Debate: Are GPA, SAT, SATIIs, AP Tests, etc. indicators of how smart a person is

My stance:

Although there is no sure way to exactly a measure a person's intelligence, I strongly believe that examantion of a person's academic record (All those tests/Grades listed above) will indicate how intelligent a person is. For example, I believe that a person with a 4.0 (Straight As) GPA, and a 2200+ SAT score is a highly intelligent person. AFter all, the person has proved that he/she is able to learn and apply everything that the teachers/administration has taught them.

As a result, I don't understand why a lot of people don't put much basis in these tests/grades..like some of my friends claim that High School records (such as test scores and grades) don't matter.

I beg to differ because if a person fails to do well in High School, he/she will probably have to go to a bad college (maybe one of the lower level community colleges) and then he/she will be offered lower paying jobs.

*Don't get me wrong, there are instances in history where billionaries didn't even go to college but those cases are few as opposed to the millions of impoverished citizens who barely make a living because they never obtained a good college degree.

My definition of intelligence is:

A person's ability to learn and apply what he/she has learned and sometimes draw inference that go a little above what they have learned.

So what are your thoughts?

And to those who think that intelligence can't be measured by tests/GPA, then can you suggest another method of measuring intelligence? Or how you would define intelligence.

SAT scores mean a ton more than GPA.

Alot of people arent smart but do the mindless homework to get a decent GPA but then bomb the SAT.

Others dont do the stupid homework some teachers assign but are smart and get a nice score on the SAT.

Yea I agree sort-of with you.

SAT scores probably show a person's IQ more than GPA because of what you said..and since it is a reasonin test

But one thing I hate about the SAT is the way they ask the questions (like try to trick us...like they will have three geometric figures intertwined with one another and then you have to find the area of like one of them..whn the colegeboard could have easily just placed that figure all alone and told us to find the area). And the stifiling time limit. lol.

Does it matter?

If you wanna do something great you don't even need to be smart, all you need is perseverance.

A person could be the smartest person in the world and simply not care about doing well in high school. Does that make him any less smart? I don't think so. Then there are people like a friend of mine, who had a 104 average in high school and goes to a good college, yet if you were to ask him a question about anything that he hasn't read a text book about, he will have no idea what to say. Does that make him smart? To me, honestly, it doesn't. Being able to memorize text books is one thing, it might mean you've got a good memory, but memory isn't the only factor in intelligence.Mumbles527

Not to be rude or anything..but if a person chooses willingly to do bad in high school (when there is so much at stake)..doesn't that make them in a way stupid..afterall they are throwing away thier education.

Another thing is that if the "smart" person chooses not to care in high school, will he/she learn anything then? Without any learning, he/she will fall behind in society.

Plus, this is a motto/saying that I believe in:

"It doesn't matter how smart a person is...if he/she can't prove it to others".

So by refusing to show others, through thier GPA and SAT scores, that they are smart, people will think they are stupid and most times in life: Perception is reality.

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"]A person could be the smartest person in the world and simply not care about doing well in high school. Does that make him any less smart? I don't think so. Then there are people like a friend of mine, who had a 104 average in high school and goes to a good college, yet if you were to ask him a question about anything that he hasn't read a text book about, he will have no idea what to say. Does that make him smart? To me, honestly, it doesn't. Being able to memorize text books is one thing, it might mean you've got a good memory, but memory isn't the only factor in intelligence.Ocelot500

Not to be rude or anything..but if a person chooses willingly to do bad in high school (when there is so much at stake)..doesn't that make them in a way stupid..afterall they are throwing away thier education.

Another thing is that if the "smart" person chooses not to care in high school, will he/she learn anything then? Without any learning, he/she will fall behind in society.

Plus, this is a motto/saying that I believe in:

"It doesn't matter how smart a person is...if he/she can't prove it to others".

So by refusing to show others, through thier GPA and SAT scores, that they are smart, people will think they are stupid and most times in life: Perception is reality.

Would you say that, despite all of that, I'm stupid because I didn't feel a need to pay attention in useless classes that you will very rarely, if ever, use in the real world?

i disagree. the sat was designed almost as an iq test, however the people that do well on the sat are not necessarily the intelligent, but were forced to take sat review classes by their parents.

i am sure that, on average, there is a direct correlation between intelligence and gpa and standardized test scores, however there is more to intelligence than what most education systems care to measure. inteligence can be manifested in creativity, sense of humor, the desire for knowledge, etc. in high school, i felt like my grades were based on how much time i took to memorize the information that teachers spat at me or made me read.

