Supreme Commander or Company of Heroes? Which one should i get?
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COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws. Also COH is more about capturing points in combat and using it for resources to make more units. Supcom is more about building your base up then going into war.
Even tho supcom has larger battles, COH has more action because it's on much smaller maps that fully get destroid and alot more fast paced.
Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
Terrorantula
But guys, how do you think Ill be able to run the games? I heard Supcom was hard on pcs...BTW it has 3 ghzpeterrobauYou can run it on medium/high. Just download the demo.
[QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
DarkRecruit
Flaws:
- Cameras need work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
- single player is not good
- Bland units
- Bland boring maps
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
- Sounds arnt great tbh
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
[QUOTE="DarkRecruit"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
Terrorantula
Flaws:
- Cameras need work They do work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen Get a mod
- single player is not good Explain?
- Bland units Explain? The units are awesome, maybe you should get higher techs
- Bland boring maps Explain? If you mean you want more detail, you'd probably won't be able to run it and complain about that
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile Like almost every RTS where you have to build a base?
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off Maybe you should stop turtling and attack their base to destory resources, nukes take a TON of resourses, and you can build anti-nuke devices that cost HALF the cost of a nuke
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit Modes? It's the same as any RTS, kill your oppentent's army. Features? like what? you can customise (mods)
- Sounds arnt great tbh You must be really picky....what sounds anyways?
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
[QUOTE="DarkRecruit"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
Terrorantula
Flaws:
- Cameras need work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
- single player is not good
- Bland units
- Bland boring maps
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
- Sounds arnt great tbh
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
Do you have the game??? Some of your points are kinda right (the nukes one is anyways....) but then you say UI takes too much of the screen. The latest patches fixed that and added a new UI. If you are only playing the demo you really should reserve your opinion. Anyways, I have both games and SC is the choice if you want a game that will keep you busy for months, CoH is awesome but i pretty much been there done that.- Cameras need work
What are you talking about? The game has better camera features then just about any RTS out there, just hold down the space bar and you can move the camera around! You can even SNAP it in place so you can play the dam game at that angle if you want to via Control+V
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
Again you obviously have no clue what your talking about, the games first patch put in a mini UI that has removed all complaints of this! It's a NON issue now.
- single player is not good
Idk how far you got, but while I didn't care at all for earlier mission I found the later ones to be fantastic.
- Bland units
The unit design in the game is fantastic in my opinion, but thats just what that is an opinion why did you even mention it? I think he can judge for himself with all the games screens.
I can't believe you brought this up in comparison to Company of Heroes which uses the most stale and overdone setting in the industry, WW2 the main reason I think it failed miserably in sales.
- Bland boring maps
Really the same as above, the bigger maps may not be packed with props everywhere, but they all look fantastic and realistic for the most part.
The 5 by 5 maps which are the games smallest maps that are just a bit bigger then what I'd consider a regular RTS map are pretty detailed.
Also this game is goiing to have one of the most active mod communities in RTS history so I think we will be seeing some great things from it. I mean the map making tool isn't even out! And theres arleady hundreds of custom maps because the community is so active they made there own map maker!
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
It's more boring in Supcom then other RTS games? No! Seems like you just don't like base building in general, Supreme Commander unarguably has the deepest base building system in the history of the RTS genre with simple yet very deep features like the adjacency system.
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
Wtf are you kidding me man? I've never even used a nuke except for messing around!
I think your touching on another common ignorant view towards supcom.
This game is not about 4 hour games like some people would have you believe, in fact I have been in the beta since last october and have yet to play a game over and hour long!
On top of that anti nuke silos are like 1/10 the cost of a Nuke silo so your argument makes little sense.
If you want a very long game, thats fine there are maps for that, there are also maps that make up the majority of the games maps that dictate much shorter games.
The game scales remarkably well to whatever map type you want to play, you can pick a map that will likely give you an extremely long game all the way down to maps that have a 15 minute game average!
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
You mean like the games
Five different Gameplay modes that allow you to pick what has to happen for the game to end?
 Or the prebuild option that allows you to start with the basics of a base already built?
Or the speed adjustability that allows you to go from the standard 0 down to -10 or upto +10
Or the ability to pull the UI altogether off the screen or move it to the left,right or bottom of the screen.
