Jesus's body was moved or stolen from his burial by his followers

Even though,

Jesus' tomb was secured in three ways:

(a) A large stone was rolled against it. It was customary to roll big stones against tombs; the stones were generally too big to be moved by just a few men, so levers were used to move them. Some have estimated that the stone that sealed Jesus' tomb weighed 1-1/2 to 2 two tons (1,361-1,814 Kilograms), which is the approximate weight of a midsize car.

(b) A Roman guard unit--which usually consisted of four soldiers--was stationed at the tomb. Roman guards were strictly disciplined fighting men held to the highest standards. Failure often required death by torturous and humiliating methods.

(c) The Roman seal was affixed to the stone that secured the tomb. The seal stood for the power and authority of the Roman Empire. Breaking the seal meant automatic execution by crucifixion upside down. Anyone trying to move the stone from the tomb's entrance would have broken the seal and thus incurred the wrath of Roman law.1

On resurrection Sunday morning, the first thing that impressed the people who approached the tomb was that the large stone was moved.3 Certainly the entire guard unit would not have fallen asleep with torture and death as the consequences. But even if the guards did fall asleep, how could thieves have sneaked by the guards and moved the massive stone without waking them up?

Jesus's body could not have been resurrected, he was moved or probably stolen despite all of this. His body could still be out there somewhere? What you think?

Jesus's body could not have been resurrected...you sure about that?Anti-Venom

[QUOTE="Anti-Venom"]Jesus's body could not have been resurrected...you sure about that?aka_aj03

[QUOTE="Anti-Venom"]Jesus's body could not have been resurrected...you sure about that?aka_aj03

Apparently you forgot the factor of a loving god and his angels.................just saying you know.

How could a few Women possibly move a giant boulder? The tomb was guarded as well.

In order for one not to believe that Jesus is God, that He was not raised from the dead, which therefore proves that God exists, they would have to deny the truth of the empty tomb and the Resurrection. In addition, they would have to deny the fulfillment of hundreds of prophecies in Christ. .

They would have to believe that the Apostles and early Christians made up the resurrection account. This would require a rational explanation for why the Apostles and early Christians would willingly endure persecution and death for something they knew was a lie? The Apostles and early Christians, many of whom were eyewitnesses to the resurrection, were stoned, beheaded, boiled in oil, imprisoned, crucified, scourged, fed to lions, clothed in animal skins and then torn apart by wild beasts, tarred and lit on fire, disemboweled, burnt at the stake, etc., rather than recant their faith.

A rational explanation would be required as to why the Jewish Priests and Roman authorities that wanted so much to stamp out early Christianity, as evidenced by their persecution of Christians, chose not to display Jesus' body to disprove the claims of the followers of Christ that he had arose from the dead., if they had stolen the body.

A rational explanation would be required for the dramatic change in the Apostles' behavior. They scattered and even denied knowing Jesus when He was arrested. After His death, they were crushed, in hiding, their Messiah put to death like a common criminal. Suddenly, after Jesus appeared to them there was a dramatic change. They began to openly preach the Gospel in the Temple in Jerusalem, the very city where Jesus was crucified. The very city where there were living eyewitnesses to the events that would have refuted them if they were lying. They were told to stop but defied the authorities. The endured persecution and ultimately death rather than recant their faith because they believed they saw, touched, and fellowshipped with the resurrected Jesus.

Also needing rational explanation would be why the Apostles were bold enough to preach the resurrection in Jerusalem, the very city where Christ was crucified, to crowds that lived during those events and could have easily disputed the resurrection claims publicly. If they were spreading a lie, why did they not go to some remote area where there were no eyewitnesses to the crucifixion and resurrection of Christ that could disputed their claims if they were lying?

Finally, one would need to explain why the early Church grew so quickly in a pagan world, especially when it was under intense persecution. Even today, in countries like North Korea and China, where Christians are under the most intense persecution, the Church is growing faster than in areas with less persecution.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that others are not entitled to their beliefs, far be it to impose on their free will, but personally, when one considers the evidence, a belief in the truth of Christianity is well-founded.

