Ok people, you want better third-party support?

1. Stop the bad games from selling! I doubt any of you are supporting all of Wii's shovelware, but many people are. If you have any freinds or relatives with a Wii, tell them about the games they should buy. If you're at the store and you see some mom deciding what to get her kid, help her out and prevent the possible purchase of carnival games. I suggest just making a list of all the good games and leave lying around the Wii section at your local stores.

2. Support the good games. Give Okami a shot, port or not. Stop judging Boom Blox by it's colorfull skin. Don't bash the conduit's graphics before we've even seen footage. And don't just support them by buying them, although that is the best way. Hype the games on the web, send emails to the developer showing your support, every little bit counts.

3. Contact Nintendo. You may be surprised to discover they actually have a heart, for a company. Even though the Hardcore are in the minority, they are working their hardest to fix our storage problems. They care about us. If we start emailing them by the millions, i'm sure they will consider buying us some exclusives or something of the like. Who knows, they may even raise the bar of quality so that a game actually has to work to be on Wii.

1. Stop the bad games from selling! I doubt any of you are supporting all of Wii's shovelware, but many people are. If you have any freinds or relatives with a Wii, tell them about the games they should buy. If you're at the store and you see some mom deciding what to get her kid, help her out and prevent the possible purchase of carnival games. I suggest just making a list of all the good games and leave lying around the Wii section at your local stores.

Head_of_games

I just want to say that most shovelware doesn't sell well. At all. As in, a game like Ninjabread Man has sold around 30,000 copies (which is nothing for a video game these days).

I did a whole thread about this actually. Most shovelware games fail, contrary to popular belief.

1. Stop the bad games from selling! I doubt any of you are supporting all of Wii's shovelware, but many people are. If you have any freinds or relatives with a Wii, tell them about the games they should buy. If you're at the store and you see some mom deciding what to get her kid, help her out and prevent the possible purchase of carnival games. I suggest just making a list of all the good games and leave lying around the Wii section at your local stores.

2. Support the good games. Give Okami a shot, port or not. Stop judging Boom Blox by it's colorfull skin. Don't bash the conduit's graphics before we've even seen footage. And don't just support them by buying them, although that is the best way. Hype the games on the web, send emails to the developer showing your support, every little bit counts.

3. Contact Nintendo. You may be surprised to discover they actually have a heart, for a company. Even though the Hardcore are in the minority, they are working their hardest to fix our storage problems. They care about us. If we start emailing them by the millions, i'm sure they will consider buying us some exclusives or something of the like. Who knows, they may even raise the bar of quality so that a game actually has to work to be on Wii.

Head_of_games

Have you ever played carnival games?

I did a whole thread about this actually. Most shovelware games fail, contrary to popular belief.

bob_newman

Yeah, but if a game costs $100 to make they're still making money off of it... well that's an exaggeration, but don't a lot of shovelware games end up profitable due to their low development costs?

We have fairly good third party support. We just dont have big name titles like Assassin's creed or GTA4.

The biggest thing that might help third party support is WiiWare. Many third party titles on WiiWare look better than retail Wii games, graphically, and concept wise.

We have fairly good third party support.

Haziqonfire

[QUOTE="bob_newman"]

I did a whole thread about this actually. Most shovelware games fail, contrary to popular belief.

Funkyhamster

Yeah, but if a game costs $100 to make they're still making money off of it... well that's an exaggeration, but don't a lot of shovelware games end up profitable due to their low development costs?

Yep, but it's not an epidemic like people make it out to be. I don't see anything wrong with smaller companies putting out crappy shovelware titles, because:

1) They don't have the funding to make a better game. These companies are usually just starting off, so they don't have the millions of dollars to fund a AAA title.

2) They need the money. When they make sales, they get more funding for their next game. Eventually, some of these companies will turn out good enough games that a bigger publisher will buy them out and use their franchises, as well as their dev teams, to make better games in the future.

3) If you're not buying them, they don't affect your life, or your gaming purchases at all. All they do is sit there on the shelf. I made a thread a while back about how shovelware doesn't affect your gaming experience in any way, so it shouldn't matter if they sit on the shelf. As it turned out, a lot of people responded by being shallow and saying "but I just don't want my good games sitting next to the crappy ones" as if it makes those games look worse or something. Really, they're just embarrassed because someone might see them when they go into a store and pick up a game that is sitting next to Anubis II. It's shallow, and that's all there is to it.

