Crysis? Tactical? Only in your imagination.

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Birdy09

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#1 Birdy09
Member since 2009 • 4775 Posts

Alright ive seen these kind of debates since Crysis has released, while I am NOT one of those people that claim its nothing more than a flashy tech demo, I am one of the players that see it as nothing more than any other FPS on the market, and I do believe that alot of its prestige and critic score is heavily based on its technical feats as apposed to its gameplay.

The way I see it is, there are 2 kinds of people that play this game and look at it in 2 very dinstinct ways (other variations apply but the main 2 Im refering to.)

A) Those of you that claim this game is more tactical than most FPS games, and use that as an excuse to its score, and claim that its brilliant. You are the kind of people that are 100% relying on your imagination to get into this game. You are the kind that mayaswell be pretending to be a sexual predator on Grand Theft Auto, finding a female NPC alone at night picking her up and driving her off a cliff... you know... the stereotyped aspect of GTA .... you roleplay these outcomes even though there is no benefit to the player or any relevance to the games motivation.

B) The other ones are us... the ones that think its a typical shooter... with no more depth than Bioshock, Half-Life 2 (at least thats my view) as both of them have physic based help and some whacky weapons/powers... but are alittle more closed off. Type A will claim that we lack tactical play, that we play it as a regular shooter, and we dont make good use of the powers....

As Type B I would like to explain why I or possible WE look at it this way:

Lets look at the amazing powers....

STRENGTH - Double Jump, 1 shot melee, improved aiming - Whats special about this? Throwing Items at people and jumping high?

SPEED - Enhanced Speed, Super Speed - Base Speed difference isnt much, burst speed lasts no time at all.

STEALTH - Invisibility - Useful for initiation or escape... nothing else.

ARMOUR - Default, Energy Regain. Standard form.

So I ask you, other than a few feeble ambushes.... from this bland open nothingness, that is no more of a sandbox than RPG games such as Vampire Masquerade: Bloodlines.... which has more stealth and more ways of taking people down than Crysis... IRONICALLY.

There is nothing tactical about Crysis, the AI on highest is not that great. its far more efficient to go around shooting everything like in any other shooter, theres no tactical advantage to the powers over any other shooter on the market.

If you believe I'm wrong, then explain or link/show some proof of these powers made useful and fun.

And I'm not talking about pre-school crap like lobbing a barrel at someone... I can do that with a gravity gun... in a much cooler way. I was to see this "Tactical enhanced gameplay thats not present in most other shooters and is a large reason why its scores are so high.". Because as far as anyone outside the rose tinted goggles can see, its multiplayer is awful and dead, the main campaign is absolutely nothing special for any genre and the world itself beyond its technical aspects is boring.... with its ... 5-6 different enemies to boot.

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Wildedge93

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#3 Wildedge93
Member since 2007 • 835 Posts
YawnGeneralShowzer
Coming from the Type a ppl. I totally agree with you as there being nothing new to Crysis except the fantastic graphics and good controls. Everything else i saw in games like cod4, killzone 2 and so on (sorry i have a large console background). But i saw more tactical in Metro 2033, then crysis. But best of all i didnt really like crysis's story to much. i mean it was really good up to the point..... SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER where you find out ur fighting those aliens instead of like mutated Koreans or something. But after that point it was pretty much readable till the end.
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DanielDust

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#4 DanielDust
Member since 2007 • 15402 Posts
I don't know what exactly you want to prove there but most of what you say is like "gun shoots bullets....so what? what else? nothing special". All that you fail to see is the tactical aspect, so obviously you wouldn't see what's so tactical about it and what you can do with the pros of every mode, I mean you did write them but I doubt you actually thought about them you also forgot the tranquilizer darts. I didn't think it's so hard to figure out how to play tactically but I guess there are such individuals, try not to play it as a run and gun game and use the suit functions, see what happens.
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Skittles_McGee

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#5 Skittles_McGee
Member since 2008 • 9136 Posts
If there's nothing tactical about it, why will I get killed if I just run into a group of enemies and start shooting? :? You HAVE to think about your actions and strategize. If you don't, you die.
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Baranga

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#6 Baranga
Member since 2005 • 14217 Posts

Translation of OP:

I have little to no imagination and I'm insulting those that have.

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Crimsader

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#7 Crimsader
Member since 2008 • 11672 Posts
[QUOTE="Skittles_McGee"]If there's nothing tactical about it, why will I get killed if I just run into a group of enemies and start shooting? :? You HAVE to think about your actions and strategize. If you don't, you die.

I dunno that tactic always worked for me :P I passed the whole game just by bailing out and shooting like crazy.
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SamiRDuran

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#8 SamiRDuran
Member since 2005 • 2758 Posts
do you play fps games? whats special about shooting?
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jun_aka_pekto

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#9 jun_aka_pekto
Member since 2010 • 25255 Posts

STRENGTH - Whats special about this? Throwing Items at people and jumping high?

Besides scaling rooftops and an alternate entrance to the second floor? Once in awhile I like to sneak up to KPA, grab them, then killing them without firing a shot. That usually don't alarm the other KPA like gunshots would.


SPEED - Base Speed difference isnt much, burst speed lasts no time at all.

It lasts long enough to get me under cover of trees if I'm caught in the open. But, it's my least-used nanosuit feature.


STEALTH - Useful for initiation or escape... nothing else.

