Favorite MMO combat system?

I agree with the GW2/Wildstar combat system. After playing both I enjoy it more cause it's fun imo and has dodge mechanics etc. The other one seems just stand there and press the next spell.

I wish SWTOR has the combat of Wildstar, would be a perfect MMO for me then.

At first I liked wildstars targeting cause it was different. Now I prefer my classic wow targeting again.

I really like Tera. Combat had some weight to it and it was action based but not too fast.

FF14 ARR probably has my favorite combat system, the only thing I hate about it is the GCD is a little longer than the normal GCD in other MMO's.

Guild Wars 1 if you classify that as an mmorpg. The group dynamics were superb in that game, the buffs and debuffs and countergame was so damn well executed. Laying waste to people using meta builds is really rewarding too, using your own builds and far outplaying them. The energy/mana system was brilliant too, encouraging constant watch over it and making mana drain more important than it normally is.

If not, PlanetSide 1. People actually used military tactics in that game. Been ages since I played PlanetSide 2, but I am sure it has improved quite a bit.

As for the options in the poll.

Guild Wars 2: Spammy floaty combat with no resource management, dumbed down buffs/debuffs to the point of tedium, zero oomph, hilariously imbalanced towards Berserker (go berserker or get out), low skill ceiling even for mmorpg standards, no viable role outside of dps, dodge roll ends up being nothing more than a without fail get out of jail card making the game even more shallow. The only good thing I can say about this combat system is the combo field system. I let my friend try this game and I gave him my build. Despite having never played it, he was killing everyone with ease just because he had an OP build. This has NEVER happened in any other combat centric MMORPG showing how hilariously bad the combat system is.

TERA: Played as a lancer, hated it, it felt like an awkward hybrid between action and hotkey.

WoW: Easily the best battle system of a traditional post 2004 hotkey mmo. Skills feel satisfying to use and everything just feels right.

Honorable mention: Ascheron's Call: If you dont count Guild Wars as an MMORPG, Ascheron's Call has the best combat system of any mmorpg.

Its not the combat system that make or break an mmo for me but the wildstar combat system is without a doubt the best ive experienced. It combines all the strategy and complexity of tab targeting while requiring constant movement and and concentration to keep you involved in the second to second combat also the limited action set functions like a deck of cards you can quickly change out to adapt to the situation.

I liked ESO's combat the best, only complaint is that you can only have 5 spells and 1 ult per weapon.

Worst has to be Wildstar, just could not get used to the targeting and projection system. Pvp turns into a big mess.

WildStar's combat is...how do I put it...sexy ;)

Tera's combat is the best, too bad the game has gone so downhill.

It's nice how you actually have to aim, which doesn't exist in other mmorpgs. (As archer and sorcerer)

Guild wars 2 combat system is just tab targeting with a low amount of skills to use. Pretty boring...

Wildstar has no Z axis aiming, and there is 0 precision required due to how large the aoe of your attacks are.

FF: AAR is a fantastic combat system. It's a GW2/WOW hybrid - but better in every way IMO.

The fact that I can sit back on my couch and play it with a PS4 controller hooked up wireless via bluetooth on my computer is AMAZING.



PS. Huge plus they support PS button mapping to replace the standard xbox button prompts.

@fatee:

Actually I'm kinda hoping that one of the big publishers actually invests in a console-centric MMO. Not this shared world crap like Destiny that doesn't even do cross-platform. I mean a real MMO experience that is designed around using a controller. There are enough buttons on the DualShock/XB Controller that you can set up about 7 abilities + dodge and use the D-pad for swapping ability sets or weapons. That is more than enough for a decent MMO experience. I know there have been some that have come out for the PS3, but they weren't really designed for it, just kinda shoe-horned in. I would really like to see an MMO designed for consoles from the ground up, preferably with a GW2/Wildstar combat system.

Ultima Online always had the best imo.. from melee to magic combat.. even though its almost 17 years old now, theres alot in the original version that does things better than modern mmorpgs

Best: WoW

Worst: ESO

A Realm Reborn? a friend plays it on his PS4 and says it works perfectly with a controller.

The MMORPG with my favorite combat model was probably City of Heroes. I'm not a fan of these new real-time 'twitch' games.

I prefer tradtional hotkey tbh. Rather play something like Final Fantasy Reborn than Wildstar.

GW2 was probably my favorite of the bunch, it gets my vote.

guild wars 1. only 8 skills to bring...oh the choices :).

