Wii sales not rising in tandem with higher review scores

In the latest issue of GamesTM (a UK games magazine) there was a comment that

"Analysts have proved that the Wii is the first console whose games sales don't rise in tandem with higher review scores."

Very Interesting. What's your take on this sentence and what do you think the implications are?

Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.Sepewrath

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

um is it my eyes playing tricks , ,

did he not claim wii sales not rising,

they are rising lol , in fact yesterday about 12 pm i went into gamestop there was a lady and man buying a wii , , lol

thats one sale right there that adds to the total number of sales,

so uk magazine fails completely , as wii is out of stock every where i look for games for my wii , so its not just us or japan its the uk to ,

wiis are sold everywhere evey day they come in ,,

games are selling,

they just dont monitor them as much as they do 360 and ps3s lol ,

i just bought indinapolis legends today lol , thats a game sold,

galaxy sold well as did super paper mario metroid 3 mariokart rockband ssbb zelda red steel re4 wii edition and so on ,

epic failed topic,

mariokart64fan

I don't think you understood the topic, actually. There is a relationship between games sales and good reviews (obviously). However, in the case of the Wii this relationship doesn't appear to exist, but it does exist for all other consoles. That's what this topic is about, which is hopefully more interesting that the usual 'what game should i buy' or 'what's your favourite game' topics.

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.xylophagous

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

Of course not. Dont you realize by now that the Wii's market are casual gamers? Most casual gamers do not go to websites like Gamespot and check up on review scores. I bet half of these casual gamers dont even know about any other games besides Wii games. And less than half are hardcore gamers. Ask them if they ever played Super Metroid or Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time, and they'll probably answer no. That's why Zelda Twilight Princess didnt see that much success because the Nintendo crowd are more casual than ever now. Video game analysts are saying it, Reggie is probably even saying it and they know it, whether you like it or not.

epic failed topic

mariokart64fan

Wow.

Reading comprehension: use it.

Disagree - This is a very good topic.

Whoever says otherwise seriously just cannot read an entire magazine (Speaking Attention Span and the ability to read well [not good])

Is it truely the only system? That's pretty bad. I think it's because the Wii, and this is from my view and from many others, just doesn't come at you. Like we all love the wii (most of us), we all want the wii, and the wii is just in general a fun console. But the Wii doesn't really come at you like 360 or even PS3 does. Nintendo first of all has longevity as a children's device. A lot of Wii Gamers, even myself who plays the wii often, line the Wii up in heights of perspective to new games, the same as the DS. (We will look at past monthly releases, vice next week's releases).

360 and PS3 are in their own league. Each has exclusive games that are usually a regurgitation of controls and bears a very high stream of competition. Have you ever heard of a ZELDA KILLER? or a MARIO KILLER? Not me. But HALO KILLER and COD4 KILLER, those are commonly used terms and WELL AWAITED.

Let's also look at the market. Parents usually buy the games, although a lot of kids are on GS, that barely shows the real neighborhood of children that reads game reviews. And we know most parents don't. They will buy games that are hot listed and these games are usually duds. PIRATES OF THE CARRIBEAN, HARRY POTTER, and whatever other game is out. No More Heroes shed a broad light on Nintendo's political position on it's market. WE CAN DO VIOLENCE. So now parents are even more concerned. Wii will do fine (obviously), but no one, not even the adults, really is concerned with NEXT WEEK. Too many big ticket items like RESISTANCE II and GoWII are coming.

um is it my eyes playing tricks , ,

did he not claim wii sales not rising,

they are rising lol , in fact yesterday about 12 pm i went into gamestop there was a lady and man buying a wii , , lol

thats one sale right there that adds to the total number of sales,

so uk magazine fails completely , as wii is out of stock every where i look for games for my wii , so its not just us or japan its the uk to ,

wiis are sold everywhere evey day they come in ,,

games are selling,

they just dont monitor them as much as they do 360 and ps3s lol ,

i just bought indinapolis legends today lol , thats a game sold,

galaxy sold well as did super paper mario metroid 3 mariokart rockband ssbb zelda red steel re4 wii edition and so on ,

epic failed topic,

mariokart64fan

No, epic failed post (yours)

Of course not. Dont you realize by now that the Wii's market are casual gamers? Most casual gamers do not go to websites like Gamespot and check up on review scores. I bet half of these casual gamers dont even know about any other games besides Wii games. And less than half are hardcore gamers. Ask them if they ever played Super Metroid or Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time, and they'll probably answer no. That's why Zelda Twilight Princess didnt see that much success because the Nintendo crowd are more casual than ever now. Video game analysts are saying it, Reggie is probably even saying it and they know it, whether you like it or not.