4) These games actually make some kids happy. Typically, these games are incredibly simplistic, which is a perfect fit for a child who has never played a game before and doesn't have the knowledge or dexterity to press 5-button combos.

In fact, here's a little quote from Amazon.com from a kid who owns Ninjabread man:

" My mom got this for me as last minute Christmas gift, when she found out that I'd purchased a wii for myself. It's a cute game. Basically you are the Ninjabread Man and you have to save Candy Land from being taken over by evil cupcakes & such. I give it 3 stars because it's hard to control him. He never swings his sword when he needs to and always ends up being killed. It's annoying and I haven't been able to get past the first level. You have to use both controllers and you use your left hand to make Ninjabread Man jump, so that took some getting used to. :o( Also the camera angle gets weird lot and I find myself pressing the down button on the d-pad frequently to see where I'm going. Perhaps I need more practice. I will update this when I get a better feel for the game. I've only had it a few days."

So as you can see, the only negative things about these games come from out of the "hardcore" gamer's mouth.

I basically agree with him (the forum starter). It doesn't make much sense to sit around all day b-s'ing to other Hardcore gamers why there isn't enough games that you like on the Wii. You all need to contact your favorite companies and tell them to cut the crap.

I don't know how far suggested idea's go, but so far many of the obviously awesome things that the Wii can do are overlooked and forgotten about. The Wii is way below it's potential.

DO SOMETHING PEOPLE!

[QUOTE="Head_of_games"]

1. Stop the bad games from selling! I doubt any of you are supporting all of Wii's shovelware, but many people are. If you have any freinds or relatives with a Wii, tell them about the games they should buy. If you're at the store and you see some mom deciding what to get her kid, help her out and prevent the possible purchase of carnival games. I suggest just making a list of all the good games and leave lying around the Wii section at your local stores.

bob_newman

I just want to say that most shovelware doesn't sell well. At all. As in, a game like Ninjabread Man has sold around 30,000 copies (which is nothing for a video game these days).

I did a whole thread about this actually. Most shovelware games fail, contrary to popular belief.

yeah but the amount of money to produce would probably allow them to make profit if they sold 10,000

the hardcore are not in the minorityCyber-

I disagree completly but I guess we're just two Wii owners that differ.

[QUOTE="Cyber-"]the hardcore are not in the minorityLyphe2k

I disagree completly but I guess we're just two Wii owners that differ.

lol if hardcore weren't the minority then they wouldn't be the hardcore...

the hardcore are not in the minorityCyber-

Can you elaborate a bit? I know the thread creator just said the opposite without any kind of elaboration, but I think it's generally accepted that the "hardcore" are the minority of gamers. We obviously can't put a number on a "hardcore vs. casual" ratio, since neither term is adaquately defined. I'm just curious about why you think hardcore gamers are in the majority.

I say we should all go in a group to Japan, stand outside Iwata's house with picket signs saying"Wii want better third party support!" We could also sing songs and whatnot. We could also say, "What do Wii (put stress when you say Wii) want? Better third party support! When do Wii want it? Now!" We could also do it like they did in Futurama: "What do Wii want? Better third party support! When do Wii want it? Better third party support!" We could also go on food strikes and burn giant piles of Brain Age games to show him we mean business. We could also hold Reggie hostage. The only problem is... I don't think too many of us knows Japanese...

i think hardcore players must be divided in sub-categories

hardcore overall player (own in every game he gets(any console)

hardcore consoller player (own in every game of a specific console)

hardcore genre gamer (own in a specific genre)

hardcore game player (own in a specific title(the sequel/prequel included)(generally the favorite game or the only one he/she possesses)

We could also go on food strikes and burn giant piles of Brain Age games to show him we mean business.Jakendo

I'd have to steal one of those copies before we burn them. ;)

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think they have shovelware habits of their own.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.nintendoboy16

No, there's a big difference here. Those games all had exceptional development time and funding. Nintendo didn't just say, "Let's put no effort into these games and just release them to make a quick buck."

An argument could be made for the Wii version of Twilight Princess as shovelware, but that's only if you bought both the GC and Wii version. If you never played the GC version, there's no problem with it being on the Wii. And you can't argue that the GC version is shovelware.

Super Paper Mario might have originated on the GC hardware, but it's still a quality game. They didn't even make this a simple port. It's not available on the GC. The Wii version is still top-notch quality.

