Your thoughts on :Israel

The little country that America is always supporting in the middle east. That is also almost always recently fighting the palestinians.
I believe that there is a whole lot wrong with them. So far, they seem to have been only making things worse for the palestinans rather than
making peace with them. They have pushed them out slowly out of what they believe is their land, and theirs alone when in fact the palestinans
have shared this land with them for years without a hitch until recently.

What are your thoughts on this small country run by Zionists?

The country will fall eventually. It has too many internal and external foes. This is not to mention that the whole country is dependent on Washington to remain viable. It depends on one lobby, and America is pretty whimsical; Congress loyal only to itself. It won't last.xXBuffJeffXx

[QUOTE="xXBuffJeffXx"]The country will fall eventually. It has too many internal and external foes. This is not to mention that the whole country is dependent on Washington to remain viable. It depends on one lobby, and America is pretty whimsical; Congress loyal only to itself. It won't last.vito_128

Sort of. The Congressmen don't have to be pro-Zionist. AIPAC has many members and a lot of money. Congress will support Israel while it is convenient to them. When Israel is no longer necessary; when, and if, the money is no longer there, Israel will be on its own. You've probably noticed the subtle shift in opinion already. The media has long been biased in favor of Israel. That was not so much the case in this last engagement. I don't know how long a small country in the heart of hostile territory can last while it perpetually acts litigiously and aggressively.

"Further, Israel depends entirely on a foreign country, namely America, for its survival. The US provides the weaponry, the financial aid, the vetoes in the UN, and the last-resort military support that comes when Israel is in trouble (1973, for example). Without this support, Israel could not last. Small countries without oil cannot support massive militaries.

If I were an Israeli, I would be uneasy about this. American support depends crucially, if not entirely, on the Israeli lobbies. Should these falter, so will Israel. It is not that the US seethes with repressed anti-Semitism awaiting its chance. It doesn't. But Americans don't much care about the outside world, know little of history and less of geography.

Today one reads of the recent overwhelming vote in Congress in support of Israel, but the number is highly artificial. The rub is that today is today, but there is always tomorrow. Congress supports whoever pays it or intimidates it, and today the Lobby can exact a heavy price for opposition. If the winds blow another way, Congress will sway in another direction. What might constitute a sufficient wind? I don't know. I note that Israel has no oil, its enemies do, and world demand is growing fast. Think: Taiwan."

-Fred Reed

The guy has an interesting column. He's a self-proclaimed curmudgeon, but his stuff is interesting. It's too bad he just quit.

Well... what can i say...

Im from Israel.

Well Israel was established after WW2 as a place for the Jewish community to heal after the Holocaust. America, was allies from the very beginning, as America saw it as a great ally to have in southwest Asia. As for the whole Israel-Palestine deal. It's been going on for ages, ever since David and Goliath, I doubt it will ever end.Marksman2200

[QUOTE="Marksman2200"]Well Israel was established after WW2 as a place for the Jewish community to heal after the Holocaust. America, was allies from the very beginning, as America saw it as a great ally to have in southwest Asia. As for the whole Israel-Palestine deal. It's been going on for ages, ever since David and Goliath, I doubt it will ever end.vito_128

[QUOTE="Marksman2200"]Well Israel was established after WW2 as a place for the Jewish community to heal after the Holocaust. America, was allies from the very beginning, as America saw it as a great ally to have in southwest Asia. As for the whole Israel-Palestine deal. It's been going on for ages, ever since David and Goliath, I doubt it will ever end.vito_128

I suppose they've always been latent in the region. I think, really, the Middle East would tear itself apart without some external or internal foe that it can collectively concentrate on. Israel is really the biggest scape goat for Middle Eastern governments. All they have to do is tell their people, "hey, look at the Israelis killing Palestinians," and suddenly the peoples' attention is set on them instead of their parasite of a government. Really, nobody in the Middle East wants the Palestinians. Do you think Egypt wants to take them in? Syria? Saudi Arabia? No, nobody wants them. They just utilise them to concentrate all of their peoples' bellicosity towards Israel.

I am going to make a couple of points and I am not going to argue or debate them,just some food for thought.

1. Unless you believe the bible is wholly fictional,not just the god stuff,and account for some non israeli reason for the exsistence of biblical places such as jerusalem, I would say the jewish people have at least equal claim to the land.

2. How come no one looks at the fact that the palestinians have also warred with other neigboring countries for territory and are not very well liked or givenrefuge in said countries. when will peopel realize the arab run middle eastern countries do not respect the palestinians,they only support them because they feel it is the easiest way to drive the jews into the sea,and eradicate israel forever.

