Kotaku conduit hands on

http://kotaku.com/5044031/pax-hands+on-the-conduit

"I felt like I was 14 again, playing Turok on my N64"

Even though The Conduit was only in pre-alpha, it already looked way better than Red Steel. Certainly not as good as Metroid, but then, as Eric said, "That'd be like saying you're better than Jesus."

thoughts?

I am better than Jesus. There. I said it.

[spoiler] JUST KIDDING JUST KIDDING!!! [/spoiler]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Wintry_Flutist

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Rocky32189

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

They do, but it sounds like HV isn't really aiming as high as they first meant to.

thats good news

Don't hate me...but I actually like this impression.

I loved playing Turok on the N64. xP

They do, but it sounds like HV isn't really aiming as high as they first meant to.

Wintry_Flutist

Well, they're at least still saying that they are; the guy at PAX openly stated that their aim was to have the best-looking game on the Wii when it's done.

[QUOTE="Rocky32189"][QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Wintry_Flutist

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

They do, but it sounds like HV isn't really aiming as high as they first meant to.

No, it sounds like they're being modest.

No, it sounds like they're being modest.

clicketyclick

As in admitting they can't keep their word, yes.

[QUOTE="clicketyclick"]

No, it sounds like they're being modest.

Wintry_Flutist

As in admitting they can't keep their word, yes.

As in admitting that their game doesn't look better than a first-party title during the pre-alpha stage.

As in admitting that their game doesn't look better than a first party title during the pre-alpha stage.

clicketyclick

Pre-alpha this, pre-alpha that. Being in pre-alpha doesn't mean it will look twice as better in alpha build and four times better in beta build - it just means they still havent all features they wish to include in this build and their paths needed to be tested. Of course, looks progress as development goes on, but visuals and such isn't what defines the build.

Anyway, it's how I feel - the more I listen from HV, the more it sounds like they're loosing their goals. Can't blame them with TGS and other announcements all of a sudden. It ain't easy to be the hardcore saviours one day, and the next, tens of games from experienced developpers are there to fill the games drought HV wanted to benefit from.

It looks awsome. I can't wait to say to my friends that I get to shoot aliens like they do in halo:Ddoctores143

Yes, finally something I can hold over my 360 fanboy friends!

Pre-alpha this, pre-alpha that. Being in pre-alpha doesn't mean it will look twice as better in alpha build and four times better in beta build - it just means they still havent all features they wish to include in this build and their paths needed to be tested. Of course, looks progress as development goes on, but visuals and such isn't what defines the build.Wintry_Flutist

Check out the difference between Uncharted pre-alpha and release. The difference is astounding.

Anyway, it's how I feel - the more I listen from HV, the more it sounds like they're loosing their goals.

Wintry_Flutist

Well, it's always nice to share our feelings, but as GabuEx pointed out, they aren't admitting or conceding anything. Their aim is the same as it always has been: to be the best looking game on Wii. So if you feel that something has changed, well, what can I say? You feel wrong. :P

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

Pre-alpha this, pre-alpha that. Being in pre-alpha doesn't mean it will look twice as better in alpha build and four times better in beta build - it just means they still havent all features they wish to include in this build and their paths needed to be tested. Of course, looks progress as development goes on, but visuals and such isn't what defines the build.clicketyclick

Check out the difference between Uncharted pre-alpha and release. The difference is astounding.

OK, and why do you think The Conduit will evolve like Uncharted?

The current build is called pre-alpha because the multiplayer is still in early development, so the whole game cannot yet be delivered to software testers. If the game were single player only, it would be in beta build, since according to HV, only graphics polishing is left for the campaign, a feature that isn't appreciated by software testers.

When HV says The Conduit is in pre-alpha, they don't mean the demos they're showing will improve dramatically, as if "the single player is in pre-alpha". There's no such thing as part of a game being in alpha, some other in beta and such. The Conduit is in pre-alpha because it's lacking major features - all multiplayer options.

