Why are people who are pro-life demonized?

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the_plan_man

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#1 the_plan_man
Member since 2011 • 1664 Posts

They are battling for the rights of the unborn, ones that cannot make the decision themselves. While the pro-choice audience believes they are only concerned with taking away the "choice" of the woman, it is really just the "choice" to take away someone's chance at life, and fewer choices would probably help deter people with half a conscience from having unprotected sex. Anybody using the "coat hanger" method (who we're fighting for's "rights") should receive the death penalty, or a very harsh punishment, and we should crack down on that at all costs. What do you think?

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Chris_Williams

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#2 Chris_Williams
Member since 2009 • 14882 Posts

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

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lightleggy

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#3 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chris_Williams
Because she isn't ending her life, but another one. "But it's just a collection of cells, not a human being!" And that's where the debate starts
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Zuzuvela

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#4 Zuzuvela
Member since 2013 • 1993 Posts
Because of the extent they go to when trying to get support. shoving pictures of aborted babys in peoples faces in busy streets and practically harassing them
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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#5 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

Why are people who are pro-slavery demonized?

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lightleggy

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#6 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts
Because of the extent they go to when trying to get support. shoving pictures of aborted babys in peoples faces in busy streets and practically harassing themZuzuvela
Not the best methods, but it's a noble cause.
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XilePrincess

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#7 XilePrincess
Member since 2008 • 13130 Posts
People who are pro life are not demonized. You can be pro life and not shove that belief down the throats of others. Those are the people who get flack, not everyone who is pro life. But evidently you're not up to speed on the birth control situation in many parts of the world, are you? It's many of the same people who are against abortion that are perpetuating a demand for it with their actions. Even in many first world countries, pro life and religious groups are fighting to have planned parenthood shut down, sex education only include abstinence and NOT birth control, and making birth control inaccessible and expensive. Perhaps if you taught young people about contraception rather than just abstinence and gave them access to information and tools to prevent unwanted pregnancy, there would be far fewer abortions performed.
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Chris_Williams

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#8 Chris_Williams
Member since 2009 • 14882 Posts
[QUOTE="Chris_Williams"]

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

lightleggy
Because she isn't ending her life, but another one. "But it's just a collection of cells, not a human being!" And that's where the debate starts

does anything ever get accomplish in these debates?
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lightleggy

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#9 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts

Why are people who are pro-slavery demonized?

Aljosa23
Because they are trying to remove the rights of a person who already has them, who can think, who is rational and who can make a life for itself (most of the times) So this argument is completely stupid, it's like comparing a homosexual man with a burglar
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worlock77

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#10 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

If you're pro-life then don't have an abortion. That's about as far as your say-so extends and should extend.

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lightleggy

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#11 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts
[QUOTE="lightleggy"][QUOTE="Chris_Williams"]

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chris_Williams
Because she isn't ending her life, but another one. "But it's just a collection of cells, not a human being!" And that's where the debate starts

does anything ever get accomplish in these debates?

Someone usually gets so pissed they end up leaving and then they claim they won in front of their friends.
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The_Lipscomb

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#12 The_Lipscomb
Member since 2013 • 2603 Posts

I have the position of I don't care.

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lightleggy

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#13 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts
[QUOTE="XilePrincess"]People who are pro life are not demonized. You can be pro life and not shove that belief down the throats of others. Those are the people who get flack, not everyone who is pro life. But evidently you're not up to speed on the birth control situation in many parts of the world, are you? It's many of the same people who are against abortion that are perpetuating a demand for it with their actions. Even in many first world countries, pro life and religious groups are fighting to have planned parenthood shut down, sex education only include abstinence and NOT birth control, and making birth control inaccessible and expensive. Perhaps if you taught young people about contraception rather than just abstinence and gave them access to information and tools to prevent unwanted pregnancy, there would be far fewer abortions performed.

The funny part is that we're actually at the lowest point of teen pregnancies since like the 1950s or something like that.
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XilePrincess

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#14 XilePrincess
Member since 2008 • 13130 Posts
[QUOTE="lightleggy"] The funny part is that we're actually at the lowest point of teen pregnancies since like the 1950s or something like that.

