Was it a mistake for Ron Paul to not run in the general election?

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Laihendi

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#1 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

Polls indicated that he would have gotten ~17-18% of the vote in a 3 way election between him, Obama, and Romney.

This would have been enough to get him into the debates, which is something Johnson obviously couldn't do.

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lo_Pine

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#2 lo_Pine
Member since 2012 • 4978 Posts
He's really only popular with the college kids and 20 year olds. He is still known as the crazy guy amongst older people. He has no chance.
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Fightingfan

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#3 Fightingfan
Member since 2010 • 38011 Posts
I would of voted for him; now I'm just voting for who I dislike less...
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chessmaster1989

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#4 chessmaster1989
Member since 2008 • 30203 Posts
One poll by an unknown pollster from March? Seems legit
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whipassmt

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#5 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

No. Paul probably didn't want to take votes away from Romney and end up helping Obama win.

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coolbeans90

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#6 coolbeans90
Member since 2009 • 21305 Posts

He might've snagged about 5%, not nearly enough to be competitive or anything, but enough to steal any hope of winning the election from Romney.

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TopTierHustler

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#7 TopTierHustler
Member since 2012 • 3894 Posts

He's really only popular with the college kids and 20 year olds. He is still known as the crazy guy amongst older people. He has no chance.lo_Pine
This.

Nobody cares what selfish teenagers/hipsters have to say, and most can't vote anyway.

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JML897

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#8 JML897
Member since 2004 • 33134 Posts
It would have really hurt Romney.
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deactivated-59f03d6ce656b

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#9 deactivated-59f03d6ce656b
Member since 2009 • 2944 Posts
1 poll from Reason (a strongly libertarian leaning publication) Seems legits.
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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#10 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

Would be funny to see in the debates, otherwise meh.

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Fightingfan

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#11 Fightingfan
Member since 2010 • 38011 Posts

Would be funny to see in the debates, otherwise meh.

Aljosa23
That's pretty much the only reason why I like him.
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djdarkforces

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#12 djdarkforces
Member since 2009 • 812 Posts

i have read articles and watched many videos of Ron Paul and i will say he doesnt get the credit that he deserves

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Toxic-Seahorse

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#13 Toxic-Seahorse
Member since 2012 • 5074 Posts

i have read articles and watched many videos of Ron Paul and i will say he doesnt get the credit that he deserves

djdarkforces
Credit for what? What has he done?
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whipassmt

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#14 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

[QUOTE="djdarkforces"]

i have read articles and watched many videos of Ron Paul and i will say he doesnt get the credit that he deserves

Toxic-Seahorse

Credit for what? What has he done?

he totally owned William Jennings Bryan in the debate over monetary policy.

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z4twenny

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#15 z4twenny
Member since 2006 • 4898 Posts

im neither teenager nor 20 something and i would've voted for ron paul.

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-TheSecondSign-

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#16 -TheSecondSign-
Member since 2007 • 9303 Posts

He wouldn't have won. I would like a third party, and I agree that him getting about 20% of votes would be a big deal, and would definitely get the other candidates' attention, but wouldn't that also be a massive amount of money and effort for something that he knew wouldn't land him the presidency?

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Laihendi

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#17 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

He wouldn't have won. I would like a third party, and I agree that him getting about 20% of votes would be a big deal, and would definitely get the other candidates' attention, but wouldn't that also be a massive amount of money and effort for something that he knew wouldn't land him the presidency?

-TheSecondSign-
I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama and weaken the 2 party system.
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deactivated-5b78379493e12

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#18 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="-TheSecondSign-"]

He wouldn't have won. I would like a third party, and I agree that him getting about 20% of votes would be a big deal, and would definitely get the other candidates' attention, but wouldn't that also be a massive amount of money and effort for something that he knew wouldn't land him the presidency?

Laihendi

I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama and weaken the 2 party system.

Ron Paul couldn't own anyone in the GOP primary debates. It's not guaranteed that he could do anything against anyone else.

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the_bi99man

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#19 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11465 Posts

No. Paul probably didn't want to take votes away from Romney and end up helping Obama win.

whipassmt

This. As much as the two party system sucks, it's what we have right now. Third parties never get anywhere near a majority of the votes, and they only take away potential votes from the candidates that actually have a chance. That's not how it should be. That's not how it's always been. But it is the reality, at this time. And as much as Ron Paul might disagree with Romney on certain issues, he'd rather see Romney win than Obama. And he knows that his presence on the ballot would do nothing but takes votes away from Romney (and maybe a few from Obama, but far more from Romney).

