Ironii

Isn't it a little more than Ironic that the Wii is a system that boasts of its innovation, and yet there are only 2 games I can think of off the top of my head that actually use the motion sensor controls in a fun and creative fashion. (I'm not counting crummy techdemo minigame compilations like Wiiplay and Mario Galaxy could have easilly been done on the Gamecube controller.)

Why did people buy the Wii? Because it looked fun and different. The people who didn't buy the Wii for those reasons bought it for Next generation nintendo games, like Smash Bros Brawl and Mario Kart. But both of those titles mentioned give you the option to use the Gamecube controller, as if they don't have confidence that they could do it well on the Wii-Remote and nunchuck. They're probably right; I personally will be using the Gamecube Controller for those games myself, and the current reviews on Smash Bros say it's the only way to go.

How long do you think it will take before we'll get some real "Wii" games that aren't just wannabe PC games that use the Wiimote for a mouse or games that would probably be better off with a DIFFERENT controller? When will we get games that don't just turn the wiimote sideways and pretend it's a Nintendo controller? When will we get games where we actually have to USE the motion controls in a fun and intuitive fashion creating a completely unique experience to the Wii?

The Wii has been out for a year now, it's going on its second year... I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my head; when do you think some REAL innovations will start materializing?

I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my headmstc_Q

System Wars, where we dump the ignorant people.sexy_chimp

I think the other systems suck.

This isn't a system wars topic.

[QUOTE="sexy_chimp"]System Wars, where we dump the ignorant people.mstc_Q

I think the other systems suck.

This isn't a system wars topic.

You're insulting a system.

It belongs in System Wars.

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"]

[QUOTE="sexy_chimp"]System Wars, where we dump the ignorant people.sexy_chimp

I think the other systems suck.

This isn't a system wars topic.

You're insulting a system.

It belongs in System Wars.

Actually, I'm insulting the current games available.

I like my Wii. I like my Resident Evil 4, I will like Smash Bros Brawl when it comes out.

I like the virtual console, I like the Everyone Votes channel...

HOWEVER I do think innovation could go a whole lot further.

IGN and GS both said in their hands-on that the Wii Wheel is the best way to go after some getting used to.

And Mario Galaxy uses the controls well imo, motion and waggle wasn't overdone or forced on you. Just giving the remote a shake to spin feels right, as well as the pointer to get starbits.

I see what you're saying, and to an extent you are right. Wii games just haven't been coming out that use the full potention of the the system. I think it's just that devs have to think differently when it comes to this system if they want to fully utilize it, and maybe they just don't want to take the time to do that.

Either way, I bet by the end of the year we will have an awesome Wii game that couldn't be done on any other system. Not because of graphics, but because of the way the Wii remote is used, and that it just would be a dull, uninspired game on any other system.

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"]I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my headZumaJones07

I'm sure you haven't played a Wii game and thought "Oh, they could totally use this for this, or that for that, in a game that lasts longer than 5 minutes, and it woudl be amazing"

What needs to happen is they need to have companies like Capcom and Konami and maybe even square to make some real epics that aren't afraid to break the formula. (And not just remakes of old epics using the Wii controls either, as much as I look forward to Okami since I still haven't had a chance to try that game.)

The trouble so far is that Nintendo has been putting out thier obligatory franchises that haven't broken the formula since 3-D gaming was invented. I know that's moving based off the idea of "If it's not broke, don't fix it", but I think it's about time they innovate something else, I mean they invented the dang system after all.

I fear it's going to be another year of them coughing up thier samies though before we get to that.

Isn't it a little more than Ironic that the Wii is a system that boasts of its innovation, and yet there are only 2 games I can think of off the top of my head that actually use the motion sensor controls in a fun and creative fashion. (I'm not counting crummy techdemo minigame compilations like Wiiplay and Mario Galaxy could have easilly been done on the Gamecube controller.)

Why did people buy the Wii? Because it looked fun and different. The people who didn't buy the Wii for those reasons bought it for Next generation nintendo games, like Smash Bros Brawl and Mario Kart. But both of those titles mentioned give you the option to use the Gamecube controller, as if they don't have confidence that they could do it well on the Wii-Remote and nunchuck. They're probably right; I personally will be using the Gamecube Controller for those games myself, and the current reviews on Smash Bros say it's the only way to go.

How long do you think it will take before we'll get some real "Wii" games that aren't just wannabe PC games that use the Wiimote for a mouse or games that would probably be better off with a DIFFERENT controller? When will we get games that don't just turn the wiimote sideways and pretend it's a Nintendo controller? When will we get games where we actually have to USE the motion controls in a fun and intuitive fashion creating a completely unique experience to the Wii?

