Are MMO's Bad for PC Gaming? I NEED your opinions

In an article I read recently the author poses the question "is World of Warcraft bad for the PC gaming industry" My personal opinion leads me to believe that the answer is a resounding YES.

In order to understand my answer you have to understand that I'm not just talking about WOW when I say "it" is having a negative affect on the industry, I am talking about MMORPGs (Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games) as a whole.

As an avid MMORPG gamer (I have played almost every one currently on the market including titles such as Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, World of Warcraft, Anarchy Online, Eve Online, and several other more obscure titles), and I have noticed that when I am playing one of these games my desire to experience other, non-massively multiplayer games is limited. I simply look for the "next great" MMORPG, for example I am currently playing Tabula Rasa but waiting expectantly for Age of Conan.

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?

Do they detract from the variety and steal valuable resources such as talented developers from games that would otherwise be much richer and more vibrant?

Do they create a culture that is unwilling to return to mainstream video gaming and play a game simply to beat it?

I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

As an non-MMO'er, I must say that MMO is here to stay, and as a general, it is not bad for the industry. A lot of FPS, TRS and driving games have gained a lot from it. And now that the consoles are catching on, removing MMO would be a bad move indeed.

Now, MMORPGs are another issue, as they then to be sooooo time consuming. WoW is even worse, as it drains money of players gaming budget by its monthley fees. (On the other hand, many say it is soooo rewarding, so who am I to argue?)

WoW is even worse, as it drains money of players gaming budget by its monthley fees. (On the other hand, many say it is soooo rewarding, so who am I to argue?)

belboz

Tbh, I'd rather spend $12 a month to play a game I'm already familiar and happy with than pay $60 out the rear for a game (excluding the thought I may or may not purchase more than one game in said month) I may beat in under 10 hours, or may not like entirely.

MMOs are not bad for the environment. Hell, they're a good thing if any, as any games that actually make MMO users log-off to play them have to be of some actual quality to be worth their time, which gives developers an indirect incentive to make their games....not suck.

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?Tvac897

The thing is, how do you know that you would have been interested playing in these games even if you weren't playing MMO's?

[QUOTE="Tvac897"]

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?G013M

The thing is, how do you know that you would have been interested playing in these games even if you weren't playing MMO's?

Thats my point exactly, I am not sure if I wasn't so wrapped up in what the next "hot" mmorpg would be I would be more focused on other cool games coming out that I could just enjoy and beat, I just wanted to know if anyone else has the same feelings, not trying to argue just posing food for thought.

[QUOTE="G013M"][QUOTE="Tvac897"]

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?Tvac897

The thing is, how do you know that you would have been interested playing in these games even if you weren't playing MMO's?

Thats my point exactly, I am not sure if I wasn't so wrapped up in what the next "hot" mmorpg would be I would be more focused on other cool games coming out that I could just enjoy and beat, I just wanted to know if anyone else has the same feelings, not trying to argue just posing food for thought.

I take breaks to try new games. I do that with wow all the time. I normally take a break to try out the next best FPS or RTS. Then go back playing and WoW seems a bit more fresh since I left it alone for a few weeks.

If they're so dangerously addicting that they keep people from playing any other game, then yes, they hurt the industry. WoW keeps people from playing truly great games.paullywog

You could say that about any game with a little replay value.

they hurt the rest of the pc game industry, either through time or money

if you pay $15 a month for a game then most would feel obligated to get the best value for their money by playing lots.

If you are playing lots you are less likely to get other gams to fill a void and you also aren't going to be spending as much money on other games

But WOW is most certainly part of the PC games industry, so it doesn't really hurt something its exclusively apart of, it just hurts every other game (inc mmorpg) on the platform

Wouldn't say it hurts the industry as it is part of the industry. The only problem is that it makes it harder for the upstarts to come into the market if they have these bohemoths in the media and drowning their products out. This is not always the case but how many games get released and never spoken about? And then you see every media talking about how well WoW is doing? Plus, MMOs also create a bad stereotype for the PC gaming community as people start to assume that every game is "addictive" as WoW can be. (Seriously, most people get bored and can it or can take a break from it without breaking into a sweat)

Also, I am one of these gamers who is willing to try anything. That means I'm willing to try my luck with a MMO to see if it is worth my time/money and if not then I go on my merry way to something else.

