Do you think WOW needs optimizing?

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

mattuk69

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

[QUOTE="mattuk69"]

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

Buttons1990

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

I think WoW needs a shotgun to the face.

I think WoW needs a shotgun to the face.

Cruxis27

[QUOTE="Cruxis27"]

I think WoW needs a shotgun to the face.

testfactor888

Doesn't it? :)

Im running WoW on a C2Q q6600 and a 5750. It runs buttery smooth for me on the highest settings regardless of the number of players. The secret ingredient? Its running off my 64 GB SSD along with my OS.

WoW uses alot of streaming, especially for other player's gear. As long as people are coming in and out of view, your hard drive will take a hit and subsequently so will your FPS. Younger MMOs suffer this issue less because of less content, data, and bloat.

[QUOTE="mattuk69"]

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

Buttons1990

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

Let's be honest, you're never going to have more than 300 characters on your screen at one time. Even last generation cards, ATI 4XXX and Nvidia GTX 2XX, should be a massive over kill for displaying those kinds of numbers on the now very dated WoW graphics engine. I can run Napoleon Total War on HIGH/HIGHEST settings at HD resolution with 15,000 units on screen and still keep my average FPS over 25, but in WoW my computer could be brought down to 20 FPS just by standing in a capital city during peak traffic times.

Also, there's very little difference between my average FPS and my friends average FPS even though our hardware is quite different(GTX9800+, 4870CF-X, 5770)(Q6600@2.66GHz, Q9440@3.5GHz, PhenomII X3 720 @ 3.0GHz). We can all run the game at 60+ FPS when we are out of town away from everyone, but during heavy traffic times we all get around 20-30 FPS.

A game like L4D2 demonstrates large FPS changes between our 3 computers because it's actually optimised well.

There's no question that WoW is in great need of some optimiztion toward quad-core processors and the new generation of GPUs.

[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]

[QUOTE="mattuk69"]

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

soliderPp

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

Let's be honest, you're never going to have more than 300 characters on your screen at one time. Even last generation cards, ATI 4XXX and Nvidia GTX 2XX, should be a massive over kill for displaying those kinds of numbers on the now very dated WoW graphics engine. I can run Napoleon Total War on HIGH/HIGHEST settings at HD resolution with 15,000 units on screen and still keep my average FPS over 25, but in WoW my computer could be brought down to 20 FPS just by standing in a capital city during peak traffic times.

Also, there's very little difference between my average FPS and my friends average FPS even though our hardware is quite different(GTX9800+, 4870CF-X, 5770)(Q6600@2.66GHz, Q9440@3.5GHz, PhenomII X3 720 @ 3.0GHz). We can all run the game at 60+ FPS when we are out of town away from everyone, but during heavy traffic times we all get around 20-30 FPS.

A game like L4D2 demonstrates large FPS changes between our 3 computers because it's actually optimised well.

There's no question that WoW is in great need of some optimiztion toward quad-core processors and the new generation of GPUs.

Rendering 300 highly detailed (not by a game like Crysis' point of view, but highly detailed nontheless)... Every item you have equipped is rendered, as is its individual texture... Some of them quite high in resolution, such as shoulders, helms, weapons... They are 512x512 textures... They are all also, simultaneously executing any number of animations (entirely random as they are player controlled)... You compare it to Napoleon TW... That is nowhere near the same... As in Napoleon, it is clone armies (yes, still cloned like before, just with more variation and animations) and the textures for those units are only 256x256... Plus, you only render a few of those 15k at a time as any immediately outside of your fov are turned into 2d sprites... I know you aren't having 25+fps with all 15k in one spot on screen at once... That is a complete lie... I have a Q9550 @ 3.65GHz, 8GB of PC1000, and 2 GTX 470's in SLI and I can't even get 25fps with that many units on screen at once... So unless you have an extreme edition i7 @ 4GHz and tri-sli 480's... You are talking out your butt right now...

Any game would slow down with that much being rendered... Look at crysis... Go into the editor... Spawn a guy... Everything is good right... 45fps, everything looks great...? Now spawn 2 more... Woah just lost 10fps from just 3 guys... What about 10 guys? Now you are in the 20's and things are getting a bit choppy... That is how every game is...

[QUOTE="soliderPp"]

[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

Buttons1990

Let's be honest, you're never going to have more than 300 characters on your screen at one time. Even last generation cards, ATI 4XXX and Nvidia GTX 2XX, should be a massive over kill for displaying those kinds of numbers on the now very dated WoW graphics engine. I can run Napoleon Total War on HIGH/HIGHEST settings at HD resolution with 15,000 units on screen and still keep my average FPS over 25, but in WoW my computer could be brought down to 20 FPS just by standing in a capital city during peak traffic times.

