Why do people see a conflict in believing in both God and science?

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ShadowMoses900

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#1 ShadowMoses900
Member since 2010 • 17081 Posts

I tell people that I believe in both God and Evolution and I always get people getting surprised and upset at my statement (religious and atheists) and I don't understand why? How is it a conflict if you believe that God simply guided or used Evoltution to create humans? And why do people get upset about that? I hear from some religious people that I'm a heritic because I belive in Evolution, and I hear from some Athiests that Ican't belive in God and Evolution because they say that "smart people"(their words not mine) don't believe in God and that only athiests can "truly understand" (again their words not mine)Evolution.

WellI'm sorry butboth those groups are wrong IMO, the relgious people refusing to accept science and learn about the world are not understanding what God is about IMO and arn't willing to see the way God works, while the atheists need to realise that believing in God doesn't make someone "stupid" nor does not beliving in God make someone "smarter" it doesn't and atheism has NOTHING to do withscience and Evolution isn't exclusive to atheists. When both groups realise this the better....

I respect other peoples views but I find it wrong when people try to create a conflict between these two things, does anyone else?

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Kcube

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#2 Kcube
Member since 2003 • 25398 Posts
The only people I know of doing that are the Neo-Cons.. It's possible to believe in Creation and evolution but they are always right and the rest of us are always wrong.
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scorch-62

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#3 scorch-62
Member since 2006 • 29763 Posts
Because of atheists.
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cd_rom

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#4 cd_rom
Member since 2003 • 13951 Posts
Look up Deism.
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cybrcatter

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#5 cybrcatter
Member since 2003 • 16210 Posts

I respect other peoples views

ShadowMoses900

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

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Frame_Dragger

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#6 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
Because of atheists.scorch-62
I disagree, the only people who have a real issue with it are specifically fundamentalist christians. Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc... all can simply ascribe the way the universe works as the "how", and god as the "why". Unless you think the new testament is 100% accurate, and lack the ability to comprehend the word, "parable", it's not an issue.
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Frame_Dragger

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#7 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="cybrcatter"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I respect other peoples views

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful.
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cd_rom

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#8 cd_rom
Member since 2003 • 13951 Posts
[QUOTE="scorch-62"]Because of atheists.Frame_Dragger
I disagree, the only people who have a real issue with it are specifically fundamentalist christians. Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc... all can simply ascribe the way the universe works as the "how", and god as the "why". Unless you think the new testament is 100% accurate, and lack the ability to comprehend the word, "parable", it's not an issue.

Because of neo-atheists.
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KDhigherthangod

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#9 KDhigherthangod
Member since 2011 • 59 Posts

I think it's a conflict in ideology

Religion vs. Science

Assumption vs. Experimentation, evidence, never assuming something to be 100% correct, ect.

The ideologies are opposite, so there will always be conflict.

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Last-Origin

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#10 Last-Origin
Member since 2011 • 25 Posts

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I respect other peoples views

cybrcatter

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

He also would shoot people that would want to ban guns.
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Pirate700

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#11 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

Some people see a conflict. I don't. It just depends what you're definition of creationism is.

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Frame_Dragger

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#12 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="scorch-62"]Because of atheists.cd_rom
I disagree, the only people who have a real issue with it are specifically fundamentalist christians. Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc... all can simply ascribe the way the universe works as the "how", and god as the "why". Unless you think the new testament is 100% accurate, and lack the ability to comprehend the word, "parable", it's not an issue.

Because of neo-atheists.

Whatever you say.
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cybrcatter

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#13 cybrcatter
Member since 2003 • 16210 Posts

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I respect other peoples views

Frame_Dragger

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful.

I'm not here to help anyone.

Thank you for this most informative post.

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194197844077667059316682358889

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#14 194197844077667059316682358889
Member since 2003 • 49173 Posts

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="cybrcatter"] Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

cybrcatter

Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful.

I'm not here to help anyone.

Thank you for this most informative post.

You are extremely helpful to me
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parkurtommo

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#15 parkurtommo
Member since 2009 • 28295 Posts

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I respect other peoples views

cybrcatter

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

EDIT:

meh

nvm

Yeah I dunno TC maybe because they almost contradict each other. Almost, not quite.

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Frame_Dragger

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#16 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="cybrcatter"] Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

cybrcatter

Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful.

I'm not here to help anyone.

Thank you for this most informative post.

OooooooooK. Just figured that you'd want the heads-up.... not the first time I've been wrong, won't be the last.

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Pirate700

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#17 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I respect other peoples views

parkurtommo

Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

EDIT:

meh

nvm

Yeah I dunno TC maybe because they almost contradict each other. Almost, not quite.

