Car audio anyone?

Going to be buying a van for around $15K with heavy focus on the sound system

Any one recognise the speakers/brand?

2 concert speakers a subwoofer a few tweeters around the interior of the car powered by 2 X 2000 watt amplifiers

And then there's this van... I know nothing about and can't recognise any speakers

Both cost the same... the one above is a 5.2 litre V8 Dodge Ram... the one below is owned by girls so god knows whats powering it but they're advertising it has 6000HP... oh dear (:

Priority is loud music and bass.. obv :P

2nd van are sony explodes...cheap subs! if u wand decible readings go rockfordfosgate or mtx...for clean sound go jl audio

2nd van are sony explodes...cheap subs! if u wand decible readings go rockfordfosgate or mtx...for clean sound go jl audio

rogelio22

Mozelleple112

[QUOTE="rogelio22"]

2nd van are sony explodes...cheap subs! if u wand decible readings go rockfordfosgate or mtx...for clean sound go jl audio

-GeordiLaForge-

2nd van are sony explodes...cheap subs! if u wand decible readings go rockfordfosgate or mtx...for clean sound go jl audio

rogelio22

Owners claim to have spent $4000 on the sound... (last year, Norwegian prices approx ~ 25-35% higher than US prices)

[QUOTE="rogelio22"]

2nd van are sony explodes...cheap subs! if u wand decible readings go rockfordfosgate or mtx...for clean sound go jl audio

Mozelleple112

edit: reason im saying this is because its never good to buy used audio equipment! u never know how much use or abuse it has taken!

oh and to answer your ? yes the 1st van prob sounds louder than the 2nd because of the concert speakers

Xplodes sound fine, they're just not expensive. the ones in that pic are ~100$ retail each.

That many of any kind of sub is going to sound less "good" and more "loud" anyways.

Xplodes sound fine, they're just not expensive. the ones in that pic are ~100$ retail each.

That many of any kind of sub is going to sound less "good" and more "loud" anyways.

topgunmv

Mozelle:

Car Audio: My specialty! I'm a former MECP certified installer and used to compete in both db Drag Racing and USAC here in the Northeast. I hit in the mid-140db range in a custom dual-sub category installation (db Drag racing categorized by woofer surface area). I worked for a couple different installers back before I graduated college, and have worked with custom fiberglass enclosures among other advanced installation techniques.

First, I'm terribly concerned you're considering buying a van with a custom system already installed. I would advise against this; considering your preference for B&W and high-end headphones, you'll be sorely disappointed by the piercing highs, muddied bass, and terrible imaging that these installations would yield. Pro Audio cabinets have no place in the car audio world; after all, would you use a guitar speaker in your home theater?

If you're aiming for a van, pick up a quality, unmodified vehicle first. Then use your remaining budget for your audio system. If you spent $10,000 on the van and $5,000 on the sound system, you'll end up with a pretty impressive piece of mobile audio equipment.

First and foremost: Car Audio has more misinformation and misconceptions than with ANY other consumer product I have ever had experience. Brand misconceptions, measuring wattage, how much amperage and what gauge wire to use: It's amazing how tough it is to find accurate information.

That said, for the amount you are considering spending you should be able to afford:

• A quality installation from a reputable car audio installer (meaning MECP-certified with an extensive portfolio)
• Full sound-deadening for the cabinet
• New head unit, speakers, amplifiers, and subwoofer
• Decent support equipment, such as external capacitors for the amps
• Fiberglass enclosures matched to your vehicle

As far as what products to consider, you are going to want to stick with drivers designed for car audio. Home theater speakers are not designed to weather the environment of a car, including direct sunlight, drastic changes in heat and humidity, etc. There are dozens of reputable brands out there, and everyone has their preferences. I've used pretty much all of them from the bottom of the barrel to ultra high-end stuff from Focal.

The biggest problem people have is figuring out which products from a particular brand are the "good" speakers/amps versus the "value" brands. Rockford Fosgate has Punch and Power to distinguish between their low- and high-end. In no particular order, Alphasonik , Alpine, Audiobahn, Boston Acoustics, Cerwin Vega, Focal, Hifonics, Infinity, JBL, JL Audio, JVC, Kenwood, Kicker, Kole Audio, MTX, Orion, Pioneer, Polk Audio all have excellent products within their lineup (and some crap).