In an article I read recently the author poses the question "is World of Warcraft bad for the PC gaming industry" My personal opinion leads me to believe that the answer is a resounding YES.

In order to understand my answer you have to understand that I'm not just talking about WOW when I say "it" is having a negative affect on the industry, I am talking about MMORPGs (Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games) as a whole.

As an avid MMORPG gamer (I have played almost every one currently on the market including titles such as Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, World of Warcraft, Anarchy Online, Eve Online, and several other more obscure titles), and I have noticed that when I am playing one of these games my desire to experience other, non-massively multiplayer games is limited. I simply look for the "next great" MMORPG, for example I am currently playing Tabula Rasa but waiting expectantly for Age of Conan.

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?

Do they detract from the variety and steal valuable resources such as talented developers from games that would otherwise be much richer and more vibrant?

Do they create a culture that is unwilling to return to mainstream video gaming and play a game simply to beat it?

I look forward to hearing what you have to say.Tvac897

I think that's a personal thing. Everyone that I used to play WoW with played all sorts of different types of games, not just MMO's. It sounds to me that MMORPG's just happen to be your personal favorite type of game, just like some gamers only play sports games, or only play first-person shooters.

To answer your question: No, MMO's are not bad for PC gaming. They get people interested in PC games, drive up hardware sales, get gamers used to using a keyboard and mouse to play with, and encourage cooperation in players. Then, once people get tired of farming loot and grinding mobs, they move on to other types of PC games. Maybe not in your case, but a lot of people get bored and look for other types of games to play on their new PCs.

Bad for the pc gaming industry? According to whom?

I love MMORPGs. I looked at several different ones when I decided I wanted to start playing online. Tried playing WoW. Thought the graphics were cheesy, and didn't really want to spend money every month, knowing that I wouldn't be playing ALL the time. So I went with Guild Wars. Have all three campaigns, and the expansion. Waiting patiently for GW2 :) And I don't pay every month to play, which I love. When I get bored with GW (which I do on occasion), I take a break and play offline games. Currently in the middle of playing Morrowind, Oblivion, and The Witcher, depending on my mood. I subscribe to PCGamer, and check out GS every day, always on the lookout for a new game that looks exciting. I think it really depends on what kind of gamer you are. Some people may just like MMORPGs, or there may be gamers who like every type of pc game that exists.

As an non-MMO'er, I must say that MMO is here to stay, and as a general, it is not bad for the industry. A lot of FPS, TRS and driving games have gained a lot from it. And now that the consoles are catching on, removing MMO would be a bad move indeed.

Now, MMORPGs are another issue, as they then to be sooooo time consuming. WoW is even worse, as it drains money of players gaming budget by its monthley fees. (On the other hand, many say it is soooo rewarding, so who am I to argue?)

belboz

In an article I read recently the author poses the question "is World of Warcraft bad for the PC gaming industry" My personal opinion leads me to believe that the answer is a resounding YES.

In order to understand my answer you have to understand that I'm not just talking about WOW when I say "it" is having a negative affect on the industry, I am talking about MMORPGs (Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games) as a whole.

As an avid MMORPG gamer (I have played almost every one currently on the market including titles such as Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, World of Warcraft, Anarchy Online, Eve Online, and several other more obscure titles), and I have noticed that when I am playing one of these games my desire to experience other, non-massively multiplayer games is limited. I simply look for the "next great" MMORPG, for example I am currently playing Tabula Rasa but waiting expectantly for Age of Conan.

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?

Do they detract from the variety and steal valuable resources such as talented developers from games that would otherwise be much richer and more vibrant?

Do they create a culture that is unwilling to return to mainstream video gaming and play a game simply to beat it?

I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

Tvac897

Who gives a damn? If people want to play MMOs, then let them. If others hate MMOs and would rather die then play, then that's their decision.

If you can honestly say and provide proof that MMOs are bad for PC gaming, then you might have something for avid PC gamers to worry about. But until then, it's just personal opinions that people take out of context.