Wildstar.

Though I like most... even FFXIV's slow pace is good in its own way.

Can't understand the love for guild wars combat... its a mish mashy mess with no real class definitions... and some of the most uninteresting skills possible.

WoW then GuildWars.

For SCI-FI, it's WildStar :)

I think GW2 strikes a really good balance between traditional hotkey and action combat. Only 10 active abilities makes it easy to handle in terms of hotkeys, but you have dozens of abilities that you can slot and each class generally has at least a couple viable set-ups. Plus the visuals are amazing and IMO combat has a really great flow and good mechanics (I am a big fan of the Mai boss battle).

Being a sci-fi fan I really wanted to get into Wildstar. I played the beta 2 or 3 times and really enjoyed it, but I know I wont be able to handle anything other than DPS at max level. There are just far to many variables for me to keep track of. In WoW I can maintain my rotation and stay out of the bad in boss fights. In GW2 I can dodge telegraphs easy enough and lay down the pain with targeted AoEs (play power/well necro). And in other games I can pull off the skill shots and keep moving. But keeping up the rotation + dodging + heavy movement + telegraphs + skillshots for every ability is just too much IMO. I click about 50% of my hotkeys (5-0) and there is no room for clicking and mouse turning at the same time.

As long as it feels good...

Ehh, Guild Wars had great combat. Unless you are talking about that embarassment of a sequel that was laughed out by the esports community.

• Non existant balance, in PvE the berserker everyone dpses bringing a few support abilities meta dominates the game. It is all about dps and nothing else. In PvP there are like 4 builds people use, even in tournaments. Needless to say the buildmaking is incredibly shallow thanks to terrible balance. And no tweaking skill stats will not fix anything as their 6 bi-annual balancing patches have prooven thus far. The problem is simply put the character stat system is broken in its very core, and quite frankly has to be rebuilt from the ground up. Glass Cannons 1 or 2 shot everyone and Bunkers are impossible to kill for most. This is quite possibly the most hilariously broken balance I have seen in any mmo. Not even vanilla WoW was this bad.
• No resource management+every skill does dps=spammy spammy
• Waaaay too fast paced for its own good. Makes combat messy with too many special effects flying around at once, lower the particle effects if oyu please, but again you are completely ignoring the root of the problem if you do.
• Downed State, no other mmo implemented this in their mmos for a reason after GW2.
• Combat revolves around outdpsing your enemy before they outdps you, this is mainly due to incredibly uninspired skill design. This issue stems from the overly homogenized classes and buffs/debuffs system. For comparisons sake, in WoW you have skills that can turn your foes attacks against them, in Pokemon you can use the enemy's set up to counter against them, in Guild Wars 1 there were so many ways to combine and exploit various skills and class combos which in turn lead to interesting team play. Problem with Guild Wars 2 is that it was balanced around 1v1 (who in the blazes plays mmos for 1v1?) and the balancing team was so incredibly shy they went with a no fun allowed mentality.
• Dodge rolls: Words alone can not express my hatred for dodge rolls, PvE devolves into dodge the big attack, facetank the rest, PvP gets filled with get out of jail card and the main method of defense becomes the same for every damn class. Not to mention it makes defensive options really limited, instead of asking yourself "Should I defend myself against this attack and how should I defend myself against it?" you find yourself asking "Should I defend myself against this attack?", also 1 second invulnerabilities?!? seriously.
• No roles. Oh wait there is 1 role, dps with some slight support along. In PvP there are 2. Instead of contributing to interesting group mechanics they contribute to exploiting the flaws of a poorly implemented game mode.
• Lack of feedback. Landing crits in something like WoW or FFXIV feels satisfying, enemies from what I have seen and since you attack so fast, the damage each attack does has to adjust for this, so now you attack 2 times per second with each blow doing negligable damage and each skill being weak as well resulting in no skills you do ever feeling impactful.
• Too much AI in your own skills for most classes. In Guild Wars 1 there was the ritualist, ranger and necro (3/10 classes). In GW2 there is the thief, necro, guardian, ranger, mesmer, elementalist and engineer (7/8) which use AI.

Edit: I feel like I could go on bringing in more flaws of the battle system. Such as the lack of cast bars, static and stale targetted enemy attacks (especially compared to WildStar) and lack of options for a lot of classes but I think I made my point clear already.

and yet its winning this poll.... people love mindless button mashing combat it seems.