Alpine, JL Audio, and Kicker are far and away the most popular car audio brands out there from a sales standpoint. Focal and MB Quart are probably the highest-end speakers you'll get, though the aforementioned brands all have their upper-escelon stuff. Personally I use a combination of Alpine, Kicker, Infinity Kappa, and JVC Arsenal products with wiring from assorted manufacturers, though this is more the result of price and availability than ideal options. I'd be just as happy with Pioneer, JL Audio, Alphasonik, etc. depending on the model in their lineup.

So think about what it is you want to do, besides having a heavy emphasis on bass (since that's the easiest part), and let me know. Know that at a minimum you'll want an aftermarket head unit, front speakers, one or two amps, and a pair of subwoofers to achieve a quality listening experience and heavy bass. I'll be happy to help you assemble the products that would fit in the vehicle you select as well as audit local installers that would do an excellent job on your behalf. If local installers are an issue or you want to save a few bucks and DIY, a little woodworking, basic tools, and elbow grease (and a bunch of time) is all that's really needed to get a great car audio system installed.

Boz

@Boz. Wow that posts was hard to digust... Where to start..

Well first off I should've said this is not just for me, I'm buying it with a group of friends, its Norwegian graduation tradition... Long story short...

Its going to be used for parties. Things will break, beer will be spilled every where etc... Music being played will be any popular song with good bass.

bass,bass,bass for instance:

SWEAT

Analogue Players in a digital world

amongst others...

That's why we use old vans with cheap "bang for buck" sound systems. I'd never put a B&W in here...

Norwegian car prices are ridiculous because we have a 100% import tax. So a $10,000 van in Norway is equal to one that costs ~ $5000 in the US.

So a really old beat up Dodge Ram, Chevrolet Starcraft or GMC getting pimped with new sofas etc...

And remember, we're going to have to sell it in a years time :)

I found out the XO drivers in the sub woofer can be found for as low as 250 NOK= $40/pair

Honestly when I heard the bass it would more than decent. You know those boomy logitechs ? Those were equal to at least 3 logitechs woofers

So I guess thats good ? I figure if they're only 40 bucks a pop we could buy like 8 of them and place them around the car? If not an overkill... They have an RMS of 250 W and the previous owners claimed to have 2 * 2000W amplifiers..

I'm eager to find out what those concert speakers are... how much they cost etc... because the bass they're using is cheap as chips...

Oh and my dad's Jaguar XF would like a word with you...

It packs a 600W B&W sound system and sounds absolutely incredible, though the bass isn't boomy enough for what we're gonna be using the van for ;)

Also saw a van with some Klipsch speakers... concert speakers, never seen them before. I doubt they were those heritage speakers anyways XD

But yeah Bowers & Wilkins has been done in several Jaguars... Hard to tell what they equate too though... :)

Since we're going to be investing thousands I'd love to find something by Snell acoustics.... Also if we were millionaires would be cool bolting 2 Snell THX reference towers on each side of the car and an 18" in the back :lol:

First: Note that those images in my prior post are not from my installations! Those are professional installs for demo cars from their respective manufacturers. I've got some pictures from my installs somewhere, but I'd have to scan them in (and find them).

Second: I assume you are basically picking from these two vans. If this is just a party wagon, it doesn't really matter what you're buying since you're just going to trash it anyway. If the stereo turns on and it's loud, that seems to fit the bill. Go purely on price and ease of use, and ignore everything else. This is not an audiophile ride, and shouldn't be evaluated as such: Does it work? Are you going to break it? Will it do everything you want it to? These are the more important questions now that I've got some more context. Some thoughts based on what little I can see:

• The XO drivers and PA speakers would probably be more useful if you can remove them from the vehicle, from a party perspective. The subs look like they're just sitting on top of the PAs, meaning you could theoretically take the subs and PAs out of the back and point them in whatever direction you needed while parked. So if you're at a beach/park/middle of the woods/random parking lot you can have an instant party. I cannot see how it's wired or the amplifiers they're using, so it's tough to tell beyond that it looks like it'd be great for an outside party and bass-heavy, but not much else. Consider throwing the XO drivers in a bandpass box (rather than a simple ported box) for more boom and a bit more safety for the speakers. Ignore the "2 * 2000W amplifiers" comment; wattage is the most misleading statement in car audio. If you can find out the make/model of the amp, and the amperage (you can just add the fuses installed on the amp itself), that'll give you a better idea of what kind of power they're putting out. Then again, you have no idea what the Sony van is using, and therefore no frame of reference, so it really doesn't matter in the end, anyway!
• The Sony installation looks cleaner and it's got a television, which is great from a party standpoint if most of the partying is going to happen inside the van, and the speakers facing out look like they'd make a reasonable PA system, to boot. That said, looking at the doors of the van you can see the indentation of the shape of the woofers in the carpeting of the door covers, meaning the speaker drivers are physically touching the doors when they are closed. If you plan on turning the woofers on while operating the vehicle with the doors closed, you risk damaging the woofers. This was a pretty big mistake during the installation, and a shame. Still, I like the Sony install better; it's a lot cleaner. I'd probably do something with the doors to keep them from touching the woofers, though.

All that said, either is fine for a party wagon, to be honest.

Or you can ask this guy if you can borrow his ride, since he's in Norway...somewhere!

If you get more information on the head unit, wiring, speakers used elsewhere in the vehicles, or more photos in general, I am happy to comment.

Good luck!

Boz

Nonono.. this is all graduation tradition so our options are limitedless. Graduates from this year have finished so they're selling their vans to the next generation (my generation) So that we can use them for a 4 week period next year.

That's 4 weeks of almost non stop partying etc... Its a huge investment just for a month but its worth it, its what graduating is all about, we're going to be buying drinks for $3000, pay $200 tickets to get into places etc, etc, etc..

Those were just 2 of many.. You can browse through this website to check them out but if none of these people are audiophiles or even have a clue about audio outside of 'lots of bass' so you really won't get much info in the descriptions etc... Google Chrome is your friend (instant translation)

So in that case, you want as good stuff as possible, but with out it being something of a fancyness/design factor (e.g. nice wood B&W speakers)

What we want is proper bang for buck stuff., so that when some one spills to beers on them and they get a crack no one really notices.... Fence Audio XO's seem fantastic. 40 bucks and you get really good bass. What ever system/van we pick I figure I can buy loads of XO drivers, eh? 8 of them is only $160, divide that by the 7 of us and you've got just over 20 bucks per person on a hell of a lot of bass.

Also, my local cinema uses EV (Electrovoice?) speakers they only cost like $100-200 but make a lot of noise... Perhaps EV has stuff suited for car audio?

Alright, we don't have anything like what I'm seeing on that site here in the States, and I must have some more details. Is this a "thing" in Norway, because I see an awful lot of party vans that are way over the top at that site, and I'm getting quite a thrill out of looking at so much junk.

I'm heading home for the night, but I'll take a closer look in the morning.

Happy gaming,

Boz

Alright, we don't have anything like what I'm seeing on that site here in the States, and I must have some more details. Is this a "thing" in Norway, because I see an awful lot of party vans that are way over the top at that site, and I'm getting quite a thrill out of looking at so much junk.

I'm heading home for the night, but I'll take a closer look in the morning.

Happy gaming,

Boz

Bozanimal

I found these http://www.finn.no/finn/torget/tilsalgs/annonse?finnkode=26556179

Which are honestly cheap if they're like 900 bucks in norway Then you have these for almost half that price...

http://www.finn.no/finn/torget/tilsalgs/annonse?finnkode=28872709

Normally things I'd look away from but big speakers, low price, crappy looking design, and prestigeless looking brand is what we need :)

Video demonstrating a system

Oh and my dad's Jaguar XF would like a word with you...

*pictures*

It packs a 600W B&W sound system and sounds absolutely incredible, though the bass isn't boomy enough for what we're gonna be using the van for ;)

Mozelleple112

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"]

Oh and my dad's Jaguar XF would like a word with you...