GW2 is going to own wow and all the other mmo's out there. It will be free to play, there will be battle ships, mounts and a higher standard of rpg......

there will be no mounthly fee

That's a good question. Personally I know tons of friends who's aPC gamer.However because of MMOs like WoW, GW they can care less about purchasing anything else for their PC. While this is good for the industry it's also crushing for other developers because if Blizzard is making a monopolyoff their game and you release a FPSand sell poorly because of people just favor a MMO experience (primarily WoW) you just loss money. In result you get developers that look at the market and say it really doesn't pay to release a high budget title when in reality the sales are in the MMO genre, now you get more MMOs and less risk taking. PC games are taking a totally different change then previous years and time will only tell.OoSuperMarioO

I love playing Guild Wars, but I also play Crysis, Bioshock, Witcher, MASS EFFECT on xbox 360, Assassin Creed on PS3, so I dont think that is true, although I'm sure it can happen.

Of course the games I play MUST be good becuase I try to have a social life too, so I only play the best games.

You mean there are OTHER MMO's besides EVE?

But seriously, I think a lot of GOOD normal game developers are getting pulled into BAD MMO teams to the detriment of other PC games. The MMO business model is a great one for the industry but to be perfectly honest I don't know if it's a good one for gamers. Particularly I'm not sure if it's good for folks who like to keep up on how gaming as a whole is progressing.

I pretty regularly go back and review the history of a genre by playing older games but with MMO's once they're offline the only record we have of them is memory and heresay. This contrasts sharply with the stand alone games or stand alone with multiplayer games that you can go back and play long after companies have gone belly up. What kind of benchmark would we have for RPG's if we werent' able to play Interplay or Black Isle games after the companies went belly up?

If they're so dangerously addicting that they keep people from playing any other game, then yes, they hurt the industry. WoW keeps people from playing truly great games.paullywog

Is chocolate bad for vanilla?

MMO's aren't bad for gaming, but lack of developer creativity is. There's nothing inherently wrong with the MMO genre, quite the opposite, really. MMO's (in theory) can do things that single-player games have no chance of doing, but no MMO actually takes advantage of this. Having played a few here and there in hopes of finding one to latch onto, all I've found is endless grinding and repetitive quests. For some reason that sells, however, so that's all anyone wants to make.Mediocre_man90

MMO's aren't bad for gaming, but lack of developer creativity is. There's nothing inherently wrong with the MMO genre, quite the opposite, really. MMO's (in theory) can do things that single-player games have no chance of doing, but no MMO actually takes advantage of this. Having played a few here and there in hopes of finding one to latch onto, all I've found is endless grinding and repetitive quests. For some reason that sells, however, so that's all anyone wants to make.Mediocre_man90

Interesting Question. In my oppinion, no.

- Addiction. It's very true that some players end up wasting their lives on MMO's. However thats also true for other games. There are plenty of people who've done the same while playing games like starcraft or counter-strike. That dosent make it a non issue by any means but it's a problem that afflicts pretty much any form of entertainment (people go nuts, and waste their lives, over everything from their their favorite sports team, always watching movies and so on.

- People not buying as many games. It's probably true, but if thats the case you could point at the orange box as well. It seems that the original argument is that since you dont run out of or get bored with an mmo as fast its bad for the industry. How many hours have some of us spend on Counter-Strike, Team Fortress 2, Total War: Rome, Civilization 1-4. In that light.. is a game bad for the industry if it has a lot of replay value? Also remeber that the games are charging pr. month which ultimatly means that they keep generating an income for the industry unlike for example Counter Strike.

As for WoW in perticular

- Wow is hurting other MMO developers. Again I disagree. I actually think WoW is about the best think that could happen for the smaller 'upstart' MMO developers. WoW is not a very unique or original game. The one thing it does far better than any other MMO out there is that it's easy to learn and easy to get into. However like just about all other MMO's most people will eventually tire of the game. At some point most WoW players is going to get bored with WoW and a lot of those will start looking around for a new MMO. Something that offeres something diffrent. Given that WoW alone has pretty much resulted in near 10 times as many people playing MMORPGs now as before it started, that means that every month there are thousands, if not tens of thousands that are looking at new MMOs while at the same time experienced enough with MMOs to not be driven off by the steep learning curves a lot of the smaller MMOs have. WoW is not killing smaller MMOs.. it's feeding them.

- WoW is killing the creativity. Kinda true, but thats on the shoulders of the designers. The same has happened with EVERY huge video game title. For people who remember doom.. you might also remeber the flood of bad clones that followed after doom became a huge hit. Remeber all the RTS clones after Dune started it all? All the Sim this Tycoon that games that we still see more off every month.. blame Sim City 1.