Which is fantastic, but I'm not crediting that at ALL to people being progressive. I'm crediting that to the internet giving information and help when parents and schools won't. I credit even shows like 16 and pregnant for bringing light to the situation. But that doesn't fix the fact that birth control is still hard to get in some places, and education about anything but abstinence is hard to find anywhere other than the internet isn't good or promising for the future. And as for teaching teenagers, I'm not talking about JUST teen pregnancies, I'm talking about educating young people BEFORE disaster strikes and puberty sets in so that teens, 20somethings and beyond will not need abortions that could have been avoided by proper use of birth control and proper sex ed. Teach them young, they can carry it with them through life.
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lostrib

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#15 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

They do and say some pretty fvcked up stuff

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lostrib

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#16 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

If you're pro-life then don't have an abortion. That's about as far as your say-so extends and should extend.

worlock77

well they view it as murder

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foxhound_fox

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#17 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts
Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.
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Murderstyle75

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#18 Murderstyle75
Member since 2011 • 4412 Posts

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chris_Williams
Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.
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#19 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts
[...] it's like comparing a homosexual man with a burglarlightleggy
There is a fanny bandit joke here, I tihnk.
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RadecSupreme

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#20 RadecSupreme
Member since 2009 • 4824 Posts

Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.foxhound_fox

You're the idiot. I'm pro-life and I'm not religious nor do I enforce it on anyone else. I simply value human life more than you do.

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Murderstyle75

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#21 Murderstyle75
Member since 2011 • 4412 Posts
[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.

What if you are the father?
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lostrib

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#22 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.foxhound_fox

Well I don't murder people, but I still think it should be illegal for others to do it

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lostrib

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#23 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.Murderstyle75
What if you are the father?

oh man that always gets complicated.  

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deactivated-5b19214ec908b

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#24 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
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[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.RadecSupreme

You're the idiot. I'm pro-life and I'm not religious nor do I enforce it on anyone else. I simply value human life more than you do.

Then you're pro-choice. 

Pro-choice doesn't mean you support abbortion, it just means you give them a choice (i.e you don't force your views on them)

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lostrib

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#25 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

[QUOTE="RadecSupreme"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.toast_burner

You're the idiot. I'm pro-life and I'm not religious nor do I enforce it on anyone else. I simply value human life more than you do.

Then you're pro-choice. 

Pro-choice doesn't mean you support abbortion, it just means you give them a choice (i.e you don't force your views on them)

well if he still votes for pro life candidates and anti-abortion laws, then he would be pro life

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famicommander

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#26 famicommander
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[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.

I'm completely non-religious and I am against abortion on the grounds that it constitutes aggression against an innocent. It is non-compatible with the nonaggression principle. Your reasoning that pro-lifers should just not have abortions themselves is exactly the same thing as saying that if you're against theft or murder your only course of action should be to not commit theft and murder. That's obvious, but it doesn't address the problem of OTHER people murdering and stealing. The whole debate is patently dishonest. When you say, "Nobody should have the right to tell a woman what to do with her body" you ignore the fact that the woman getting the abortion is herself telling someone else what to do with THEIR body; namely, she's telling the unborn child to die. This is not the same thing as prohibiting someone from taking drugs, which is wrong because it truly does only involve THEIR body. An abortion by definition involves TWO bodies; that one resides inside the other doesn't change the fact that they are distinct.
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#27 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts
[QUOTE="Murderstyle75"] Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.

Because rape doesn't exist and birth control works 100% of the time.
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deactivated-598fc45371265

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#28 deactivated-598fc45371265
Member since 2008 • 13247 Posts

Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.foxhound_fox

belive it or not there are pro-life atheists out there including myself

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BossPerson

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#29 BossPerson
Member since 2011 • 9177 Posts

Why are people who are pro-slavery demonized?

Aljosa23
you cant seriously compare the two...
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lostrib

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#30 lostrib
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[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.famicommander
I'm completely non-religious and I am against abortion on the grounds that it constitutes aggression against an innocent. It is non-compatible with the nonaggression principle. Your reasoning that pro-lifers should just not have abortions themselves is exactly the same thing as saying that if you're against theft or murder your only course of action should be to not commit theft and murder. That's obvious, but it doesn't address the problem of OTHER people murdering and stealing. The whole debate is patently dishonest. When you say, "Nobody should have the right to tell a woman what to do with her body" you ignore the fact that the woman getting the abortion is herself telling someone else what to do with THEIR body; namely, she's telling the unborn child to die. This is not the same thing as prohibiting someone from taking drugs, which is wrong because it truly does only involve THEIR body. An abortion by definition involves TWO bodies; that one resides inside the other doesn't change the fact that they are distinct.

But when is it a person?

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deactivated-5b19214ec908b

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#31 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="RadecSupreme"]

You're the idiot. I'm pro-life and I'm not religious nor do I enforce it on anyone else. I simply value human life more than you do.

lostrib

Then you're pro-choice. 

Pro-choice doesn't mean you support abbortion, it just means you give them a choice (i.e you don't force your views on them)

well if he still votes for pro life candidates and anti-abortion laws, then he would be pro life

Then he is forcing his views on to people. 

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#32 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Then you're pro-choice. 

Pro-choice doesn't mean you support abbortion, it just means you give them a choice (i.e you don't force your views on them)

toast_burner

well if he still votes for pro life candidates and anti-abortion laws, then he would be pro life

Then he is forcing his views on to people. 

true, but I would imagine he is thinking of the whackjobs that stand outside clinics and show aborted fetuses to people

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#33 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
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[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.Murderstyle75
What if you are the father?