The Wii has been out for a year now, it's going on its second year... I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my head; when do you think some REAL innovations will start materializing?

mstc_Q

you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

fleig_man

I don't touch EA Games with a 5 foot pole anymore. They've disapointed me with every game I've gotten from them - and with all honesty, this doesn't look that much better to me.

No offense, but when I was talking about innovation, I wasn't referring to Gimmicks either.

To me, fun is just as important as innovation.

SMG could've done on a gamecube controller, but its a lot more fun with the Wiimote. And the same applies for games like Mario Kart.

all we find are crappy minigames and games that only last for 10 or less hours. machod_19

You're wrong.

Read this

To me, fun is just as important as innovation.

SMG could've done on a gamecube controller, but its a lot more fun with the Wiimote. And the same applies for games like Mario Kart.

sexy_chimp

I like SMG, and I don't disagree that there is something charming about wagging that controller around.

BUT, it seems like they are only scratching the surface of its potential, mainly because, as I mentioned before, you could have pushed B on the Gamecube controller to spin in Mario Galaxy, and you could have just held down the A button to feed the stars, since all the stars that had to be fed cut to a "Feed Me" shot anyway.

[QUOTE="fleig_man"]you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

mstc_Q

I don't touch EA Games with a 5 foot pole anymore. They've disapointed me with every game I've gotten from them - and with all honesty, this doesn't look that much better to me.

No offense, but when I was talking about innovation, I wasn't referring to Gimmicks either.

so i guess you are saying that SSX Blur was a disapointment, or MOHH2 was a disapointment. but from what i'm hearing from you is that you don't like much. anyways Boom Blox is innovative and is in no way near a "gimmick"

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"][QUOTE="fleig_man"]you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

fleig_man

I don't touch EA Games with a 5 foot pole anymore. They've disapointed me with every game I've gotten from them - and with all honesty, this doesn't look that much better to me.

No offense, but when I was talking about innovation, I wasn't referring to Gimmicks either.

so i guess you are saying that SSX Blur was a disapointment, or MOHH2 was a disapointment. but from what i'm hearing from you is that you don't like much. anyways Boom Blox is innovative and is in no way near a "gimmick"

And I'm sure it will have EA's trademarked slowdowns and unecessarily long loading times.

And as for Medal of Honor, that game has been plagued with mediocraty for its entire existence, and its single player mode still sucks.

When it comes to snowboarding, like all sports games, I'd rather just go out and do it. Check out the motion controls on that! It's like the real thing! Oh wait...

Boom Blox looks like it would get boring after about an hour or two. It might look flashy now, but I doubt it'll have much lasting value.

[QUOTE="fleig_man"][QUOTE="mstc_Q"][QUOTE="fleig_man"]you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

mstc_Q

I don't touch EA Games with a 5 foot pole anymore. They've disapointed me with every game I've gotten from them - and with all honesty, this doesn't look that much better to me.

No offense, but when I was talking about innovation, I wasn't referring to Gimmicks either.

so i guess you are saying that SSX Blur was a disapointment, or MOHH2 was a disapointment. but from what i'm hearing from you is that you don't like much. anyways Boom Blox is innovative and is in no way near a "gimmick"

And I'm sure it will have EA's trademarked slowdowns and unecessarily long loading times.

And as for Medal of Honor, that game has been plagued with mediocraty for its entire existence, and its single player mode still sucks.

When it comes to snowboarding, like all sports games, I'd rather just go out and do it. Check out the motion controls on that! It's like the real thing! Oh wait...

Boom Blox looks like it would get boring after about an hour or two. It might look flashy now, but I doubt it'll have much lasting value.

well, that is your opinion.

but i hope you find a game that fills your needs :roll:

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"]

Isn't it a little more than Ironic that the Wii is a system that boasts of its innovation, and yet there are only 2 games I can think of off the top of my head that actually use the motion sensor controls in a fun and creative fashion. (I'm not counting crummy techdemo minigame compilations like Wiiplay and Mario Galaxy could have easilly been done on the Gamecube controller.)

Why did people buy the Wii? Because it looked fun and different. The people who didn't buy the Wii for those reasons bought it for Next generation nintendo games, like Smash Bros Brawl and Mario Kart. But both of those titles mentioned give you the option to use the Gamecube controller, as if they don't have confidence that they could do it well on the Wii-Remote and nunchuck. They're probably right; I personally will be using the Gamecube Controller for those games myself, and the current reviews on Smash Bros say it's the only way to go.

How long do you think it will take before we'll get some real "Wii" games that aren't just wannabe PC games that use the Wiimote for a mouse or games that would probably be better off with a DIFFERENT controller? When will we get games that don't just turn the wiimote sideways and pretend it's a Nintendo controller? When will we get games where we actually have to USE the motion controls in a fun and intuitive fashion creating a completely unique experience to the Wii?