For the record, I play alot of MMO's though right now I'm kinda waiting for something that dosent feel and play much like EQ 1 did 10 years ago :P

Interesting Question. In my oppinion, no.

- Addiction. It's very true that some players end up wasting their lives on MMO's. However thats also true for other games. There are plenty of people who've done the same while playing games like starcraft or counter-strike. That dosent make it a non issue by any means but it's a problem that afflicts pretty much any form of entertainment (people go nuts, and waste their lives, over everything from their their favorite sports team, always watching movies and so on.

- People not buying as many games. It's probably true, but if thats the case you could point at the orange box as well. It seems that the original argument is that since you dont run out of or get bored with an mmo as fast its bad for the industry. How many hours have some of us spend on Counter-Strike, Team Fortress 2, Total War: Rome, Civilization 1-4. In that light.. is a game bad for the industry if it has a lot of replay value? Also remeber that the games are charging pr. month which ultimatly means that they keep generating an income for the industry unlike for example Counter Strike.

As for WoW in perticular

- Wow is hurting other MMO developers. Again I disagree. I actually think WoW is about the best think that could happen for the smaller 'upstart' MMO developers. WoW is not a very unique or original game. The one thing it does far better than any other MMO out there is that it's easy to learn and easy to get into. However like just about all other MMO's most people will eventually tire of the game. At some point most WoW players is going to get bored with WoW and a lot of those will start looking around for a new MMO. Something that offeres something diffrent. Given that WoW alone has pretty much resulted in near 10 times as many people playing MMORPGs now as before it started, that means that every month there are thousands, if not tens of thousands that are looking at new MMOs while at the same time experienced enough with MMOs to not be driven off by the steep learning curves a lot of the smaller MMOs have. WoW is not killing smaller MMOs.. it's feeding them.

- WoW is killing the creativity. Kinda true, but thats on the shoulders of the designers. The same has happened with EVERY huge video game title. For people who remember doom.. you might also remeber the flood of bad clones that followed after doom became a huge hit. Remeber all the RTS clones after Dune started it all? All the Sim this Tycoon that games that we still see more off every month.. blame Sim City 1.

For the record, I play alot of MMO's though right now I'm kinda waiting for something that dosent feel and play much like EQ 1 did 10 years ago :P

Mazoch

See i think the original EQ and UO people are the only ones who really get this question. We were so immersed in the growth of the industry we can take a step back and see the degradation of what we loved

[QUOTE="belboz"]

As an non-MMO'er, I must say that MMO is here to stay, and as a general, it is not bad for the industry. A lot of FPS, TRS and driving games have gained a lot from it. And now that the consoles are catching on, removing MMO would be a bad move indeed.

Now, MMORPGs are another issue, as they then to be sooooo time consuming. WoW is even worse, as it drains money of players gaming budget by its monthley fees. (On the other hand, many say it is soooo rewarding, so who am I to argue?)

Crucifier

What do you mean by that? Personally I think that MMORPG's are hurting the PC gaming alot. First of all think about how many people play them? Tens of millions and then think how time consuming those games are. They can take years from people's lifes. Its surely hurting game sales alot. Plus its a shame that a company like Blizzard lets WOW take up most of its resources. Im longing for another Diablo or WC4 and long waited Starcraft.

MMO's aren't bad for gaming, but lack of developer creativity is. There's nothing inherently wrong with the MMO genre, quite the opposite, really. MMO's (in theory) can do things that single-player games have no chance of doing, but no MMO actually takes advantage of this. Having played a few here and there in hopes of finding one to latch onto, all I've found is endless grinding and repetitive quests. For some reason that sells, however, so that's all anyone wants to make.Mediocre_man90

I agree with Mediocre_man90, have you seen the trailer for Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning? That looks an awful lot like World of Warcraft. Empire? Chaos? Greenskins? These are just other names for humans, undead, and orcs! I'd also like to see another Star Wars MMO. Star Wars Galaxies was a little iffy, but I think they can make a better one.

Do they detract from the variety and steal valuable resources such as talented developers from games that would otherwise be much richer and more vibrant?

Do they create a culture that is unwilling to return to mainstream video gaming and play a game simply to beat it?

I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

Tvac897

Well, obviously you can't generalise, but I think generally the answer is yes. I played EverQuest very hardcore from 2002 to 2004, and during that time I bought a total of two other games. Two. And I'm a twelve a year guy usually.