Or the mode that basically doubles the resources of everything?
I don't know what you want, maybe you should list some examples of things you would have liked, anyway the game is basically LUA with a 3D engine on top, they made it that way to make it the most mod friendly game ever made so I think it's safe to say you can expect a mod/mode for everything you can think of soon enough.
[QUOTE="Terrorantula"][QUOTE="DarkRecruit"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
dtrem1
Flaws:
- Cameras need work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
- single player is not good
- Bland units
- Bland boring maps
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
- Sounds arnt great tbh
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
Do you have the game??? Some of your points are kinda right (the nukes one is anyways....) but then you say UI takes too much of the screen. The latest patches fixed that and added a new UI. If you are only playing the demo you really should reserve your opinion. Anyways, I have both games and SC is the choice if you want a game that will keep you busy for months, CoH is awesome but i pretty much been there done that. yep, he's obviously only played the demo. I can't believe anyone can diss SC's musical score, as that's one of the best scores I've heard in an RTS game ever. Also you can't just build up your base and then go. Of course base building is important, but you're acting as if you can just be one of those defensivve type people that primarily get a very large base and then try to get the enemy. You will literally be decimated if you do that. Saying that further proves that Terrorantula has either never played the game or has only played the demo.Single Player, at least in comparison to that in COH, is very much a poor experience. Being limited to Tech 1 and 2 level units the majority of the way, its a far better experience simply to plug directly into the skirmish mode if you really want to duke it out. Plus, the storyline for the most part simply seems pieced together, and almost every single campaign begins the same way. Very frustrating on the single player campaign.
In you opinion it is, I thought it was great and many others did as well, yes you limited to tow techs for much of the campaign, but even with just 2 tech you have more the double the units of CoH combined!
As for the units, perhaps Bland isn't the best adjective. Straightforward and singleminded are perhaps better words to describe the units in Supreme Commander. For example, what can you do with tanks in Supreme Commander? Send them into a fight, and watch them shoot back and forth until their HP's fall to nothing and they explode. What can you do with Tanks in COH? Blow infantry out of buildings, flank another tank by bursting through a wall, protect your side and rear armor from pesky infantry, etc etc. Units in COH are far more dual purposed, with many many different ways to use them, and include them in your tactics. Bland Boring Maps is basically referring to fairly similar setups on the majority of maps. You have land chokepoints, the occasional sea checkpoint, and a huge mass of open space. You have room to execute basic maneuvers, but for the most part, it's battle on open ground and in the opponent's base. In COH, your fighting in cityscapes, countrysides, hedgerows, etc. The landscapes are far more varied and intricate in detail. Each map is an entirely new experience, that can yield entirely new results.
Thats because they are two different type of games! Do you really think Relic could have made the maps anything like that if they wanted to focus on strategy and really large scale war? Of course not, CoH has about as much strategy as tic tac toe, the game is all about tactics...
Base Building, for the most part in Supreme Commander, is a very standard affair. With enough open space, the exact same identical base can be build regardless of actual terrain circumstances. The defense of a base in Supreme Commander can be as simple as focused turret fire, and a series of shields. In COH, you have to focus upon specific chokepoints and barriers, all of which can be easily destroyed under the correct circumstances. No wall in COH can withstand the brute force of a tank, so you have to construct mines, tank traps, etc. to counter all of the various attacks.
Fairly standard? Thats the biggest load of crap I have ever heard, STANDARD? Next to WHAT exactly????? Bash Supreme Commander all you like, but to even try to compare the pitiful base building of CoH to Supreme Commander is the saddest thing I have ever seen on these forums.
CoH has what like 5 structures? Lmfao how many defensive measures? A few?! Supreme Commanders base building no matter what way you gut it is a billion times deeper!