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sexyweapons

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#20 sexyweapons
Member since 2009 • 5302 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="-TheSecondSign-"]

He wouldn't have won. I would like a third party, and I agree that him getting about 20% of votes would be a big deal, and would definitely get the other candidates' attention, but wouldn't that also be a massive amount of money and effort for something that he knew wouldn't land him the presidency?

jimkabrhel

I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama and weaken the 2 party system.

Ron Paul couldn't own anyone in the GOP primary debates. It's not guaranteed that he could do anything against anyone else.

He owned Romney plenty of times in the Primaries and Obama would be a pushover.
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sexyweapons

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#21 sexyweapons
Member since 2009 • 5302 Posts
[QUOTE="djdarkforces"]

i have read articles and watched many videos of Ron Paul and i will say he doesnt get the credit that he deserves

Toxic-Seahorse
Credit for what? What has he done?

what hasn't he done is more the question at hand.
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the_bi99man

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#22 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11465 Posts

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

[QUOTE="Laihendi"] I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama and weaken the 2 party system.sexyweapons

Ron Paul couldn't own anyone in the GOP primary debates. It's not guaranteed that he could do anything against anyone else.

He owned Romney plenty of times in the Primaries and Obama would be a pushover.

This. I really don't understand how anyone could possible be so dense, as to watch the GOP primaries, and not think Paul was the only one making a lick of sense.

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worlock77

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#23 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"][QUOTE="djdarkforces"]

i have read articles and watched many videos of Ron Paul and i will say he doesnt get the credit that he deserves

sexyweapons

Credit for what? What has he done?

what hasn't he done is more the question at hand.

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

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the_bi99man

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#24 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11465 Posts

[QUOTE="sexyweapons"][QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"] Credit for what? What has he done?worlock77

what hasn't he done is more the question at hand.

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

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worlock77

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#25 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="sexyweapons"] what hasn't he done is more the question at hand.the_bi99man

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

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sexyweapons

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#26 sexyweapons
Member since 2009 • 5302 Posts

[QUOTE="the_bi99man"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

worlock77

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

Audit The Fed Bill Legalisation Of Marajauna Bill and appealing to Congress to stop a bunch of wars and NDAA stuff
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sexyweapons

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#27 sexyweapons
Member since 2009 • 5302 Posts

[QUOTE="sexyweapons"][QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"] Credit for what? What has he done?worlock77

what hasn't he done is more the question at hand.

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

Its not like h hasn't tried to make a differance
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the_bi99man

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#28 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11465 Posts

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="the_bi99man"]

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

sexyweapons

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

Audit The Fed Bill Legalisation Of Marajauna Bill and appealing to Congress to stop a bunch of wars and NDAA stuff

This. He's actually been very prolific during his decades in office. But, it's hard to make things happen in congress, when literally everyone else, Republican and Democrat thinks you're crazy because you use logic, and realize that the government isn't supposed to be spending trillions of dollars it doesn't have.

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Serraph105

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#29 Serraph105
Member since 2007 • 36092 Posts

It would have been nice to see a presidential debate between three people, but I don't think it was a mistake for Ron Paul to drop out of the race.

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Barbariser

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#30 Barbariser
Member since 2009 • 6785 Posts

Wouldn't have done anything except torpedo the election for Romney.

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lloveLamp

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#31 lloveLamp
Member since 2009 • 2891 Posts
better to let the ship sink with the two party system intact.
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lloveLamp

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#32 lloveLamp
Member since 2009 • 2891 Posts
better to let the ship sink with the two party system intact.
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lloveLamp

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#33 lloveLamp
Member since 2009 • 2891 Posts
better to let the ship sink with the two party system intact.
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dercoo

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#34 dercoo
Member since 2006 • 12555 Posts

No, it hides how small his fanbase is.

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DroidPhysX

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#35 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts
Sure. That's why I donated to his campaign in the first place.
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KC_Hokie

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#36 KC_Hokie
Member since 2006 • 16099 Posts
He couldn't because his son is a republican senator.
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Laihendi

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#37 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

He couldn't because his son is a republican senator. KC_Hokie
I don't see how that is important though.

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worlock77

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#38 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]He couldn't because his son is a republican senator. Laihendi

I don't see how that is important though.

Ron's political career is in its twilight, his son's is just starting and he doesn't want to do things that could potentially damage his son's standing in the party.