They don't contradict each other unless you're only going strictly by the bible.

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cybrcatter

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#18 cybrcatter
Member since 2003 • 16210 Posts

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"]

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"] Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful. xaos

I'm not here to help anyone.

Thank you for this most informative post.

You are extremely helpful to me

Surely that was drunk cybr.

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parkurtommo

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#19 parkurtommo
Member since 2009 • 28295 Posts

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"]

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"] Um... GS hasn't actually changed its rules on trolliing yet, just a heads-up. I don't see how bringing the baggage of many other threads to this, instead of offering an answer is goingto be helpful. Frame_Dragger

I'm not here to help anyone.

Thank you for this most informative post.

OooooooooK. Just figured that you'd want the heads-up.... not the first time I've been wrong, won't be the last.

He knows frame

he knows.

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parkurtommo

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#20 parkurtommo
Member since 2009 • 28295 Posts

[QUOTE="parkurtommo"]

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"] Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

Pirate700

EDIT:

meh

nvm

Yeah I dunno TC maybe because they almost contradict each other. Almost, not quite.

They don't contradict each other unless you're only going strictly by the bible.

that's why I said almost
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Frame_Dragger

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#21 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Pirate700"]

[QUOTE="parkurtommo"]

[QUOTE="cybrcatter"] Aren't you the youngster who calls folks who don't support Israel in 100% of its endeavors anti-Semites?

EDIT:

meh

nvm

Yeah I dunno TC maybe because they almost contradict each other. Almost, not quite.

They don't contradict each other unless you're only going strictly by the bible.

I mean, REALLY strictly too... which also means that you basically think the Flintstones represents near-documentary material. Then again, these people are (a VERY vocal) minority in this country and the world, so I would say generally... no conflict. Certainly generations of Indian hindu scientists see no conflict, Muslim scientists have no problem, Jewish scientists know it's kosher, and non-frothing-at-the-mouth Christians have made it work. It's a pretty recent development that the issue has been biblical literalism, as opposed to a political issue a la Gallileo.
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DeX2010

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#22 DeX2010
Member since 2010 • 3989 Posts
Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.
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Pirate700

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#23 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.DeX2010
So God couldn't have caused the big bang theory?

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ShadowMoses900

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#24 ShadowMoses900
Member since 2010 • 17081 Posts

I just thought I would chime in here real quick again and just say that I find it funny how (most) people in this thread don't want to discuss the question at hand and would rather justmake fun of me or derail the thread. Why go into a thread and not contribute to it? :?

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Ace6301

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#25 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.Pirate700

So God couldn't have caused the big bang theory?

I think it's mostly fundamentalists who disagree with both. Science and God can be rationalized so there's room for both. However if you're taking genesis literally then the big bang didn't happen. That and the whole 6000 year old earth thing which science kind of disproves.
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194197844077667059316682358889

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#26 194197844077667059316682358889
Member since 2003 • 49173 Posts

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.Pirate700

So God couldn't have caused the big bang theory?

That show is the work of something worse than Satan
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Barbariser

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#27 Barbariser
Member since 2009 • 6785 Posts

A literal interpretation of most religious texts is incompatible with modern scientific knowledge, that's why.

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Pirate700

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#28 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

[QUOTE="Pirate700"]

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.xaos

So God couldn't have caused the big bang theory?

That show is the work of something worse than Satan

:lol: True enough.

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Frame_Dragger

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#29 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="Pirate700"]

Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.DeX2010
So God couldn't have caused the big bang theory?

I think it's mostly fundamentalists who disagree with both. Science and God can be rationalized so there's room for both. However if you're taking genesis literally then the big bang didn't happen. That and the whole 6000 year old earth thing which science kind of disproves.

Yeah, and taking things on faith that way also fundamentally conflicts with the scientific method and mindset. Sometimes even in less than biblical literalists you see the issue of mindset, but frankly I see that in lots of people regardless of religion; education seems to be the bigger factor there.
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ShadowMoses900

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#30 ShadowMoses900
Member since 2010 • 17081 Posts

Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.DeX2010

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

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Frame_Dragger

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#31 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts

A literal interpretation of most religious texts is incompatible with modern scientific knowledge, that's why.

Barbariser
Most religions don't accept a literal interpretation of their texts however, or don't both have literal interpretations AND a specific creation myth. Judaism for instance, comes out of the gate with the Torah as parable and metaphor, not something to be taken literally.
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DeX2010

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#32 DeX2010
Member since 2010 • 3989 Posts

I am not really sure if I believe in god. There is part of me that takes comfort in believing in god, because for some, the concept of god is reassuring and like a safety mat. With no god, there is no 'I'll be ok' anymore.