*pictures*

It packs a 600W B&W sound system and sounds absolutely incredible, though the bass isn't boomy enough for what we're gonna be using the van for ;)

NVIDIATI

I see your right. Well I guess it is a 440W B&W system in it then :)

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"]

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"]

Oh and my dad's Jaguar XF would like a word with you...

*pictures*

It packs a 600W B&W sound system and sounds absolutely incredible, though the bass isn't boomy enough for what we're gonna be using the van for ;)

I see your right. Well I guess it is a 440W B&W system in it then :)

Damn car audio! All any-yers cars eva do is blast dat dang der rap sounds cuz it ain't music. You and odder youngins' got nuthin but that loud beat, blowing up your trunks and eardrums!

Young peoples today got no respect for TRUE music! Why back in my day when STEREO finally came aroun.....*snooze...* AND THATS HOW WE WON WORLD WAR 2!

[spoiler] [/spoiler]

I dont even know what to say to this, those are not car speakers, car speakers are made different than regular speakers because they are made to play in an enclosed space.

These are sony xplods, they are going to sound like crap, with that many they will be loud and put alot of earstrain because they do not sound that good.

Mozelleple112

One thing that most people dont realize is that placement of subwoofer and box are more important than the actual subwoofer! You could easily get 2 JL w7 12" and they will be louder than either of those if they are placed right in a good box, all the while they will take up less room, and sound 10x cleaner and have way less earstrain.

The second thing to talk about is amp, amps are really important for speakers but not as much for subwoofers because they run at such low ohms. Those jl subs i recomended will be at 1000 watts each @ 3 ohms which means they will use a 3000 watt amp. So you will need 2 3000 watt amps, you can mount these on the subwoofer box, or on a part of the car, i highly advise on part of the car.

Next thing is speakers, one of my favorites is polk audio, they get very loud and sound very clean. Their low end component speakers are $200 for a set and pull 125 each, which is alot for speakers. The back speakers of a car are not as important as they front and will not have much treble at all, they are used to fill the sound inbetween mostly and will play mids for the most part.

Next is deck, the deck is not nearly as important as it used to be, i advise you stay away from alpine decks unless you are using alpine speakers. Basically pick whichever you like the interface the most because sound quality is minimal difference now days.

If you have any questions in specific ask away

Note that brands like GAS and XO are not known here in the states, though Fusion made a go of it a few years ago. The aforementioned are alternate brands of subs manufactured in China that are rebranded throughout the world for redistribution. Much of car audio is the exact same equipment with various rebrandings, making it tough to figure out just who is who and which is actually better (versus perceived to be better). In other words: Brand carries a lot of weight it doesn't deserve in the car audio space.

On topic, to be honest, all of those vans are pretty awful...and wonderful! Note that I only got through the first couple pages of "russebil" before I had to stop. It brings back great memories of high school. They're all cobbled together, with frightening wiring jobs and a mish-mosh of styIes. Just for fun, Google "Dave Fishman Rivera" and "Team Gates, Bronco" and take a look at the images. Those are what car audio installation should look like!

That said, if you're looking to buy a pre-existing system, I rifled through the site you sent for a few worth considering.

This is my personal favorite, though probably not the loudest install. It looks great, it's got a TV, the Pioneer subs are going to sound good, and the concert speakers should be nice when you're parked assuming they've got an amp to back them up (I am highly suspect of the amp/amps they are using):

http://www.finn.no/finn/car/used/object?finnkode=28855545

The most bass of the lot, probably:

http://www.finn.no/finn/car/used/object?finnkode=28595614

Second-most bass (too bad they're facing the wrong direction or it might be the most):

http://www.finn.no/finn/car/used/object?finnkode=28639714

The wiring is scary, but the subs have a similar magnet structure to those used by Focal. Anyway, worth considering:

http://www.finn.no/finn/car/used/object?finnkode=28813810

All this said, what would I do? I'd start from scratch and build exactly what I wanted. But I'm not you. It's a lot of work to build it yourself, especially if you don't have any experience. You may be better off, therefore, buying something from someone else and considering what you need. Do you want pure SPL in the cabin? Do you want to be able to open the back doors and set out concert speakers? Do you want to entertain your buddies while driving (Read: Television)? Do you want to impress the ladies (Read: Lots of room, good lighting, and clean interior)? It's all well and good to want a loud car, but in the long run you might want to consider just in what you're investing all your money. ;)