The Wii has been out for a year now, it's going on its second year... I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my head; when do you think some REAL innovations will start materializing?

fleig_man

you bring up a somewhat solid point, but I want you to take a look at this game: Boom Blox

and here is IGNs hands-on with it.

wow. never heard of that before. looks really interesting. like warioware meets jenga (IRL not the game) meets starcraft

[QUOTE="ZumaJones07"][QUOTE="mstc_Q"]I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my headmstc_Q

I'm sure you haven't played a Wii game and thought "Oh, they could totally use this for this, or that for that, in a game that lasts longer than 5 minutes, and it woudl be amazing"

What needs to happen is they need to have companies like Capcom and Konami and maybe even square to make some real epics that aren't afraid to break the formula. (And not just remakes of old epics using the Wii controls either, as much as I look forward to Okami since I still haven't had a chance to try that game.)

The trouble so far is that Nintendo has been putting out thier obligatory franchises that haven't broken the formula since 3-D gaming was invented. I know that's moving based off the idea of "If it's not broke, don't fix it", but I think it's about time they innovate something else, I mean they invented the dang system after all.

I fear it's going to be another year of them coughing up thier samies though before we get to that.

thats all well and good now go ahead name those things he asked you to originally

[QUOTE="sexy_chimp"]

To me, fun is just as important as innovation.

SMG could've done on a gamecube controller, but its a lot more fun with the Wiimote. And the same applies for games like Mario Kart.

mstc_Q

I like SMG, and I don't disagree that there is something charming about wagging that controller around.

BUT, it seems like they are only scratching the surface of its potential, mainly because, as I mentioned before, you could have pushed B on the Gamecube controller to spin in Mario Galaxy, and you could have just held down the A button to feed the stars, since all the stars that had to be fed cut to a "Feed Me" shot anyway.

Well actually, now that I think about it, collect and shooting star bits would've been impossible on the Gamecube.

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"]

[QUOTE="ZumaJones07"][QUOTE="mstc_Q"]I can think of a whole bunch of creative game designs just off the top of my headSerraph105

I'm sure you haven't played a Wii game and thought "Oh, they could totally use this for this, or that for that, in a game that lasts longer than 5 minutes, and it woudl be amazing"

What needs to happen is they need to have companies like Capcom and Konami and maybe even square to make some real epics that aren't afraid to break the formula. (And not just remakes of old epics using the Wii controls either, as much as I look forward to Okami since I still haven't had a chance to try that game.)

The trouble so far is that Nintendo has been putting out thier obligatory franchises that haven't broken the formula since 3-D gaming was invented. I know that's moving based off the idea of "If it's not broke, don't fix it", but I think it's about time they innovate something else, I mean they invented the dang system after all.

I fear it's going to be another year of them coughing up thier samies though before we get to that.

thats all well and good now go ahead name those things he asked you to originally

Other games have the innovation, but they aren't real games. They are more like "Tech Demos".

Like Wii Sports, lets take that baseball bat and slam it against the head of some zombie.

Or take the Knife in Resident Evil 4 - that was an intuitive edition to the game even though it may have reduced the challenge a bit since it was a homing attack. Now that you have the knife on motion control, use the L button for something else, like a secondary weapon. In speaking of which, you could use the motion sensor on the Nunchuck to throw a grenade.

Then there was that one Konami game, the one where you used electricity to lift things up, like telekenesis. They kinda have the idea in Boom Blox, but lets put it in a real game. Take an action game for instance, you're in the fray, and your fighting in a dirt feild, point the Wiimote at the dirt, push a button to pick up a fist full, and then throw it in the enemy's eyes. You're in a castle and something takes a swing at you, grab that vase next to you and use it to block an attack, or just chuck it at thier face.

Like I said, everything that has even the slightest innovation is just a game that centers itself on that one gimmick. Implement them and make a real game out of them, something like Metal Gear solid, something like Zelda, those games have been screaming for more interaction, but what do we get? Waggle your controller to spin, or swing your sword when the B button works exactly the same. Now, push the A button to swing your sword at enemies to fend them off while you use the Wiimote to aim your hookshot? That's more like it!

And what happened to the whole flashlight thing they showed in the Wii demo thing? Heck, I heard you could use the Wiimote's sensors to duck behind your couch and play a real duck and cover shooting game; implement THAT into MGS (Granted, you could probably just put your hand in front of your wiimote, but the option is at least there.)

Make something new! Something no one has ever heard of before! Make a new story, use the Wii controls, make it impossible to put on any other system. Then I'll be impressed.