3. If we are going to destroy a country for land for the palestinians,how about Jordan,which was never a real country and was fabricated out of nothing into a country when britian split up and relinqueshed their hold on the middle east.

Again, I am not going to debate or argue,I am just stating these thoughts,if they make you think instead of wasting your time arguing with me do what I did and check out some history books.

I am going to make a couple of points and I am not going to argue or debate them,just some food for thought.

1. Unless you believe the bible is wholly fictional,not just the god stuff,and account for some non israeli reason for the exsistence of biblical places such as jerusalem, I would say the jewish people have at least equal claim to the land.

2. How come no one looks at the fact that the palestinians have also warred with other neigboring countries for territory and are not very well liked or givenrefuge in said countries. when will peopel realize the arab run middle eastern countries do not respect the palestinians,they only support them because they feel it is the easiest way to drive the jews into the sea,and eradicate israel forever.

3. If we are going to destroy a country for land for the palestinians,how about Jordan,which was never a real country and was fabricated out of nothing into a country when britian split up and relinqueshed their hold on the middle east.

Again, I am not going to debate or argue,I am just stating these thoughts,if they make you think instead of wasting your time arguing with me do what I did and check out some history books.

mattykovax

No, I mostly agree with you. The thing is, it doesn't matter who is "right" or "wrong." I just don't think Israel is going to last long. Too much geopolitical turmoil and reliance on external entities and factors.

No, I mostly agree with you. The thing is, it doesn't matter who is "right" or "wrong." I just don't think Israel is going to last long. Too much geopolitical turmoil and reliance on external entities and factors.

xXBuffJeffXx

I am going to make a couple of points and I am not going to argue or debate them,just some food for thought.

1. Unless you believe the bible is wholly fictional,not just the god stuff,and account for some non israeli reason for the exsistence of biblical places such as jerusalem, I would say the jewish people have at least equal claim to the land.

2. How come no one looks at the fact that the palestinians have also warred with other neigboring countries for territory and are not very well liked or givenrefuge in said countries. when will peopel realize the arab run middle eastern countries do not respect the palestinians,they only support them because they feel it is the easiest way to drive the jews into the sea,and eradicate israel forever.

3. If we are going to destroy a country for land for the palestinians,how about Jordan,which was never a real country and was fabricated out of nothing into a country when britian split up and relinqueshed their hold on the middle east.

Again, I am not going to debate or argue,I am just stating these thoughts,if they make you think instead of wasting your time arguing with me do what I did and check out some history books.

Well they have been trying to make peace with palistine for a while, but it doesn't work. I think Isreal should stop listening to the rest of the world and go ahead and defeat all of those people that constantly attack them that is what the US, UK and all of the rest of the west would do.Jacobistheman

[QUOTE="Jacobistheman"]Well they have been trying to make peace with palistine for a while, but it doesn't work. I think Isreal should stop listening to the rest of the world and go ahead and defeat all of those people that constantly attack them that is what the US, UK and all of the rest of the west would do.killtactics

To be completely honest

I don't mind the Israeli people or the country itself...but I believe the "alliance" between the US and Israel needs to end. It does not benefit the United States in any way, if anything our alliance with Israel is a complete liability to our national relations with the middle east and our national security

Lets look at what Israel has done compared to our other allies

Israel- Attacked the USS Cole and gave a lofty excuse,Has been caught spying on us several times,refuses to house any US bases and systemically harassed US peacekeepers in Lebanon in the 1980's.

Hell, relations got so bad between the IDF and the USMC during the peacekeeping mission in Lebonan that Marines and IDF soldiers almost got in fire fights on several occations because the IDF would attempt to go where they weren't suppose to. A Lt. Colonel had to jump up on an Israeli tank and threaten the tank commander with a gun to get him to turn around.

Meanwhile

Canada - One of the first countries to commit troops to Afghanistan,Allowed 40,000 americans to stay in country after 9/11 without any questions asked ( the only country to ever do so),important trade partner and has never spied on us in recent history.

Germany - Currently houses 60,000 US Soldiers, Houses the largest airbase outside of the US,Commited soldiers to Afghanistan,Gave intel to the US during the Iraq war and has not spied on us in recent history.

UK: Commited soldiers to both Afghanistan+Iraq,houses a large US Airbase (although it may have been closed down just recently),has not spied on us in recent history and does a lot of other stuff worth mentioning.

Australia: Commited soldiers to both Iraq+Afghanistan and allows for the US military to hold a huge training exercise every two years.