If you want to go ahead and build a pure SPL - meaning high-volume - vehicle, a wall of woofers is the way to go ala Mike Bartell or Alma Gates (Alma Gates is a legend in the Car Audio circuit for her Bronco). But I'd start researching now to make sure you know how to wire all the woofers properly to achieve the correct load on the amp, and get an amp capable of powering all those woofers. The only reason you should ever consider concert speakers is if you are planning to remove them from the vehicle for operation; they're going to sound awful inside.

Let me know if you're considering starting from scratch, and I can sketch out a few ideas for you, otherwise I'd take a closer look at those vehicles I mentioned above. Anyway, I hope I've given you a few things to chew on.

Happy gaming.

Boz

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"]

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"] Strange, the older XF models had a 600watt B&W system with a 300HP V8, and the newer ones have a 440watt B&W system with a 385HP V8. Its as if they diverted the power from the sound system to the engine :P

NVIDIATI

I see your right. Well I guess it is a 440W B&W system in it then :)

] Nice suggestions you posted.

I liked the 61 585 NOK one... 32 bass drivers hahah However there is nothing stopping us from changing anything...

Point is we're going to change the car, we can't drive the EXACT same van as graduates did last year.

We're going to do a paint job, fix the interior etc... we could easily add bass drivers etc... I found out that an XO 10" bass driver costs $20, so I figure we could just buy... like 20-30 of those? And add to whatever system we're getting :)

Anyways we're going to drive (about 40 mins) to some town where these girls are selling this:

Now I reeeeaally want their car :)

Figure we can change some things add more bass elements or add 2 concert speakers (found some used ones for ~ $500-800 etc..) or whatever :P

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"][QUOTE="Mozelleple112"] Really? Well my dad's is from december 2010... Its the 5.0 litre V8 supercharged But I thought it had 400+ HP... :P

I see your right. Well I guess it is a 440W B&W system in it then :)

Mozelleple112

I think you'll find that four 15's will be more than enough bass: That's a LOT of bass. You would need six 10's to get the same surface area, and I guarantee you that those 15's will take a lot of power. Further, 15's will go a lot lower in terms of frequency than 10's, so you're getting more rumble. Looking at the box they're in, though, I'm betting you could get even more bass out of them with a larger bass-reflex enclosure. Consider sealing the rear of the vehicle, facing those four 15's into the cabin, increasing the size of the enclosure, and porting it into the cabin. If you do decide to take out the 15's and put in your own subs, don't go any smaller than a 12" sub.

I will say one thing: The amplifiers sitting on top of one another are scary. Unless they were designed to stack like the Alpine PDX or Kicker IX amps, you'll want to mount those to something rather than having them sit atop one another; you're just begging to have them overheat.

As soon as you figure out the make and model of the equipment, let me know.

Boz

Also Boz: Reading your comment a few posts above... the car is going to be used for several things.

*Its got to be comfortable we're going to have to sleep in it and of course, bring women in here with us (heeehee)

*It needs to be entertaining, we'll prolly throw in a TV + PS3 since there'll be a few 5+ hour drives

*It needs a great sound system with LOTS AND LOTS of Bass, the earth moving / glass shattering kind since we're going to be partying and listening to thumpy music...

*It needs does need to impress girls but the sound system and comfort mentioned above covers that

Some peripherals we're going to add includes:Red,green,yellowlights (the colours of Rastafari), smoke machine, possibly dry ice to keep ground level smoke?

Beer/booze cooler and so on.

The system in the blue van posted above won the system of the year in their town/school, the van that had the system of the year in my town/school got stolen... So there's a good chance we're gonna have the best system this year in our school...

