Sonic is Dead
This topic is locked from further discussion.
To Quote Darth Vader: "I find your Lack of Faith Disturbing".
Im a Sonic fanboy, i admit, in fact i even worked for Sega for a few years before my job got cut after sony drove us out of the console game, and ill also admit he has been slipping over the pasy few years, but SaTSR gave me hope he can be saved. Rush Adventure look very promising, The Advebture were good, i even liked Shadows game...........but ill say it, even i thought Sonic riders was a dumb idea.......
eather lower your expectations or don't bother with the blue blur anymore, simple as that.
It's true. Unless there is some kind of revitalization in the near future, I'm afraid that Sonic has lost all of his appeal to real gamers.
My girlfriend's little brother, who's 12 and autistic, still loves him, though, because the games are super easy and only require one button.
I'm not sure where i stand on the sonic subject because, ive only ever played 3 sonic games.
Sonic Heroes
Sonic Adventure 2: Battle
Sonic Riders
The fact that its only three isnt the reason. The reason is, I loved Sonic Adventure 2, thought Sonic Heroes was OK, and hated Sonic Riders.So...I guess it just varies. It wouldn't hurt to try the next one though.
sonic will never die because of the first games!!! frosty_sharkSonic will never die he will cling on to life just to spite us
Sonic needs to either die or retire. The same could be said of Megaman. :(
I use to be a Sonic fan back when the genisis games came out. But one faithful day, I was given Shadow, and the fanboy in me died that very day.
If I have to stomach another gut-wrenching 3D spinoff Sonic game, I'm just going to kill everyone. To all that buy/bought any 3D Sonic games, shame on you. Buy a Genesis and see what Sonic really is. (Or download it on the wii) These are the games that started it and these are the best ones period. The very second Sonic went to 3D, the games started to shrink rapidly in quality, depth, and overally awesomeness. YES, I did by Sonic Adventure 2 on the GC. YES it sucked really really bad. If anything, get the GBA or DS Sonic games. These seem to be the only current versions of sonic worth anything mentioning. Sonic Riders 2. Gee, I wonder what kind of score it will get. I'll take a random stab and say 7.2. You can quote me if you want. I hate you so much Shadow, so much... :evil:starfox157.2? on gamespot? i wont quote you but i can bet money it wont get it.
Ever since they put Shadow into the mix its just been downhill from there....shadow hogs all the spotlight in adventure 2 and if you ask me he truly ruined the series.
Shadow the hedgehog (SUCKED)
Sonic the hedgehog 360(SUCKED BECAUSE HE MADE OUT WITH THE PRINCESS AT THE END)
Sonic Adventure Battle 2(Ugh...this is where they screwed it up SUCKED)
Hopefully Sonic will be able to stay alive by relying on the Sonic Rush series on the DS(Anyone other than me notice that Sonic Rush wasn't made by Sonic team when all the other crap 3D games were?) Though Secret Rings was pretty good.
--
First of all, I'm not claiming my opinion as fact, and I'm not saying that good or bad review scores are always indicitive of a game's quality. Average scores are a safer bet than using just one source, but they are not universal. Please don't comment unless you have read the entire post. Negative and positive comments and suggestions will be taken seriously, so long as you have some sort of backing for your claims.
Listed are all of the Sonic games and their Gamerankings scores starting from the launch of the Dreamcast. The scores are rounded to the nearest whole number and the higher score was taken for the multiplatform titles. They have been broken down into categories..
A lot of people say that "all 3D Sonic games are bad", or "Sonic doesn't belong in 3D". I don't see it:
Sonic Adventure-87%
Sonic Adventure 2-84%
Sonic Heroes-74%
Sonic and the Secret Rings-71%
Sonic the Hedgehog-46%
I see two great games, two good games, and one bad game.
The Sonic Adventure (Dreamcast versions, we'll get to the Gamecube ports later, along with Shadow the Hedgehog) games, while not without flaws, were simply awesome. People seem to forget that Sonic's first ventures into an entirely 3D world were very successful. The cla*sic Sonic atmosphere was there, but it felt fresh and new. There hadn't been a true Sonic platformer on a console since Sonic CD. The levels and gameplay modes were varied and interesting.
Heroes was a very good game, but a lot of people thought that it was weighed down by the over-use of other characters and somewhat limited gameplay. It wasn't very difficult, and controls became an issue at some points. The game relied too heavily on the abilities of Tails and Knuckles, and they seemed to slow Sonic down at times. Still, it recieved generally favorable reviews and turned out to be a very good game. The narrow level design eliminated a lot of camera issues without taking away from the game's sense of speed.