I like to use it when grabbing KPA. It's also useful for sneaking in when I don't feel like firing a shot. It certainly was useful when I forgot to load up on ammo at the night time stage of Relic and I was trying to escape a net of KPA closing in from four directions. It was also useful in dealing with KPA nanosuits in the cemetery. No choice but to cloak because of their murderous sniper fire:

KPA Nanos in Cemetery


If you're bored with it, that's fine. I never expected everyone to have the same tastes as me.

................plus, I don't recall ever thinking of Crysis as a tactical shooter. You want a tactical shooter? Get ArmA 2.

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chandu83

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#10 chandu83
Member since 2005 • 4864 Posts

Translation of OP:

I have little to no imagination and I'm insulting those that have.

Baranga
Couldn't have said it better. Its not tactical like GRAW, but its definitely not like BioShock. I know because I played both.
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Solar-X

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#11 Solar-X
Member since 2010 • 510 Posts

It's definitely a sandbox FPS.

You have different terrain in a lot of the stages. High and low paths. vantage point to climb and snipe from.

different vehicles to control.

When you approach a enemy base in the game your suit powers give you options on how to get into the base. You can jack a car and drive through and go all out. Stealth through. Run around the back and super jump over barbed wire. Drive through stealth out of vehicle and find cover...

Once in the base, you can Stealth right to the target and try to by pass all enemies. Jump on roofs and super jump across roofs whilst taking out enemies. Go into buildings and snipe from windows. Stealth to a vehicle or tank, and use the tank to take out all the enemies..

For a FPS there's a lot of different styles of gameplay in there. Can't really complain.

this is a video I made for Crysis a few months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w140BzgtQ_c

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lucfonzy

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#12 lucfonzy
Member since 2008 • 1835 Posts

I think you may be failing to grasp the fundamental factor of a game, which is essentially, to give the player a sense of enjoyment.

I myself do not find it that fun constantly running into a situation with no strategy.

It makes the game more enjoyable for me to try out different way of tackeling a situation, and Crysis is one of those games that offers you these numerous ways.

You must be used to rail shooters like the whole Cod franchise where you must do what the computer tells you.

All in all, it's a matter of opinion, no one is wrong or right about crysis being a good tactical game or not, it's a pointless argument and i think that it should be dropped and be an opinionated statement only.

"Crysis is one of the best tactical games out there, in my opinion".

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jun_aka_pekto

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#13 jun_aka_pekto
Member since 2010 • 25255 Posts

I also don't know why imagination has to be in a bad light. It's part of immersion. I imagined myself as actually the one in the game. I don't see anything wrong with that. When I'm immersed, I do things my way.

For example, the swamp in Warhead..... My backseater wanted me to stay and protect the car with the alien remains inside. I could've just followed the game and stayed with the train using all the nanosuit powers. But, I imagined myself as really being there. I thought, "Yeah, right. I'm not going to stay with the train and get myself killed". I'll fall back a little farther behind the train where the terrain and trees were to my advantage which resulted in this clip:

Warhead Swamp

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spiderman120988

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#14 spiderman120988
Member since 2005 • 1421 Posts
Baranga: I have little to no imagination and I'm insulting those that have. I agree. What's wrong with a little imagination? Game developers use their imagination to make games anyway! It adds to the enjoyment! It's like Batman AA: oh you're just punching people, what's special about that? or Assassin's Creed: oh you're just stabbing people, what's special about that? If you say that for every game, I find it hard to believe that you can enjoy anything.
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rzepak

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#15 rzepak
Member since 2005 • 5758 Posts

Since it seems the OP made this topic only to insult those who enjoyed Crysis I will just say that your opinion on anything means absolutely nothing seeing as you play HoN. As to your criticism of Crysis...all it basically does is show that you must hate all FPS games since these days there is no such thing as a tactical shooter with the exception of ARMA and the new Flashpoint to a certain degree.

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ShadowsRunner

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#16 ShadowsRunner
Member since 2006 • 742 Posts

Cool story bro :D

It doesn't matter if you don't like it. As long as the people who play it thought that it was a worthwhile purchase then your opinion doesn't matter at all. Your opinion is just another piece of sand in the desert.

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lespaul1919

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#17 lespaul1919
Member since 2003 • 7074 Posts

If there's nothing tactical about it, why will I get killed if I just run into a group of enemies and start shooting? Skittles_McGee

Just like every other shooter.

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mrbojangles25

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#18 mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 60752 Posts

Birdy, you dont know wtf you're talking about.

If you think it is typical, it is because you lack imagination, and you are accustomed to being bosses around by the game, having it tell you what to do.

If someone thinks otherwise (that Crysis is inventive, sandboxy, and tactical) it is because they recognize Crytek has given us the tools, and has take nthe leash off to let us do what we wish.

For those accustomed to being on a leash (people with your mindset) this newfound freedom can be frightening; you look around, you don't know what to do...you might experiment a tiny bit just to test it out, but it is abnormal, and thus distasteful, so you keep doing things the way youve been doing things.

I'd keep going, but frankly I am tired of arguing against people that think games need to be as formulaic as Call of Duty. Instead, read my blog post if you like.

http://www.gamespot.com/users/mrbojangles25/post_blog_entry.php?msg_id=m-100-276715584&user=mrbojangles25

In a thread a few days ago the subject of Crysis came up and, as usual, it started to turn into a debate about the technical merits.