Elann2008

The problem is that it's the supposed "hardcore" gamers that gave up on Nintendo. Not Nintendo gaving up on the core. Nintendo just reached a new market but they are still making game for the core. The "hardcore" gamers gave up on Nintendo when the Playstation became mainstream. They always said the games are kiddy and the game sucks. How many people didn't buy the GameCube or the N64? I have a feeling you're on the list for that kind of turning. However, the "hardcore" gaming will be a niche market very soon. I can see Wii beat the PS360 in sales combined. The casual market is on for an expansion. It's your fault. Not Nintendo's fault. It's the fault of the supposed hardcore gamers. If people bought the GameCube more, you would see probably a better faith for you. Also, Casual games are not meaning they are bad. Boom Blox is awesome. Next gen, you'll see Sony and Microsoft becoming more casual. They won't let Nintendo ruled that market again.

As for me, I can see many "hardcore" games coming: Tales of Symphonia 2, Fragile, Kizuna, MadWorld, The Conduit, Mushroom Men, Arc Rise Fantasia, ... and I can count many "hardcore" games on Wiiware coming as well. I can't complain at all for that. Is it because they are not known games? If that so, I pity people that are thinking that. As for me, I gave up on the huge 3rd party companies unless they make original games. I'm now on the small 3rd party that can make original and interesting games. Maybe that's why I think the 360 or the PS3 games are lacking in originality.

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.xylophagous

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

Disagree - This is a very good topic.

Whoever says otherwise seriously just cannot read an entire magazine (Speaking Attention Span and the ability to read well [not good])

Is it truely the only system? That's pretty bad. I think it's because the Wii, and this is from my view and from many others, just doesn't come at you. Like we all love the wii (most of us), we all want the wii, and the wii is just in general a fun console. But the Wii doesn't really come at you like 360 or even PS3 does. Nintendo first of all has longevity as a children's device. A lot of Wii Gamers, even myself who plays the wii often, line the Wii up in heights of perspective to new games, the same as the DS. (We will look at past monthly releases, vice next week's releases).

360 and PS3 are in their own league. Each has exclusive games that are usually a regurgitation of controls and bears a very high stream of competition. Have you ever heard of a ZELDA KILLER? or a MARIO KILLER? Not me. But HALO KILLER and COD4 KILLER, those are commonly used terms and WELL AWAITED.

Let's also look at the market. Parents usually buy the games, although a lot of kids are on GS, that barely shows the real neighborhood of children that reads game reviews. And we know most parents don't. They will buy games that are hot listed and these games are usually duds. PIRATES OF THE CARRIBEAN, HARRY POTTER, and whatever other game is out. No More Heroes shed a broad light on Nintendo's political position on it's market. WE CAN DO VIOLENCE. So now parents are even more concerned. Wii will do fine (obviously), but no one, not even the adults, really is concerned with NEXT WEEK. Too many big ticket items like RESISTANCE II and GoWII are coming.

LotsOfGrenades

Well another things is alot of the so call hardcore gamers who own Wii's constantly whine about how they want hardcore games, but when they come out they don't buy them. I mean you mentioned No More Heroes, obviously a hardcore title, and it is actually a great game, but no one bought it, and that game was a AAA title. So a high rating and poor sales, Wii owners seem to only want to do go with established franchises. Thats why two non-original RE titles broke 1 million in sales. Granted they were good games but when you go through the boards instead of new IPs or fresh versions of classic franchises all you see is remake this and remake that. If devs rereleased every highly rated hardcore title then we would see sells of games increase since that seems to be all people want.

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.xylophagous

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.xylophagous

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

the public never ever reads reviews.

Technically the Dreamcast would be the first console to not follow this trend (higher scores led to lesser sales) but the Wii being second proves the same point.

Video games are for fun. When people know how to have fun, they will buy something that will give it to them. When you hide pure fun, suddenly fun becomes relative. Don't take away pure fun.