Secret Rings was a good game as well, but it was just a little too simplified. It was basically a run-and-jump game with back-tracking issues. It took hits from the critics for the story, sound track, voice acting, and the annoying "helper" similar to Navi the Fairy from Ocarina of Time. The only gameplay-related issues were regarding the few times when you had to go backwards through the levels. The on-rails approach completely destroyed the camera issues, and the Wii Remote control seemed ideal for it.
Even Sonic '06 wasn't terrible, per se, but it had a lot of flaws that should have been fixed in the series long ago. The camera, controls, acting, storyline, and other things were as dated as ever, (although slightly improved over Shadow) but this game also included annoying puzzle elements among other things. A good time can be had with the game by hardcore fans, but it does not live up to the name of its predecessors.
Handheld Sonic has been nothing short of outstanding:
Sonic Advance 2-85%
Sonic Advance-84%
Sonic Rush-83%
Sonic Advance 3-80%
Not a whole lot needs to be said about these games. 2D Sonic games are as strong as they've ever been. Sonic Advance was one of the most praised series on the Game Boy Advance, and Sonic Rush was pretty much an extension of it.
It's been the ports, compilations, and spin-offs that have given the series a bad name (which is Sega's fault), and even then, most of the games have been at least decent, and some of them ave been great.
Sonic Advance and Sonic Pinball Combo Pack-80% (compilation)
Sonic Pinball Party-79% (spin-off)
Sonic Mega Collection-76% (compilation)
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle-72% (port)
Sonic Battle-70% (spin-off)
Sonic Gems Collection-66% (compilation)
Sonic Rivals-66% (spin-off)
Sonic Adventure DX-63% (port)
Sonic Riders-62% (spin off)
Sonic Shuffle-57% (spin off)
Shadow the Hedgehog-53% (spin-off)
Sonic the Hedgehog Genesis-33% (port)
The two compilations of older games cannot really be judged by today's standards. They contain wonderful games such as Sonic CD, Sonic 2, Sonic 3, and Sonic and Knuckles. They scored low because some publications find it hard to justify paying 30+ dollars for 10-20 year old games (plus the Game Gear games look terrible on a fullscreen TV).
Sonic Battle and Pinball Party were spin-offs, but they kept the Sonic feel and turned out to be pretty good games. They were about as deep as a pinball game and a fighting game on GBA could be.
Rivals tried something new, and succeeded to some extent. The side-scrolling multiplayer racer had never really been done before. The game layed a nice foundation that is sure to be improved upon in Sonic Rivals 2 (shown at E3).
The Gamecube ports scored low because they failed to improve upon the well-documented flaws of the Dreamcast games. DX had a lot of space-filler in between levels that genuinely took away from the gameplay experience, but it still includes the wonderful aspects of the original game. SA2:Battle suffered the same fate as DX. This time, however, a lot of the problems came from being forced into boring and tedious levels away from the main game and main characters (Big the Cat fishing FTL). Most reviews of both games agree that they were still good games, but they scored lower because they failed to improve (and in some cases made worse) the camera and sound issues from the Dreamcast games. Still, these games are definitely worth a purchase if you don't own a Dreamcast.
Sonic Riders and Sonic Shuffle are poor attempts at copying Mario Kart and Mario Party. Riders suffers from minor control issues and a flawed trick system which may end up knocking you off of your "GEAR". Shuffle was a Dreamcast minigame compilation. It suffered from ridiculous load times, lack of variety, and camera issues (sound familiar?). Both games can be very fun if you're playing with friends or in short bursts.
There is no excuse for Shadow the Hedgehog. Not only does it fail to improve upon the old flaws of the series, it introduces new ones. The camera, controls, story, and acting are terrible. It's like controlling Sonic '06, but downhill and on roller-skates, yet somehow slightly slower. The gun system is totally useless and it's very difficult to complete even basic takes due to the movement problems. Again, if you are willing to look past all the flaws, it can be pretty fun. But that doesn't excuse it from bringing down Sonic's good name.
Sonic Genesis was a sloppy port of the original Sonic the Hedgehog game. It was basically the same game, but the GBA version suffered from such terrible view perspectives and frame rates that players would often find themselves falling to their demises before they even realized it. Easily the only game in the series that offers absolutely nothing to anyone.
