i dont understand. I understand being good in first person shooters or strategy games, but RPG? i have many friends who say "im better at Diablo II than YOU are!" and so forth. And i have a VERY DIFFICULT time comprehending that. anybody wanna tell me how you can be good in RPG games other then playing it for longer than somebody else and beating um by level differences?
There's a good bit of strategy when it comes to building a character properly and using that character's abilities and attributes correctly, in the proper ways and at the proper times.If you don't know what you're doin, you're not gonna get very far in an RPG.
Most RPGs are action RPGs these days, so you can in fact be good at them. And the classic RPG kind often has strategy to the gameplay. And as was said before, there is also strategy in the way you build your character.
In a good number of RPGs, how you build your character can matter just as much as your level. In Diablo 2, for example, there are some character builds that players found out work better if compared to any other character that has invested points in some other random skills. Here is, for example, an in-depth FAQ for a Necromancer character in Diablo 2 that should show you what I'm talking about.
Sometimes the way you play comes to complement the way you've built your character. For example, if you are a thief in a D&D game, you'll try to sneak to your opponent to make a surprise attack and get a 2x/3x/nx damage bonus by using Sneak Attack. The idea is to know the pros and cons of your skills and make the most of all of them in order to defeat your foes.
i dont understand. I understand being good in first person shooters or strategy games, but RPG? i have many friends who say "im better at Diablo II than YOU are!" and so forth. And i have a VERY DIFFICULT time comprehending that. anybody wanna tell me how you can be good in RPG games other then playing it for longer than somebody else and beating um by level differences?horadriclucifer
hmm i think the less times you've died in RPG game tell that you're better than other gamer
Take Neverwinter Nights (1 or 2). When you are in the Multiplayer Persistant Worlds environment, you are playing with other players. The ones who know how to make their character better, know which equipment to use and know how to defeat their enemies do the best.
This is especially true of spellcasters as there is lots of strategy in how to defeat your enemy (which spells to use, when to use them and in what order to use them).
It's a matter of time dude, that's why I quit MMORPG altogether. In MMORPG, the more time and money you spend, the better your character is. So unless you want to get pwned, you will have to dedicate a lot of time into the game, which in the long run gives you nothing. Don't follow my path, brother! Anyway, as someone has already mentioned, you have to make sure your character is as good as he can get in the class you have chosen. Example, in Oblivion, if you are a Mage and you choose the the wrong Birthsign which gives you +50 attack or something then you have su*ked.
[QUOTE="BurnThisCity"]It's a matter of time dude, that's why I quit MMORPG altogether. In MMORPG, the more time and money you spend, the better your character is. So unless you want to get pwned, you will have to dedicate a lot of time into the game, which in the long run gives you nothing. Don't follow my path, brother! Anyway, as someone has already mentioned, you have to make sure your character is as good as he can get in the class you have chosen. Example, in Oblivion, if you are a Mage and you choose the the wrong Birthsign which gives you +50 attack or something then you have su*ked.
That is very true of MMORPGs but not really for RPGs. You don't really invest time in RPGs. You play them. In MMOs though you are really competing for gear so you are really investing.
The closest you come to "investing" is in NWN PWs where you do compete with others. But it is not a constant investment for gear. You can make a decent character without the best gear (it is more how you play them and construct them).
In Diablo 2 in particular, there was plenty of room for character strategy/tactics in PvP. When I still played in 1.09, it was pretty easy to dismantle other players using a necromancer (before the 1.10 buffs!) or a no-pierce amazon, both of whom didn't use any dupes or hacks.
I recenlty started playing RPG's and KOTOR is my first one so I can only tell you from that perspective. There is a lot of strategy in the game, but it's from a different kind than when I play a FPS or RTS. KOTOR makes me need to think a little creative at a level that I only found on the earlier LucasArts adventures, but now blended with some awesome battles and character build up. IMHO it doesn't let itself describe as skilled in a way where you need to aim accurate, but it does require you to make well thought out descissions throughout the whole game.
Is there someone else better or worse in the world on KOTOR than me!? I don't know if that is possible - but the cool thing is, all those people play the game way different and that is all good. Sure, there will be people who can level up way faster than I do, beat bigger monsters with lesser weapons or solve puzzles more rapidly than I do - but to me that's not really the point of the game. You can't really be a NOOB in RPG I think (talking only offline here), you just have to experience the game.
My little niece is 11 years old and she plays the sims II a lot different than me or my girlfriend. I like to build complex houses, my girlfriend likes to run a family and my niece likes to dress up the dolls. We all play the same game, but in a very different manner. Is either one of us the best!? That doesn't really apply to this way of gaming. Now I know this is not a RPG but it does it does emphisize they way I feel about my newly discovered field of gaming: RPG's.
As for online RPG's - I don't have a clue... I never played one - yet.
