Does undertanding game design ruin gaming?

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BewilderedRonin

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#1 BewilderedRonin
Member since 2006 • 456 Posts

I noticed whilst plowing through Doom 3 again that my understanding of how games are made (script triggers, ambient sounds, script oriented sounds, creature oriented sounds, so on...) seriously detract from the gameplay experience. For example; there are moments where I know that the sound effects of monsters in Doom 3 are an ambient area sound, whereas the intent of the effect is to keep players on their toes because they think it is a sound coming from a nearby creature. This epidemic is also encountered in FEAR where I know the ambient music is directly related to various triggers and not to creature location specifications. Also, within a few encounters, I am able to recognize the tactics that each and every squad will essentially adhere to. Which allows me to easily bait-and-switch, or lure them to their deaths by undertsanding their AI script priority sequences.

 

I know I'm not alone in this. Many reviews I've read about Doom3, FarCry, Half Life 2, etc. often make references to game production methods and how they are implemented. Does YOUR knowledge of game design and its functionality detract from the enjoyment of some games?

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FragMonkey09

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#2 FragMonkey09
Member since 2005 • 1543 Posts
It really doesn't bother me unless its blatantly obvious. Also, game designers tend to trick the player so that he cannot guess wether its ambiance or actual npc doing stuff.
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el_carl

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#3 el_carl
Member since 2006 • 2376 Posts
I never pay attention to that stuff... I just get in the zone and play :P
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concord9

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#4 concord9
Member since 2003 • 949 Posts
Basically knowing the amount of effort needed to make them look and play the way they do makes me appreciate gaming so much more.
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BewilderedRonin

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#5 BewilderedRonin
Member since 2006 • 456 Posts

It really doesn't bother me unless its blatantly obvious. Also, game designers tend to trick the player so that he cannot guess wether its ambiance or actual npc doing stuff.FragMonkey09

I agree that many typically do this, but if you dabble in game design, scripting, etc, you can often spot the "choke points" where a trigger is, or can quickly realize how the designers use their trigger points. I have found that, over the years, it is increasingly harder for game developers to trick me.

 

Anyone else, perhaps heavy modders, that may relate?

Basically knowing the amount of effort needed to make them look and play the way they do makes me appreciate gaming so much more. concord9

I concur. Often times, knowing how much work must go into a level's detail or how well and how complexly scripted some events are make me respect some games more. It is kind of weird. It's like typography. For everyone else it's just a bunch of letters. To me they are an art style that must be carefully weighed and evaulauated on their usefulennes and visual conitation for the task at hand.

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Generic_Dude

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#6 Generic_Dude
Member since 2006 • 11707 Posts

Like a few other people, knowing how much work it is to code something like Oblivion, or work with Maya or 3DSMAX as well as some Adobe applications for textures and such, I think I really appreciate games more. I'm more apt to notice someone who does good texture design work or marvel at a designer's ability to design realistic human models. It also allows me to feel some sympathy for the games that aren't as polished as Gears of War in the graphics department. This isn't easy stuff, after all.

Insofar as recognizing scripted events and so forth? I see it as more of an advantage, really. Plus, people who haven't studied any sort of game design disciplines can notice things like this to. If you walk over the same area and the same monster pops out, or if you hear the same noise every time you go into the walk-in freezer, you learn. Y'know? 

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BewilderedRonin

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#7 BewilderedRonin
Member since 2006 • 456 Posts

Like a few other people, knowing how much work it is to code something like Oblivion, or work with Maya or 3DSMAX as well as some Adobe applications for textures and such, I think I really appreciate games more. I'm more apt to notice someone who does good texture design work or marvel at a designer's ability to design realistic human models. It also allows me to feel some sympathy for the games that aren't as polished as Gears of War in the graphics department. This isn't easy stuff, after all.

Insofar as recognizing scripted events and so forth? I see it as more of an advantage, really. Plus, people who haven't studied any sort of game design disciplines can notice things like this to. If you walk over the same area and the same monster pops out, or if you hear the same noise every time you go into the walk-in freezer, you learn. Y'know?

Generic_Dude
Agreed. BTW, lovin the River City Ransom avatar. Technos was so awesome back in the day. I used to pump so many quarters into Combatribes. :)
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Dracunos

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#8 Dracunos
Member since 2004 • 1154 Posts
Maybe the point of those sounds and such are to actually mess with gamers like me! That can't even play games like Doom 3 because when stuff pops out at me I can't control the amount of jumping, throwing my mouse across the room and my heart pounding like crazy.. I just can't play those games.. And I never quit the games after something jumping out at me and me getting all crazed and loopy and dying.. I just start again.. It's worst when something jumps out, freaks me out, I get hit a few times but kill it.. And then there's yet another corridor where I KNOW something will pop out at me.. When I know for sure somethings about to pop out, my internal tension just skyrockets so much worse than when something is actually popping out, and I can't continue the game! It's just a trait I have I suppose, but it's funny that the actual thing, or even the being unsure if something will pop out, isn't nearly as scary as the tension I feel when I know something for sure WILL pop out.. You'd think that seeing a hole in the wall or a screen where I know for sure something will be popping out at me would kinda.. make it less of a surprise when it happens, but it makes it even worse! They could probably put a large, out-of-game-ish sign that point to a hole in the wall that reads 'Monster will pop out here in (timer)', and it'd freak me out more than something popping up behind me : p.. I don't have any older brothers that terrorized me by popping out of closets in masks as a child or anything, so I dunno.
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XaosII