So, to change the subject to where it mattered (gameplay) I put forth the idea that the reason Crysis is an excellent game is because of excellent gameplay. This is the reply I got, and my response:

[QUOTE="The_Capitalist"]

I remember how hyped this game was four years ago when they announced it. Then, it came, made some good money for Crytek, had an expansion pack and hasn't been heard much of since.

Crysis was great for a few hours, but it lacked the staying power of many games I have played. Graphics were very nice... but it just felt like another generic shooter. I beat it, and haven't touched it in years. It's still sitting on the shelf...

And Crysis 2 hasn't hyped me up all that much either. Oh no, aliens invading New York City? How original!

mrbojangles25

I can see where you are coming from, but I beg to differ.

The thing with Crysis is that the developer gave you all these amazing tools to play the game how you want to play it. Unfortunately, most gamers are so used to generic shootersthey treated Crysis as a generic shooter even though it is far from it.

Imagine youre given a recipe and the ingredients to bake a cake. You have everything you need to make an ordinary yellow cake with bland frosting. And that is exactly what 90% of the population would do; they would follow the directions, as they do with all other things, and leave it at that.

But what about the other 10% of the population? They would do something creative, something inspired...they'd say "Im not gonna make some ordinary cake, I have all the tools I need to make a grande gateau!" So they take these tools and ingredients and whip up an amazing, multi-tiered cake that looks and, more importantly, tastes amazing.

Crysis is exactly this. It is full of multiple tools and ingredientsa gamer can use for whatever they like. Unfortunately, only a small number of people really take advantage of such generosity and make the most of it. The rest? Well, they just leave armor mode on and shoot their way through the game.

This is why, imo, Crysis is the most misunderstood game in history. People judge it by its cover ("Oooh its just sexy, but lacks depth of gameplay") and dont see the true potential. People have become so used to Dooms and Quakes and FEARs and corridor after corridor and games tellign them how to play that they have forgotten how to apply their God-given creativity to games that let them play around for once. We have become slaves to visuals to the point where we almost equate looks with quality.

In short, Crysis is a true gamer's game. The sheer potential gameplay one can extract from it if they are willing to apply their mind to it makes it one of the greatest shooters in history.

Those are just my thoughts on the matter. Not to continue the cake analogy, but the visuals in Crysis are merely icing on the cake. The bulk of the game's success, imo, is due to an amazing singleplayer experience that is unique and unlike any other game I have experienced.

While it is not my favorite game overall (that goes to Halflife saga, for combining multiple elements to form a solid game), Crysis has the best FPS gameplay I have ever experienced.

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Im_single

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#19 Im_single
Member since 2008 • 5134 Posts
What a dumb post, the tactics exist and you're just too lazy to use them, just because you are too lazy/unimaginative doesn't mean the game isn't tactical.
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chandu83

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#20 chandu83
Member since 2005 • 4864 Posts
The thing is, anything can be generalized and trivialized. You could say, Half Life is nothing but a extremely linear game where you point and shoot at things.
Is that a lie? Actually no. But the game is not just that.
Same goes with Crysis. You could say, its a generic FPS with good visuals.
Crysis is no more generic than Half-Life. Yes, story leaves a lot to be desired, I get it, but its serviceable. It does the job. The gameplay is where the fun is at, if you know how to play it and enjoy it.
If you do not, well, too bad. A lot of us enjoyed it.
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rmfd341

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#21 rmfd341
Member since 2008 • 3808 Posts
My definition of tactical is ARMA 2, Crysis is definitely not ARMA 2. But I can see you didn't mean tactical as I did, so I will tell you why Crysis and FarCry 2 have some kind of tactics into them. Crysis' main gameplay feature is the nanosuit, which lets you go predator on the korean soldiers, rambo, or even speedy gonzalez ( I don't recommend this one, I remember this playthrough, it was only fun when I cheated with the game's files), you can approach each situation in a different way each time you play, Far Cry 2 also has tactics depending on your weaponry, the day night cycle and the place you're invading, if you play on Infamous especially you'll see what I mean.
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Ondoval

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#22 Ondoval
Member since 2005 • 3103 Posts

1-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ore80pmNEso

2-Well, you can prone, crouch and lean in Crysis; you can walk, run and sprint (note: you can't perform some of this in a "military sim" as Flashpoint 2, and tons of recent shooter).

3-You can also use both Strength and Speed to strafe jumping as in Quake and UT games. You can select the fire mode in most of weapons between single shots or full auto.

4-You can customize in real time your weapons adding silencers (with the drawback of less damage), laser pointers (less spray, but you're more easy to detect), reflex sights, assault sights ant telescopic sights. You can attach a tactical flashlight and/or use enhanced vision.

5-The suit provides you Armor mode, in which your health bar refills at 4 health points x second and uses the energy as shield, whereas in the other modes isn't energy shield and you only refills life at 2 HP x second. Strength gives you increasing range launching grenades, better accuracy and insta-kill mele attacks, whereas Speed open the door to strafe jump and exhilarating flanking capabilities. Cloak mode is only useful in Power Struggle since in Team Instant Action the camping is a lot less effective.