When talking about the Sonic series, people seem to focus on the bad rather than the good, and there is plenty of good to be found. It seems that people blindly follow the numbers associated with the review scores rather than the content of the reviews themselves. The majority of the series' problems rest in camera issues (resolved somewhat in Heroes and Secret Rings), voice acting, sound tracks, storylines (who plays Sonic for the story anyways?) and controls (only in Sonic '06 and Shadow).
To judge an entire series based on what is mostly a few bad ports and spin-offs with a few sub-par entries in the main series is ridiculous. There are still plenty of quality Sonic games to be found. If you don't like one of the games in the series, there's a simple solution: ignore it instead of trashing an entire series over it. It's perfectly fine to dislike Sonic the Hedgehog, because everyone has different tastes. But to bash the series and dismiss each game as bad is totally ridiculous, because the general consensus around the gaming industry is positive.
[QUOTE="jmangafan"][QUOTE="starfox15"]All due respect, Mario has some games to answer to as well. I'm looking at you, Sunshine and Luigi's Mansion.leegar88
Super Mario Sunshine > Luigi's Mansion > Super Mario 64
Woah :o this threads about to get ugly.
If worse comes to worse, I'll defend my opinion. But this is a thread about the decline of quality in Sonic titles. So, I'm going to hope it remains on track.
BTW, SmashBrosLegend, thats the most well thought out thing on Sonic yet. Aside from me disliking SA1 and SA2 regardless, I don't think Sonic is totally dead, you make a great point as the handheld titles have kicked some major ass.
That's ridiculous. I know I've posted this before, but I think it needs to be said again.
--
First of all, I'm not claiming my opinion as fact, and I'm not saying that good or bad review scores are always indicitive of a game's quality. Average scores are a safer bet than using just one source, but they are not universal. Please don't comment unless you have read the entire post. Negative and positive comments and suggestions will be taken seriously, so long as you have some sort of backing for your claims.
Listed are all of the Sonic games and their Gamerankings scores starting from the launch of the Dreamcast. The scores are rounded to the nearest whole number and the higher score was taken for the multiplatform titles. They have been broken down into categories..
A lot of people say that "all 3D Sonic games are bad", or "Sonic doesn't belong in 3D". I don't see it:
Sonic Adventure-87%
Sonic Adventure 2-84%
Sonic Heroes-74%
Sonic and the Secret Rings-71%
Sonic the Hedgehog-46%
I see two great games, two good games, and one bad game.
The Sonic Adventure (Dreamcast versions, we'll get to the Gamecube ports later, along with Shadow the Hedgehog) games, while not without flaws, were simply awesome. People seem to forget that Sonic's first ventures into an entirely 3D world were very successful. The cla*sic Sonic atmosphere was there, but it felt fresh and new. There hadn't been a true Sonic platformer on a console since Sonic CD. The levels and gameplay modes were varied and interesting.
Heroes was a very good game, but a lot of people thought that it was weighed down by the over-use of other characters and somewhat limited gameplay. It wasn't very difficult, and controls became an issue at some points. The game relied too heavily on the abilities of Tails and Knuckles, and they seemed to slow Sonic down at times. Still, it recieved generally favorable reviews and turned out to be a very good game. The narrow level design eliminated a lot of camera issues without taking away from the game's sense of speed.
Secret Rings was a good game as well, but it was just a little too simplified. It was basically a run-and-jump game with back-tracking issues. It took hits from the critics for the story, sound track, voice acting, and the annoying "helper" similar to Navi the Fairy from Ocarina of Time. The only gameplay-related issues were regarding the few times when you had to go backwards through the levels. The on-rails approach completely destroyed the camera issues, and the Wii Remote control seemed ideal for it.
Even Sonic '06 wasn't terrible, per se, but it had a lot of flaws that should have been fixed in the series long ago. The camera, controls, acting, storyline, and other things were as dated as ever, (although slightly improved over Shadow) but this game also included annoying puzzle elements among other things. A good time can be had with the game by hardcore fans, but it does not live up to the name of its predecessors.
Handheld Sonic has been nothing short of outstanding:
Sonic Advance 2-85%
Sonic Advance-84%
Sonic Rush-83%
Sonic Advance 3-80%
Not a whole lot needs to be said about these games. 2D Sonic games are as strong as they've ever been. Sonic Advance was one of the most praised series on the Game Boy Advance, and Sonic Rush was pretty much an extension of it.
It's been the ports, compilations, and spin-offs that have given the series a bad name (which is Sega's fault), and even then, most of the games have been at least decent, and some of them ave been great.