And as I'm the only audiophile in town (Well almost, I think I know 1 guy with B&W speakers) it would be great if our van is the one with the best sound ;)

HECK let me rephrase...

ITS A MUST THAT OUR VAN WINS SOUND SYSTEM OF THE YEAR.

green ones look like fusion subwoofers.. 2nd is sony xplods. both are utter crap. I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

Youtube Video Link

I suggest you go for FI Audio, DD Audio, Orion HCCA or if your on a budget go for Alpine X Type 15's

I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

SPBoss

[QUOTE="SPBoss"]

I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

ChubbyGuy40

Coming from the guy thats rocknrollin in his dp :P

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"]

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"] The 5.0 liter V8 is 470HP supercharged and 385HP naturally aspirated. Pre-2010 was 420HP and 300HP.NVIDIATI

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"]

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"] Ah I see. Knew it was closer to 500 HP . I do know it can go from 0-100 km/h in ~ 5 seconds, got to test that in an empty street. The car is fantastic, love the leather seats the wood works etc... the B&W system in there is only a bonus :) We actually got 2 Jaguar XFs. The other one is green 4.2 litre V8 supercharged aswell. from 2009

Mozelleple112

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"][QUOTE="NVIDIATI"] Overall I think Tata is doing some good with Jaguar, they really took the company into this new direction. It'll be interesting to see the CX75 put into production, I can only hope they include the twin turbines at some point.

NVIDIATI

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"]

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"] Yeah I love the new Jags, especially the XF and XF-R but god the XJ is kinda awful the interior is over the top and the car is too long. A shame though since its got the same engine as XF but with 25 more HP, and B&W system with 1400 watts over our 600watt or 440 watt system... :PMozelleple112

vs

Anyways I'll try not to go off topic anymore :P

[QUOTE="Mozelleple112"]

[QUOTE="NVIDIATI"] TBH I think the interior is just right on the XJ. Remember its a car in the same class as a 7 series, S-class, A8, so the dimensions are appropriate. After being inside, the interior style and feel is a lot like the Bentley Arnage, defined headrests/seats, wood tables, etc. Though I found the Bentley to be more comfortable. I'm still wondering if or when Jaguar will release a small car to compete with the 3 series, C class, and A4, because as of now their lineup is still relatively small (not including Range Rover).

NVIDIATI

vs

Anyways I'll try not to go off topic anymore :P

And as always, German interiors are cheap and lousy compared to British ones. And I thought the XF was always pitched against the BMW M5?

Examples of music that could be play on the sound system:

Faxing Berlin

Beautiful Things

Analogue players

SWEAT

Not Exactly

In a years time I'll definitely be sick of them but it should give you an impression of what we'll be rolling around with!

green ones look like fusion subwoofers.. 2nd is sony xplods. both are utter crap. I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

Youtube Video Link

I suggest you go for FI Audio, DD Audio, Orion HCCA or if your on a budget go for Alpine X Type 15's

SPBoss

"max power" or rms?

[QUOTE="SPBoss"]

green ones look like fusion subwoofers.. 2nd is sony xplods. both are utter crap. I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

Youtube Video Link

I suggest you go for FI Audio, DD Audio, Orion HCCA or if your on a budget go for Alpine X Type 15's

topgunmv

"max power" or rms?

Also Boz: Reading your comment a few posts above... the car is going to be used for several things.

*Its got to be comfortable we're going to have to sleep in it and of course, bring women in here with us (heeehee)

*It needs to be entertaining, we'll prolly throw in a TV + PS3 since there'll be a few 5+ hour drives

*It needs a great sound system with LOTS AND LOTS of Bass, the earth moving / glass shattering kind since we're going to be partying and listening to thumpy music...

*It needs does need to impress girls but the sound system and comfort mentioned above covers thatMozelleple112

[QUOTE="SPBoss"]

green ones look like fusion subwoofers.. 2nd is sony xplods. both are utter crap. I have 9000watts of bass in my room :) Its three 3000w pioneer 12" subwoofers

Youtube Video Link

I suggest you go for FI Audio, DD Audio, Orion HCCA or if your on a budget go for Alpine X Type 15's

"max power" or rms?