I think it rises in tandem with high profile games, such as Mario Kart or Mario Party. But most of the Wii's high profile games came during the holiday season, where of course the Wii will sell, so it really isn't that shocking.

Let's look at the PS3 and 360. The only game that has really driven PS3 sales outside of the holiday season is MGS4. I can't think of anything else for either console recently.

EDIT: Oh, I thought this thread was about console sales, not software sales. My bad. Then again, the Wii doesn't have many AAA games in the first place, and almost all of them have sold very well.

[QUOTE="xylophagous"]

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.goblaa

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

the public never ever reads reviews.

[QUOTE="xylophagous"]

[QUOTE="Sepewrath"]Well you can't sell consoles that arent on the shelves, and you can't increase beyond selling out. The only way sells can increase is if Nintendo ramps up production.Elann2008

We're not talking about console sales but games sales. Does it mean that the public don't take notice of Wii game review scores and just buy anything.

Of course not. Dont you realize by now that the Wii's market are casual gamers? Most casual gamers do not go to websites like Gamespot and check up on review scores. I bet half of these casual gamers dont even know about any other games besides Wii games. And less than half are hardcore gamers. Ask them if they ever played Super Metroid or Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time, and they'll probably answer no. That's why Zelda Twilight Princess didnt see that much success because the Nintendo crowd are more casual than ever now. Video game analysts are saying it, Reggie is probably even saying it and they know it, whether you like it or not.

Casual gamers are masively increasing and the casual gamers don't care about reviews, only the hardcore gamers.

Casual gamers are masively increasing and the casual gamers don't care about reviews, only the hardcore gamers.

wiifan001

[QUOTE="Elann2008"]

Of course not. Dont you realize by now that the Wii's market are casual gamers? Most casual gamers do not go to websites like Gamespot and check up on review scores. I bet half of these casual gamers dont even know about any other games besides Wii games. And less than half are hardcore gamers. Ask them if they ever played Super Metroid or Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time, and they'll probably answer no. That's why Zelda Twilight Princess didnt see that much success because the Nintendo crowd are more casual than ever now. Video game analysts are saying it, Reggie is probably even saying it and they know it, whether you like it or not.

chris3116

The problem is that it's the supposed "hardcore" gamers that gave up on Nintendo. Not Nintendo gaving up on the core. Nintendo just reached a new market but they are still making game for the core. The "hardcore" gamers gave up on Nintendo when the Playstation became mainstream. They always said the games are kiddy and the game sucks. How many people didn't buy the GameCube or the N64? I have a feeling you're on the list for that kind of turning. However, the "hardcore" gaming will be a niche market very soon. I can see Wii beat the PS360 in sales combined. The casual market is on for an expansion. It's your fault. Not Nintendo's fault. It's the fault of the supposed hardcore gamers. If people bought the GameCube more, you would see probably a better faith for you. Also, Casual games are not meaning they are bad. Boom Blox is awesome. Next gen, you'll see Sony and Microsoft becoming more casual. They won't let Nintendo ruled that market again.

As for me, I can see many "hardcore" games coming: Tales of Symphonia 2, Fragile, Kizuna, MadWorld, The Conduit, Mushroom Men, Arc Rise Fantasia, ... and I can count many "hardcore" games on Wiiware coming as well. I can't complain at all for that. Is it because they are not known games? If that so, I pity people that are thinking that. As for me, I gave up on the huge 3rd party companies unless they make original games. I'm now on the small 3rd party that can make original and interesting games. Maybe that's why I think the 360 or the PS3 games are lacking in originality.

Isnt the Wii games selling well? There are games that sold pretty well from Nintendo and other third parties.irongutvi

I think the reason why highly reviewed game sales are not rising is because true hardcore gamers are choosing not to buy them. Why is that? Well I think one of the reasons is that hardcore gamers buy games that come with online support because more replay value and it it not easy to play bootleg games online. They also probably wait until it is cheap enough to buy or they burn them onto DVDs and play them on their modded Wiis.standalonekuro

Well if thats true then they are the reason we will have pet horse 8 on the Wii in a couple of years, while the PS3 and 360 get games like Bioshock and the new Prince of Persia. While I don't think what your saying is necessarily true, the take home message is the so called hardcore gamers arent buying the games, when it takes Metroid Prime 3 3x as long to reach a million copies as it took Resident Evil 4 a port of a 3 yr old game we have a problem. They complain that Nintendo and devs have forgotten the hardcore but its their fault, sells are what drive decisions, when games like No More Heroes and Metroid Prime 3 sit on the shelves while games like Wii Play sells millions of copies, if you were a dev what message would you get.