Sonic Advance and Sonic Pinball Combo Pack-80% (compilation)
Sonic Pinball Party-79% (spin-off)
Sonic Mega Collection-76% (compilation)
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle-72% (port)
Sonic Battle-70% (spin-off)
Sonic Gems Collection-66% (compilation)
Sonic Rivals-66% (spin-off)
Sonic Adventure DX-63% (port)
Sonic Riders-62% (spin off)
Sonic Shuffle-57% (spin off)
Shadow the Hedgehog-53% (spin-off)
Sonic the Hedgehog Genesis-33% (port)
The two compilations of older games cannot really be judged by today's standards. They contain wonderful games such as Sonic CD, Sonic 2, Sonic 3, and Sonic and Knuckles. They scored low because some publications find it hard to justify paying 30+ dollars for 10-20 year old games (plus the Game Gear games look terrible on a fullscreen TV).
Sonic Battle and Pinball Party were spin-offs, but they kept the Sonic feel and turned out to be pretty good games. They were about as deep as a pinball game and a fighting game on GBA could be.
Rivals tried something new, and succeeded to some extent. The side-scrolling multiplayer racer had never really been done before. The game layed a nice foundation that is sure to be improved upon in Sonic Rivals 2 (shown at E3).
The Gamecube ports scored low because they failed to improve upon the well-documented flaws of the Dreamcast games. DX had a lot of space-filler in between levels that genuinely took away from the gameplay experience, but it still includes the wonderful aspects of the original game. SA2:Battle suffered the same fate as DX. This time, however, a lot of the problems came from being forced into boring and tedious levels away from the main game and main characters (Big the Cat fishing FTL). Most reviews of both games agree that they were still good games, but they scored lower because they failed to improve (and in some cases made worse) the camera and sound issues from the Dreamcast games. Still, these games are definitely worth a purchase if you don't own a Dreamcast.
Sonic Riders and Sonic Shuffle are poor attempts at copying Mario Kart and Mario Party. Riders suffers from minor control issues and a flawed trick system which may end up knocking you off of your "GEAR". Shuffle was a Dreamcast minigame compilation. It suffered from ridiculous load times, lack of variety, and camera issues (sound familiar?). Both games can be very fun if you're playing with friends or in short bursts.
There is no excuse for Shadow the Hedgehog. Not only does it fail to improve upon the old flaws of the series, it introduces new ones. The camera, controls, story, and acting are terrible. It's like controlling Sonic '06, but downhill and on roller-skates, yet somehow slightly slower. The gun system is totally useless and it's very difficult to complete even basic takes due to the movement problems. Again, if you are willing to look past all the flaws, it can be pretty fun. But that doesn't excuse it from bringing down Sonic's good name.
Sonic Genesis was a sloppy port of the original Sonic the Hedgehog game. It was basically the same game, but the GBA version suffered from such terrible view perspectives and frame rates that players would often find themselves falling to their demises before they even realized it. Easily the only game in the series that offers absolutely nothing to anyone.
When talking about the Sonic series, people seem to focus on the bad rather than the good, and there is plenty of good to be found. It seems that people blindly follow the numbers associated with the review scores rather than the content of the reviews themselves. The majority of the series' problems rest in camera issues (resolved somewhat in Heroes and Secret Rings), voice acting, sound tracks, storylines (who plays Sonic for the story anyways?) and controls (only in Sonic '06 and Shadow).
To judge an entire series based on what is mostly a few bad ports and spin-offs with a few sub-par entries in the main series is ridiculous. There are still plenty of quality Sonic games to be found. If you don't like one of the games in the series, there's a simple solution: ignore it instead of trashing an entire series over it. It's perfectly fine to dislike Sonic the Hedgehog, because everyone has different tastes. But to bash the series and dismiss each game as bad is totally ridiculous, because the general consensus around the gaming industry is positive.
SmashBrosLegend
Crap, wall of text. I don't want to read that but the Sonic games lately have been ass so they need to step up their game fast.
Crap, wall of text. I don't want to read that but the Sonic games lately have been ass so they need to step up their game fast.
Duckman5
*sigh*
Why bother quoting it and commenting if you didn't read it?
It is a thorough and subjective analysis of the entire Sonic series from the launch of the Dreamcast up until now. By Gamespot standards, it looks like this:
7 great games (8.0+)
6 good games (7.0+)
4 fair games (6.0+)
2 mediocre games (5.0+)
2 bad games (below 5)
The series, for the most part, has been good. The vast majority of them have been great or good, with some fair and mediocre, and a few bad. Read the post if you want to know why those games scored the way they did, rather than just looking at the numbers.