But I'll just chime in here and say that I guess there is room for religion and science together... If the Pope says God control's all individual particles and therefore the Big Bang was his will. :)

NOTE: I don't have anything against anyone, nor do I critize anyone for there beliefs, and yes, this looks like a disclaimer you see in advertisements.

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Pirate700

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#33 Pirate700
Member since 2008 • 46465 Posts

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.ShadowMoses900

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

This discussion seems to be going in circles...

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Frame_Dragger

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#34 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.ShadowMoses900

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

Barring radical and unimaginable breakthroughs in physics, there is no conflict.
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Colin1192

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#35 Colin1192
Member since 2008 • 6221 Posts

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.ShadowMoses900

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

how could one man do such a thing?
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Kcube

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#36 Kcube
Member since 2003 • 25398 Posts

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.Pirate700

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

This discussion seems to be going in circles...

Ok.. The big nag never happened and we have always just been here.
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Frame_Dragger

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#37 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Colin1192"][QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.DeX2010

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

how could one man do such a thing?

A big firecracker?
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cybrcatter

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#38 cybrcatter
Member since 2003 • 16210 Posts

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.Colin1192

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

how could one man do such a thing?

It's easier than you think.

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Joshywaa

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#39 Joshywaa
Member since 2002 • 10991 Posts

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="DeX2010"]Not everyone generally. But, most 'very religious' people tend to believe that God Created the world. Scientists have the Big Bang theory, and that is where the conflict arises.Colin1192

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

how could one man do such a thing?

I've never really pictured God as "one man", so to speak.

I've never really pictured him/it as a "being" at all, for that matter :o

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Frame_Dragger

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#40 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Joshywaa"]

[QUOTE="Colin1192"][QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

But I belive God used the Big Bang to create the world, I don't see the conflict :?

how could one man do such a thing?

I've never really pictured God as "one man", so to speak.

I've never really pictured him/it as a "being" at all, for that matter :o

That's why the firecracker has to be EXTRA huge.
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ShadowMoses900

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#41 ShadowMoses900
Member since 2010 • 17081 Posts

[QUOTE="Barbariser"]

A literal interpretation of most religious texts is incompatible with modern scientific knowledge, that's why.

Frame_Dragger

Most religions don't accept a literal interpretation of their texts however, or don't both have literal interpretations AND a specific creation myth. Judaism for instance, comes out of the gate with the Torah as parable and metaphor, not something to be taken literally.

Well the more stricter sects of Judaism do take the Torah Literally, I once had an Orthodox Rabbi tell me when I was a little kid that the dinosaur bones were put here to test our faith, and even as a little kid I knew that was silly lol.

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Frame_Dragger

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#42 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="Barbariser"]

A literal interpretation of most religious texts is incompatible with modern scientific knowledge, that's why.

Most religions don't accept a literal interpretation of their texts however, or don't both have literal interpretations AND a specific creation myth. Judaism for instance, comes out of the gate with the Torah as parable and metaphor, not something to be taken literally.

Well the more stricter sects of Judaism do take the Torah Literally, I once had an Orthodox Rabbi tell me when I was a little kid that the dinosaur bones were put here to test our faith, and even as a little kid I knew that was silly lol.

Oh... them... OK, let me be more precise... with the except of ultra-orthodox sects that think it's 2011 on the JEWISH calender. :P
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branketra

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#43 branketra
Member since 2006 • 51726 Posts

It's just a smartass approach, that's all. Both sides are to blame.

On one hand, you have a side that encourages faith and trust. In some cases, certain religions actually have it that to demand God to perform for them, thereby providing its existence, is blasphemy. At the core of that idea, I believe it means well. You wouldn't want a tyrannical king ordering someone to chop your head off as a way of proving himself, would you? Probably the same thing here.

On the other hand, you have modern science, which requires evidence to be accepted, period. If not direct evidence, proof that an idea cannot be disproven. When something like a God who isn't considered apparently evident comes into the picture, science doesn't accept it. Again, it's in science's best interest to focus on evidence to get anywhere, for most people. Faith and science aren't enemies; they actually have similarities. It's just that the differences between them are so controversial to some that combining them would regress humanity.