6-The game gives you 4 different grenades (frag, smoke, flash bang and EMP), claymores, AT mines, C4 demolition charges, repairing tools, a pistol, 2 kinds of smg, 2 assault rifles, 2 sniper rifles, a shotgun, 2 types of grenade launchers and 4 types of heavy weapons (Gatling, missile launcher, MOAC and MOAR), plus a few vehicles (boats, hoovercrafts, Humvee, various APCs, two MBTs, 2 aircraft vehicles. Not the biggest arsenal in the world, but pretty decent.

I'm answering since the mp part of the game, since I wrote a 70+ pages article and spent over 320 hours only in the mp. I think that ArmA II and Quake Wars were a lot more tactical and some other shooters have better balance between weapons (UT III) since in Crysis Wars the SCAR clearly rules, but aside from the low popularity I think that the game is far deeper in gunplay mechanics than Half-Life 2, Bioshock and some other recent shooters that heavily fail in the gunplay department.

My review about the mp (sorry, is not in English) :

http://zonaforo.meristation.com/foros/viewtopic.php?t=1313668&highlight=Dossier

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Macutchi

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#23 Macutchi
Member since 2007 • 11197 Posts

Alright ive seen these kind of debates since Crysis has released, while I am NOT one of those people that claim its nothing more than a flashy tech demo, I am one of the players that see it as nothing more than any other FPS on the market, and I do believe that alot of its prestige and critic score is heavily based on its technical feats as apposed to its gameplay.

The way I see it is, there are 2 kinds of people that play this game and look at it in 2 very dinstinct ways (other variations apply but the main 2 Im refering to.)

A) Those of you that claim this game is more tactical than most FPS games, and use that as an excuse to its score, and claim that its brilliant. You are the kind of people that are 100% relying on your imagination to get into this game. You are the kind that mayaswell be pretending to be a sexual predator on Grand Theft Auto, finding a female NPC alone at night picking her up and driving her off a cliff... you know... the stereotyped aspect of GTA .... you roleplay these outcomes even though there is no benefit to the player or any relevance to the games motivation.

B) The other ones are us... the ones that think its a typical shooter... with no more depth than Bioshock, Half-Life 2 (at least thats my view) as both of them have physic based help and some whacky weapons/powers... but are alittle more closed off. Type A will claim that we lack tactical play, that we play it as a regular shooter, and we dont make good use of the powers....

As Type B I would like to explain why I or possible WE look at it this way:

Lets look at the amazing powers....

STRENGTH - Double Jump, 1 shot melee, improved aiming - Whats special about this? Throwing Items at people and jumping high?

SPEED - Enhanced Speed, Super Speed - Base Speed difference isnt much, burst speed lasts no time at all.

STEALTH - Invisibility - Useful for initiation or escape... nothing else.

ARMOUR - Default, Energy Regain. Standard form.

So I ask you, other than a few feeble ambushes.... from this bland open nothingness, that is no more of a sandbox than RPG games such as Vampire Masquerade: Bloodlines.... which has more stealth and more ways of taking people down than Crysis... IRONICALLY.

There is nothing tactical about Crysis, the AI on highest is not that great. its far more efficient to go around shooting everything like in any other shooter, theres no tactical advantage to the powers over any other shooter on the market.

If you believe I'm wrong, then explain or link/show some proof of these powers made useful and fun.

And I'm not talking about pre-school crap like lobbing a barrel at someone... I can do that with a gravity gun... in a much cooler way. I was to see this "Tactical enhanced gameplay thats not present in most other shooters and is a large reason why its scores are so high.". Because as far as anyone outside the rose tinted goggles can see, its multiplayer is awful and dead, the main campaign is absolutely nothing special for any genre and the world itself beyond its technical aspects is boring.... with its ... 5-6 different enemies to boot.

Birdy09

i managed about 5 lines of that. not bad going all things considered

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rollermint

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#24 rollermint
Member since 2010 • 632 Posts
Personally, Crysis is a game that allows a gamer to be tactical if they choose to be such. It also allows a gamer to play the typical run'n'gun ala Doom/COD if thats what they choose to be. I don't know why is it so hard to comprehend that...
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RK-Mara

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#25 RK-Mara
Member since 2006 • 11489 Posts
The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.
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mrbojangles25

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#26 mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 60752 Posts

The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.RK-Mara

that is hardly the game's fault though, and this is my main objection: a lot of people lacking the will to get out of their safe little box blame the game for that.

if the game forced you to play and think differently, then youre removing the choice of playing it how you want which makes the game so great.

It is a double-edged sword, a lose-lose, and its a damn shame Crytek gets blamed for people's laziness.

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Revolution_DDM

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#27 Revolution_DDM
Member since 2005 • 274 Posts

I found crysis to be an extremely pretty but shallow game. But that's just, like, my opinion, man.