Does the father have to endure pregnancy for 9 months?

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The_Lipscomb

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#34 The_Lipscomb
Member since 2013 • 2603 Posts

[QUOTE="Murderstyle75"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.toast_burner

What if you are the father?

Does the father have to endure pregnancy for 9 months?

Why impregnate the woman in the first place?
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deactivated-598fc45371265

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#35 deactivated-598fc45371265
Member since 2008 • 13247 Posts

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Then you're pro-choice. 

Pro-choice doesn't mean you support abbortion, it just means you give them a choice (i.e you don't force your views on them)

toast_burner

well if he still votes for pro life candidates and anti-abortion laws, then he would be pro life

Then he is forcing his views on to people. 

Unless you're a pure libertarian you have no right to talk.

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ghoklebutter

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#36 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
Because they're anti-abortion.
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famicommander

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#37 famicommander
Member since 2008 • 8524 Posts
[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="Murderstyle75"] Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.

Because rape doesn't exist and birth control works 100% of the time.

The rape qualifier is absolutely ridiculous. Extract the logic from your statement. Either abortion is murder and should always be illegal or it isn't murder and it should always be legal. To make a special case for rape or incest is to say that people born as a result of a rare or incest are somehow less deserving of their right to live than people born through normal circumstances. The actual acts of rape or incest are of course deplorable, but in allowing abortion in those cases and not others you are explicitly punishing the innocent child in the case for the crimes of one or both of their parents. Either you're against murder or you're not. If you consider abortion murder you should be against all kinds of abortion (except when it is to save the life of the mother) and if you don't consider it murder you should not.
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#38 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="lostrib"]

well if he still votes for pro life candidates and anti-abortion laws, then he would be pro life

Storm_Marine

Then he is forcing his views on to people. 

Unless you're a pure libertarian you have no right to talk.

Brilliant logic :roll:

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ghoklebutter

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#39 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
Anybody using the "coat hanger" method (who we're fighting for's "rights") should receive the death penalty, or a very harsh punishment, and we should crack down on that at all costs.the_plan_man
What if the person is pregnant due to rape?
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#40 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="Murderstyle75"] Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.famicommander
Because rape doesn't exist and birth control works 100% of the time.

The rape qualifier is absolutely ridiculous. Extract the logic from your statement. Either abortion is murder and should always be illegal or it isn't murder and it should always be legal. To make a special case for rape or incest is to say that people born as a result of a rare or incest are somehow less deserving of their right to live than people born through normal circumstances. The actual acts of rape or incest are of course deplorable, but in allowing abortion in those cases and not others you are explicitly punishing the innocent child in the case for the crimes of one or both of their parents. Either you're against murder or you're not. If you consider abortion murder you should be against all kinds of abortion (except when it is to save the life of the mother) and if you don't consider it murder you should not.

Did you only read half of his post?

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lostrib

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#41 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="Murderstyle75"] Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.famicommander
Because rape doesn't exist and birth control works 100% of the time.

The rape qualifier is absolutely ridiculous. Extract the logic from your statement. Either abortion is murder and should always be illegal or it isn't murder and it should always be legal. To make a special case for rape or incest is to say that people born as a result of a rare or incest are somehow less deserving of their right to live than people born through normal circumstances. The actual acts of rape or incest are of course deplorable, but in allowing abortion in those cases and not others you are explicitly punishing the innocent child in the case for the crimes of one or both of their parents. Either you're against murder or you're not. If you consider abortion murder you should be against all kinds of abortion (except when it is to save the life of the mother) and if you don't consider it murder you should not.

i think you missed the point

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Murderstyle75

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#42 Murderstyle75
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[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="Murderstyle75"] Apparently nobody since she didn't have to spread her legs without using birth control to begin with. It you ask me, a woman who has an abortion should be labeled a deadbeat.

Because rape doesn't exist and birth control works 100% of the time.

Not talking about rape. Rape is probably the only logical exception. And birth control works pretty damn well. Most are over 99% effective. A lot of women unfortunatly don't think about birth control until its too late. Abortion becomes the birth control. During my last stint of being single, I dated a whole lot thanks to bars and Internet dating. Lets just say I was running around like Glen Quagmire for about two years. Now guess how many women asked me to wear a condom? Zero.
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#43 deactivated-598fc45371265
Member since 2008 • 13247 Posts

[QUOTE="Storm_Marine"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Then he is forcing his views on to people. 

toast_burner

Unless you're a pure libertarian you have no right to talk.

Brilliant logic :roll:

I'm just hoping that you're consistent with your opinon that 'forcing views on people' is wrong. Somehow i doubt you are.

