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crisrizo18

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#1 crisrizo18
Member since 2003 • 132 Posts

I recently got a hdtv that supports HDMI ( http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Samsung-32-LCD-HDTV-LN-T3253H/sem/rpsm/oid/173637/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do ) and i've been wondering, can someone tell me what is the big deal about the HDMI? Is there any difference between Component Av cables and HDMI cables? I'm getting a PS3 soon so i need to know which one works better on a 720p hdtv since i can only buy one of them..

HDTV era is so freaking confusing...

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66comet

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#2 66comet
Member since 2002 • 133 Posts
hdmi and dvi are digital connections whereas component, s-video, and composite are all analog connections. hdmi and dvi are exactly the same except hdmi can carray and audio signal aswell. the digital connections provide a picture that is not compressed at all. to get 1080 on an analog signal it must be compress somewhat. composite doesn't transmit the whole color spectrum. it only transmits two colors and the brightness and the third color is derived from that.
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crisrizo18

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#3 crisrizo18
Member since 2003 • 132 Posts
Will theHDMIcablesmakes that big of a picture difference over component if my TV only supports up to720p though?
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billyforde

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#4 billyforde
Member since 2005 • 596 Posts
Honestly, the difference between component and HDMI won't really be distinguishable to most people.
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cspiffo

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#5 cspiffo
Member since 2005 • 2841 Posts

hdmi and dvi are digital connections whereas component, s-video, and composite are all analog connections. hdmi and dvi are exactly the same except hdmi can carray and audio signal aswell. the digital connections provide a picture that is not compressed at all. to get 1080 on an analog signal it must be compress somewhat. composite doesn't transmit the whole color spectrum. it only transmits two colors and the brightness and the third color is derived from that. 66comet

Huh!?!?!?

Analog signals aren't compressed at all! They can't be. HDMI has nothing to do with compression. The advantage of HDMI and DVI is that They match the language spoken by digital displays like LCDs, Plasmas and DLPs. Since the displays understand the language being transmited to them all they have to do is display it. Analog signals Work on a totally different principle and rely on frequency modulation to properly display content. They do not talk in Digital 1s and 0s. They work best with analog Television, such as CRTs because CRTs require frequency modulation to steer the electron gun that draws the picture. Analog signals on a digital display must run through a DAC (Digital/Analog Converter) which turns these frequencies into 1s and 0s that the display understands. This can introduce artifacts into the picture and can also soften image lines due to the inherent inaccuracy of analog signals and inaccurate DAC translation. The better the signal and theDAC is the the Better analog signals will look on a Digital display.

analog signal differences

composite - a single cable that transmits color, luminance, chroma, and video timing all in 1 cable.

Component - a 3 cable video transmision that transmits , Red color information in 1 cable, Blue color information in another cable, and lumanance and video timing on another cable. The final color information is derived from the difference between both red and blue and the lumanance of the 3 cables.

VGA - seperates all analog vido information into 15 different pins. The most accurate Analog signal transmission.

Digital signals

There are many different digital configurations within The DVI standard Some also include VGAanalog signal transmission.

Essentially HDMI and DVI are the same signal in different form factors. You can a simple DVI-D to HDMI cable to switch between form factors.

Digital signals are sharper on digital displays. In real world comparison between analog and Digital signals on Digital displays there really isn't much of a difference between the two. HDMI is a bit better but Component and VGA are no slouches either. You'll never hear someone say that Component and VGA look like crap, because they don't.

I would recommened HDMI but because of the overly intrusive HDCP that is incorporated into the signal transmission it can be a real pain to deal with, especially in the computer world. I don't like what they have done to the standard and really recommend that consumers stand up for there rights and not let the content providers get away with what they are trying to do.

The only drawback to using component with the PS3 is that you lose the upconverting capabilities of DVDs. Content providers don't allow analog transmission of upconverted DVDs even though they allow 720p/1080i playback of Bluray and HDDVD over component. Ask yourself, "Does that make any sense?"