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Frame_Dragger

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#44 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
It's just a smartass approach, that's all. Both sides are to blame. On one hand, you have a side that encourages faith and trust. In some cases, certain religions actually have it that demanding God to perform for them, providing its existence, is blasphemy. At the core of that idea, I believe it means well. You wouldn't want a tyrannical king ordering someone to chop your head off as a way of proving himself, would you? Probably the same thing here. On the other hand, you have modern science, which requires evidence to be accepted, period. If not direct evidence, proof that an idea cannot be disproven. When something like a God who isn't considered apparently evident comes into the picture, science doesn't accept it. Again, it's in science's best interest to focus on evidence to get anywhere, for most people. Faith and science aren't enemies; they actually have similarities. It's just that the differences between them are so controversial to some that combining them would regress humanity.BranKetra
I agree that they are incompatible as a single entity, but a person can have both; they just can't try to use one to support the other. Personally, I find that the scientifc mindset puts me on the more atheistic end of agnosticism, but the notion that the universe we explore is made by a god outside of that universe is fine. I don't see the need for that, but it doesn't conflict with science either, at least, not yet, nor is it likely to anytime in our lives.
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#45 deactivated-58df4522915cb
Member since 2007 • 5527 Posts

I dont have a problem with it. I mean im christian, but i think god used evolution as a means of creating us.

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branketra

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#46 branketra
Member since 2006 • 51726 Posts
[QUOTE="BranKetra"]It's just a smartass approach, that's all. Both sides are to blame. On one hand, you have a side that encourages faith and trust. In some cases, certain religions actually have it that demanding God to perform for them, providing its existence, is blasphemy. At the core of that idea, I believe it means well. You wouldn't want a tyrannical king ordering someone to chop your head off as a way of proving himself, would you? Probably the same thing here. On the other hand, you have modern science, which requires evidence to be accepted, period. If not direct evidence, proof that an idea cannot be disproven. When something like a God who isn't considered apparently evident comes into the picture, science doesn't accept it. Again, it's in science's best interest to focus on evidence to get anywhere, for most people. Faith and science aren't enemies; they actually have similarities. It's just that the differences between them are so controversial to some that combining them would regress humanity.Frame_Dragger
I agree that they are incompatible as a single entity, but a person can have both; they just can't try to use one to support the other. Personally, I find that the scientifc mindset puts me on the more atheistic end of agnosticism, but the notion that the universe we explore is made by a god outside of that universe is fine. I don't see the need for that, but it doesn't conflict with science either, at least, not yet, nor is it likely to anytime in our lives.

Pretty much. Although, I do think you could use faith to support science. IMO it would eventually lead to a thought-process with idealistic tendencies, though. So, I won't go there.
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Frame_Dragger

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#47 Frame_Dragger
Member since 2009 • 9581 Posts
[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="BranKetra"]It's just a smartass approach, that's all. Both sides are to blame. On one hand, you have a side that encourages faith and trust. In some cases, certain religions actually have it that demanding God to perform for them, providing its existence, is blasphemy. At the core of that idea, I believe it means well. You wouldn't want a tyrannical king ordering someone to chop your head off as a way of proving himself, would you? Probably the same thing here. On the other hand, you have modern science, which requires evidence to be accepted, period. If not direct evidence, proof that an idea cannot be disproven. When something like a God who isn't considered apparently evident comes into the picture, science doesn't accept it. Again, it's in science's best interest to focus on evidence to get anywhere, for most people. Faith and science aren't enemies; they actually have similarities. It's just that the differences between them are so controversial to some that combining them would regress humanity.BranKetra
I agree that they are incompatible as a single entity, but a person can have both; they just can't try to use one to support the other. Personally, I find that the scientifc mindset puts me on the more atheistic end of agnosticism, but the notion that the universe we explore is made by a god outside of that universe is fine. I don't see the need for that, but it doesn't conflict with science either, at least, not yet, nor is it likely to anytime in our lives.

Pretty much. Although, I do think you could use faith to support science. IMO it would eventually lead to a thought-process with idealistic tendencies, though. So, I won't go there.

You might be right, but as I've never had a moment's idealism AFAIK, I'm not the guy to comment anyway. :P
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Human-after-all

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#48 Human-after-all
Member since 2009 • 2972 Posts
It depends on their belief for me. I don't have a problem combining them in some ways...but i have afterthoughts when someone tells me "god facilitated evolution" and they are [pick-your-religion]. It just sounds like desperate attempt to keep everything connected to religion. I
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alexside1

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#49 alexside1
Member since 2006 • 4412 Posts
[QUOTE="scorch-62"]Because of atheists.Frame_Dragger
I disagree, the only people who have a real issue with it are specifically fundamentalist christians. Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc... all can simply ascribe the way the universe works as the "how", and god as the "why". Unless you think the new testament is 100% accurate, and lack the ability to comprehend the word, "parable", it's not an issue.

I know a user that is an example of scorch-62 statement.
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Jd1680a

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#50 Jd1680a
Member since 2005 • 5960 Posts
Questioning the bible the slightest will get alot backlash from those who are brainwashed. Kind of sad to think there are people who allow someone else tell them what to think and remain in 18th century.