Sonic needs to either die or retire. The same could be said of Megaman. :(
I use to be a Sonic fan back when the genisis games came out. But one faithful day, I was given Shadow, and the fanboy in me died that very day.
dekasuperlink
Sonic and megaman will never die!!!!!!!!!! They will live on forever, for my children, and there children, and so forth!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[QUOTE="leegar88"][QUOTE="jmangafan"][QUOTE="starfox15"]All due respect, Mario has some games to answer to as well. I'm looking at you, Sunshine and Luigi's Mansion.jmangafan
Super Mario Sunshine > Luigi's Mansion > Super Mario 64
Woah :o this threads about to get ugly.
If worse comes to worse, I'll defend my opinion. But this is a thread about the decline of quality in Sonic titles. So, I'm going to hope it remains on track.
BTW, SmashBrosLegend, thats the most well thought out thing on Sonic yet. Aside from me disliking SA1 and SA2 regardless, I don't think Sonic is totally dead, you make a great point as the handheld titles have kicked some major ass.
I respect you opinion although personally it is Mario 64> Luigi's Mansion> sunshine in my book. But a lot of people will probably harshly disagree.
BTW, SmashBrosLegend, thats the most well thought out thing on Sonic yet. Aside from me disliking SA1 and SA2 regardless, I don't think Sonic is totally dead, you make a great point as the handheld titles have kicked some major ass.
jmangafan
Thank you for taking the time to read it.
That's ridiculous. I know I've posted this before, but I think it needs to be said again.
--
First of all, I'm not claiming my opinion as fact, and I'm not saying that good or bad review scores are always indicitive of a game's quality. Average scores are a safer bet than using just one source, but they are not universal. Please don't comment unless you have read the entire post. Negative and positive comments and suggestions will be taken seriously, so long as you have some sort of backing for your claims.
Listed are all of the Sonic games and their Gamerankings scores starting from the launch of the Dreamcast. The scores are rounded to the nearest whole number and the higher score was taken for the multiplatform titles. They have been broken down into categories..
A lot of people say that "all 3D Sonic games are bad", or "Sonic doesn't belong in 3D". I don't see it:
Sonic Adventure-87%
Sonic Adventure 2-84%
Sonic Heroes-74%
Sonic and the Secret Rings-71%
Sonic the Hedgehog-46%
I see two great games, two good games, and one bad game.
The Sonic Adventure (Dreamcast versions, we'll get to the Gamecube ports later, along with Shadow the Hedgehog) games, while not without flaws, were simply awesome. People seem to forget that Sonic's first ventures into an entirely 3D world were very successful. The cla*sic Sonic atmosphere was there, but it felt fresh and new. There hadn't been a true Sonic platformer on a console since Sonic CD. The levels and gameplay modes were varied and interesting.
Heroes was a very good game, but a lot of people thought that it was weighed down by the over-use of other characters and somewhat limited gameplay. It wasn't very difficult, and controls became an issue at some points. The game relied too heavily on the abilities of Tails and Knuckles, and they seemed to slow Sonic down at times. Still, it recieved generally favorable reviews and turned out to be a very good game. The narrow level design eliminated a lot of camera issues without taking away from the game's sense of speed.
Secret Rings was a good game as well, but it was just a little too simplified. It was basically a run-and-jump game with back-tracking issues. It took hits from the critics for the story, sound track, voice acting, and the annoying "helper" similar to Navi the Fairy from Ocarina of Time. The only gameplay-related issues were regarding the few times when you had to go backwards through the levels. The on-rails approach completely destroyed the camera issues, and the Wii Remote control seemed ideal for it.
Even Sonic '06 wasn't terrible, per se, but it had a lot of flaws that should have been fixed in the series long ago. The camera, controls, acting, storyline, and other things were as dated as ever, (although slightly improved over Shadow) but this game also included annoying puzzle elements among other things. A good time can be had with the game by hardcore fans, but it does not live up to the name of its predecessors.
Handheld Sonic has been nothing short of outstanding:
Sonic Advance 2-85%
Sonic Advance-84%
Sonic Rush-83%
Sonic Advance 3-80%
Not a whole lot needs to be said about these games. 2D Sonic games are as strong as they've ever been. Sonic Advance was one of the most praised series on the Game Boy Advance, and Sonic Rush was pretty much an extension of it.