... While I don't think what your saying is necessarily true, the take home message is the so called hardcore gamers arent buying the games, when it takes Metroid Prime 3 3x as long to reach a million copies as it took Resident Evil 4 a port of a 3 yr old game we have a problem. They complain that Nintendo and devs have forgotten the hardcore but its their fault, sells are what drive decisions, when games like No More Heroes and Metroid Prime 3 sit on the shelves while games like Wii Play sells millions of copies, if you were a dev what message would you get.

Sepewrath

Why all this focus on hardcores' buying behavior? Hardcores aren't driving the sales of the Wii consoles so why should you expect them to drive the sales of Wii software?

Review scores don't matter to the majority of Wii owners because they didn't buy the Wii because they wanted to play critically acclaimed games - they bought the Wii for the motion controls and to play mini games like those found on Wii Play. It should be no shock that a game like No More Heroes didn't sell better - its not the type of game that most Wii owners bought the system to play. Its like expecting a bunch of hardcore action movie fans to ignore the latest summer blockbuster to go out and see an oscar-award winning French artsy type film. It's not gonna happen.

If you want to bring the hardcore gamers into the discussion -- and you are assuming that hardcore gamers are influenced by good reviews when buying games -- then the fact that good reviews ≠ sales increase is a sign that the percentage of hardcore gamers that own the Wii is not significant in comparison to the number of non-hardcore gamers that own a Wii. It doesn't mean that hardcore gamers aren't buying hardcore games, it just means that there are not enough of them to make a difference in the sales percentages.

ive got to say, the reaoning is simple:

nintendo likes the " casuals" the usual non-gamers. non gamers buy what they think looks good, not what someone TELLS us to buy. how they decide what they want? ADVERTSING. what are some of the highest rated games out there? ill tell you what. games without alot of advertising. the other competiting consoled appeal more to the general gamer ( i refuse to say hardcore, they are of a dying breed ), who understands what is good and bad in a game, and can make an informed decision based on what they read via other sources. the casual gamer is to blame for this more than pointless statistic, but its not necessarily a bad thing, they are just more... for lack of a better term innocent, and unknowing of the gaming... things

1. There are millions of gamers who consider themeselves hardcore and are Wii owners,

2. and just look at the numbers Galaxy and Brawl both with about 7million in sells, Zelda with near 5million in sells, of course those are the golden franchises but casual gamers wont buy those games.

3.Maybe some would get Galaxy but they wouldnt be getting Brawl and Zelda, so obviously that means among the massive fanbase of the Wii there is a substantial number of hardcore gamers.

The problem is they only buy Nintendo games that are geared to the hardcore, there are enough hardcore gamers to make each hardcore title a million seller. I mean No More Heroes and Medal of Honor combined didnt sell as well as deca sport and there is no reason for that.

and when devs see that they figure why try, so yes I am coming down on the buying behavior of hardcore gamers because their inactivity is what devs are looking at.Sepewrath

im not trying to be rude dividing your post, i just have things that i want to set aside in the post.

1. anybody can consider themselves " hardcore" it doesnt make what they see good or bad THAT much different, everybody has tastes for certain games

2.both mario AND SSBB were advertised quite well, so you cant blame the good sales on the hardcore gamer, even LOZ was advertised a little at launch, and since the system was new, alot of the people who bought wii's saw that and decided to buy that as well. the fact that not alot of casual gamers wanted LOZ caused the lesser sales.

3. once again, the casual gamer will but ANYTHING that appeals to their fancy, they are uneducated, and that doesnt keep them from buying both gold and dirt, they dont know the difference. you cant look at sales and say " hardcore" and " casual" because its a combined effort ALWAYS.

4. neither MOH or NMH was advertised very well, and a sports game really needs NO advertising. people look at that and they see " nice fun family game, just like wii sports but with different things" when they look at MOH they see " guns... and lots of them, and war" and NHM, they see "rated M, with a lightsaber, and red in the background, NOT suitable for my children"

im not trying to kick dirt at your points, just trying to keep the debate going lol, those are good points

What Wii game out there has gotten a high score lately?firefox59

Boom Blox, Madden 09, Tiger Woods 09, and Rock Band (all EA games...) have all recieved good scores in the past four months.

