating players looking for familiarity. Hopefully we are reaching the point of stagnation so the industry will be forced to change or decline.

dchan01

The monetary value of video games?

Short answer: There is none.

The state of gaming from an investors point, the belief that the piece of plastic with a label that they hold on to so dearly, until they find a sucker who is willing to hand over his/her hard earn cash. Im sick of seeing the outrageous pricing on ebay/amazon; on so called rare games that pop up like roaches every summer. For Example: Sealed Copies of Radiant Silver Gun $400 (the game isn't even that good) Boarder Down $200, Marvel VS. Capcom 2 $80-$100 Rez $80-$100. Its %#(@^$# rediculous.

The only value video games have is nostolgic and sentimental value. Yet those are feelings that people grasp onto with an iron grip and cant seem to let go.

Achievments and Trophies?

We live in a society where we feel that we must be rewarded for any accomplishments that we acheive. It starts at a young age when your parents pat you on the back for trying to speak. As you get older they hand out awards for the winning and loosing teams. Then you expect bonuses for a job where you're suppose be performing at your best (that's why they hired you in the first place) Then you are shipped off over seas and kill a few a people, you are rewarded for being a hero. When you're on the verge of dying you're collecting Social Security for all the time you put into the game of life.

Congratulations! You've managed to turn the game on and play for five minutes. Please don't insult my intelligence and keep your at a boys to a negative zero.

The belief that 2D is dead?

Its not. You've just been looking in all the wrong places.

Radiant Silvergun is the best shooter ever made. It was released in Japan only with a very small print run. The Saturn is so convoluted and complex that no one can properly emulate it. Why wouldn't it demand high prices?

Radiant Silvergun is the best shooter ever made. It was released in Japan only with a very small print run. The Saturn is so convoluted and complex that no one can properly emulate it. Why wouldn't it demand high prices?

dchan01

That's just it, it's not even the best shmup on the Saturn. Don Pachi (and its sequel) Sexy Parodius and Battle Garrega are by far superior to the most expensive on disc shmup excluding PCB boards. I paid $200 for Boarder Down, so I speak from experience when I say that no game is worth that much. Not even Radiant Silver Gun.

And I loved Boarder Down.

Just because a video game has a low print run doesn't mean that it justifies a steep price. It all comes down to what your willing to pay.

A few people in this thread amaze me how arrogant, pretenious, and yet how utterly short sighted and ignorant they are. And to think that my statement sounds arrogant, but im making that claim that you are all so much more, should be something to consider.

A few people in this thread amaze me how arrogant, pretenious, and yet how utterly short sighted and ignorant they are. And to think that my statement sounds arrogant, but im making that claim that you are all so much more, should be something to consider.

XaosII

To put it shortly, there's very few games I'm looking foward to. One of the things I thought before getting my DS (and I'm not a nintendo fan, not really into Mario (I kinda hate him) and Zelda, though I think Metorid is the best FPS I've ever played) like 3 years ago is ok, let's get a console where they cannot rely heavily on graphics, where they are forced to come up with someting good... well, they did.

Personally I don't expect great things from the market in the years to come, games are getting short and soulless, too much money involved, huge risks for developers and zero willingness to take any, by I kind of expect good things from the indipendent developers... and guess what? One again... you don't need ridiculously powerful hardeare for those games....

In a nutshell, I think video games are being dumbed down. Look at Resident Evil 5. RE games are supposed to be rediculously challenging. Why they had to lower the difficulty level to that of a children's game is beyond me. We used to be getting masterpieces coming out left and right from the 80's up unitl the early/mid 2000's. Now it's just a bunch of crap. Very few modern games even come close to being good enough to be considered masterpieces. I think that video games are relying too much on technology and less so on good storytelling and game mechanics. This is just a phase though. As technology gets better people will get used to the fact that video games have amazing graphics, and will start demanding more. Atleast I hope that's what happens.

I've been playing games for 28 years now and I think this particular generation of consoles is by far and away the best that I've ever experienced. I'm not saying this purely on graphics, I say this because the graphics help in absorbing you into the game alot easier.

People have spoken about non-originality, and for some part, I agree. There are certain game franchises and characters that should just be left in the history books and creators do need to get more original. However, think about how many games that have been created, coming up with a purely original idea is becoming harder. I'm not saying its impossible, but harder.