OK, and why do you think The Conduit will evolve like Uncharted?Wintry_Flutist

Okay, and why do you think I think that The Conduit will evolve like Uncharted? I am merely pointing out that visuals can change dramatically between pre-alpha and release - yes, maybe even four times better if it were possible to quantify it.

When HV says The Conduit is in pre-alpha, they don't mean the demos they're showing will improve dramatically, as if "the single player is in pre-alpha". There's no such thing as part of a game being in alpha, some other in beta and such. The Conduit is in pre-alpha because it's lacking major features - all multiplayer options.

Wintry_Flutist

And motion+. And, as you said, graphical polishing. ;)

And motion+. And, as you said, graphical polishing. ;)

clicketyclick

And the more footage they show, the less impressive it gets!

[QUOTE="clicketyclick"]

And motion+. And, as you said, graphical polishing. ;)

Wintry_Flutist

And the more footage they show, the less impressive it gets!

In your opinion. I disagree. More interestingly, GabuEx disagrees. But regardless, that doesn't mean they've decided to change their goals.

It just keeps getting better...

The game's in pre-alpha with less than half a year till release?:?

The game's in pre-alpha with less than half a year till release?:?

-Wheels-

As of E3 08, they started working on multiplayer...

[QUOTE="Rocky32189"][QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Wintry_Flutist

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

They do, but it sounds like HV isn't really aiming as high as they first meant to.

The game's in pre-alpha with less than half a year till release?:?

-Wheels-

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"][QUOTE="Rocky32189"][QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Wild_Card

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

They do, but it sounds like HV isn't really aiming as high as they first meant to.

"The current build is called pre-alpha because the multiplayer is still in early development, so the whole game cannot yet be delivered to software testers. If the game were single player only, it would be in beta build, since according to HV, only graphics polishing is left for the campaign, a feature that isn't appreciated by software testers.

When HV says The Conduit is in pre-alpha, they don't mean the demos they're showing will improve dramatically, as if "the single player is in pre-alpha". There's no such thing as part of a game being in alpha, some other in beta and such. The Conduit is in pre-alpha because it's lacking major features - all multiplayer options."

Don't throw pre-alpha around as a guarantee what we see is super early production...

I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.presto7640

[QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.Cesar_Barba

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"]

But WTF? OK, let's say Metroid gameplay is the pinnacle of Wii FPS... But they're talking as if it's the limit for Wii visuals too and it's excusable they don't surpass it? Lame, just lame.

Rocky32189

The game is pre-alpha. They have tons of time to polish the visuals.

The game isn't in pre-alpha, back at when the first trailer was released, then it was pre alpha, but it's way too far itno development to be pre-alpha now. This is about the 20th time we've seen it, it's gotta be doing beta tests by now

at very least the game is in ALPHA stages, pre alpha is before it's playable

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.presto7640

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

Cesar is saying that it was done before at the point that you were doing it before. And it was done in great games that you likely enjoyed, so your criticism is rather unfair. Where the enemy is from is not what makes a game good or bad.

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.presto7640

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

every gaming mechanic is exhausted, except quirky little minigame S tyle ones

[QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.clicketyclick

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

Cesar is saying that it was done before at the point that you were doing it before. And it was done in great games that you likely enjoyed, so your criticism is rather unfair. Where the enemy is from is not what makes a game good or bad.

I suppose it's an unfair criticism if you believe that originality has no place in a video game. But I don't.

[QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.monty_4256

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

every gaming mechanic is exhausted, except quirky little minigame S tyle ones

I don't agree with you. I think there is still, and always will be, plenty of room for developers to be creative. Even games that do copy settings and scenarios generally have some twist or gimmick that makes them stand out from the crowd. The Conduit, from what I've seen so far, does not. The only reason I think it stands out at the moment is because there's no competition for it, and because of the big talk from HV and IGN.

I'm not trying to say it will be a bad game, or give it any kind of judgement before it comes out. I reserve the right to change my mind after an actual review is written next year :) I'm just saying that from what I've seen so far, I can't find a reason to be interested.