It's been the ports, compilations, and spin-offs that have given the series a bad name (which is Sega's fault), and even then, most of the games have been at least decent, and some of them ave been great.
Sonic Advance and Sonic Pinball Combo Pack-80% (compilation)
Sonic Pinball Party-79% (spin-off)
Sonic Mega Collection-76% (compilation)
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle-72% (port)
Sonic Battle-70% (spin-off)
Sonic Gems Collection-66% (compilation)
Sonic Rivals-66% (spin-off)
Sonic Adventure DX-63% (port)
Sonic Riders-62% (spin off)
Sonic Shuffle-57% (spin off)
Shadow the Hedgehog-53% (spin-off)
Sonic the Hedgehog Genesis-33% (port)
The two compilations of older games cannot really be judged by today's standards. They contain wonderful games such as Sonic CD, Sonic 2, Sonic 3, and Sonic and Knuckles. They scored low because some publications find it hard to justify paying 30+ dollars for 10-20 year old games (plus the Game Gear games look terrible on a fullscreen TV).
Sonic Battle and Pinball Party were spin-offs, but they kept the Sonic feel and turned out to be pretty good games. They were about as deep as a pinball game and a fighting game on GBA could be.
Rivals tried something new, and succeeded to some extent. The side-scrolling multiplayer racer had never really been done before. The game layed a nice foundation that is sure to be improved upon in Sonic Rivals 2 (shown at E3).
The Gamecube ports scored low because they failed to improve upon the well-documented flaws of the Dreamcast games. DX had a lot of space-filler in between levels that genuinely took away from the gameplay experience, but it still includes the wonderful aspects of the original game. SA2:Battle suffered the same fate as DX. This time, however, a lot of the problems came from being forced into boring and tedious levels away from the main game and main characters (Big the Cat fishing FTL). Most reviews of both games agree that they were still good games, but they scored lower because they failed to improve (and in some cases made worse) the camera and sound issues from the Dreamcast games. Still, these games are definitely worth a purchase if you don't own a Dreamcast.
Sonic Riders and Sonic Shuffle are poor attempts at copying Mario Kart and Mario Party. Riders suffers from minor control issues and a flawed trick system which may end up knocking you off of your "GEAR". Shuffle was a Dreamcast minigame compilation. It suffered from ridiculous load times, lack of variety, and camera issues (sound familiar?). Both games can be very fun if you're playing with friends or in short bursts.
There is no excuse for Shadow the Hedgehog. Not only does it fail to improve upon the old flaws of the series, it introduces new ones. The camera, controls, story, and acting are terrible. It's like controlling Sonic '06, but downhill and on roller-skates, yet somehow slightly slower. The gun system is totally useless and it's very difficult to complete even basic takes due to the movement problems. Again, if you are willing to look past all the flaws, it can be pretty fun. But that doesn't excuse it from bringing down Sonic's good name.
Sonic Genesis was a sloppy port of the original Sonic the Hedgehog game. It was basically the same game, but the GBA version suffered from such terrible view perspectives and frame rates that players would often find themselves falling to their demises before they even realized it. Easily the only game in the series that offers absolutely nothing to anyone.
When talking about the Sonic series, people seem to focus on the bad rather than the good, and there is plenty of good to be found. It seems that people blindly follow the numbers associated with the review scores rather than the content of the reviews themselves. The majority of the series' problems rest in camera issues (resolved somewhat in Heroes and Secret Rings), voice acting, sound tracks, storylines (who plays Sonic for the story anyways?) and controls (only in Sonic '06 and Shadow).
To judge an entire series based on what is mostly a few bad ports and spin-offs with a few sub-par entries in the main series is ridiculous. There are still plenty of quality Sonic games to be found. If you don't like one of the games in the series, there's a simple solution: ignore it instead of trashing an entire series over it. It's perfectly fine to dislike Sonic the Hedgehog, because everyone has different tastes. But to bash the series and dismiss each game as bad is totally ridiculous, because the general consensus around the gaming industry is positive.