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Rhazakna

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#39 Rhazakna
Member since 2004 • 11022 Posts
He would be completely blacklisted by the Republican party, since he would be a major spoiler and probably guarantee an Obama win. Reps already don't like him because he's anti-war and critical of lobbyists, but this would make him a complete pariah in mainstream GOP circles.
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Rhazakna

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#40 Rhazakna
Member since 2004 • 11022 Posts

[QUOTE="the_bi99man"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

What has he actually done? In all his years in politics what meaningful things has he accomplished?

worlock77

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

Why on Earth would you only, or even primarily judge a politician based on what he's in favor of? What someone rejects can often be far more important and telling than what they accept.
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edgewalker16

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#41 edgewalker16
Member since 2005 • 2286 Posts
He's really only popular with the college kids and 20 year olds. He is still known as the crazy guy amongst older people. He has no chance.lo_Pine
His son will have a chance once those old people die.
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l4dak47

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#42 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="lo_Pine"]He's really only popular with the college kids and 20 year olds. He is still known as the crazy guy amongst older people. He has no chance.edgewalker16
His son will have a chance once those old people die.

You're overestimating the intelligence level of Americans.
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worlock77

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#43 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="the_bi99man"]

He's been one of the only congressmen not constantly voting himself a raise, supporting meaningless, convoluted laws, or robbing the people of their rights. I'd say the fact that he's "done" so little is why he's so great.

Rhazakna

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

Why on Earth would you only, or even primarily judge a politician based on what he's in favor of? What someone rejects can often be far more important and telling than what they accept.

I didn't say I would. I'm just asking what he's accomplished. I know what he's rejected, I'd like to know what he's accomplished though.

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Rapporteur

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#44 Rapporteur
Member since 2012 • 95 Posts
I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama /and weaken the 2 party system/.Laihendi
Quite optimistic, aren't we?
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Laihendi

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#45 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="Laihendi"]I think it would be worth it to see him debate Obama /and weaken the 2 party system/.Rapporteur
Quite optimistic, aren't we?

How else can the system be weakened other than through strong third party/independent candidates?
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Rapporteur

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#46 Rapporteur
Member since 2012 • 95 Posts
It's not really a secret, but most political scientists tend to think the electoral system's configuration is a factor in determining what sort of party system a political community develops. So, yeah, call me crazy, but that might be an alternative.
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Rhazakna

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#47 Rhazakna
Member since 2004 • 11022 Posts

[QUOTE="Rhazakna"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

It's easy enough to just sit back and constantly say "no" to everything, but has he worked to actually get anything done?

worlock77

Why on Earth would you only, or even primarily judge a politician based on what he's in favor of? What someone rejects can often be far more important and telling than what they accept.

I didn't say I would. I'm just asking what he's accomplished. I know what he's rejected, I'd like to know what he's accomplished though.

"Accomplishments" in politics are vastly overrated. Bush got a whole helluva lot "accomplished".
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Laihendi

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#48 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="Rapporteur"]It's not really a secret, but most political scientists tend to think the electoral system's configuration is a factor in determining what sort of party system a political community develops. So, yeah, call me crazy, but that might be an alternative.

And we're going to do that by continuing to elect people who support the 2 party system?
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#49 Rapporteur
Member since 2012 • 95 Posts
And we're going to do that by continuing to elect people who support the 2 party system?Laihendi
Non-ideally, yes. You'd need a benevolent section of the parties to vote on the measure, otherwise it won't go through. Even ideally, you'd still need that to happen. Now, whether that does or doesn't tickle your fancy, I don't really care. I just retorted to your assertion that a strong third party candidate was the only way to weaken a two party system, which wasn't correct. The other complaint I have is assuming that a strong third party showing in the Presidential election is going to do much to weaken the two party system (we've had this before recently, nothing much happened). This isn't really the most sensible solution. Yes, I'll grant that if you have a good showing in the Presidential elections, you'll get more exposure -- that much is obvious. However, if you don't continue this momentum into Congressionals, you'll only ever be ineffectual. If you want a road to change, it'd seem like you'd want to establish a strong base in state congresses and eventually Congress, then focus on the Presidential.
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Laihendi

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#50 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="Laihendi"]And we're going to do that by continuing to elect people who support the 2 party system?Rapporteur
Non-ideally, yes. You'd need a benevolent section of the parties to vote on the measure, otherwise it won't go through.

Let's just ignore the fact that people have been voting for people who support the 2 party system since it has existed, and that has done nothing to weaken it.