[QUOTE="clicketyclick"][QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.presto7640

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

Cesar is saying that it was done before at the point that you were doing it before. And it was done in great games that you likely enjoyed, so your criticism is rather unfair. Where the enemy is from is not what makes a game good or bad.

I suppose it's an unfair criticism if you believe that originality has no place in a video game. But I don't.

It's unfair criticism if you accept that a game can have you shoot aliens and still be original.

[QUOTE="presto7640"][QUOTE="clicketyclick"][QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.clicketyclick

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

Cesar is saying that it was done before at the point that you were doing it before. And it was done in great games that you likely enjoyed, so your criticism is rather unfair. Where the enemy is from is not what makes a game good or bad.

I suppose it's an unfair criticism if you believe that originality has no place in a video game. But I don't.

It's unfair criticism if you accept that a game can have you shoot aliens and still be original.

A game with aliens could still be original of course. But there has to be something in the mix to make it new, and The Conduit doesn't have anything as far as I can tell. I don't see why that's an unfair criticism at all.

[QUOTE="monty_4256"][QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.presto7640

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

every gaming mechanic is exhausted, except quirky little minigame S tyle ones

I don't really consider aliens a game mechanic, they're more a part of the setting. And I don't agree with you. I think there is still, and always will be, plenty of room for developers to be creative. Even games that do copy settings and scenarios generally have some twist or gimmick that makes them stand out from the crowd. The Conduit, from what I've seen so far, does not. The only reason I think it stands out at the moment is because there's no competition for it, and because of the big talk from HV and IGN.

standing out is not about having a twist or gimmick, if they stand out for that reason then they get nowhere, games like dark sector, battle field bad company, crisis, half life 2 all show that, even tho some are AMAZING games, it's not due to their little gimmicks that they are that way

a great game is onlyachievedthrough refining the fundamental mechanics of it's genre, creating new genre's is fine, as long as they do it well. COD4 did NOT have a twist or gimmick, and is revered as the best FPS at the moment (I'd disagree since it's lousy and boring), mario galaxy is revered as the best platformer ever, only because platformers ar ethere to offer varying challenges in large abundance, they did that second to none. the RPG genre has gone slightly stagnent in japan, because it's not evolving, but it's got nothing but gimmicks added into it at the moment.

I'm just saying twist aren't right, refining of core gameplay is

[QUOTE="presto7640"][QUOTE="monty_4256"][QUOTE="presto7640"]

[QUOTE="Cesar_Barba"][QUOTE="presto7640"]I just don't see anything to get excited about yet. Run around and shoot aliens...I think I've done that before.monty_4256

I guess I'm not sure what you mean either. I was trying to say that the idea is already exhausted, so it's hard to get excited about this game. You would seem to agree, I guess?

every gaming mechanic is exhausted, except quirky little minigame S tyle ones

I don't really consider aliens a game mechanic, they're more a part of the setting. And I don't agree with you. I think there is still, and always will be, plenty of room for developers to be creative. Even games that do copy settings and scenarios generally have some twist or gimmick that makes them stand out from the crowd. The Conduit, from what I've seen so far, does not. The only reason I think it stands out at the moment is because there's no competition for it, and because of the big talk from HV and IGN.

standing out is not about having a twist or gimmick, if they stand out for that reason then they get nowhere, games like dark sector, battle field bad company, crisis, half life 2 all show that, even tho some are AMAZING games, it's not due to their little gimmicks that they are that way

a great game is onlyachievedthrough refining the fundamental mechanics of it's genre, creating new genre's is fine, as long as they do it well. COD4 did NOT have a twist or gimmick, and is revered as the best FPS at the moment (I'd disagree since it's lousy and boring), mario galaxy is revered as the best platformer ever, only because platformers ar ethere to offer varying challenges in large abundance, they did that second to none. the RPG genre has gone slightly stagnent in japan, because it's not evolving, but it's got nothing but gimmicks added into it at the moment.