[QUOTE="Ocelot500"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"]A person could be the smartest person in the world and simply not care about doing well in high school. Does that make him any less smart? I don't think so. Then there are people like a friend of mine, who had a 104 average in high school and goes to a good college, yet if you were to ask him a question about anything that he hasn't read a text book about, he will have no idea what to say. Does that make him smart? To me, honestly, it doesn't. Being able to memorize text books is one thing, it might mean you've got a good memory, but memory isn't the only factor in intelligence.Mumbles527

Not to be rude or anything..but if a person chooses willingly to do bad in high school (when there is so much at stake)..doesn't that make them in a way stupid..afterall they are throwing away thier education.

Another thing is that if the "smart" person chooses not to care in high school, will he/she learn anything then? Without any learning, he/she will fall behind in society.

Plus, this is a motto/saying that I believe in:

"It doesn't matter how smart a person is...if he/she can't prove it to others".

So by refusing to show others, through thier GPA and SAT scores, that they are smart, people will think they are stupid and most times in life: Perception is reality.

Would you say that, despite all of that, I'm stupid because I didn't feel a need to pay attention in useless classes that you will very rarely, if ever, use in the real world?

Well when I meant "not care about HS", I meant not care about SATs also. IMO, if You are truly intelligent you will get a good score on the SAT, since it is a reasoning test.

However, IMO, if you are a very intelligent person, you will realize that although you might not use every class that you take in HS, it is wise to pay attention and do well in them. After all, although you went to a top university (since you got a 1400), I bet if you did a little better in HS (I mean like if you cared), you would have gone to an even better university or gotten more schoalrship.

Besides, I have two more points to make:

1.) If someone is truly smart, they can do real well in HS without having to work too hard on homework or anything. After all, all you have to do is semi-whatpay attention in class( well this works for me and other people I know) and you can make up BS answers for HW and still ACE the class. IMo this shows that you are smart enough to get As and smart enough to outsmart the system.

2.) No disrespect or anything, but the only reason why you got a 1400 out of 1600 is because you have had to atleast pay attention in your English and Math classes in either HS or earlier. You might not have tried/put your best effort but youhad to have semi-what studied/paid attention or else there is no way youcould have learned enough to get a 1400 out of 1600.

P.S.: How does one join MENSA and what IQ do you need to have? Like do I need to take a test or something..I want to join MENSA..although I am a high schooler.

i disagree. the sat was designed almost as an iq test, however the people that do well on the sat are not necessarily the intelligent, but were forced to take sat review classes by their parents.

i am sure that, on average, there is a direct correlation between intelligence and gpa and standardized test scores, however there is more to intelligence than what most education systems care to measure. inteligence can be manifested in creativity, sense of humor, the desire for knowledge, etc. in high school, i felt like my grades were based on how much time i took to memorize the information that teachers spat at me or made me read.

maximusmmii

I agree with you 100%. This is basically what I said (or at least meant to say) in my intro. post.

Although intelligence can manifest in any form, on average it is usually demonstrated through good gpa and SAT scores.

As a result, the majority of "intelligent" people in the world have good GPAs and SAT scores.

However, there are always exceptions (but not too many of them compared to the greater majority).

P.S.: How does one join MENSA and what IQ do you need to have? Like do I need to take a test or something..I want to join MENSA..although I am a high schooler.Ocelot500

SAT scores mean a ton more than GPA.

Alot of people arent smart but do the mindless homework to get a decent GPA but then bomb the SAT.

Others dont do the stupid homework some teachers assign but are smart and get a nice score on the SAT.

Breesy

GPA in grade school means NOTHING..especially since kids have a tendancy to CHEAT. SAT's could be an indication but then again the couldnt be.

I think those tests show how smart someone is at studying a test that you know what is gonna be on it.

GPAs are good indicators because since you pick your own classes, youre grades should show yourt smartness in your preffered area.

But I think there is something more importatn than being smart and that is being wisely open minded. There are some countries where there are no GPAs and standardized tests but that doesnt mean that they dont have "smart" people.