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chandu83

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#28 chandu83
Member since 2005 • 4864 Posts
The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.RK-Mara
If a game forced you to think different, it wouldn't be a sandbox game. I enjoyed the freedom to employ different kinds of gameplay. Too bad that you can't be bothered.
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mrbojangles25

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#29 mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 60752 Posts

[QUOTE="RK-Mara"]The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.chandu83
If a game forced you to think different, it wouldn't be a sandbox game. I enjoyed the freedom to employ different kinds of gameplay. Too bad that you can't be bothered.

qft

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liquid_snake20

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#30 liquid_snake20
Member since 2010 • 25 Posts
crysis quite a good game..
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KHAndAnime

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#31 KHAndAnime
Member since 2009 • 17565 Posts
crysis quite a good game..liquid_snake20
Agreed. One of the best shooters of the generation.
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dakan45

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#32 dakan45
Member since 2009 • 18819 Posts
Well when there are people who claim can run around and kill anytthing via run and gun, i cant really say there is much tactics there now are there? I only once experianced tactics in crysis. I saw some koreans near a big truck, i shot the gastank of that track and they all died. But apart from that the rest of the "tactics" are just hide and seek with the cloack mode and silenced guns with sniper scopes :lol: Anyway i agree about the ai not being that good. But seriously many people see this whole "freedom"and suit function thing which is mostly a lie. Armor: like saying basic health regeneration like in every game. Speed: a short shot of Nitro that does not do much, i would prefer a slower sprint mode that runs out and i have to wait a while before i sprint again. Or slow mo would be cool. Strength: I dont understand why its not the same function as speed, but anyway strength and speed modes will be merged in crysis 2. So with strength you can jump a bit high on huts and fixed rock position that will get you further in the game, but what practical use they got that results into tactics or advantages while fighting? Can you jump on a tree like a predator? Can you jump on a tank and open the hatch with strength and throw a grenade? and you do the same to jump on a boat or grab yourself from a helicopter that is just taking off? Offcourse with stregth your meele attacks are more powerfull and you got less innacuracy in long range. But then again in every other fps i have ever played both accuracy and meele attacks are more powerfull without the need of a musccle enchancing mechanics. Only cloak is good but its not as good as in say, alien vs predator. Cloak has a short tem usage, go from here to there, de cloak to recharge and cloack back on. Plus shooting disables cloack. I guess if items you picked up from the ground also became invisible, then it will have some usage. At the end of the day that "freedom" is a joke when it comes to games with real freedom like deus ex and system shock2 that you can play with diffirent toys.
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dakan45

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#33 dakan45
Member since 2009 • 18819 Posts

I found crysis to be an extremely pretty but shallow game. But that's just, like, my opinion, man.

Revolution_DDM
To be honest i did not find it shallow, more like a game with too much hype for what it offers. More like people are making it sound more than it really is. At the end i did not saw what this whole fuzz about and it remained in my memory as an "ok" game with graphics. Therefore average without anything noteworthy to keep me excited. But whatever, thats just me, most people here seem to find all of its features quite amazing....when i say "right" and drop the discussion and go play games like half life, system shock 2 and far cry that actually were amazing.
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RK-Mara

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#34 RK-Mara
Member since 2006 • 11489 Posts

[QUOTE="RK-Mara"]The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.mrbojangles25

that is hardly the game's fault though, and this is my main objection: a lot of people lacking the will to get out of their safe little box blame the game for that.

if the game forced you to play and think differently, then youre removing the choice of playing it how you want which makes the game so great.

It is a double-edged sword, a lose-lose, and its a damn shame Crytek gets blamed for people's laziness.

I can't see why they couldn't remove the option to run and gun if it's 'wrong' to do so. Run and gun is one of the choices the game's giving me and I'm using it. Next I won't be allowed to play as a good character in RPGs because it's boring.
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mrbojangles25

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#35 mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 60752 Posts

[QUOTE="mrbojangles25"]

[QUOTE="RK-Mara"]The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.RK-Mara

that is hardly the game's fault though, and this is my main objection: a lot of people lacking the will to get out of their safe little box blame the game for that.

if the game forced you to play and think differently, then youre removing the choice of playing it how you want which makes the game so great.

It is a double-edged sword, a lose-lose, and its a damn shame Crytek gets blamed for people's laziness.

I can't see why they couldn't remove the option to run and gun if it's 'wrong' to do so. Run and gun is one of the choices the game's giving me and I'm using it. Next I won't be allowed to play as a good character in RPGs because it's boring.

thats why I said giving the play such choice, and having to rely on player creativity/ambition, is a double-edged sword: youre going to have people praising Crysis for its ingenuity and choice as much as you're going to have people criticizing it for not bossing you around.

Crysis is a linear game on the surface, so people expect linearity, but Crysis also allows several different options all the time, and even more options is specific situatons (i.e. taking out patrols, bases, etc).

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deactivated-5926b7362eeb7

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#36 deactivated-5926b7362eeb7
Member since 2009 • 126 Posts
[QUOTE="rollermint"]Personally, Crysis is a game that allows a gamer to be tactical if they choose to be such. It also allows a gamer to play the typical run'n'gun ala Doom/COD if thats what they choose to be. I don't know why is it so hard to comprehend that...

Yes. If your going to play Crysis like a generic shooter it will feel like one. (ala my first play through on normal), because Crysis allows you to. When I played through on its hardest setting, (I believe you've never really finished a game till you've done this.) I was forced to hide more, and come up with diff tactics since they weren't shooting in the air anymore, even used the tranq weapon a few times. But that may be because I lack the "mad skillz" required to generic my way through the hard mode. On an unrelated note, I really wish they made the language the Korean enemies speak a toggle rather than tying it in with the difficulty. Korean's screaming obscenities at me in English almost ruined the experience. I was kinda "wtf"
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MondeEdlu

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#37 MondeEdlu
Member since 2005 • 181 Posts

its not really tactical, not any more than bioshock as that other poster suggested, both games give you the tools be creative but that doesn't mean its tactical. The game doesnt REQUIRE tactics hence its not tactical, you play with your own imaginative tactics but thats about as useful as just running in and gunning everything down.