Out of them, Rock Band is the only one to meet small sales (due to GH:WT having most the features missing), and the other three had solid advertising campaigns to drive sales up.

Heh, you just made me prove everyone here wrong.

[QUOTE="Elann2008"]

Of course not. Dont you realize by now that the Wii's market are casual gamers? Most casual gamers do not go to websites like Gamespot and check up on review scores. I bet half of these casual gamers dont even know about any other games besides Wii games. And less than half are hardcore gamers. Ask them if they ever played Super Metroid or Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time, and they'll probably answer no. That's why Zelda Twilight Princess didnt see that much success because the Nintendo crowd are more casual than ever now. Video game analysts are saying it, Reggie is probably even saying it and they know it, whether you like it or not.

chris3116

The problem is that it's the supposed "hardcore" gamers that gave up on Nintendo. Not Nintendo gaving up on the core. Nintendo just reached a new market but they are still making game for the core. The "hardcore" gamers gave up on Nintendo when the Playstation became mainstream. They always said the games are kiddy and the game sucks. How many people didn't buy the GameCube or the N64? I have a feeling you're on the list for that kind of turning. However, the "hardcore" gaming will be a niche market very soon. I can see Wii beat the PS360 in sales combined. The casual market is on for an expansion. It's your fault. Not Nintendo's fault. It's the fault of the supposed hardcore gamers. If people bought the GameCube more, you would see probably a better faith for you. Also, Casual games are not meaning they are bad. Boom Blox is awesome. Next gen, you'll see Sony and Microsoft becoming more casual. They won't let Nintendo ruled that market again.

As for me, I can see many "hardcore" games coming: Tales of Symphonia 2, Fragile, Kizuna, MadWorld, The Conduit, Mushroom Men, Arc Rise Fantasia, ... and I can count many "hardcore" games on Wiiware coming as well. I can't complain at all for that. Is it because they are not known games? If that so, I pity people that are thinking that. As for me, I gave up on the huge 3rd party companies unless they make original games. I'm now on the small 3rd party that can make original and interesting games. Maybe that's why I think the 360 or the PS3 games are lacking in originality.

Awesome post. And I agree that the hardcore market will be a niche market sooner rather than later. I do believe, however, that one system will still cater to mostly hardcore gamers. Wheter that's Sony, MS, or EA (who I believe will be entering the hardware market soon) has yet to be seen...

Not sure about that, SpaceMountain. Making a hardcore gaming system with narrow appeal is now being shown to simply not be very profitable. I see hardcore gaming moving in a big way towards the PC, myself. (PC gaming is very profitable) While the consoles all take the more broad appeal approach of the Wii. As for the TC article, not so sure. Dreamcast, I'm positive, could not have had sales rising with review scores, or it wouldn't be dead, and I'd be replaying Shenmue 3 on it for the billionth time right now. (now that was a hardcore console, and featured the REAL Sega at it's best)

I know review scores have very little impact whatsoever on software sales, so I'd be interested to do more research into why it would affect hardware sales. I think previous dominate consoles simply had the best sales and review scores because they simply attracted the most games from the best developers due to their popularity. Thats different for the Wii because of the casual audience, many developers don't take us seriously, they think we're all Aunt Jane, Gramps, or little Susy who doesn't give a toss about clipping issues and a terrible framerate so long as it has a catchy gimmick and is fun to play in five minute spurts.

wii has attracted many many new casual types to gaming.

these people don't research games/read reviews etc etc

they just buy things either because they are cheap or they are full of waggle "this looks fun" or both

they miss out on the better games.

that's their loss, however it is not so good for the "hardcore" developers, its easier (and cheaper) to just whip up some mini games and slap some pretty colours on the box and call it a day. that stuff sells like hotcakes. companies like money

I think the reason why highly reviewed game sales are not rising is because true hardcore gamers are choosing not to buy them. Why is that? Well I think one of the reasons is that hardcore gamers buy games that come with online support because more replay value and it it not easy to play bootleg games online. They also probably wait until it is cheap enough to buy or they burn them onto DVDs and play them on their modded Wiis.standalonekuro

and wii gets seriously crappy games too.