Also, there's very little difference between my average FPS and my friends average FPS even though our hardware is quite different(GTX9800+, 4870CF-X, 5770)(Q6600@2.66GHz, Q9440@3.5GHz, PhenomII X3 720 @ 3.0GHz). We can all run the game at 60+ FPS when we are out of town away from everyone, but during heavy traffic times we all get around 20-30 FPS.

A game like L4D2 demonstrates large FPS changes between our 3 computers because it's actually optimised well.

There's no question that WoW is in great need of some optimiztion toward quad-core processors and the new generation of GPUs.

Rendering 300 highly detailed (not by a game like Crysis' point of view, but highly detailed nontheless)... Every item you have equipped is rendered, as is its individual texture... Some of them quite high in resolution, such as shoulders, helms, weapons... They are 512x512 textures... They are all also, simultaneously executing any number of animations (entirely random as they are player controlled)... You compare it to Napoleon TW... That is nowhere near the same... As in Napoleon, it is clone armies (yes, still cloned like before, just with more variation and animations) and the textures for those units are only 256x256... Plus, you only render a few of those 15k at a time as any immediately outside of your fov are turned into 2d sprites...I know you aren't having 25+fps with all 15k in one spot on screen at once...That is a complete lie... I have a Q9550 @ 3.65GHz, 8GB of PC1000, and 2 GTX 470's in SLI and I can't even get 25fps with that many units on screen at once... So unless you have an extreme edition i7 @ 4GHz and tri-sli 480's... You are talking out your butt right now...

Any game would slow down with that much being rendered... Look at crysis... Go into the editor... Spawn a guy... Everything is good right... 45fps, everything looks great...? Now spawn 2 more... Woah just lost 10fps from just 3 guys... What about 10 guys? Now you are in the 20's and things are getting a bit choppy... That is how every game is...

I'll address your comments individually from left to right.

1) In every game any object off your screen is not be fully rendered in 3D. Warcraft is no exception.

2) It's more of less impossible to have your camera over all the units on the field at one time. You just can't zoom out enough. It's my mistake for using the term "on screen". I just meant that during a battle a can have a 15,000 unit battle and have the game run just fine.

3) It's not, I have no need to make up random **** on the internet to bash a game that I love.

4) Can you not exercise more civility?

Now you've also not addressed that even if you had 300 toons on your screen at a time, which is highly unlikely in itself, I was just throwing out the highest number I though was possible; WoW would still have each character rendered to different levels based on the draw distance. Only the characters in your immediate area would be fully animated and rendered.

You've also not accounted for my statement about three reasonably different computers all reaching a similar bottle necks in terms of the games performance. We all hit a max FPS in the area of 90-100FPS. It is possible to get higher numbers but only with changes made to the games registry. In addition our minimum FPS's are very close to each other in the area of 20-25FPS. I'm sure if you conducted a similar test your results would come out like mine. The only way that would be explained would be a lack of optimization for newer hardware.

If you post again try to be nice.

Im running WoW on a C2Q q6600 and a 5750. It runs buttery smooth for me on the highest settings regardless of the number of players. The secret ingredient? Its running off my 64 GB SSD along with my OS.

WoW uses alot of streaming, especially for other player's gear. As long as people are coming in and out of view, your hard drive will take a hit and subsequently so will your FPS. Younger MMOs suffer this issue less because of less content, data, and bloat.

XaosII

Xaosll, do you have any links to your 64 GB SSD?

OoSuperMarioO

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820139132

I recently purchased a convertible tablet PC (HP Touchsmart tm2t). I wanted to squeeze out as much performance as possible from it. I wanted to buy an SSD for it. I was debating on whether i should spend on one of the cheapest SSDs available or splurge on a more expensive, high performance models like Corsair 300D or the Vertex 2. My target was 60 - 90 GB as i shouldn't have anything on the laptop beyond school stuff and small handful of casual games.

I ultimately decided to buy the cheapest i could get within my target size just to test the waters. After lots of investigations i found that even the worst SSDs far outperformed even the best HDDs even in RAID. The best SSDs did even better, but it was hard to justify the cost, for me.

I bought that SSD and it arrived before my laptop so i spent a bit of time messing with it on my desktop. I liked it enough that i bought another one of it for my desktop's OS drive and a few games. I figured, two years down the line, i'll probably upgrade my laptop's hard drive and then i can take the SSD and RAID it with desktop one to double performance.... Probably get another one even after that later on get a triple raid setup.

The shadows definitely need optimzing. I have a 5770 (2 but WoW doesn't utilize CF) plus a AMD 955BE x4 @3.6ghz and I run this game 60fps solid on ultra everywhere except Dalaran (the most crowded WOTLK city). On some boss fights with spell effects with shadows on ultra I dip down into the 20s-30s too.