SmashBrosLegend
the 3d sonic games were given those initial scores because at the time it seemed like a great game, but look at it with a clearer set of eyes and those games will seem much worse...because they are exactly that. the only ppl to think of those games as good are super die-hard sonic fans that cant come to fact that 3d sonics are not sonic. sonic was made to go fastand his initial premise was built on speedbut the 3d sonic games have not only made him significantly slower, but they tried to turn him into mario by adding all these extra characters and by making you do puzzle based platformer sessions (that are 500 times slower than the already slower paced sonic levels). What they need to do to make a truly great sonic game is 1) skip the puzzles 2) kill off all the characters (except knuckles and tails, but you dont play as them) 3) change eggman back to robotnik (sounds cooler and more menacing) 4) give him more weight (sonic is too floaty and because of that the sense of speed is greatly diminished. look at the secret rings minus the bad camera) 5) put less enemies and less emphasis on enemies so you can concentrate more on speed. so yeah... (btw nice analysis. its good to see someone actually take the time to write a well thought out passage as opposed to the random fanboy-esque rantings and garbage uttered on the forums by ppl that dont think)
I respect you opinion although personally it is Mario 64> Luigi's Mansion> sunshine in my book. But a lot of people will probably harshly disagree.
leegar88
Nah, you're not alone there. I'm not sure why, but I didn't enjoy Sunshine as much as Mario 64 or Luigi's Mansion. It's still a good game, it just didn't strike me like the other two games. I don't mean to step on any toes either, just wanted to say you're not the only one that held those in that order.
As to the original topic, I haven't paid a whole lot of attention to the Sonic series lately. I will agree, however, that the handheld games seem to be of a higher quality than the 3d console games.
Guys we gotta let go of what we liked and get on with the new... some games arent ment to be.. just like some movie sequels, Sonic has been dying as well as Megaman, But I very seriously doubt they will make any good sonic games or megaman ones that will make us go 'WOW!!" cause lately they have been just been quickly thrown together piles of crap, Now I like Sonic and Megaman, but some things just need to die off, smacking a dead corpse around never solved anything. Most of the Sonic fan boys will choose to deny it all up and down.But true gamers know and realize those franchises have been dying and should be put the rest. Seriously though they need to pull the plug.EndlessPunisher
well, the 2d sonics are pretty good so he's not fully decimated...yet. but he will eventually become like megaman and come out with a new game every other week and then slowly die an agonizing death...so long as they dont go overboard with the sonic game production
[QUOTE="leegar88"]I respect you opinion although personally it is Mario 64> Luigi's Mansion> sunshine in my book. But a lot of people will probably harshly disagree.
FFXIsAstyanax
Nah, you're not alone there. I'm not sure why, but I didn't enjoy Sunshine as much as Mario 64 or Luigi's Mansion. It's still a good game, it just didn't strike me like the other two games. I don't mean to step on any toes either, just wanted to say you're not the only one that held those in that order.
As to the original topic, I haven't paid a whole lot of attention to the Sonic series lately. I will agree, however, that the handheld games seem to be of a higher quality than the 3d console games.
I think it is because how different sunshine was fromMario N64. In 64 the stageshad majordifferences, whilein sunshine theyall had some type of island vacation theme. And Luigi's Mansion wasn't a super mario game I haven't played it in a while but I think you couldn't even jumpwhen you wanted to, but the game was stillvery fun.Luckily from what I have seen so far smg has more diverse stages.
Yeahhh.. he was something great when the Genesis and Saturn were around.. now I really just don't care for him.Sants412same here
I really respect it when somebody takes the time to answer what I've started with something that is indeed well thought out and thorough. I'm also flattered that somebody from the head of a group would do so. The thesis you presented me with deserves a well thought out reply that quite frankly, I just can't do justice to. I'll take notice in the fact that while you pointed out some of my minor flaws in logic I'd point some out to you.
I'm sure you know that Sonic 1-3 are the best in the series. These games were made to take advantage of and capitalize on Genesis' ability to show what a fast game looks like. Sonic had other forays into other interesting games on the Genesis, Game Gear, CD, Saturn, Dreamcast, but none others with a few exceptions carried the white-knuckle(s) adrenaline that the first few gems inspired. Nintendo at the time just didn't have the technology capable of such high frame rate and processing power. (Which begs the question, where's the save feature Sega Genesis?)
Anyway, what I said earlier was blunt. To a fault. You can't deny the fact that going by what this very site says as well as other notable sources of video game reviews etc. point out. This is my opinion as well. New Sonic games, particularly in the 3 Dimensional perspective, just aren't as entertaining or overall as satisfying to play as the classics. This is in part due to technical glitches and an overall downfall of the classic video game. I would consider this a simple matter of opinion, because that's what most of this is anyway. I like apples, some like oranges. It's a matter of an opinion an any case and the market reflects that. Sonic's target audience is also of the younger prospectus and thusly, they don't carry such high expectations as I do. This is not to say anything ambiguous about the fans of Sonic either. I love Sonic, and Mario, and many other classic video game heroes. It's a sad shame when the game developers don't show that with most of the games that they release for these icons.