You have for structures
3 different levels on ground radar
3 levels of Sonar
2 types of standard defense
Tactical Missile launcher
Anti Missile Defense system
Walls
3 levels of Anti Air
3 Types of shields
Stealth Generators
Nukes/Anti Nukes
2 Types of long range Artillery
2 Types of Torpedo launchers
On with the rest of the structures now you have
3 levels for each Air, Sea and land factory not even including the 12 experimental units your Tech 3 engineers can build
3 levels for the mass extractors
2 types of mass fabricators that turn energy into mass
3 types of Power Generators
Energy Storage
Mass Storage
Quantum Gatway
Air refuel/repair platform
On TOP of that you have the ability to connect these building complex adjacent combinations that can give you dramatic bonous resources, I don't even think anyone even knows all the combinations yet or everything this is capable of, I've seen some insane combinations that result in huge boosts, the downside to this is the fact that your buildings are all so close and some of the buildings like the fabricators have violent explosions when they explode.
Or how about the actual structures that fuel and pump out units of the base itself in which CoH dumbed it down as much as they could, I know there are many people that don't like the base building part of an RTS, but it really is repulsive and extremely low to try to argue to this guy there is more to the shallow base building/defense of CoH then there is to it in Suprme Commander.
As for the Nuke argument, in a game like Supreme Commander, most games do usually dissolve to that kind of a standoff. When both players reach a certain tech level on a large map, they become virtually invunerable to all conventional and even unconventional weapons attacks. In COH, you never see a game reduce to simple rocketry back and forth. Instead, conventional tactics, appropriate unit distribution, and timed advances can overcome any defense. Suddenly, no player is safe from a tank spearhead followed by a series of infantry backed up by snipers and MG's. Much more fast paced.
Thats a bunch of BS, sure it can happen, but the fact is that sort of thing only really ever happens when the players are turtles/noobs I challenge you to find me a single replay featuring two players who the Supcom community would consider GOOD players who had this kind of stand off. It just doesn't happen when good players are playing!
With your RTS argument, you have a fairly valid point, but that's no reason to simply choose Supreme Commander over COH. In a game that focuses upon the large scale conflicts, with fairly generic unit abilities, the simple grind of building a force and attacking your enemy can often become a large obstacle in enjoying the game in the long term.
Bottom line, COH simply has many more variables :lol:Â on a strategic level. Every unit is far more versatile, and can be countered in a variety of ways. As a result, the person that wins isn't necessarily the one that masters the mathematical inputs and outputs of resources and units, and creates the most units in the least amount of time. The person that wins is instead the person that better understands the flexibility of his units, and understands the necessity of deploying them to the correct place at the correct time. And in my humble opinion, that is the goal that every strategy game should strive to achieve.
CoH is Tactics not strategy get it right!
Your right with a few exceptions, most the units in CoH have more uses then the units in Supreme Commander, but I would imagine they would have to when you only have like 10 units in the game :lol:Â Â
Supreme Commadner takes a completely different approach, rather then give you a few units that can each do a few things they give you tons of different unit types each having there own unique purpose, there is no such thing as a useless unit in Supreme Commander, every unit has it's own role, it's own stengths and weaknesses/counters.
The sheer amount of units and different types of combat in Supreme Commander simply dictate that Strategically it makes CoH look like a joke. Hell the games navy alone has as many units as a faction in CoH and that, plus the air add even more the the strategic depth of Supcom
It simply brakes down to tactics and strategy, CoH is more about tactical depth, Supreme Commander is more about strategic depth.
The CoH units seemed a lot more real (not realistic). What I mean is they felt like complete moving machines with weight and mass whereass the SC units felt like flat things constructed of sticks. The normal artillary fire seemed like pop guns and also had no oompf. This is all really hard to describe for me and others may have a different impression from the 2 games.
Strategically, I know CoH has some really interesting strategies and counters and is really fun when building defenses and knocking them down. To be honest I am not sure how strategic SC is because I got tired of the game and bought Medieval TW 2 and have been playing that instead.
I loved CoH and had fun with it for a few months. SC I just could not get into which made me kind of sad because I was really looking forward to the game and really wanted to like it. I really thought SC was going to be something speacial but at best it is just a good RTS.
... Lastly, im more into the fighting tactics in RTS than economy building.peterrobauAm I one of the only people in this thread who saw that? Company of Heroes is the obvious choice, usually with SupCom you're building your base up for a relatively long time in the beginning, and then spending increasingly longer amounts of time building your base until Tech 3... Meanwhile with CoH, you start out by recruiting a few units, and then keeping constant pressure on the enemy. If you don't, they'll take over the resource points quickly, giving them superiority quickly. Less than halfway into the game, you don't need to construct any more structures (aside from defensive ones, to secure a position...), and it becomes a game of tactics, not basebuilding...