If they made the game optimized for more than 1 core I think it would solve this issue, but I don't a depth of knowledge on what optimizing a game engine involves. I used to play it on a 64mb video card, 256mb RAM, and a Single core 2.0ghz when it first came out. Times have changed :lol:

[QUOTE="mattuk69"]

I dont know about others but i get some pretty bad lagg in WOW. Ive got a high end rig but in WOW places like dalaran i go under 20fps and play around 40fps in most areas. This is at 1920x1080 at ultra settings but WOW is not exactly a crysis looking game. I understand its 5 years old but if they are still releasing expansion packs and adding new water effects etc. They should atleast take the time to optimize the game abit more for newer hardware. Im sure i was playing Aion around 200fps and that looks much better.

Buttons1990

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

[QUOTE="soliderPp"]

[QUOTE="Buttons1990"]

Yes the game is terribly optomized... The thousands of players standing around that you have to render has nothing to do with it at all.

[/sarcasm]

Buttons1990

Let's be honest, you're never going to have more than 300 characters on your screen at one time. Even last generation cards, ATI 4XXX and Nvidia GTX 2XX, should be a massive over kill for displaying those kinds of numbers on the now very dated WoW graphics engine. I can run Napoleon Total War on HIGH/HIGHEST settings at HD resolution with 15,000 units on screen and still keep my average FPS over 25, but in WoW my computer could be brought down to 20 FPS just by standing in a capital city during peak traffic times.

Also, there's very little difference between my average FPS and my friends average FPS even though our hardware is quite different(GTX9800+, 4870CF-X, 5770)(Q6600@2.66GHz, Q9440@3.5GHz, PhenomII X3 720 @ 3.0GHz). We can all run the game at 60+ FPS when we are out of town away from everyone, but during heavy traffic times we all get around 20-30 FPS.

A game like L4D2 demonstrates large FPS changes between our 3 computers because it's actually optimised well.

There's no question that WoW is in great need of some optimiztion toward quad-core processors and the new generation of GPUs.

Rendering 300 highly detailed (not by a game like Crysis' point of view, but highly detailed nontheless)... Every item you have equipped is rendered, as is its individual texture... Some of them quite high in resolution, such as shoulders, helms, weapons... They are 512x512 textures... They are all also, simultaneously executing any number of animations (entirely random as they are player controlled)... You compare it to Napoleon TW... That is nowhere near the same... As in Napoleon, it is clone armies (yes, still cloned like before, just with more variation and animations) and the textures for those units are only 256x256... Plus, you only render a few of those 15k at a time as any immediately outside of your fov are turned into 2d sprites... I know you aren't having 25+fps with all 15k in one spot on screen at once... That is a complete lie... I have a Q9550 @ 3.65GHz, 8GB of PC1000, and 2 GTX 470's in SLI and I can't even get 25fps with that many units on screen at once... So unless you have an extreme edition i7 @ 4GHz and tri-sli 480's... You are talking out your butt right now...

Any game would slow down with that much being rendered... Look at crysis... Go into the editor... Spawn a guy... Everything is good right... 45fps, everything looks great...? Now spawn 2 more... Woah just lost 10fps from just 3 guys... What about 10 guys? Now you are in the 20's and things are getting a bit choppy... That is how every game is...

WOW pic

Morrowind pic

morrowind came out in like what? 2002? personally i think it looks WAY better than wow.

never.... EVER have i seen thousands of players standing around.... even in the main cities. at most, maybe 50.Roland123_basic

Unofficial servers ftw.

50 at most? If you're playing at peak hours, you're lucky to find a spot with less than 50 in Dalaran.

If you look at banks, in the yard in front of the banks, in the inns or in the faction you can easily get to 100+. I'd log in and take a screenshot if my account wasn't expired.

Seems fine to me, i got a poor rig and in dalaran i get 60fps after maybe 10secs of 10-20fps of loading and rendering.... Maybe its your direct x files or something cos it runs fine for me. Oh and it's not optimisation thats needed, the lag is mostly server pull... Just getting the details of all those people in dala, and their positions and their buffs and all sorts.... plus it has to be updated every time it changes meaning more server pull.

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]never.... EVER have i seen thousands of players standing around.... even in the main cities. at most, maybe 50.Mograine

Unofficial servers ftw.

50 at most? If you're playing at peak hours, you're lucky to find a spot with less than 50 in Dalaran.

If you look at banks, in the yard in front of the banks, in the inns or in the faction you can easily get to 100+. I'd log in and take a screenshot if my account wasn't expired.

Seems fine to me, i got a poor rig and in dalaran i get 60fps after maybe 10secs of 10-20fps of loading and rendering.... Maybe its your direct x files or something cos it runs fine for me. Oh and it's not optimisation thats needed, the lag is mostly server pull... Just getting the details of all those people in dala, and their positions and their buffs and all sorts.... plus it has to be updated every time it changes meaning more server pull.

