Intellectual Debates on Atheism, Christianity and God

I was raised as a Christian but have often been skeptical about just about everything. One of these things happened to be whether or not God was real. To help discover whether this was true, I began to search for debates between intellectual advocates for each side so that I may form my own opinions.

The best sources I have found are outlined here.

They are from the Fixed Point Foundation, an organization that is dedicated to defending Christianity. At first, I believed I hit another dead end and expected more biases, but this organization hosts fair and structured debates and include some of the most famous advocates for Atheism in our time: Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins.

These sources are also thoughtful because they extend beyond simply Atheism vs. Christianity, but also the idea of any God.

The organization also offers a full length video of one these debates free of charge. I am also open to additional sources that anyone else may like to offer.

is this some sort of weird advertising?Jandurin

When I was in High School, we had an assignment to debate with each other over some current political issues. I thought the whole assignment was silly, because I understood that we were still too immature, young, and just plain "stupid" to understand current political issues. Likewise, I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]is this some sort of weird advertising?Turtlecream

When I was in High School, we had an assignment to debate with each other over some current political issues. I thought the whole assignment was silly, because I understood that we were still too immature, young, and just plain "stupid" to understand current political issues. Likewise, I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]is this some sort of weird advertising?Jandurin

When I was in High School, we had an assignment to debate with each other over some current political issues. I thought the whole assignment was silly, because I understood that we were still too immature, young, and just plain "stupid" to understand current political issues. Likewise, I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.

Obviously? What does that have to do with anything?

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

When I was in High School, we had an assignment to debate with each other over some current political issues. I thought the whole assignment was silly, because I understood that we were still too immature, young, and just plain "stupid" to understand current political issues. Likewise, I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.

Obviously? What does that have to do with anything?

is this some sort of weird advertising?Jandurin

Seems like it... He asks for debates, but then post his own and discusses how fantastic and free they are...

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]is this some sort of weird advertising?Buttons1990

Seems like it... He asks for debates, but then post his own and discusses how fantastic and free they are...

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Jandurin"] are strangers not people too?Jandurin

Obviously? What does that have to do with anything?

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]is this some sort of weird advertising?Buttons1990

Seems like it... He asks for debates, but then post his own and discusses how fantastic and free they are...

I do not own any of the debates and I do not recall ever asking for anything. I don't think you know what you're talking about.

You should watch some debates with William Lane Craig. He's muuuch better than D'souzaSilenthps

I'll look into it.

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

Obviously? What does that have to do with anything?

Turtlecream

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]

[QUOTE="Jandurin"]is this some sort of weird advertising?Turtlecream

Seems like it... He asks for debates, but then post his own and discusses how fantastic and free they are...

I do not own any of the debates and I do not recall ever asking for anything. I don't think you know what you're talking about.

Right at the end of your post:

"I am also open to additional sources that anyone else may like to offer."

And if that isn't asking for more debates or asking for discussion here, then what is the point of this thread? If you don't want anything from here, then the only other thing you are doing is advertising those sites...?

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Jandurin"] why would you think their beliefs/arguments aren't worthy of altering or solidifying a viewpoint?Silenthps

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

I think Dawkins and Hitchens are geniuses.

I don't think I could stand to look at any of the intellectual debates, as I have very little respect for the "big name" people arguing the side I disagree with. As such, that taints my views on the subject.

Hitchens is a grumpy old sod.

Dawkins, while a great mind in biology, is a polemic hack when it comes to religion.

Harris is just an ****

[QUOTE="Silenthps"][QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

Turtlecream

I think Dawkins and Hitchens are geniuses.

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

Obviously? What does that have to do with anything?

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Silenthps"]Actually the atheist on Gamespot are waaay more sophisticated in religious debates than Dawkins or Hitchens is. Dawkins/Hitchens are pretty much a jokesSilenthps

I think Dawkins and Hitchens are geniuses.

Religion only serves to divide people in my opinion.

I am still waiting for The First Amalgamated Church to sprout up.

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]

Seems like it... He asks for debates, but then post his own and discusses how fantastic and free they are...

Buttons1990

I do not own any of the debates and I do not recall ever asking for anything. I don't think you know what you're talking about.

Right at the end of your post:

"I am also open to additional sources that anyone else may like to offer."

And if that isn't asking for more debates or asking for discussion here, then what is the point of this thread? If you don't want anything from here, then the only other thing you are doing is advertising those sites...?

Having an open mind to consider suggestions has nothing to do with asking for anything. Surely you understand the difference.

Also, I don't know why a person should be unable post something on these forums unless they are specifically asking a question or for more discussion. There are plenty of posts with discussion that only have a link to a news article with the purpose being to make that topic apparent. This is no different.

Perhaps you should go to those posts and claim they have no point, that they should ask a question, specifically write, "I want to talk about this article that I am linking," and that they should stop advertising for CNN, Fox News, or wherever they are getting the information from.

so my question to you tc is just where do you stand now that you've listened to or read through these debates? have you changed your belief due to some intellectual analysis or debate on whether if God exists or not, and if so what God you should put your faith into?

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]

[QUOTE="Jandurin"] why would you think their beliefs/arguments aren't worthy of altering or solidifying a viewpoint?Jandurin

I don't even know why I should response to this because it seems so obvious, but: because a stranger may be a 14-year-old child who may be parroting whatever their parents are telling them. It is far more logical to listen to renowned professors instead of hoping that they are typing on the GameSpot forums.

I think it's more odd to make assumptions based upon limited information.

You are automatically assuming that, because I do not enjoy arguing with random strangers over the Internet about complicated topics such as God, that I do not respect the Internet. The Internet is the primary reason why this time period is called the Information Age.

You are automatically assuming that, because I do not enjoy arguing with random strangers over the Internet about complicated topics such as God, that I do not respect the Internet. The Internet is the primary reason why this time period is called the Information Age.

Turtlecream

so my question to you tc is just where do you stand now that you've listened to or read through these debates? have you changed your belief due to some intellectual analysis or debate on whether if God exists or not, and if so what God you should put your faith into?

zmbi_gmr

I am not sure yet.

I think it's more logical to believe in a deistic God (a God that created everything and then left it to its natural order). I think John Lennox put forth some exceptional arguments for supporting the Christian God, while Richard Dawkins, as an example, pointed out possible absurdities.

I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.Turtlecream

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.markop2003

[QUOTE="Turtlecream"]I think forming beliefs, even partly, based on arguments with strangers over the internet is just as silly.markop2003

That's true. It should be primarily instead of even partly, but that's how I feel.

It's a pretty dead end inquiry. We simply can't prove or disprove the existence of a God, or gods, or any type of being. Any philosopher that says they can prove it one way or the other are employing rhetorical tricks, or logical loopholes.
If you think that there is even a small possibility of this existence, then you might as well try to live your life in a way that would please this deity.
Why take the risk, right?




I for one see god as a man made concept. It's actually a testament to our logical faculties. For whatever reason, human beings are problem solvers. Our brains need our thoughts to be in equilibrium, or 'make sense'. When they don't, we feel anxiety, and a host of other negative emotions. The brain is in a constant state of reconciliation of what we perceive to be 'true'. Not what may or may not be empirically true, but what we 'believe' to be true.
That is where the concept of God comes in. It is a convenient term that balances the equation of causation when applied to the concept of the earth, the sky, and everything.
Everything we perceive in the real world seems to be created by something else. And th ultimate extrapolation of this when taken to infinity would be God.

The problem I have is that there are plenty of other reasons, for me at least, that make more sense.