[QUOTE="dtrem1"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"][QUOTE="DarkRecruit"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
onemic
Flaws:
- Cameras need work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
- single player is not good
- Bland units
- Bland boring maps
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
- Sounds arnt great tbh
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
Do you have the game??? Some of your points are kinda right (the nukes one is anyways....) but then you say UI takes too much of the screen. The latest patches fixed that and added a new UI. If you are only playing the demo you really should reserve your opinion. Anyways, I have both games and SC is the choice if you want a game that will keep you busy for months, CoH is awesome but i pretty much been there done that. yep, he's obviously only played the demo. I can't believe anyone can diss SC's musical score, as that's one of the best scores I've heard in an RTS game ever. Also you can't just build up your base and then go. Of course base building is important, but you're acting as if you can just be one of those defensivve type people that primarily get a very large base and then try to get the enemy. You will literally be decimated if you do that. Saying that further proves that Terrorantula has either never played the game or has only played the demo.Well i've obviously played the FULL game, and it's just how i felt after playing. Just because i don't agree with what other people say and put my personal views of the game doesn't make u right or me right, just how we both see the game. Supcom tries to relive TA but imo it just doesn't work.
[QUOTE="onemic"][QUOTE="dtrem1"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"][QUOTE="DarkRecruit"][QUOTE="Terrorantula"]Like....? Only flaw I see is the pathfinding, and that's only sometimes. And if you're saying you can't run it on max, run it on medium maybe? What if medium was max?COH imo is a MUCH better game, supcom just has tooo many flaws.
Terrorantula
Flaws:
- Cameras need work
- Ui take sup too much of the screen
- single player is not good
- Bland units
- Bland boring maps
- base building is just doing the same thing over and over again, gets pretty boring after awhile
- On multiplayer with mates all it becomes about is NUKES, which you can't seem to turn off
- Lacking features and modes and ability to turn stuff off and customise it abit
- Sounds arnt great tbh
I dunno the whole thing just felt uncomplete and needs work, where as COH was much more polished apart from dodgey lag in multiplayer once in awhile.
Do you have the game??? Some of your points are kinda right (the nukes one is anyways....) but then you say UI takes too much of the screen. The latest patches fixed that and added a new UI. If you are only playing the demo you really should reserve your opinion. Anyways, I have both games and SC is the choice if you want a game that will keep you busy for months, CoH is awesome but i pretty much been there done that. yep, he's obviously only played the demo. I can't believe anyone can diss SC's musical score, as that's one of the best scores I've heard in an RTS game ever. Also you can't just build up your base and then go. Of course base building is important, but you're acting as if you can just be one of those defensivve type people that primarily get a very large base and then try to get the enemy. You will literally be decimated if you do that. Saying that further proves that Terrorantula has either never played the game or has only played the demo.Well i've obviously played the FULL game, and it's just how i felt after playing. Just because i don't agree with what other people say and put my personal views of the game doesn't make u right or me right, just how we both see the game. Supcom tries to relive TA but imo it just doesn't work.
Well if you actually have the full game how did you not know about the patch that slim lined the UI just a week or so after the game came out?and you can turn off fog through the console(i think it's ren_fog or something similar to that)
but - but - supcom is very moddable, and once the modders get to work on it, it could well end up being pretty damn amazing - i skipped coh becuase i am crazy for warhammer 40k, so i play dawn of war (coh is essentially dawn of war 2, but in a ww2 setting) - but i do own supcom, and while i've already grown bored of the vanilla game and gone back to dawn of war, the mod potential is totally awesome, and there's a lot of interesting mods on the horizon
i just found out today, for example, that there's a total conversion warhammer 40k mod in development for supcom, with a focus on massed infantry - sounds very, very cool so i'm glad i own a copy of supcom
out of the box, though, coh is definitely the better game - but six months from now, supcom will probably be the better game to own for the number of mods out there - i think supcom is definitely worth owning right now, but by the end of the year, mods considered, it'll probably be the rts to own - but only for the mods themselves, the vanilla game has made an awful lot of mistakes imo
so if you can only get one of them now and forever, i'd say get supcom for the mods that are on their way - but if you are able to get both, i'd say definitely get company of heroes right now, and keep an eye on the mod lists for supcom and pick it up cheap in half a year
because both are definitely well worth owning
out of the box, company of heroes is by far the better game - the structure is better, the combat is more enjoyable, the entire game has a more coherent feel, the resource system means you have to battle hard for territory, so there's no turtling - it looks better, it runs better... there's a hundred reasons to get coh over supcomI have COH, but playing supcom has really made me more interested in that game than COH. The scale of the game itself is huge and like COH it pushes you to not just stay at your starting point forever and build a base because of the mass spread around the map. At the same time though it gives out a happy medium because you still need to be able to update your structures and in some way build a main base. Both game are very well done, but like you said supcom has a ton of potential in the future. RIght now though I'm just enjoying supcom more although there are some things that annoy me about the game.(Mainly pathing for naval units) But other than that it's been a really enjoyable experience for me.