You guys concentrate too much on the combat of GW2, that's not where it's strengths lay. Gameplay just isn't about killing stuff, just sayin...

I only really see Guild Wars 2 given a decent ammount of praise on Gamespot.

Elsewhere, it really isnt pretty. People get called out as trolls for stating positive things about GW2.

This thread is about the combat system and as it happens 95% of the gameplay in GW2 is killing stuff. But what else is there about the gameplay?

• Combat suffers for the reasons stated
• SPvP has only one game mode, one that does not really work all that well for the scale the game is using.
• WvW is a zergfest and is shouldnt even be mentioned near as good as the game it was inspired by
• Levelling gets repetitive extremely fast, with players facing the same enemy types for dozens of levels spanning multiple zones.
• Crafting had some good ideas, but were ruined by sloppy execution and developers taking shortcuts. It feels like they were trying to ape what Rune Factory 3 was doing, only to completely miss the point on what made Rune Factory 3's crafting work.
• RNG RNG RNG, Do I need to bring up the horror stories of the mystic forge?
• Game punishes you for grinding
• Platforming sections? If I wanted to platform I would play a proper platformer with mechanics designed with platforming in mind first and foremost.
• Heart events get old really fast and quickly turn into chores

Sort of agree about Guild Wars 2's combat system. At least the lack of the class. On the other hand, the card deck aspect, in which you collect skills and are only able to use a specific set, was a million times more interesting than a simple pre-set of skills dribbled. (it was better in GW1 imo). The idea of changing weapons as well as underwater specific combat was pretty fucking cool.

In FF: Reborn rather than mindlessly spamming crafting, they are actual classes. With quests and even quest-lines, skills and leveling up. Likewise you can duel class once you hit a level specifically choosing what classes you want to meld together.

If I got an MMO with the best elements of these games it would be heaven.

I prefer the classic style. I thought FFXIV had a good system as well.

You can't beat gw2's combat system the problem is that it isn't deep enough. The combat itself is the best around but too simplistic.

I really love the combat setup for Guild Wars 1. It was so simple yet allowed so many builds and combos. I loved how there was real thought before an instance about skills and teamwork.

In contrast, I detest the combat in GW2. Downed state is awful, would rather a 60% death penalty any day. I spent like 20 hours with multiple classes actually trying to find a setup that was even remotely satisfying. Even after I got the combat to passable levels I could not stomach playing the game for much longer and never finished it.

It's true that this thread is about combat. I was just pointing out that GW2 has a lot going for it, it's not all about combat.

I cant see anything GW2 has going for it outside of graphics. Music is copy pasted from GW1 which was lazy as hell, there is no mod support, developers ban people for redicilous reasons, the game is nothing but a "boring grind" (har har har), the writing is fanfic levels of bad, the voice overs are atrocious (at least you can toggle them off), optimization is non existent.

Edit: GW2 having nothing going for it outside of graphics... Guild Wars 2 truly is the Oblivion of mmorpgs, I mean there is even an absurd ammount of level scaling.

lol.... no point responding cause I know you hate GW2 on all levels. I don't even know why I responded on the first go, hahahahaha.

well.... I can agree with him mostly... IT was a fun 1 time playthrough, but all of its end-game aspects are awful even now. Its no suprise that it gets so much praise because of the level of content it had without charging a fee.... which is correct.

As a casual playthrough experience it was good. but as a MMO I'd choose to live in (not liretally.)... would probably be one of my very last choices... it just accelerates at nothing in the long term.

Combat is the thing you do most often in an MMO, so you at least need to have reason to like it. don't get me wrong, the smoothness of its combat is great.... but its lack of trinity .... and no priority moves / rotations (just spam the first 3 usually then buffs ect) makes it so shallow as Maroxad stated ..... its a DPS race mish mash with an awful roll mechanic.

Wildstar for example. took GW2 style combat and made it work... gave it trinity, gave it better skillset cohesion and made the roll mechanic not a cheap "get out of jail free with invulnerability from practically everything" card.

What struck me so much about Wildstar was the combat! I've seen real-time combat systems in a few MMOs before, but none as smooth as their's. It doesn't have that usual clunk of hitting and waiting to get hit, repeatedly mashing the same buttons over and over again. It's fun, frantic, and fast, but not too overwhelming.