For most people i think the SAT is good for it. My dad doesnt exactly speak the best english though, as his origin is of a different country, and im pretty sure you get most of the base of your language skills from your parents, so i didnt do as well on the english parts of the SAT as i could have. they should have just a 'logic' section on the SAT like what to do in certain situations to get the best/fastest results.

IMO, intelligence is not like having brown hair or something (either you got it or you don't). Instead, there are different levels of intelligence. It all depends on a person's interests. For example, if one really likes history, then that person is going to do well on history tests/classes/etc. If one really likes numbers, then they will do well in math. If one really enjoys flowers, then he will do very well on botany tests/classes. If one really enjoys baseball, then they will likely have a solid HS/college baseball career. Of course, there are many other qualities that a person needs in order to be a damn good botanist or a damn good shortstop.

But interest is the #1 key.

[QUOTE="Ocelot500"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"]A person could be the smartest person in the world and simply not care about doing well in high school. Does that make him any less smart? I don't think so. Then there are people like a friend of mine, who had a 104 average in high school and goes to a good college, yet if you were to ask him a question about anything that he hasn't read a text book about, he will have no idea what to say. Does that make him smart? To me, honestly, it doesn't. Being able to memorize text books is one thing, it might mean you've got a good memory, but memory isn't the only factor in intelligence.Mumbles527

Not to be rude or anything..but if a person chooses willingly to do bad in high school (when there is so much at stake)..doesn't that make them in a way stupid..afterall they are throwing away thier education.

Another thing is that if the "smart" person chooses not to care in high school, will he/she learn anything then? Without any learning, he/she will fall behind in society.

Plus, this is a motto/saying that I believe in:

"It doesn't matter how smart a person is...if he/she can't prove it to others".

So by refusing to show others, through thier GPA and SAT scores, that they are smart, people will think they are stupid and most times in life: Perception is reality.

Would you say that, despite all of that, I'm stupid because I didn't feel a need to pay attention in useless classes that you will very rarely, if ever, use in the real world?

I can relate to that. I NEVER study for tests and constantly slack off on homework. Despite this I got a 1900 on the SAT and recently tested my IQ to be 173.

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="Ocelot500"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"]A person could be the smartest person in the world and simply not care about doing well in high school. Does that make him any less smart? I don't think so. Then there are people like a friend of mine, who had a 104 average in high school and goes to a good college, yet if you were to ask him a question about anything that he hasn't read a text book about, he will have no idea what to say. Does that make him smart? To me, honestly, it doesn't. Being able to memorize text books is one thing, it might mean you've got a good memory, but memory isn't the only factor in intelligence.lobo234

Not to be rude or anything..but if a person chooses willingly to do bad in high school (when there is so much at stake)..doesn't that make them in a way stupid..afterall they are throwing away thier education.

Another thing is that if the "smart" person chooses not to care in high school, will he/she learn anything then? Without any learning, he/she will fall behind in society.

Plus, this is a motto/saying that I believe in:

"It doesn't matter how smart a person is...if he/she can't prove it to others".

So by refusing to show others, through thier GPA and SAT scores, that they are smart, people will think they are stupid and most times in life: Perception is reality.

Would you say that, despite all of that, I'm stupid because I didn't feel a need to pay attention in useless classes that you will very rarely, if ever, use in the real world?

I can relate to that. I NEVER study for tests and constantly slack off on homework. Despite this I got a 1900 on the SAT and recently tested my IQ to be 173.

Don't take this the wrong way....but (correct me if I am wrong)..isn't an IQ of 173..like beyond genius?

So if you honestly got that, how did you bomb your SATs..with a 1900? I mean since the SAT is a REasoning test (like a pseudo IQ test)..shouldn't you have gotten at least 2100 or +.

Plus, where did you take this IQ test? Online?Offically at a location? etc. And did yo guess on some questions?

But hey I could be wrong..and if you honestly got that IQ score..congratualtions.

First i would like to say i think it is amazing how GS seems to attract only the best and the brightest, really i find it hard to believe almost anything people say on here, especially in regards to academics, if i did believe it all i would be forced to believe that 90% of GS members are in the top 2% in the world in regards to IQ, looks, income, etc. Roland1987

It just means that gamespot attracts ego maniacs. A lot of people on here are teenagers, and they are naturally arrogant. So that's why.