MMO games are clearly an issue for gaming as a whole. Imagine if the ten million WoW players didn't buy other games? Then imagine how good it'd be for the PC gaming industry if they all quit WoW and started buying PC games. Ten million. THere's a lot of PC gamers who don't buy PC games.

[QUOTE="Mediocre_man90"]MMO's aren't bad for gaming, but lack of developer creativity is. There's nothing inherently wrong with the MMO genre, quite the opposite, really. MMO's (in theory) can do things that single-player games have no chance of doing, but no MMO actually takes advantage of this. Having played a few here and there in hopes of finding one to latch onto, all I've found is endless grinding and repetitive quests. For some reason that sells, however, so that's all anyone wants to make.gamer71693

I agree with Mediocre_man90, have you seen the trailer for Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning? That looks an awful lot like World of Warcraft. Empire? Chaos? Greenskins? These are just other names for humans, undead, and orcs! I'd also like to see another Star Wars MMO. Star Wars Galaxies was a little iffy, but I think they can make a better one.

WarCraft is actually based on the Warhammer IP. Warhammer is decades old - it's a tabletop gaming universe. Just like StarCraft is based on Warhammer 40K.

Warhammer's Chaos isn't copying WarCraft's Undead, WarCraft's Undead is copying Warhammer's Chaos. World of WarCraft just happened to come before Warhammer Online as a computer game.

WoW is great because it is a computer exclusive....over 9million subscriber execlusing thats like 3/4 wii sales...double ps3 sales...and half of xbox 360 sales...thats epic and thats jsut one game. MMo's them self don't ruin the pc they make it actually considered a gaming platform.
JordanCupcakes

What about all of microsoft's new attempts to enter the MMO gaming arena on the console level? They are doing a great job of integrating their PC MMO'S with the console community IMO any takers?

In an article I read recently the author poses the question "is World of Warcraft bad for the PC gaming industry" My personal opinion leads me to believe that the answer is a resounding YES.

In order to understand my answer you have to understand that I'm not just talking about WOW when I say "it" is having a negative affect on the industry, I am talking about MMORPGs (Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games) as a whole.

As an avid MMORPG gamer (I have played almost every one currently on the market including titles such as Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, World of Warcraft, Anarchy Online, Eve Online, and several other more obscure titles), and I have noticed that when I am playing one of these games my desire to experience other, non-massively multiplayer games is limited. I simply look for the "next great" MMORPG, for example I am currently playing Tabula Rasa but waiting expectantly for Age of Conan.

My point is that throughout all of this I have had no desire to try such titles as Assassin's Creed, Bio-Shock, COD4, or any of the other titles I have heard are so amazing. I wanted to post this in this forum to get feedback from some of my fellow gamers who may not be as engrossed in the world of MMORPG's as I am. Please let me know what you think, are these games bad for the industry?

Do they detract from the variety and steal valuable resources such as talented developers from games that would otherwise be much richer and more vibrant?

Do they create a culture that is unwilling to return to mainstream video gaming and play a game simply to beat it?

I look forward to hearing what you have to say.

Tvac897

Everything you said came out as a positive thing for pc gaming in my mind. Infact I find mmos to be the strongest reason for me to be a pc gamer seeing as how I think mmos on consoles just do not work well. Maybe if it was all voice chat but trying to juggle a keyboard and a controller is hard and uncomfortable. Also I was still playing my half life 2, my ut2k4, and even diablo 2 while I was playing Wow as well. I was far from casual when it came to Wow too, so the experience isn't the same for everyone.

The argument that a successful component of pc gaming is hurting pc gaming just doesn't make sense to me. It sounds to me like you are getting at the idea since mmos are becoming more successful that companies are feeling more compelled to make a mmo instead of a single player game. Which in that case its a more widespread issue of single player vs. multiplayer thus this is no longer just about pc gaming anymore. Does online games in general, mmo or not, hurt single player games? My opinion is no. Online gaming like counter strike and gears of war certainly is popular, but people still want to play by themselves every now and then in a game that is story driven and has all the other aspects you can only find in a single player game.

MMO s are not going anywhere nor is online gaming in general. But this doesn't mean single player gaming is in trouble. There will always be a market for such regardless of platform.