Then there was that one Konami game, the one where you used electricity to lift things up, like telekenesis. They kinda have the idea in Boom Blox, but lets put it in a real game. Take an action game for instance, you're in the fray, and your fighting in a dirt feild, point the Wiimote at the dirt, push a button to pick up a fist full, and then throw it in the enemy's eyes. You're in a castle and something takes a swing at you, grab that vase next to you and use it to block an attack, or just chuck it at thier face.

mstc_Q

That's basically like Half Life 2...

You can pick up things, use them as shields, and throw them at people.

Although you can't pick up dirt.

honestly i thought you would have nothing but thats very good i especially like the grenade chucking idea and the secondary weapon you really should edit your first post and put some of that stuff in there so people (like say me) dont think your bluffingSerraph105

My first post is already TLDR for a lot of internet junkies.

[QUOTE="mstc_Q"]

Then there was that one Konami game, the one where you used electricity to lift things up, like telekenesis. They kinda have the idea in Boom Blox, but lets put it in a real game. Take an action game for instance, you're in the fray, and your fighting in a dirt feild, point the Wiimote at the dirt, push a button to pick up a fist full, and then throw it in the enemy's eyes. You're in a castle and something takes a swing at you, grab that vase next to you and use it to block an attack, or just chuck it at thier face.

sexy_chimp

That's basically like Half Life 2...

You can pick up things, use them as shields, and throw them at people.

Although you can't pick up dirt.

Yes, Kind of like Halflife 2, except you could be swinging your nunchuck to punch them in the face while you grab the dirt.

The potential for intuitive multitasking is fairly high with the Wii's controls.

[QUOTE="sexy_chimp"][QUOTE="mstc_Q"]

Then there was that one Konami game, the one where you used electricity to lift things up, like telekenesis. They kinda have the idea in Boom Blox, but lets put it in a real game. Take an action game for instance, you're in the fray, and your fighting in a dirt feild, point the Wiimote at the dirt, push a button to pick up a fist full, and then throw it in the enemy's eyes. You're in a castle and something takes a swing at you, grab that vase next to you and use it to block an attack, or just chuck it at thier face.

mstc_Q

That's basically like Half Life 2...

You can pick up things, use them as shields, and throw them at people.

Although you can't pick up dirt.

Yes, Kind of like Halflife 2, except you could be swinging your nunchuck to punch them in the face while you grab the dirt.

The potential for intuitive multitasking is fairly high with the Wii's controls.

The problem is that developers can't do gestures that complex accurately yet. However sooner or later they will be able to, it's always like this when a new technology comes out.

Go play Super Mario 64 on the N64, the analog is incredibly unresponsive compared to what we have today.

The problem is that developers can't do gestures that complex accurately yet. However sooner or later they will be able to, it's always like this when a new technology comes out.

Go play Super Mario 64 on the N64, the analog is incredibly unresponsive compared to what we have today.

sexy_chimp

I guess I can understand that, which brings me back to one of my questions, how long will it take? Are we going to have to wait until the next Wiigeneration before it happens?

It's funny, I'm selling my N64, and so I was testing all my old games out again after blowing the cake of dust off of them.

I think I blame Mario 64's unresponsiveness to the crappy framerate more than anything. It's kind of frustrating to play now, you're right.

I think I'm mostly annoyed with Nintendo though, I mean, Pikman was something new, and it didn't take them THAT long to put out after the GC was released (Not that I liked Pikman, but it was new, and a decent length to boot.) Or even Luigi's mansion felt like something different and unique; using the pressure sensitive buttons and all.

Everything Nintendo has out right now just feels like a tease compared to what they could be.

[QUOTE="sexy_chimp"]

The problem is that developers can't do gestures that complex accurately yet. However sooner or later they will be able to, it's always like this when a new technology comes out.

Go play Super Mario 64 on the N64, the analog is incredibly unresponsive compared to what we have today.

mstc_Q

I guess I can understand that, which brings me back to one of my questions, how long will it take? Are we going to have to wait until the next Wiigeneration before it happens?

No, the improvements seem pretty steady to me.

First Zack and Wiki which had great gesture based controls.

Then No More Heroes.

Star Wars Forced Unleashed Wii apparantly has better controls than No More Heroes.

And then theres Pro Evo 08 and although I never read into it apparantly the motion controls are great.

Also Wii Sports shows a lot of untapped potential.

With a little polishing the boxing could be great.

Baseball has 1:1 controls when your holding the bat. (But not when you swing, which I guess is kind of important =\)

And to go along with that, I don't think NECESSARILLY that devs need to be more innovative, they just need to take old ideas and USE THEM WELL with the Wii controls. Picking up stuff with a gun is nothing new, as we all know, and neither is punching someone. But with the Wii Remote and Nunchaku, it would be so much more immersive if done correctly.tobenator

Here is also truth.