Games have been watered down a little, due to the Wii and the immergance of the casual gamer. But we don't have to buy/play them. I think all of the people on here do the research in buying decent games to collect a good library.

I cannot say anything about the XBox Live content, but with the PSN, I like the downloadable games for $10 that can fill in time while I wait for a major title. The online aspect of games extends games these days, so even if you get through a game fairly quickly, that you've spent $120 on, you can still go online. Games like COD4 or Killzone 2, the online aspect is a game in itself. Take SFIV, I spent $90 on this and played for 60 hours, which means so far, I've spent $1.50 an hour to entertain myself. At the cost of these games on face value, $90-$120 IS alot, especially as the rest of the world doesn't seem to have to pay as much as Australia, but break it down, $1.50 isn't that much.

What I don't like about this generation though, is the fact that games get released that require patches later. The quality isn't what it should be because the attitude seems to be "We'll fix it later". This is amy small gripe.

I don't recall being into games as much as I have been than with this generation.

Games are better now than they have ever been

A few people in this thread amaze me how arrogant, pretenious, and yet how utterly short sighted and ignorant they are. And to think that my statement sounds arrogant, but im making that claim that you are all so much more, should be something to consider.

XaosII

Care to elaborate on that? When you make a statement like that and don't point out any examples and why you disagree with them it just makes you look like an elitist douche.

I could not disagree more.

IN MY VIEW:

Morrowind is much better than Oblivion or Fallout 3, SimCity is gone forever, No One Lives Forever is gone forever, games with toolsets are disapearing, turned based tactical pretty much no longer exists and far cry has been re-packaged with so many different names so many times its gets very old (crysis = far cry 1 with better graphics).

SEANMCAD

>

^ Morrowind was still not as innovative as TES II: Daggerfall.

While I don't regret the end of the turned based games (except Total War I don't see a point to them), I'm almost crying as I have to agree with you.

Sim City, NOLF are gone, Deus Ex III (and System Shock III if it will be made) will most likely end up as dumbed down, stripped of content, abominations like Invisible War, UT3 and so forth.

Crysis though is more then Far Cry with better graphics, it is that, but it's also a lite Deus Ex till the aliens come.

[QUOTE="efrucht"]

Games are better now than they have ever been

SEANMCAD

I could not disagree more.

IN MY VIEW:

Morrowind is much better than Oblivion or Fallout 3, SimCity is gone forever, No One Lives Forever is gone forever, games with toolsets are disapearing, turned based tactical pretty much no longer exists and far cry has been re-packaged with so many different names so many times its gets very old (crysis = far cry 1 with better graphics).

Games move on though. Yes these games and genres may be slowly dying (in your opinion), but you find other games that take your fancy and move on. People talk about creators not being original and others talk about the old games have gone. You can't please everyone all of the time.

Overall I think the industry has lost its focus. It used to be the developers understood not everyone had a top of the line PC and would deliberately aim for system specs build around a one or two generation old video card. The main drive behind this was to try and maximize the player base. This was a good thing because a lot of people were (and still are) freaked out about altering anything inside their computer. Sadly, most developers and distributors forgot about all this.

Somewhere along the line they started paying too much attention to the demand for games that would stress out the video card. Far too much focus has been put on HD gaming and photorealisitic graphics. It would not shock me at all if it was revealed that the unwise and excessive focus on graphics let to or help contribute to the long list of games that were highly buggy or just all around broken. Engine stability/compatibility >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graphics.

If they really want to boost the PC has a valid gaming platform then dropping the focus on high end graphics and refocusing on strong art direction would help alot. Both World of Warcraft and Guild Wars have hardware specs below their counterparts and yet look great and are two of the more successful PC games today.

Patches are another problem. They are supposed to be for minor tweaks and such. Distributors have perverted them into ways of finishing the game so they can game out the door sooner then later. I hear this has started to happen in the consoles too.

Someone earlier pointed out he obvious - the way every [well, almost every] type of market works - they make what you buy. It you tend to by something, and tend not to by something they will make a choice of not making/selling the one that does not bring money.

I believe it is really that simple. I mean there is a competition on - you cannot blame companies with owning this section of the market. In the end, it really is the consumers who influence where the gaming industry is headed. Maybe not the ones who write here on this thread - as it seems most of you are not satisfied.