The fact that it gives you a lot of things to mess around with doesn't mean its a core part of the gameplay, its just another fun thing to do. Its like sayng hiding behind cover in modern warfare is tactics, i sure sniped from a lot of buildings aswell, it doesn't make it a tactical game, it doesn't make it a bad game either. Its like saying GTA is tactical.

I think crysis is a great game, but not because its tactical

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skrat_01

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#38 skrat_01
Member since 2007 • 33767 Posts
Combat has more depth. The suits abilities allow the player to change play style on the fly; be it maneuvering, evasion, direct combat, ranged etc. By shooter standards it is highy impressive, and it does not stray into RPG territory specialization (as it was originally going to) like Deus Ex. - This allows the player to use a variety of tactics and strategies, and change them on the fly. Crysis isn't a tactical shooter, there isn't a concentrated focus on out thinking your enemy.
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#39 rollermint
Member since 2010 • 632 Posts
The problem with Crysis is that while there are various different ways to handle most situations (at least as long as you are fighting humans), there's no need to change tactics. I play Crysis like a regular shooter because I can't be bothered to try something different when run and gun does the job. If Crysis forced you to think differently, it would be great for me.RK-Mara
Just because you are too lazy to change tactics, it doesn't mean the game is restricted. That's your fault, not the game. The game allows you to choose whatever approach that you decide on. Its like blaming a game is too easy while ironically playing on EASY mode while refusing to switch to harder difficulties.
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Birdy09

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#40 Birdy09
Member since 2009 • 4775 Posts
[QUOTE="Skittles_McGee"]If there's nothing tactical about it, why will I get killed if I just run into a group of enemies and start shooting? :? You HAVE to think about your actions and strategize. If you don't, you die.

No you dont, you can treat it like any other shooter, take cover and shoot.... and its alot more effective than any other method... well unless the idea of tactics on this forum is just running past them all....

Translation of OP:

I have little to no imagination and I'm insulting those that have.

Baranga
Wrong.

I think you may be failing to grasp the fundamental factor of a game, which is essentially, to give the player a sense of enjoyment.

I myself do not find it that fun constantly running into a situation with no strategy.

It makes the game more enjoyable for me to try out different way of tackeling a situation, and Crysis is one of those games that offers you these numerous ways.

You must be used to rail shooters like the whole Cod franchise where you must do what the computer tells you.

All in all, it's a matter of opinion, no one is wrong or right about crysis being a good tactical game or not, it's a pointless argument and i think that it should be dropped and be an opinionated statement only.

"Crysis is one of the best tactical games out there, in my opinion".

lucfonzy
I understand this yes, and dont get me wrong like the previous person I have quoted has. I treat most sandbox games as sandbox.... but Crysis barely resembles one, the incentive to do anything but jump on roofs isnt there. yes it resembles similarities to most sandbox games but in the most bland and un-interesting form possible. ************ I Treat a tactical game as a game where if I dont... I'm going to lose, not a typical open area shooter than gives me tranquilizers darts for no other reason than them being there to laugh as you knock out a chinese guy >_> ,,, I mean cmon. theres no penalty for anything, why would I use sleeper darts when I can just silently kill him anyway? when theres no reason, motivation or objective reward for doing so? 90% of RPGs have more tactical play than Crysis.... well, oblivion/morrowing and those kind anyway.
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Birdy09

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#41 Birdy09
Member since 2009 • 4775 Posts

Cool story bro :D

It doesn't matter if you don't like it. As long as the people who play it thought that it was a worthwhile purchase then your opinion doesn't matter at all. Your opinion is just another piece of sand in the desert.

ShadowsRunner

I see your Cool Story Bro, and raise you a "Congratulations Captain Obvious".
The thing is, anything can be generalized and trivialized. You could say, Half Life is nothing but a extremely linear game where you point and shoot at things.
Is that a lie? Actually no. But the game is not just that.
Same goes with Crysis. You could say, its a generic FPS with good visuals.
Crysis is no more generic than Half-Life. Yes, story leaves a lot to be desired, I get it, but its serviceable. It does the job. The gameplay is where the fun is at, if you know how to play it and enjoy it.
If you do not, well, too bad. A lot of us enjoyed it. chandu83
I agree. but my underlying point is here, that there is so little to the game itself beyond its beauty that imagination is all that keeps this game "Serviceable" in the first place.

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Birdy09

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#42 Birdy09
Member since 2009 • 4775 Posts

It's definitely a sandbox FPS.

You have different terrain in a lot of the stages. High and low paths. vantage point to climb and snipe from.

different vehicles to control.

When you approach a enemy base in the game your suit powers give you options on how to get into the base. You can jack a car and drive through and go all out. Stealth through. Run around the back and super jump over barbed wire. Drive through stealth out of vehicle and find cover...

Once in the base, you can Stealth right to the target and try to by pass all enemies. Jump on roofs and super jump across roofs whilst taking out enemies. Go into buildings and snipe from windows. Stealth to a vehicle or tank, and use the tank to take out all the enemies..