Israel is probably one of the least helpful allies we have in the world.

Also, The land where Israel is where God chose for them to be. They are Gods chosen people.JohnnySN1P3R

Now, try using an argument that actually has some substance to it.

What do I think of Israel? Well, I think that giving any of that land to the Jews in the first place was a huge mistake, and I rather the control of ALL of it return to the Palestinians.aliblabla2007

I think Israel commited and is commiting serious crimes in Palestine. Killing children,women and innocent people for all those years and torturing underage children and young men in prisons and other countless crimes. God only knows how many Palestinians were slaughtered with hi-tech weapons since Israel invaded Palestine and established itself falsely. It just surprises me that Isreal doesn't expect any opposition or *fighting back* from Palestinians who lost their homes and loved ones and calls them "terrorists".

That's what I think and Believe.

[QUOTE="JohnnySN1P3R"]Also, The land where Israel is where God chose for them to be. They are Gods chosen people.chessmaster1989

Now, try using an argument that actually has some substance to it.

[QUOTE="aliblabla2007"]What do I think of Israel? Well, I think that giving any of that land to the Jews in the first place was a huge mistake, and I rather the control of ALL of it return to the Palestinians.mattykovax

I just don't think that having that land for the Jews, when the previous inhabitants had nothing to do with the Holocaust, as a particularly good idea... and especially since it caused a lot of conflict.

[QUOTE="chessmaster1989"]

[QUOTE="JohnnySN1P3R"]Also, The land where Israel is where God chose for them to be. They are Gods chosen people.JohnnySN1P3R

Now, try using an argument that actually has some substance to it.

[QUOTE="JohnnySN1P3R"][QUOTE="chessmaster1989"]

Now, try using an argument that actually has some substance to it.

JohnnySN1P3R

Clearly, the Arabs were the agressors when the Allies basically gave Israel to Holocost survivers, and they pushed the Palestinians out of the land they were living in :roll:.

Also, I'm glad you're not trying to use that as an actual argument. But, if you were not, what was the point of writing it?

I'm South African by birth, and I need only look at my home country's past to see Israel's future.

Sure, a country can flout international law and scoff at international opinion while the major powers are on its side (or at least willing to excuse its misdeeds), but, sooner or later, the tide inevitably turns.

[QUOTE="chessmaster1989"]

[QUOTE="JohnnySN1P3R"]Also, The land where Israel is where God chose for them to be. They are Gods chosen people.JohnnySN1P3R

Now, try using an argument that actually has some substance to it.

When the holocaust survivors came in the late 40s, Palestine was just a dessert and the land the Israelis took was what the palestinians didn't want and basically the worst land in the country, they didn't steal anything

WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG.. The creation of Israel marrooned some 750k+ refugees of Palasitne.. Clearly it was inhabited land.. With Jerualism (spelling?) being a major city of worship.

(practically belonged to their ancestors since they moved from Egypt and conquered it back BC)

I suppose the United States should be dismantled seeing as the Native Americans controled the region 500+ years ago.

they actually turn the dessert into a green area where they could grow stuff and live and the Palestinians became jealous of this and wanted that land now that it was profitable.

You have no clue what your talking about.. Those areas are with in the Fertile cresent, rich in farming.. The Jewish population did nothign special, and infact the Middle East was staunted in growth by imperialist nations of the West.. Just look at the Ottoman empire for that..

They worked that land and they deserve it. Now with the conflict today they are the only ones making any effort to make peace, they have offered land and they help a lot...this is not what the media likes to show though...they don't show how terrorists use children as shields...hide in family houses making the army bomb them or demolishing them....the coward acts they do...now haven said that, the Israeli government/army does terrible things to palestinians like torture in jails/interrogation and unnecessary demolition of houses..both sides do terrible things but if u are a bible believer you realize that the land was originally intended for the Jews...but it can be shared.tacubano

The Palastinian worked those lands ofr centuries, the League of Nations basically uprooted the people from their homes and marrooned them with no compensation.. There are people still alive to this day that remember when they were dragged fromtheir farms they worked hard on, and now live ina shanty town in Jordan. Palastinians have a right to be pissed with what happened to them.. It was just another Imperialist command by infringing foriegn western powers that have been screwing them for the past 150 years. Its amazing how clueless some people are with the history to what the western powers did to the Middle East in the past 2 centuries.. And people are some how clueless on why countries like Iran are pissed at us.. Perhapes they should read up on some history of the region.. The Western powers mettled in every affair over there, and ultimately controled their governments for explotiation.