Look at a game like Guild Wars, which ignores many of the rules of RPGs that time invested=better character and instead just focuses on player skill. It requires enough skill that tournaments are able to be run, with the winners often being the better player (top guilds win). Guild Wars also requires a certain amount of creativity in developing builds. If you saw a Guild Wars PvP match, you would see what I'm talking about.
Ignoring RPG pvp, RPGs also require abilities in pulling, resource management, patience, timing, awareness of mob spawn times and traveling routes, character construction, awareness of line of sight, character elevation, positioning, team communication, knowing your role in the team... the list is quite long.
In Diablo 2 in particular, there was plenty of room for character strategy/tactics in PvP. When I still played in 1.09, it was pretty easy to dismantle other players using a necromancer (before the 1.10 buffs!) or a no-pierce amazon, both of whom didn't use any dupes or hacks.Makari
Before they added skill synergy and necromancers went nuts I think there was some strategy involved, but after that patch, build became very linear. As far as gameplay goes I found D2 just came down to going through the motions.
I dunno, but I've grouped with many people in WoW that were just plain BAD at playing their characters. It's just not leveling and stats that make you a good RPG or MMO player.
With classic RPG's i think the only way to be good at them is to have a real good charicter. But with now Action RPG's like oblivion i think there is a degree of skill needed in them that and if your good at that you could say your better at the game. I've even started using FPS tactics i use in CSS in oblivion when im using a bow lol :P
One way to quantify how good you are is how many times you reload the game becuase you died. I find surviving is much better than constantly reloading (offline games anyways)
i dont understand. I understand being good in first person shooters or strategy games, but RPG? i have many friends who say "im better at Diablo II than YOU are!" and so forth. And i have a VERY DIFFICULT time comprehending that. anybody wanna tell me how you can be good in RPG games other then playing it for longer than somebody else and beating um by level differences?horadriclucifer
Well my girlfriend sucks at Diablo 2, she dies so fast. So I can safely say Yes, you can be better than someone at an RPG. If you are purely talking of a PvP perspective, yes there's strategy there too. Knowing your enemies strengths and weakness plays a big part in that. So people breeze through games you probably have trouble with. That could make them better at a game than you.
knowledge is a skill - in counterstrike, for example, you need to learn the maps, learn the weapons and learn how to use that to your advantage, while being familiar with the fps genre and being a great twitch headshotter can take you a most of the way toward being a really good, unless you know the maps and the weapons and how to use them all to your advantage, you'll never be a great player
the reverse is sort of true with roleplaying games, that knowledge is 90% of the game, the "skill" element is secondary in rpgs - being a great player is about knowing every c lass every skill, every spell - every item, every monster - knowing combinations of skills, attacks and items that will produce victory over an enemy constituting various also-known factors - knowing how and when to use potions, knowing which items to equip and which items to hunt
you could probably be a better player than a veteran without ever actually playing a roleplaying game, simply by extensively reading everything you can find about the game, because the actual playing of the game, the clicking, the selection spells and potions - sure, there's a skill element there, but you can pick that up in a couple hours
with roleplaying games (it's especially noticable in mmos, in my experience), your knowledge of the game as a whole is an appropriate factor for guaging your skill
[QUOTE="Makari"]In Diablo 2 in particular, there was plenty of room for character strategy/tactics in PvP. When I still played in 1.09, it was pretty easy to dismantle other players using a necromancer (before the 1.10 buffs!) or a no-pierce amazon, both of whom didn't use any dupes or hacks.Vlads_Bane
Before they added skill synergy and necromancers went nuts I think there was some strategy involved, but after that patch, build became very linear. As far as gameplay goes I found D2 just came down to going through the motions. just speaking of pvp, as i mentioned.. from what i saw of the numbers, necromancers' power stayed about the same from 1.09 to 1.10.. just most people never bothered to learn how they worked beforehand and didn't realize that stopping for a second and eating a bone spirit chain was pretty much instant death. but yea.. dodging, guessing where your enemy's going to be to lock on IBS, parking spirits against corners and using 1pt clay golems to absorb some attacks was too much for the general bnet pubbie to learn. ditto for sorceresses.. people that actually knew how to play could pretty much rip anything to shreds without being touched, and for two of them to fight you had to guess where your opponent was going to teleport to and drop an orb there two seconds in advance. it's sort of like playing chess where you can only take an opponent's piece if you call the piece 5 moves in advance. :) most people playing sorcs would just randomly teleport around and rely on randomness or thunderstorm, which made them an easy lunch for someone that had the slightest idea what they were doing. and yea, WoW too. a lot of people just don't know how to play intelligently and don't realize it either.
I dunno, but I've grouped with many people in WoW that were just plain BAD at playing their characters. It's just not leveling and stats that make you a good RPG or MMO player.Johnny_Rock
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