I can't say much for Barrel Blast since I haven't played it. I think it just doesn't look like that much fun. Doesn't mean it's shovelware.

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think so.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

nintendoboy16

According to your logic Super Mario Galaxy is shovelware.

Also Super Paper Mario is far from shovelware. Zelda TP cant be considerd shovelware since it got good scores. The only shovelware games I can think of are Barrel Blast, PBR, and maybe Wii Play and those games are actually pretty decent.

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think so.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

Jakendo

According to your logic Super Mario Galaxy is shovelware.

Also Super Paper Mario is far from shovelware. Zelda TP cant be considerd shovelware since it got good scores. The only shovelware games I can think of are Barrel Blast, PBR, and maybe Wii Play and those games are actually pretty decent.

[QUOTE="Jakendo"][QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think so.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

nintendoboy16

According to your logic Super Mario Galaxy is shovelware.

Also Super Paper Mario is far from shovelware. Zelda TP cant be considerd shovelware since it got good scores. The only shovelware games I can think of are Barrel Blast, PBR, and maybe Wii Play and those games are actually pretty decent.

No. Dont confuse ports with shovelware. Shovelware are generally bad games that are made to get a quick buck.

[QUOTE="Jakendo"][QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think so.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

nintendoboy16

According to your logic Super Mario Galaxy is shovelware.

Also Super Paper Mario is far from shovelware. Zelda TP cant be considerd shovelware since it got good scores. The only shovelware games I can think of are Barrel Blast, PBR, and maybe Wii Play and those games are actually pretty decent.

Since when Super Paper Mario was on GameCube first? It could have been in developement when the GameCube was still there but it's not a port. It's a full-fledged Wii game. It's like saying that Final Fantasy 7 is a port because the development began on N64.

I don't think you know what's the meaning of shovelware. Shovelware are games like NinjaBread Man or Anubis II. Okami is really not a shovelware. Zelda: TP is not a shovelware.

[QUOTE="nintendoboy16"][QUOTE="Jakendo"][QUOTE="nintendoboy16"]

I haven't bought the Wii Version of TP, I know that's shovelware. (A GC port) So Nintendo could do a little better in shovelware, and you guys don't think so.

Nintendo's shovelware:

Zelda: Twilight Princess

Super Paper Mario

DK: Barrel Blast

I know these are shovelware, because they were supposed to be on the Gamecube first.

Jakendo

According to your logic Super Mario Galaxy is shovelware.

Also Super Paper Mario is far from shovelware. Zelda TP cant be considerd shovelware since it got good scores. The only shovelware games I can think of are Barrel Blast, PBR, and maybe Wii Play and those games are actually pretty decent.

No. Dont confuse ports with shovelware. Shovelware are generally bad games that are made to get a quick buck.

yeah shovelware refers to games that have no effort put into them whatso ever

Eh, personally, I think we have enough third party support. Anything more than what we currently have, and I wouldn't have the time nor money to buy all of the must-have games.

Even good games can be shovelware.nintendoboy16

I think you underestimate how hard it is to port a game, how long it takes to do it, and how tricky it is to make it work.

[QUOTE="Cyber-"]the hardcore are not in the minorityJordanElek

Can you elaborate a bit? I know the thread creator just said the opposite without any kind of elaboration, but I think it's generally accepted that the "hardcore" are the minority of gamers. We obviously can't put a number on a "hardcore vs. casual" ratio, since neither term is adaquately defined. I'm just curious about why you think hardcore gamers are in the majority.

based on every good selling game evn games like Wii Play and Sonic and Mario have huge hardcore draws.

based on every good selling game evn games like Wii Play and Sonic and Mario have huge hardcore draws.Cyber-

That may be true, but I don't see how that shows that there are more hardcore gamers than casual (if we're going to use those terms).

...unless you're saying that there are more hardcore games, not necessarily more hardcore gamers. But the topic creator was talking about gamers, so.....

[QUOTE="Cyber-"]based on every good selling game evn games like Wii Play and Sonic and Mario have huge hardcore draws.JordanElek

That may be true, but I don't see how that shows that there are more hardcore gamers than casual (if we're going to use those terms).

...unless you're saying that there are more hardcore games, not necessarily more hardcore gamers. But the topic creator was talking about gamers, so.....

there wouldnt be so many high selling games of this type if it was just a small minority of hardcores.