The visual lends itself pretty well to that notion too; the billowing cartoony clouds top it off to make you feel you're in a not-so-serious world with an oh-so-epic adventure before you. It feels like the devs took what good parts players like and built a fortress of features upon those concepts. The crafting is nice, could use a lil work tho, it might stale up quick, but this is still an early age to tell. The player housing, wow, it's one of the few online games able to even make this element work. Love the dungeons too, and the sci-fi-ish setting makes you feel like it's not your daddy's MMO. All in all a vast experience!

Err, so WildStar is hardcore as an MMO?

@carbinemess Compared to other AAA online chatrooms that play too much like Diablo? Yes. Compared to titles like EverQuest 1, UO, EVE? No.

You dont have to take my word for it though :D

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/pvp/pvp/Is-PvP-Too-Complex-to-be-an-esport

People in that thread go on to discuss why Guild Wars 2 failed to be an Esport (which the devs hyped it up to be), with most of the discussion being about how broken and poorly implemented the combat is.

@carbinemess:

Slightly off topic, but I would argue yes for a number of reasons. Carbine has said they want to bring back vanilla-WoW difficulty of raids (like Naxx 40 difficulty). From what I am seeing the dungeons are even more difficult than Upper/Lower BRS in vanilla-WoW and Fractals in GW2, leading to much lamentation of the less skilled. And the combat requires 100% of your attention at all times in everything except solo content. Combined with the heavy emphasis on movement and multitasking in combat and the overly complex crafting system. Yeah, I would say Wildstar is pretty hardcore.

but isn't combat in ALL MMOs too complex to be an esport? surely there's a difference between "failed to be an esport" and "oblivion of mmorpgs". apart from the few MMORPGs mentioned, mmo combat systems suck beyond belief. you start fireball level 1 at level 1, then after a hundred levels you're using fireball level 10. you can't even cast spells while moving in some of them. WoW, the most popular of them all, is just every class with a "rotation". basically all the abilities have to be used in a specific order for them to be effective, anything else involving even the tiniest of decision making is a serious no-no. gw2's combat has a lot of shortcomings but it gets a lot of things right.

something i wrote a while back: "It doesn't have that tactical feel of the original, which is sure to turn away fans of the original. In guild wars, deck building and trying new builds was a game in itself. Interrupts don't quite function as they do in guild wars, which was a huge disappointment for players like me who excelled at and enjoyed the possibilities of winning or losing a game by interrupting a single half-second-cast ability a hundredth of a second before it activated. Organized PvP doesn't have its edge; the possibility of being genuinely surprised at other players ingenuity is lost in favor of a simpler system."

but guild wars 2 is the oblivion of mmorpgs? i think not.

which brings us back to what Felipe said. you hate gw2 with a passion unheard of even on these forums so you won't agree with anything said about gw2 by me, every reviewer that ever reviewed gw2, or anyone else that played gw2.

Check the thread.

The OP states it is too complex, with everyone else stating the contrary. That it is too simplistic, dumbed down and shallow.

Much like Oblivion, Guild Wars 2 was a game that got a lot of hype from the media and was by many promised to be the be all end all mmorpg. When it launched it got overwhelmingly positive reception from the media, and people who werent really too much into mmorpgs. But among older mmo fans, the game is universally hated, for reasons such as it being too dumbed down not only compared to its predecessors but compared to the genre as a whole as well as the mistreatment of the lore. Much like Oblivion, there were a lot of lies from the developers as well (though some did make it into the game much later). This is why I call it "The Oblivion of MMORPGs".

As for my opinions... I am hardly alone in stating any of these. Every single complaint I brought up about the game in this thread have been frequently brought up elsewhere too, including ArenaNet's own forums.

This for sure.

Guild Wars 1 was my favourite by far. The team-based combat was excellent, and very few MMOs match that game's skill system.

Meanwhile, I'll give an honourable mention to Pirates of the Burning Sea's ship combat (the dueling...not so much).

Shooting: Planetside 2 ;)

I still don't understand why people mention wildstar. It doesn't (from what I've read) even have iframes. iframes in pvp are really what set you apart since you have to react really quickly.

Probably because of the pseudo action MMORPGs, it is the best.

I didn't vote because the only one I've really played is WoW. I used to think the gameplay was great back when I used to play it (the first few years after it came out) but I recently tried a bit of The Old Republic (for the story) which has similar gameplay and it was sooooooooo boring. So I think the only reason I liked Wow was for the exploration. So I guess I'd vote not WoW. Man was that world awesome though.

Still the best combat sys is the one in Age of Conan, active movements with a nice real combos, not just targeting and bashing like most of the games.