With that statement comes this quirky nature of the current video game pool of mediocrity. All current video games have taken quite a hit with quality. But with the bad also comes the good and I truly hope that Sonic comes back with a real winner in the near future. I want to see a Sonic game that gets awards. I want to like Sonic again. I want to see the current video game market swing more towards outstanding. But all that takes time and patience. Sadly, these are not virtues of most video game companies. (Video game delays anyone?) Speed to market and cash out big seems to be more the agenda. This seems to even be the case with the truly elite. Nintendo has done this, Sony has done this, Microsoft has done this.
Once again I'd like to thank everyone for commenting, and keep posting if you want.
And Sonics Cameraman? Need's to be shot.
I really respect it when somebody takes the time to answer what I've started with something that is indeed well thought out and thorough. I'm also flattered that somebody from the head of a group would do so. The thesis you presented me with deserves a well thought out reply that quite frankly, I just can't do justice to. I'll take notice in the fact that while you pointed out some of my minor flaws in logic I'd point some out to you.
I'm sure you know that Sonic 1-3 are the best in the series. These games were made to take advantage of and capitalize on Genesis' ability to show what a fast game looks like. Sonic had other forays into other interesting games on the Genesis, Game Gear, CD, Saturn, Dreamcast, but none others with a few exceptions carried the white-knuckle(s) adrenaline that the first few gems inspired. Nintendo at the time just didn't have the technology capable of such high frame rate and processing power. (Which begs the question, where's the save feature Sega Genesis?)
Anyway, what I said earlier was blunt. To a fault. You can't deny the fact that going by what this very site says as well as other notable sources of video game reviews etc. point out. This is my opinion as well. New Sonic games, particularly in the 3 Dimensional perspective, just aren't as entertaining or overall as satisfying to play as the ****cs. This is in part due to technical glitches and an overall downfall of the ****c video game. I would consider this a simple matter of opinion, because that's what most of this is anyway. I like apples, some like oranges. It's a matter of an opinion an any case and the market reflects that. Sonic's target audience is also of the younger prospectus and thusly, they don't carry such high expectations as I do. This is not to say anything ambiguous about the fans of Sonic either. I love Sonic, and Mario, and many other ****c video game heroes. It's a sad shame when the game developers don't show that with most of the games that they release for these icons.
With that statement comes this quirky nature of the current video game pool of mediocrity. All current video games have taken quite a hit with quality. But with the bad also comes the good and I truly hope that Sonic comes back with a real winner in the near future. I want to see a Sonic game that gets awards. I want to like Sonic again. I want to see the current video game market swing more towards outstanding. But all that takes time and patience. Sadly, these are not virtues of most video game companies. (Video game delays anyone?) Speed to market and cash out big seems to be more the agenda. This seems to even be the case with the truly elite. Nintendo has done this, Sony has done this, Microsoft has done this.
Once again I'd like to thank everyone for commenting, and keep posting if you want.
And Sonics Cameraman? Need's to be shot.
starfox15
Therein lies the problem. People are comparing these games to past ****cs rather than appreciating them based on their own merits.
Honestly, can you name a set of games right now from any series that consistently matches up to Sonic 1-3, Sonic and Knuckles, or Sonic CD? I highly doubt it.
That said, the 3D series is obviously not without fault. Here is what I think needs to happen:
-Not necessarily on rails, but in a narrow environment so as to solve the camera issues once and for all without taking away from the sense of speed
-Focus on Sonic only. Tails and Knuckles can be playable, but not at the same time as Sonic (ala Heroes) and not in minigames only (ala Secret Rings). Other characters can make appearances, but focusing on them only takes away from the gameplay. No other characters should be playable.
-Stop trying to give the series a story. It doesn't need it, and we don't care about what sort of emo problems Shadow is going through this week. That's what Sonic X is for.
-Get better voice acting. SEGA is one of the world's largest publishers, and Sonic is their biggest franchise. They can afford it, and they owe us.
-Get licenced sound tracks from well-known bands or have original orchestrated sound tracks.
-Let the player controls Sonic's forward and backward motion and speed, not just left-right like in Secret Rings.
-No more puzzles.
One of the main reasons that Sonic hasn't progressed as much is because it isn't always the same development team. Sonic Team doesn't work on every single game, and people often fail to realize it.
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