Even though,

Jesus' tomb was secured in three ways:

(a) A large stone was rolled against it. It was customary to roll big stones against tombs; the stones were generally too big to be moved by just a few men, so levers were used to move them. Some have estimated that the stone that sealed Jesus' tomb weighed 1-1/2 to 2 two tons (1,361-1,814 Kilograms), which is the approximate weight of a midsize car.

(b) A Roman guard unit--which usually consisted of four soldiers--was stationed at the tomb. Roman guards were strictly disciplined fighting men held to the highest standards. Failure often required death by torturous and humiliating methods.

(c) The Roman seal was affixed to the stone that secured the tomb. The seal stood for the power and authority of the Roman Empire. Breaking the seal meant automatic execution by crucifixion upside down. Anyone trying to move the stone from the tomb's entrance would have broken the seal and thus incurred the wrath of Roman law.1

On resurrection Sunday morning, the first thing that impressed the people who approached the tomb was that the large stone was moved.3 Certainly the entire guard unit would not have fallen asleep with torture and death as the consequences. But even if the guards did fall asleep, how could thieves have sneaked by the guards and moved the massive stone without waking them up?

Jesus's body could not have been resurrected, he was moved or probably stolen despite all of this. His body could still be out there somewhere? What you think?

aka_aj03

You sure, because even scientists cannot explain how the image appeared on the Shroud of Turin, they say, it would take a insane amount of radiation or light for the image to appear. They also explained how it wasn't a light such as a laser or a light-bulb, because we wouldn't get a clear image like we see on the shroud. Further more there is no paints, dies or anything that could have caused the very thin layer of discoloration. One of the ways they said would explain it is in his resurrection. As his soul passed into his body it would have created a massive amount of light. They also said it was if the light never passed fully through the shroud, which is indeed what happened, as his body disappeared once he resurrected. Furthermore when they visited his tomb, the shroud was untouched, and still stitched and wrapped together, so the apostles came to the only possible conclusion, that he resurrected on the third day.

You sure, because even scientists cannot explain how the image appeared on the Shroud of Turin, they say, it would take a insane amount of radiation or light for the image to appear. They also explained how it wasn't a light such as a laser or a light-bulb, because we wouldn't get a clear image like we see on the shroud. Further more there is no paints, dies or anything that could have caused the very thin layer of discoloration. One of the ways they said would explain it is in his resurrection. As his soul passed into his body it would have created a massive amount of light. They also said it was if the light never passed fully through the shroud, which is indeed what happened, as his body disappeared once he resurrected. Furthermore when they visited his tomb, the shroud was untouched, and still stitched and wrapped together, so the apostles came to the only possible conclusion, that he resurrected on the third day.

VisigothSaxon

[spoiler] [/spoiler]

[QUOTE="VisigothSaxon"]You sure, because even scientists cannot explain how the image appeared on the Shroud of Turin, they say, it would take a insane amount of radiation or light for the image to appear. They also explained how it wasn't a light such as a laser or a light-bulb, because we wouldn't get a clear image like we see on the shroud. Further more there is no paints, dies or anything that could have caused the very thin layer of discoloration. One of the ways they said would explain it is in his resurrection. As his soul passed into his body it would have created a massive amount of light. They also said it was if the light never passed fully through the shroud, which is indeed what happened, as his body disappeared once he resurrected. Furthermore when they visited his tomb, the shroud was untouched, and still stitched and wrapped together, so the apostles came to the only possible conclusion, that he resurrected on the third day.Engrish_Major

The Shroud of Turin has an image of Jesus "burnt" into it. Many have contended that the shroud was concocted well after the fact by an artist of some kind.. but even scientists today agree that there is no paint or any other man-made substance forming the image of Jesus on the shroud. They can't come up with any explanation for the image on the shroud other than the idea that a massive surge of energy infused into the body caused the imprint on the cloth. To me, this is as close to scientific proof of the resurrection as we're going to get. Something happened to that shroud that we can't even explain today, and it's consistent with some unknown form of radiation eminating from the body.