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#9 XaosII
Member since 2003 • 16705 Posts

I understand what you mean, and most of the examples other people gave arent really the kinds of things you are talking about.

In general, i'd say my understanding has made me appreciate games more because i can understand why the developers chose to do something the way they did. For example, a big Starcraft fan here a few days ago said he didnt like Warcraft 3 very much. One of his reasons he gave was because of the whole Upkeep factor and how the larger your army was the less gold you earned as a sort of "tax" for those large armies.

It punishes the player for having big armies, true. But on a bigger level it does so much more. And thats why i loved it.

If an enemy with a large army destroyed your army, he would be gaining resources slowly. You, with only a small army would be gaining resources at a much faster rate allowing you to rebuild up your forces faster. The upkeep tax acts as a mechanism from preventing a winning force to just snowball into an avalanche. Without it, the weakened player would be low on units, low on resources, and low on defenses and be easily killed as over the course of a single skirmish.

Maybe its just a matter of how you look at it? Instead of thinking "This is what they did; here is how i use it and counter it" to "They decided to do this because of this and that - and i like/dislike their reasoning for it."

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L8erSquare

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#10 L8erSquare
Member since 2007 • 2599 Posts
Nope, it helps me find the good games that are worth playing 8)
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mrbojangles25

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#11 mrbojangles25  Online
Member since 2005 • 60808 Posts

Hmm good question.  I would think with good games it would make them more enjoyable, but with bad games it would make them worse.

I have an understanding of food and cooking, and its really hard not to comment how poor a food item is when your roommates are sitting around you thinking they are an enjoyable meal.  I just want to scream "This halibut is overcooked! Its dry and mushy and has no flavor!  WTF is wrong with you people?" 

Conversely, at a good restaurant, my roommates dont really know what to think.  We go to this amazing steakhouse where all the meet is prime, and they refuse to server it past medium doneness.  What do the roommates do?  They complain about how the meat is too red and the lack of BBQ sauce.  Meanwhile I am sitting there almost in a trance, staring at a small piece of spencer steak, marvelling at the marbling of fat and the flavor of grass fed beef.  Then I will talk about other things, such as truffles (the fungus) and how they dont really have a taste and they smell bad, but they have the "essence" of the earth to them, and its really hard to explain.  Then I will talk about foie gras and how they force feed the duck and all they can say is "awwwww poor duck."  Sh**, give me a freaking break people!

So, I suppose if I had an understanding of game design it would be similiar.  Its all about the subtleities imo.

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_Dark_Knight_

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#12 _Dark_Knight_
Member since 2004 • 115 Posts
I get effected both ways, sometimes I can picture in my mind what the map looks like from the editor when the triggers are blatently ovious (Such as DOOM 3 and Half-Life 2). But at the same time that this takes away from the atmosphere of the game, it reminds me how much effort was put into the game and is one of those things that can inspire me to start writing scipts to my own games.
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LordReithgar

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#13 LordReithgar
Member since 2004 • 826 Posts

I'd say most games are just too easy in genral. If you pick rpgs as an example, every games in the genre that has been released aren't challenging. I usually find a great combo to build my party which will barely get scraped throughout the game.

 After playing a game for a while, anyone who has some logic senses, will figure out the pattern of the game and will use this knowledge to their advantages. Like pick Ace Combat as an example. It's a great aircraft fighting simulation game. But every enemy planes are weak are a certain distance, the only tough part is getting in that range and getting a lock on...

 

But it does not mean that I can't appreciate games even if they are too easy to my likings in general

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nutcrackr

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#14 nutcrackr
Member since 2004 • 13032 Posts
Well I have a pretty good idea about game design and I have to say it doesn't ruin my experience. Sometimes it even impresses me more when I can understand the work involve din sequences. In any case I seem to be able to forget about most things and just play the game.
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BLaZe462

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#15 BLaZe462
Member since 2002 • 1432 Posts
After playing games like Deus ex it's hard to mentally go back in time and enjoy Doom 3 gameplay.
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#16 Oolark
Member since 2007 • 70 Posts
I know quite a bit about game design, but having that knowledge hasn't ruined my gameplay as modern developers are really raising the bar of immersion and such. I must admit that HL2 had very obvious triggers for loading up the next level, it was always a narrow corridor like a hallway or alleyway.