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famicommander

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#44 famicommander
Member since 2008 • 8524 Posts

[QUOTE="famicommander"][QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]Because they are idiots trying to enforce their religious beliefs on others politically. Go ahead, choose not to have an abortion yourself, but don't try to tell anyone else what they should and should not do. Especially men.lostrib

I'm completely non-religious and I am against abortion on the grounds that it constitutes aggression against an innocent. It is non-compatible with the nonaggression principle. Your reasoning that pro-lifers should just not have abortions themselves is exactly the same thing as saying that if you're against theft or murder your only course of action should be to not commit theft and murder. That's obvious, but it doesn't address the problem of OTHER people murdering and stealing. The whole debate is patently dishonest. When you say, "Nobody should have the right to tell a woman what to do with her body" you ignore the fact that the woman getting the abortion is herself telling someone else what to do with THEIR body; namely, she's telling the unborn child to die. This is not the same thing as prohibiting someone from taking drugs, which is wrong because it truly does only involve THEIR body. An abortion by definition involves TWO bodies; that one resides inside the other doesn't change the fact that they are distinct.

But when is it a person?

It is a person at the moment it becomes a living thing (conception). It is a unique, living entity with unique, human DNA. If it is not a person then what is it? Any other definition is necessarily arbitrary. Before conception it is simply two cells of its parents and therefore not a unique entity; at any point past conception it is its own entity in any of many different stages of development. To say that a fetus is less deserving of its right to live because it is in a less complex stage of development is logically no different than saying it's okay to kill retarded people or babies; both are less developed than a healthy adult.
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#45 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="Storm_Marine"]

Unless you're a pure libertarian you have no right to talk.

Storm_Marine

Brilliant logic :roll:

I'm just hoping that you're consistent with your opinon that 'forcing views on people' is wrong. Somehow i doubt you are.

I usaually favour giving people a choice. Being pro-choice doesn't force anything on anyone. 

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MakeMeaSammitch

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#46 MakeMeaSammitch
Member since 2012 • 4889 Posts

People like you are part of the reason for anti abortionists being hated.

That and acting like a woman doesn't own her body.

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AdamPA1006

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#47 AdamPA1006
Member since 2004 • 6422 Posts

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chris_Williams
Fetus =/= womens body.
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#48 deactivated-598fc45371265
Member since 2008 • 13247 Posts

[QUOTE="Storm_Marine"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Brilliant logic :roll:

toast_burner

I'm just hoping that you're consistent with your opinon that 'forcing views on people' is wrong. Somehow i doubt you are.

I usaually favour giving people a choice. Being pro-choice doesn't force anything on anyone. 

in other words you don't force things on people except those times when you do. Congratulations, you're like everyone else.

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foxhound_fox

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#49 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts
[QUOTE="famicommander"] I'm completely non-religious and I am against abortion on the grounds that it constitutes aggression against an innocent. It is non-compatible with the nonaggression principle. Your reasoning that pro-lifers should just not have abortions themselves is exactly the same thing as saying that if you're against theft or murder your only course of action should be to not commit theft and murder. That's obvious, but it doesn't address the problem of OTHER people murdering and stealing. The whole debate is patently dishonest. When you say, "Nobody should have the right to tell a woman what to do with her body" you ignore the fact that the woman getting the abortion is herself telling someone else what to do with THEIR body; namely, she's telling the unborn child to die. This is not the same thing as prohibiting someone from taking drugs, which is wrong because it truly does only involve THEIR body. An abortion by definition involves TWO bodies; that one resides inside the other doesn't change the fact that they are distinct.

Your position requires the unborn child being defined as an autonomous entity separate from the mother. Until about 5-6 months, a foetus cannot survive outside the womb (as it has not developed enough), and even then, will struggle it's entire life with malformed organs (due to punctuated gestation) and other complications. I don't like the idea of abortion, and wouldn't choose it myself if found in such a situation, but given the state of foster care, the state of NICU care for premature babies and the feasibility of allowing every life created to be given a chance, financially and emotionally, to live life, abortion is the only logical option at the moment. When funding for unwanted children materializes, the technology comes about that allows an unwanted foetus to be transplanted and religious nutjob politicians who enforce abstinence only sex ed die off, then I'll be first in line to vote on the criminalization of abortion. There isn't a feasible non-religious position against abortion currently. Idealism is nice until the cost of implementing it comes up. And I doubt an anarcho-libertarian society could realistically tackle such a massive undertaking.
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#50 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="Storm_Marine"]

I'm just hoping that you're consistent with your opinon that 'forcing views on people' is wrong. Somehow i doubt you are.

Storm_Marine

I usaually favour giving people a choice. Being pro-choice doesn't force anything on anyone. 

oh my

So inorder not to be a hypocrite i must be an anarchist? Obviously I oppose things like rape, theft and murder. 

Do you have an actual argument?