JohnF111

Yes I do. I'm getting 3 FPS in dalaran sometimes with an HD4870. Not good at all.shakmaster13

They've already optimized it more in the latest patch. The game not only looks better but runs better too. And I'm not just talking about the new water shader.

I also hate how everyone in WoW looks the same:

it is very easy to confuse 20 people for 50 people.... and 50 people for 100 people.... count them next time... i garauntee you have never seen more than 50 people on screen at the same time.Roland123_basic

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]it is very easy to confuse 20 people for 50 people.... and 50 people for 100 people.... count them next time... i garauntee you have never seen more than 50 people on screen at the same time.Mograine

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]it is very easy to confuse 20 people for 50 people.... and 50 people for 100 people.... count them next time... i garauntee you have never seen more than 50 people on screen at the same time.Mograine

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

[QUOTE="Mograine"]

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]it is very easy to confuse 20 people for 50 people.... and 50 people for 100 people.... count them next time... i garauntee you have never seen more than 50 people on screen at the same time.Im_single

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

[QUOTE="Mograine"]

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

Roland123_basic

and Unreal fanboys every WOW thread ever made.... so what is the difference?Roland123_basic

He actually makes valid points, you're only here to bother people with petty speculation.

There's your difference.

Also, I'll add to my previous point that 39 people in the raid you're in, in front of the dungeon, with people from other raids too, quickly adds up and goes well over 50.

"My point still stands" GJ on making a joke of your point lol.

They've already optimized it more in the latest patch. The game not only looks better but runs better too. And I'm not just talking about the new water shader.

-Unreal-

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"][QUOTE="Mograine"]

It's not really like we have to count up to 50.

Have you ever been in a vanilla raid? That's 40 persons right there. On the screen, at the same time, with dungeon mobs too.

Offtopic - Unreal, is the song in your sig the new Orgrimmar theme?(it's "temporarily" down on MU atm so I can't check) Why don't you put the Youtube link instead?

Mograine

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"] and Unreal fanboys every WOW thread ever made.... so what is the difference?Mograine

He actually makes valid points, you're only here to bother people with petty speculation.

There's your difference.

Also, I'll add to my previous point that 39 people in the raid you're in, in front of the dungeon, with people from other raids too, quickly adds up and goes well over 50.

"My point still stands" GJ on making a joke of your point lol.

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"] and Unreal fanboys every WOW thread ever made.... so what is the difference?Mograine

He actually makes valid points, you're only here to bother people with petty speculation.

There's your difference.

Also, I'll add to my previous point that 39 people in the raid you're in, in front of the dungeon, with people from other raids too, quickly adds up and goes well over 50.

"My point still stands" GJ on making a joke of your point lol.

ive never seen 40 people standing outside of an instance waiting for the rest of the raid to come.... 99.9% of the time, 50% or more of the raid is zoned in, waiting at the beginning of the instance..... again, fail point is fail.Roland123_basic

As I said, just petty speculation.

"Fail point is fail" - you're the one making the claims, you're the one to back them up, speculation won't cut it.

Just looked up a screenshot I took when Ulduar came out but the instance servers were down so everyone was stuck outside. Stopped counting at 70, and that was on Andorhal, a medium pop Pvp server. I'm sure other servers can get well over 50 in one spot pretty regularly.

[QUOTE="shakmaster13"]Yes I do. I'm getting 3 FPS in dalaran sometimes with an HD4870. Not good at all.Ravenchrome

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"] ive never seen 40 people standing outside of an instance waiting for the rest of the raid to come.... 99.9% of the time, 50% or more of the raid is zoned in, waiting at the beginning of the instance..... again, fail point is fail.Mograine

As I said, just petty speculation.

"Fail point is fail" - you're the one making the claims, you're the one to back them up, speculation won't cut it.

Just looked up a screenshot I took when Ulduar came out but the instance servers were down so everyone was stuck outside. Stopped counting at 70, and that was on Andorhal, a medium pop Pvp server. I'm sure other servers can get well over 50 in one spot pretty regularly.

ferelas

[QUOTE="Mograine"]

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"] ive never seen 40 people standing outside of an instance waiting for the rest of the raid to come.... 99.9% of the time, 50% or more of the raid is zoned in, waiting at the beginning of the instance..... again, fail point is fail.Roland123_basic

As I said, just petty speculation.

"Fail point is fail" - you're the one making the claims, you're the one to back them up, speculation won't cut it.

It's not speculation. It's what used to happen regularly. Anyone who has played WoW can tell you that.

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"][QUOTE="Mograine"]

As I said, just petty speculation.

"Fail point is fail" - you're the one making the claims, you're the one to back them up, speculation won't cut it.

Mograine

It's not speculation. It's what used to happen regularly. Anyone who has played WoW can tell you that.