I can see where this is going...

It would be best to just let people believe what they want.

jesus never existed...

we will never know the truth!!!

The Shroud of Turin has an image of Jesus "burnt" into it. Many have contended that the shroud was concocted well after the fact by an artist of some kind.. but even scientists today agree that there is no paint or any other man-made substance forming the image of Jesus on the shroud. They can't come up with any explanation for the image on the shroud other than the idea that a massive surge of energy infused into the body caused the imprint on the cloth. To me, this is as close to scientific proof of the resurrection as we're going to get. Something happened to that shroud that we can't even explain today, and it's consistent with some unknown form of radiation eminating from the body.

hartsickdiscipl

Yes, and even then, proof isn't necessary.

I didnt know you had a time machine.

Can I borrow so I can pay Hitler a visit? *pumps shotgun*

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

The Shroud of Turin has an image of Jesus "burnt" into it. Many have contended that the shroud was concocted well after the fact by an artist of some kind.. but even scientists today agree that there is no paint or any other man-made substance forming the image of Jesus on the shroud. They can't come up with any explanation for the image on the shroud other than the idea that a massive surge of energy infused into the body caused the imprint on the cloth. To me, this is as close to scientific proof of the resurrection as we're going to get. Something happened to that shroud that we can't even explain today, and it's consistent with some unknown form of radiation eminating from the body.

VisigothSaxon

Yes, and even then, proof isn't necessary.

.. Your going to need more "proof" then that to try to disprove the billions of pieces of evidence that would shatter the very foundations of mankind understands as the natural world.. Its not beyond a reasonable doubt, hence why faith is needed to believe in Jesus. If faith wasn't needed, then Christianity wouldn't be a religion or belief, but fact.. Something to read within history books and science books.

Baically TC is saying it was impossible for what they say to have happened to have happened? I agree :D

jesus never existed...

DoomZaW

[QUOTE="VisigothSaxon"]

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

The Shroud of Turin has an image of Jesus "burnt" into it. Many have contended that the shroud was concocted well after the fact by an artist of some kind.. but even scientists today agree that there is no paint or any other man-made substance forming the image of Jesus on the shroud. They can't come up with any explanation for the image on the shroud other than the idea that a massive surge of energy infused into the body caused the imprint on the cloth. To me, this is as close to scientific proof of the resurrection as we're going to get. Something happened to that shroud that we can't even explain today, and it's consistent with some unknown form of radiation eminating from the body.

sSubZerOo

Yes, and even then, proof isn't necessary.

.. Your going to need more "proof" then that to try to disprove the billions of pieces of evidence that would shatter the very foundations of mankind understands as the natural world.. Its not beyond a reasonable doubt, hence why faith is needed to believe in Jesus. If faith wasn't needed, then Christianity wouldn't be a religion or belief, but fact.. Something to read within history books and science books.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="VisigothSaxon"]

Yes, and even then, proof isn't necessary.

Snipes_2

.. Your going to need more "proof" then that to try to disprove the billions of pieces of evidence that would shatter the very foundations of mankind understands as the natural world.. Its not beyond a reasonable doubt, hence why faith is needed to believe in Jesus. If faith wasn't needed, then Christianity wouldn't be a religion or belief, but fact.. Something to read within history books and science books.

Yes this is true. Several credible sources confirm the existence of a man named Jesus that was crucified. The speculation on his ressurection , however, cannot be proven or disproven.

jesus never existed...