And I am not disappointed by the way with how things are. Every now and then you can find a decent game you can play - that is enough for me.

Sure there is a lot of crap for sale - but bare in mind, that there would not be any if someone would not buy them. My only guess that the scope of gaming and the scope of people who play, has widened. There are far more games released these days...

I don't know... I am difficult to satisfy gaming-wise, but I always find something new to play. And I don't really think that all gaming is just show and graphics - sure, every game looks... well, quite good, but certainly not great. I could tell only a hand-full of games that really look awesome...

This is just my view of things... and only for the PC platform! Unfortunately I do not play on other platforms.

Thanks guys! :)

Overall I think the industry has lost its focus. It used to be the developers understood not everyone had a top of the line PC and would deliberately aim for system specs build around a one or two generation old video card. The main drive behind this was to try and maximize the player base. This was a good thing because a lot of people were (and still are) freaked out about altering anything inside their computer. Sadly, most developers and distributors forgot about all this.

Somewhere along the line they started paying too much attention to the demand for games that would stress out the video card. Far too much focus has been put on HD gaming and photorealisitic graphics. It would not shock me at all if it was revealed that the unwise and excessive focus on graphics let to or help contribute to the long list of games that were highly buggy or just all around broken. Engine stability/compatibility >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graphics.

If they really want to boost the PC has a valid gaming platform then dropping the focus on high end graphics and refocusing on strong art direction would help alot. Both World of Warcraft and Guild Wars have hardware specs below their counterparts and yet look great and are two of the more successful PC games today.

Patches are another problem. They are supposed to be for minor tweaks and such. Distributors have perverted them into ways of finishing the game so they can game out the door sooner then later. I hear this has started to happen in the consoles too.

Drosa

What are talking about ?!

Crysis/Cryengine 2 is the only game that pushed the boundries.

There where Crysis like games in the old days too.

Quake I, TES II: Dagggerfall, Quake II, Unreal, Tribes, Quake III, Giants: Citizen Kabuto, Serious Sam, to name a few.

Unreal could only be maxed with 3 videocards, a 2D Matrox and 2x 3DFX Voodoo II in SLI mode. A year later the Geforce 256 DDR crushed that combo to pieces and could play UT at over 30 FPS per second in high resolutions.

As to bugs and issues, all I have to say is (TES II) Daggerfall and Fallout 2. Or maybe SIN.

gaming is at an all time high imo. you've got games like rock band 2 that let you play a guitar with your favorite songs. you've also got great shooters like halo 3, gears of war 2, graw, rainbow six vegas. i have never had so much fun in my whole life that i am having now. i think games will get better as time goes by. and to think i was playing asteroids when i was a kid. you guys are lucky to have such great games. i just hope it continues the way it has been going and some jerk lawyer doesn't screw it up. you know what i mean?

I've very happy with the current state of the industry. I've been gaming for 31 years and so long as a stream of quality original games and well though out sequels/ripoffs (that improve on more than the texture quality of their predecessors) keeps flowing, gaming will remain my favorite hobby.

Its really great that online play enables the sort of intense co-op/competitive gaming that disappeared with arcades, PSN/XBL facilitate the release of smaller budget/risker games and internet distributed demos enable players to more easily avoid garbage.

Overall I think the industry has lost its focus. It used to be the developers understood not everyone had a top of the line PC and would deliberately aim for system specs build around a one or two generation old video card. The main drive behind this was to try and maximize the player base. This was a good thing because a lot of people were (and still are) freaked out about altering anything inside their computer. Sadly, most developers and distributors forgot about all this.

Somewhere along the line they started paying too much attention to the demand for games that would stress out the video card. Far too much focus has been put on HD gaming and photorealisitic graphics. It would not shock me at all if it was revealed that the unwise and excessive focus on graphics let to or help contribute to the long list of games that were highly buggy or just all around broken. Engine stability/compatibility >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graphics.

If they really want to boost the PC has a valid gaming platform then dropping the focus on high end graphics and refocusing on strong art direction would help alot. Both World of Warcraft and Guild Wars have hardware specs below their counterparts and yet look great and are two of the more successful PC games today.

Patches are another problem. They are supposed to be for minor tweaks and such. Distributors have perverted them into ways of finishing the game so they can game out the door sooner then later. I hear this has started to happen in the consoles too.

Drosa