I'm just saying twist aren't right, refining of core gameplay is

Now I think we're misunderstanding each other. I didn't mean 'gimmick' as a cheap tacked on control or something. I guess the word has an unwarranted negative connotation. For instance, the WiiMote IS a gimmick in my mind, but that doesn't mean that it's bad.

I agree that refined gameplay is key, but I don't know how you can deny that being able to separate your game from the crowd isn't as important. I don't want to play the same game a million times, it's as simple as that.

A game with aliens could still be original of course. But there has to be something in the mix to make it new, and The Conduit doesn't have anything as far as I can tell. I don't see why that's an unfair criticism at all.

presto7640

You're criticising the very fact that the game has you shooting aliens, using that as evidence that the game is unoriginal. But those times you've "done that before", it had also been done before. I don't think the game has an original line of code in it (:P) but that you're shooting aliens again is the least of my concerns.

[QUOTE="presto7640"]

A game with aliens could still be original of course. But there has to be something in the mix to make it new, and The Conduit doesn't have anything as far as I can tell. I don't see why that's an unfair criticism at all.

clicketyclick

You're criticising the very fact that the game has you shooting aliens, using that as evidence that the game is unoriginal. But those times you've "done that before", it had also been done before. I don't think the game has an original line of code in it (:P) but that you're shooting aliens again is the least of my concerns.

I'm having a hard time grasping your argument against me. You're saying that because I've done it before I should just be content to keep on doing it? Even if it was fun then, the fact that I've 'done it before' is the reason it has gotten old.

Yes, I'm using the aliens, and everything else I've seen about the game, as evidence that it is unoriginal and cliche. What else am I supposed to use? That's why I've been careful throughout my posts to use phrases like, 'from what I've seen so far' and 'as far as I can tell.' I'm not making a final judgement, just an educated guess.

Now I think we're misunderstanding each other. I didn't mean 'gimmick' as a cheap tacked on control or something. I guess the word has an unwarranted negative connotation. For instance, the WiiMote IS a gimmick in my mind, but that doesn't mean that it's bad.

I agree that refined gameplay is key, but I don't know how you can deny that being able to separate your game from the crowd isn't as important. I don't want to play the same game a million times, it's as simple as that.

presto7640

yeah we are misunderstanding eachother, I was saying that seperating yourself from a crowd by having great core gameplay is key, not by some other gimmick. and I know what you meant, which is why I mentioned half life 2, which has the gravity gun ,and basically single handedly shaped modern physics engines, but no one would have noticed had the game have pushed the gravity gun as it's only idea. Take the gravity gun away and you've still got a great game

[QUOTE="presto7640"]

Now I think we're misunderstanding each other. I didn't mean 'gimmick' as a cheap tacked on control or something. I guess the word has an unwarranted negative connotation. For instance, the WiiMote IS a gimmick in my mind, but that doesn't mean that it's bad.

I agree that refined gameplay is key, but I don't know how you can deny that being able to separate your game from the crowd isn't as important. I don't want to play the same game a million times, it's as simple as that.

monty_4256

yeah we are misunderstanding eachother, I was saying that seperating yourself from a crowd by having great core gameplay is key, not by some other gimmick. and I know what you meant, which is why I mentioned half life 2, which has the gravity gun ,and basically single handedly shaped modern physics engines, but no one would have noticed had the game have pushed the gravity gun as it's only idea. Take the gravity gun away and you've still got a great game

Ah, I'm with you now :) but I think we still have the same disagreement. If Half Life 2 didn't have the gravity gun, but still retained all its other great qualities, then other developers could easily use it as a model, copying its methods for use in their own games. Now we have a bunch of Half Life 2 clones, and for me that means a bunch of stale games, even though they all have great gameplay. They're just too similar. But, if one of those clones introduces a cool new gravity gun, now it's something to get excited about.

High Voltage has talked about how they copied controls from other games on Wii that have worked well, and I don't have a problem with that, but they need to introduce their own ideas as well. They need their own nifty 'gravity gun' and their little ASE thingy just isn't cutting it for me.