DoomZaW

This is not even a possibility. There are numerous references to him in both Jewish and Roman history. His existence is fully documented, and the fact that he was crucified. You may as well deny the existence of Alexander and George Washington.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

.. Your going to need more "proof" then that to try to disprove the billions of pieces of evidence that would shatter the very foundations of mankind understands as the natural world.. Its not beyond a reasonable doubt, hence why faith is needed to believe in Jesus. If faith wasn't needed, then Christianity wouldn't be a religion or belief, but fact.. Something to read within history books and science books.

TheMightyHoov

Yes this is true. Several credible sources confirm the existence of a man named Jesus that was crucified. The speculation on his ressurection , however, cannot be proven or disproven.

[QUOTE="DoomZaW"]

jesus never existed...

hartsickdiscipl

This is not even a possibility. There are numerous references to him in both Jewish and Roman history. His existence is fully documented, and the fact that he was crucified. You may as well deny the existence of Alexander and George Washington.

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

[QUOTE="DoomZaW"]

jesus never existed...

TheMightyHoov

This is not even a possibility. There are numerous references to him in both Jewish and Roman history. His existence is fully documented, and the fact that he was crucified. You may as well deny the existence of Alexander and George Washington.

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

[QUOTE="TheMightyHoov"]

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

This is not even a possibility. There are numerous references to him in both Jewish and Roman history. His existence is fully documented, and the fact that he was crucified. You may as well deny the existence of Alexander and George Washington.

PannicAtack

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

Both :P

[QUOTE="TheMightyHoov"]

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

This is not even a possibility. There are numerous references to him in both Jewish and Roman history. His existence is fully documented, and the fact that he was crucified. You may as well deny the existence of Alexander and George Washington.

PannicAtack

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

I don't know what part of my statement was "unsafely exaggerated." There are no photographs or video records of the existence of Jesus, Alexander, or George Washington. Everything we have on all 3 of them are written records or paintings. Therefore they are on equal grounds in terms of historical validity.

I think we have no way of knowing for sure.spazzx625

[QUOTE="spazzx625"]I think we have no way of knowing for sure.foxhound_fox

It becomes much more logical and plausible when you look at the physical evidence on the Shroud of Turin. Besides, all "Supernatural" has to mean is a science that we don't yet understand. I think alot of people would've considered radio transmissions to be supernatural a thousand years ago.

I personally believe that his soul was sent to hell so that Jesus could go see the Slayer concert. It was revealed to me during my devotional time of prayer and reading.

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"][QUOTE="TheMightyHoov"]

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

hartsickdiscipl

I don't know what part of my statement was "unsafely exaggerated." There are no photographs or video records of the existence of Jesus, Alexander, or George Washington. Everything we have on all 3 of them are written records or paintings. Therefore they are on equal grounds in terms of historical validity.

You misunderstand I was referring to the post saying Jesus never existed. I was a agreeing with you. :P

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"] Which quote? The statement that flies in the face of academic consensus, or the one that unsafely exaggerates said academic consensus?TheMightyHoov

I don't know what part of my statement was "unsafely exaggerated." There are no photographs or video records of the existence of Jesus, Alexander, or George Washington. Everything we have on all 3 of them are written records or paintings. Therefore they are on equal grounds in terms of historical validity.

You misunderstand I was referring to the post saying Jesus never existed. I was a agreeing with you. :P

Fair enough :P

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]

[QUOTE="spazzx625"]I think we have no way of knowing for sure.hartsickdiscipl

It becomes much more logical and plausible when you look at the physical evidence on the Shroud of Turin. Besides, all "Supernatural" has to mean is a science that we don't yet understand. I think alot of people would've considered radio transmissions to be supernatural a thousand years ago.