For a FPS there's a lot of different styles of gameplay in there. Can't really complain.

this is a video I made for Crysis a few months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w140BzgtQ_c

Solar-X
Right, I'm looking at your video, and first off im impressed by the rig defintly, looks amazing on yours even while recording. but I again fail to see the amazing gameplay that isnt present in any other shooter with additional powers of open fields. I mean, you up above that river? You stealthed... made it all seem flashy with the music... and yet.... they couldnt see you anyway.... you jsut popped them all off with a sniper rifle in a linear line. wether or not you led them there is a different story. The rest is just typical blow up or grab a vehicle which again .... ive done before and didnt warrant those games incredible scores or cult fanatasism. Infact, your whole video is mainly about THE GRAPHICS.. which is why you all delve into your imagination so much, the same reason people mod oblivion to death to make it look prettier or even more "life-like". I stand by what I say, the rose-tinted goggles are based in a vast majority on the graphics.... no the intellectual property, tactical gameplay or amazing story... or amazing multiplayer, because those things are very much in the average category.
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RK-Mara

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#43 RK-Mara
Member since 2006 • 11489 Posts
[QUOTE="rollermint"] Just because you are too lazy to change tactics, it doesn't mean the game is restricted. That's your fault, not the game. The game allows you to choose whatever approach that you decide on. Its like blaming a game is too easy while ironically playing on EASY mode while refusing to switch to harder difficulties.

I didn't say the game is restricted, I wish it was. Unless a shooter forces me to try different approaches, I won't use them.
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#44 Solar-X
Member since 2010 • 510 Posts

[QUOTE="Solar-X"]

It's definitely a sandbox FPS.

You have different terrain in a lot of the stages. High and low paths. vantage point to climb and snipe from.

different vehicles to control.

When you approach a enemy base in the game your suit powers give you options on how to get into the base. You can jack a car and drive through and go all out. Stealth through. Run around the back and super jump over barbed wire. Drive through stealth out of vehicle and find cover...

Once in the base, you can Stealth right to the target and try to by pass all enemies. Jump on roofs and super jump across roofs whilst taking out enemies. Go into buildings and snipe from windows. Stealth to a vehicle or tank, and use the tank to take out all the enemies..

For a FPS there's a lot of different styles of gameplay in there. Can't really complain.

this is a video I made for Crysis a few months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w140BzgtQ_c

Birdy09

Right, I'm looking at your video, and first off im impressed by the rig defintly, looks amazing on yours even while recording. but I again fail to see the amazing gameplay that isnt present in any other shooter with additional powers of open fields. I mean, you up above that river? You stealthed... made it all seem flashy with the music... and yet.... they couldnt see you anyway.... you jsut popped them all off with a sniper rifle in a linear line. wether or not you led them there is a different story. The rest is just typical blow up or grab a vehicle which again .... ive done before and didnt warrant those games incredible scores or cult fanatasism. Infact, your whole video is mainly about THE GRAPHICS.. which is why you all delve into your imagination so much, the same reason people mod oblivion to death to make it look prettier or even more "life-like". I stand by what I say, the rose-tinted goggles are based in a vast majority on the graphics.... no the intellectual property, tactical gameplay or amazing story... or amazing multiplayer, because those things are very much in the average category.

You just seem to be complaining about the game because it plays like a FPS. You complain because I sniped three soldiers off. What did you want me to, walk up and shake their hand. It's FPS, the point is to blow stuff up.

If blowing stuff up is not enough for you then best not play FPS. I play Crysis because the gameplay is good not for the graphics. I've been playing FPS on PC since 1995, I know what good gameplay is.

And you can compare Crysis to any other leading FPS like COD. You only blow up a vehicle because the game tells you to shoot the vehicle. There's no choice there. You don't have a option to shoot the driver and then jack the vehicle, or blow the tyre and watch it flip or blow the exhaust. You simply shoot the vehicle and it explodes because you're in a part in the game where you're supposed to that. It's all scripted events. And most FPS are like that. No randomness. And that is not realistic or immersive.

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lucfonzy

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#45 lucfonzy
Member since 2008 • 1835 Posts

For some reason i think people find scripted events alot more exciting than doing it all of your own accord.

It's a shame, but that's what scripted events are supposed to be like, you see it from a set angle at a set time so everything goes off in perfect cinematic fashion.

The reason that people don't find the freedom in such games as Crysis fun is because they aren't seeing it from a set point of view where you can really take advantage of the epicness you know?

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Eneru112

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#46 Eneru112
Member since 2010 • 1165 Posts

i bet OP plays MW2 every day

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Birdy09

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#47 Birdy09
Member since 2009 • 4775 Posts

[QUOTE="Birdy09"][QUOTE="Solar-X"] Right, I'm looking at your video, and first off im impressed by the rig defintly, looks amazing on yours even while recording. but I again fail to see the amazing gameplay that isnt present in any other shooter with additional powers of open fields. I mean, you up above that river? You stealthed... made it all seem flashy with the music... and yet.... they couldnt see you anyway.... you jsut popped them all off with a sniper rifle in a linear line. wether or not you led them there is a different story. The rest is just typical blow up or grab a vehicle which again .... ive done before and didnt warrant those games incredible scores or cult fanatasism. Infact, your whole video is mainly about THE GRAPHICS.. which is why you all delve into your imagination so much, the same reason people mod oblivion to death to make it look prettier or even more "life-like". I stand by what I say, the rose-tinted goggles are based in a vast majority on the graphics.... no the intellectual property, tactical gameplay or amazing story... or amazing multiplayer, because those things are very much in the average category.Solar-X

You just seem to be complaining about the game because it plays like a FPS. You complain because I sniped three soldiers off. What did you want me to, walk up and shake their hand. It's FPS, the point is to blow stuff up.