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66comet

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#6 66comet
Member since 2002 • 133 Posts
analog signals can be compressed. it has to be done to transfer enough information to the screen to make 60fps in progressive. a signal is completly independent of the information transfered accross it.
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cspiffo

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#7 cspiffo
Member since 2005 • 2841 Posts
NO they can't. The only kind "compression" that an analog signal can incorporate is interlacing. Interlaced analog signals take up half as much bandwidth as there progressive counterparts. You don't understand what analog signals are.
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66comet

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#8 66comet
Member since 2002 • 133 Posts
the compression isn't done over the cable it's done before the information is sent. the tv can tell by looking if it's compressed or not. how do you think modems used to work? interlacing is part of the information that's sent, not part of the signal that's generated.
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cspiffo

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#9 cspiffo
Member since 2005 • 2841 Posts

Modems do not work the way you think they do. modems worke by transmitting digital information over analog audio. It's like morris code. dot dot dash is basically the same as 1 1 0 in computer speak. once the other modem receives this analog audio it turns it back into digital information that the computer understands. Television signals work totally different.Analog televisionworks by modulating radio frequencies within a band. Digital television information is sent by transmitting pulses within a frequency band. The pulses are received as digital information 101010. Only Digital signals can be compressed. Compression is the use of mathmatical algorithms which remove repeated information from the source and then added artificially later by a algorithm decoder. ANALOG SIGNALS CANNOT BE COMPRESSED!

You are confusing digital signal transmission and analog signal transmission. Only once analog signals are converted by a DAC can theybe compressed using digital algorithms.Component and VGA do not send digital information.

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66comet

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#10 66comet
Member since 2002 • 133 Posts

i'm not saying analog signals are compressed. the information that is sent is what is encoded. it's not the signals doing compression; the info is compressed before it is sent and decompressed when received. the signals just carry the information. this is how codecs work. mpeg4 for tv transmission encodes the data and then sends the information over an analog or digital connection to and analog or digital tv.

i'm not debating how the televisions themselves work, all i am saying is that the data has to be compressed before it is sent over an analog connection due to insufficeint bandwidth because of a low baud rate (max signal changes per second.)

there is also more than one type of modulation on an analog connection. there is frequency, pulse width, amplitude and phase shift modulation, among others. these all have different amounts of information that can be carried for a given baud rate.

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cspiffo

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#11 cspiffo
Member since 2005 • 2841 Posts
I'm telling you right now, that you do not know what you are talking about. Component cables do not carry compressed signals. I don't have any more time to debate this with you. We can continue this after I come back from vacation in a couple of days if you want. Anyway, you're wrong. There is no such thing as a compressed analog connection.
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Large_Soda

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#12 Large_Soda
Member since 2003 • 8658 Posts
Have a good vacaction!
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#13 kidkit
Member since 2005 • 2783 Posts
Wow, this thread turned into quite something. To the TP - You can probably find an HDMI for CHEAPER than a component cable for ps3 (it does NOT come with one). Ignoring the Digital vs. Analog Debate, Advantages of HDMI: - Its cleaner (only one cable) - it carries sound - and supports the newest sound formats - as cheap as $10 on monoprice.com - its the newest standard on the market, you don't have to wonder if you have the best or if the picture is compromised...
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66comet

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#14 66comet
Member since 2002 • 133 Posts

ok. i think we're just on a different page.

the signal is a digital one (eg digital cable) and is compressed before it is sent out on to whatever analog connection. analog tvs have digital circuits and the screen is rendered using coils around the crt that don't have to be analog. you can use a digital circuit to contol those coils. tubes can also have digtal connections, think hd tube tv. the signals that are sent over connections are independent of the material the information represents. you could send a digital signal over component if was designed that way, but it wasn't, the cables are just a bunch of wires that carry electrical current. when the digital information is converted to analog for output, it goes through the dac like you were saying, but before that the data is compressed. if it wasn't compressed the analog signal wouldn't have enough bandwidth to send all the signals in a timely fashion. so the signal is compressed before hand so connection doesn't have to send as much information. when it is decompressed after the signal is received through an adc the signal is displayed. moden analog tv's are mostly digitally controlled, it's just the interfaces that aren'.

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crisrizo18

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#15 crisrizo18
Member since 2003 • 132 Posts
Will this HDMI do? http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10240&cs_id=1024004&p_id=2526&seq=1&format=2&style=

To be honest, I'm surprised how cheap it is =/. Anyway, thanks for the help everyone!

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crisrizo18

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#16 crisrizo18
Member since 2003 • 132 Posts

ttt