but - but - supcom is very moddable, and once the modders get to work on it, it could well end up being pretty damn amazing - i skipped coh becuase i am crazy for warhammer 40k, so i play dawn of war (coh is essentially dawn of war 2, but in a ww2 setting) - but i do own supcom, and while i've already grown bored of the vanilla game and gone back to dawn of war, the mod potential is totally awesome, and there's a lot of interesting mods on the horizon
i just foiund out today, for example, that there's a total conversion warhammer 40k mod in development for supcom
out of the box, though, coh is definitely the better game - but six months from now, supcom will probably be the better game to own, for the number of mods out there - i think supcom will definitely be worth owning, and by the end of the year, mods considered, it'll probably be the rts to own - but only for the mods themselves, the vanilla game has made an awful lot of mistakes
so if you can only get one of them now and forever, i'd say get supcom for the mods that are on their way - but if you are able to get both, i'd say definitely get company of heroes right now, and keep an eye on the mod lists for supcom and pick it up cheap in half a year
because both are definitely well worth owning
A-S_FM
[QUOTE="A-S_FM"]out of the box, company of heroes is by far the better game - the structure is better, the combat is more enjoyable, the entire game has a more coherent feel, the resource system means you have to battle hard for territory, so there's no turtling - it looks better, it runs better... there's a hundred reasons to get coh over supcomI have COH, but playing supcom has really made me more interested in that game than COH. The scale of the game itself is huge and like COH it pushes you to not just stay at your starting point forever and build a base because of the mass spread around the map. At the same time though it gives out a happy medium because you still need to be able to update your structures and in some way build a main base. Both game are very well done, but like you said supcom has a ton of potential in the future. RIght now though I'm just enjoying supcom more although there are some things that annoy me about the game.(Mainly pathing for naval units) But other than that it's been a really enjoyable experience for me.
but - but - supcom is very moddable, and once the modders get to work on it, it could well end up being pretty damn amazing - i skipped coh becuase i am crazy for warhammer 40k, so i play dawn of war (coh is essentially dawn of war 2, but in a ww2 setting) - but i do own supcom, and while i've already grown bored of the vanilla game and gone back to dawn of war, the mod potential is totally awesome, and there's a lot of interesting mods on the horizon
i just foiund out today, for example, that there's a total conversion warhammer 40k mod in development for supcom
out of the box, though, coh is definitely the better game - but six months from now, supcom will probably be the better game to own, for the number of mods out there - i think supcom will definitely be worth owning, and by the end of the year, mods considered, it'll probably be the rts to own - but only for the mods themselves, the vanilla game has made an awful lot of mistakes
so if you can only get one of them now and forever, i'd say get supcom for the mods that are on their way - but if you are able to get both, i'd say definitely get company of heroes right now, and keep an eye on the mod lists for supcom and pick it up cheap in half a year
because both are definitely well worth owning
onemic
Pathing for any unit : If you have a group of units and tell others to go to a point past that group of units then they'll try to go straight through em and get caught up then spend ages trying to do so.
Another thing that i didn't like was the AI takes ages to respond to your command when you have tons of units out, it's like theres too many units for something thats controlling them to cope :
Now my PC isn't slow:
x1950xtx crossfire
2gb 1000mhz corsair
core 2 duo 6700
gbdq6v2
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