If blowing stuff up is not enough for you then best not play FPS. I play Crysis because the gameplay is good not for the graphics. I've been playing FPS on PC since 1995, I know what good gameplay is.

And you can compare Crysis to any other leading FPS like COD. You only blow up a vehicle because the game tells you to shoot the vehicle. There's no choice there. You don't have a option to shoot the driver and then jack the vehicle, or blow the tyre and watch it flip or blow the exhaust. You simply shoot the vehicle and it explodes because you're in a part in the game where you're supposed to that. It's all scripted events. And most FPS are like that. No randomness. And that is not realistic or immersive.

I'm not complaining, I assumed your video was what I requested.... examples of tactical gameplay, in which I saw none as usual, I pointed out that the stealth in your video was pointless because they couldnt see you from that distance anyway. and the very fact that your video's title prooves your just saying the opposite to what you are really thinking.... how to show off Crysis amazing gameplay? Shove your graphics card in the title, and make out the games more epic than it is with film music.... but then the content actually shown is very common and average to the genre, nothing outstanding, which is again what I'm requesting. As for your last paragraph... again, I can do this in GTA for example, which is a shooter aswell (only 3rd person) and that game does it better. you say its optional but Crysis is nearly complete script anyway... its not random spawns.... random generations, or anything like that, the patrols come along in a normal fashion, the reinforment spawns... everything is scripted, only difference being you have a wider scope of knowing where they are.... its sandbox to the most basic level.

i bet OP plays MW2 every day

Eneru112
Nope, though I'm not up myself enough to claim Crysis has a better SP or MP ... because it has neither.
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biggest_loser

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#48 biggest_loser
Member since 2007 • 24508 Posts
The powers allow for different playing styles.
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DigitalExile

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#49 DigitalExile
Member since 2008 • 16046 Posts

tactic: A manoeuvre, or action calculated to achieve some end. Keyword there being calculated, as in planned, thoughout.

Tactic 1: You run into a group of enemies not using cover. You invariably die. You cannot take gun fire from more than 3 people and survive, and quite often there are far more then 3 enemies around.

Tactic 2: You run into a group of enemies using your suit functions, such as cloak. Here you survive for longer. You get the upper hand on at least a few of them, but you're still not using cover, so you're soaking up those bullets like a sponge.

Obviously these tactics are not working. Sure you thought about it for a bit, but something isn't right. How can you take out so many guys without dying? Let's think about it. Using your suit certainly helped, but what didn't was rushing out of cover and giving away your position. So the key is to stay hidden and to let the enemy be confused for as long as possible.

And yes, YES, the enemy can be CONFUSED if you mvoe yourself around, under cover, using the suit functions - either speed, or cloak, to hide as fast as possible.

Tactic 3: You use a silenced weapon and stay under cover. You either use a dart to knock out guards, or you try and kill them before any others are alerted - which they will be regardless. Now that you've started your attack, displacement is key. Move from your current position, staying under cover, or while cloaked, to a new position. Now the gaurds are looking in the wrong spot, or better yet have their backs to you. Take out afew more, rinse, repeat.

Tactic 4: Play on easy and throw chickens and sea turtles at enemies.

That right there was three (four :P) different tactics utilising game mechanics and not my imagination.

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#50 Cranler
Member since 2005 • 8809 Posts
[QUOTE="Birdy09"][QUOTE="Solar-X"]

It's definitely a sandbox FPS.

You have different terrain in a lot of the stages. High and low paths. vantage point to climb and snipe from.

different vehicles to control.

When you approach a enemy base in the game your suit powers give you options on how to get into the base. You can jack a car and drive through and go all out. Stealth through. Run around the back and super jump over barbed wire. Drive through stealth out of vehicle and find cover...

Once in the base, you can Stealth right to the target and try to by pass all enemies. Jump on roofs and super jump across roofs whilst taking out enemies. Go into buildings and snipe from windows. Stealth to a vehicle or tank, and use the tank to take out all the enemies..

For a FPS there's a lot of different styles of gameplay in there. Can't really complain.

this is a video I made for Crysis a few months ago.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w140BzgtQ_c

Right, I'm looking at your video, and first off im impressed by the rig defintly, looks amazing on yours even while recording. but I again fail to see the amazing gameplay that isnt present in any other shooter with additional powers of open fields. I mean, you up above that river? You stealthed... made it all seem flashy with the music... and yet.... they couldnt see you anyway.... you jsut popped them all off with a sniper rifle in a linear line. wether or not you led them there is a different story. The rest is just typical blow up or grab a vehicle which again .... ive done before and didnt warrant those games incredible scores or cult fanatasism. Infact, your whole video is mainly about THE GRAPHICS.. which is why you all delve into your imagination so much, the same reason people mod oblivion to death to make it look prettier or even more "life-like". I stand by what I say, the rose-tinted goggles are based in a vast majority on the graphics.... no the intellectual property, tactical gameplay or amazing story... or amazing multiplayer, because those things are very much in the average category.

Thing is if you watch someone else play the same maps it will play out differently. If you watch different people play COD for example it will play out the same. COD makes you feel like you're a character in a movie. Crysis makes you feel like you're really there. I'll take immersion over cinematic any day.