Wait, someone is saying we should support third party sales by picking up that broken Okami port?

He are winner!

Maybe Nintendo just needs to get more aggressive like MS and Sony where 3rd parties are concerned.

1) I don't buy the carnival/shovel ware games. 2) I am not about to hype Conduit(or games like it) until it looks or sounds like it really needs to be hyped. I may as well hype the carnival games if I am going to hype something I don't think really looks that great so far. 3) There's no need to contact Nintendo, because they are fully aware of what is going on and they do know that in the long run, it could affect the Wii's reputation.

[QUOTE="JordanElek"]

[QUOTE="Cyber-"]based on every good selling game evn games like Wii Play and Sonic and Mario have huge hardcore draws.Cyber-

That may be true, but I don't see how that shows that there are more hardcore gamers than casual (if we're going to use those terms).

...unless you're saying that there are more hardcore games, not necessarily more hardcore gamers. But the topic creator was talking about gamers, so.....

there wouldnt be so many high selling games of this type if it was just a small minority of hardcores.

Wait, someone is saying we should support third party sales by picking up that broken Okami port?

He are winner!

Jaysonguy

1. Stop the bad games from selling!

Head_of_games

[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]

Wait, someone is saying we should support third party sales by picking up that broken Okami port?

He are winner!

Haziqonfire

LOl I know its one little thing. Yes its dissappointing but its not game breaking. Other than that the game looks nicer, it controls better overall, and you can skip teh cutscenes.

In fact, here's a little quote from Amazon.com from a kid who owns Ninjabread man:

" My mom got this for me as last minute Christmas gift, when she found out that I'd purchased a wii for myself. It's a cute game. Basically you are the Ninjabread Man and you have to save Candy Land from being taken over by evil cupcakes & such. I give it 3 stars because it's hard to control him. He never swings his sword when he needs to and always ends up being killed. It's annoying and I haven't been able to get past the first level. You have to use both controllers and you use your left hand to make Ninjabread Man jump, so that took some getting used to. :o( Also the camera angle gets weird lot and I find myself pressing the down button on the d-pad frequently to see where I'm going. Perhaps I need more practice. I will update this when I get a better feel for the game. I've only had it a few days."

So as you can see, the only negative things about these games come from out of the "hardcore" gamer's mouth.

bob_newman

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but... you didn't do enough research. If you look at the "comments" page for that Amazon review, you'll find this:

From the way your review sounded this game sounds like total garbage. How is it fun if the character doesn't respond to your commands?! I get really pissed off when a game refuses to respond and they never end up with good reviews. You don't need more practice, you need to get your money back for this garbage, because from what I've heard about it, it is regarded as one of the worst games to date on the Wii.

as it turned out, the kid actually AGREED. Have a look at her response:

You're right actually, I haven't even picked up again.

moral of the story: ALWAYS get your facts straight.

NinjaBreadMan is my second favorite game on the Wii next to MP3. I can't believe this game gets such a bad rep...I totally don't understand?

haha, all jokes aside...

I just don't buy crap games if I don't want them. It's a simple solution I find effective both cost wise, and it's less irritating as a gamer.

and by the way...DK64>DKBB

ALWAYS get your facts straight.

benjaminjoel

Fair enough.

Though that wasn't my main argument, just an aside.

I'm gonna say.... I'm fine with the wii's 3rd party :shock:.

1.) try telling the little kids and parents that aren't on video games forums that. Cause that is mainly who is buying it. And I don't really see a problem it's there money not mine.

2.) people on these forums are supporting these games cause they know about them. If your not on these forums most likely you wouldn't have heard about okami or no more heroes, or zack and wiki. This is the case cause of the horrible sales they managed.

3.) What's nintendo gonna do? this is 3rd party not 1st they can't really go over to lets say capcom and do there jobs for them. I think that would make the game 1st party.

Be happy with what you have, I'm seeing tons of great 3rd party being released. And there is a bunch more coming this year. I mean there is okami right now (not buying it cause I got the original) but greatness is out there and there is plenty.

People say Nintendo put work into these games, they did not do a good job with these two mostly.

Zelda: TP's problem- A bare flick of the Wii mote and Link swings his sword no matter what direction.

DK: Barrel Blasts problem- terrible Wii controls through the whole fluppin game.