.. This is on a completely different level.. Radio signals can be recreated and explained.. The mircles that Jesus did including ressurection goes against billions of pieces of evidence that state otherwise.. This is all within a book of some 2000 years that at times can be ambigious depending on the section your reading.. You have to have faith in this matter, becasue there is no logical way you can prove it.. Especially when its from supposed witnesses 2000 years ago that we can not cross examine nor knew who they really were.. Hence faith is needed, which is not saying its wrong.. Thats kind of the POINT to religion in having faith in the belief.

they wouldnt be able to hide the body well enough if you think about it. it was in the best interest of the pharassies and pontious pialateto find it to discredit him. I butchered some spelling but wat ev

[QUOTE="hartsickdiscipl"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]
This. But the most logical explanation is likely the most plausible. And a supernatural physical resurrection is one of the least logical to me.

sSubZerOo

It becomes much more logical and plausible when you look at the physical evidence on the Shroud of Turin. Besides, all "Supernatural" has to mean is a science that we don't yet understand. I think alot of people would've considered radio transmissions to be supernatural a thousand years ago.

.. This is on a completely different level.. Radio signals can be recreated and explained.. The mircles that Jesus did including ressurection goes against billions of pieces of evidence that state otherwise.. This is all within a book of some 2000 years that at times can be ambigious depending on the section your reading.. You have to have faith in this matter, becasue there is no logical way you can prove it.. Especially when its from supposed witnesses 2000 years ago that we can not cross examine nor knew who they really were.. Hence faith is needed, which is not saying its wrong.. Thats kind of the POINT to religion in having faith in the belief.

While I agree that faith is needed, I do believe that the Shroud of Turin serves as evidence of an intersection between this plane of existence and another.. one that primitive people like ourselves would consider "supernatural." I think those people 2000 years ago would have found radio transmissions to be evidence of spirits, since they could not recreate or explain it. All these things seem spooky or supernatural depending on the relative development of society and technology. I know that many religious people might be offended by this.. but I feel that there is a definite connection between Biblical references to Angels and Demons, and reports of "Aliens" that people have seen or encountered on this planet. They are all alien to us.

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"][QUOTE="TheMightyHoov"]

I love the ignorance of some of these posts. Lets make bold conclusions without doing any research what so ever. :roll:

hartsickdiscipl

I don't know what part of my statement was "unsafely exaggerated." There are no photographs or video records of the existence of Jesus, Alexander, or George Washington. Everything we have on all 3 of them are written records or paintings. Therefore they are on equal grounds in terms of historical validity.

Jesus' body was stolen by his CULT followers.MickeyTheNinja

[QUOTE="MickeyTheNinja"]Jesus' body was stolen by his CULT followers.LJS9502_basic

Even though,

Jesus' tomb was secured in three ways:

(a) A large stone was rolled against it. It was customary to roll big stones against tombs; the stones were generally too big to be moved by just a few men, so levers were used to move them. Some have estimated that the stone that sealed Jesus' tomb weighed 1-1/2 to 2 two tons (1,361-1,814 Kilograms), which is the approximate weight of a midsize car.

(b) A Roman guard unit--which usually consisted of four soldiers--was stationed at the tomb. Roman guards were strictly disciplined fighting men held to the highest standards. Failure often required death by torturous and humiliating methods.

(c) The Roman seal was affixed to the stone that secured the tomb. The seal stood for the power and authority of the Roman Empire. Breaking the seal meant automatic execution by crucifixion upside down. Anyone trying to move the stone from the tomb's entrance would have broken the seal and thus incurred the wrath of Roman law.1

On resurrection Sunday morning, the first thing that impressed the people who approached the tomb was that the large stone was moved.3 Certainly the entire guard unit would not have fallen asleep with torture and death as the consequences. But even if the guards did fall asleep, how could thieves have sneaked by the guards and moved the massive stone without waking them up?

Jesus's body could not have been resurrected, he was moved or probably stolen despite all of this. His body could still be out there somewhere? What you think?

aka_aj03

[QUOTE="Anti-Venom"]Jesus's body could not have been resurrected...you sure about that?aka_aj03

[QUOTE="Anti-Venom"]Jesus's body could not have been resurrected...you sure about that?aka_aj03