Team Fortress 2 Update. HEAVY!!!

i'm not a fan of leveling up in fps games. I don't want to have to grind for hours just to get a better gun. I want a level playing field where the only determining factor is skill.

This is kind of why I stopped playing TF2 in the first place.

i'm not a fan of leveling up in fps games. I don't want to have to grind for hours just to get a better gun. I want a level playing field where the only determining factor is skill.

This is kind of why I stopped playing TF2 in the first place.

fremen_warrior

How about a helmet for the heavy, so he can survive all the sniper headshots :D No seriously though, I think they should increase the Heavy's movement speed while firing the minigun. Firing the minigun really slows you down alot.TheBigBadGRIM

Why world? why?

Heavy gets one and soldier no?

Anyway he will probably have some knuckles, the rest who knows.

omg....i got it!!!

one of those cartoon retractable punching gloves

omg....i got it!!!

one of those cartoon retractable punching gloves

darkmagician06

Why world? why?

Heavy gets one and soldier no?

Anyway he will probably have some knuckles, the rest who knows.

DanielDust

Soldiers are overplayed and are very powerful as-is in most situations.

They'll probably be one of the very last classes (if not the last) to recieve unlocks. Valve seems to be filling out the unlocks of the lesser-played classes first.

[QUOTE="DanielDust"]

Why world? why?

Heavy gets one and soldier no?

Anyway he will probably have some knuckles, the rest who knows.

Velocitas8

Soldiers are overplayed and are very powerful as-is in most situations.

They'll probably be one of the very last classes (if not the last) to recieve unlocks. Valve seems to be filling out the unlocks of the lesser-played classes first.

Heavy is one of the least played clas*es but it is the most powerful clas* in TF2 IMO, put a doctor and he is invincible (if those players know how to play the game), but yeah :( soldier will be one of the last.

Heavy is one of the least played clas*es but it is the most powerful clas* in TF2 IMO, put a doctor and he is invincible (if those players know how to play the game), but yeah :( soldier will be one of the last. DanielDust

While the Heavy+Medic combo is no doubt powerful, Heavys with no medic in tow aren't nearly as deadly. Firing the Heavy's primary weapon requires that he stay near-stationary, rendering him useless in dodging projectiles and avoiding enemy fire. The next unlock update is supposed to be addressing some of this.

Currently, a Heavy at close range can rip through anything..but if an enemy can keep their distance from a Heavy and/or utilize cover, most non-support classes will end up killing him without much trouble if he has no medic (given players of roughly the same skill level.) The Heavy's chaingun is extremely inaccurate beyond short ranges.

A Heavy+Medic team isn't really "invincible." Good players will focus on taking the medic out first, given the chance..and Heavy+Medic combos are also now extremely vulnerable to sudden flanking by Pyros (with the Backburner now in their inventory.) Even if taking out the medic isn't an option, Demomen are also very effective against Heavy+Medic teams with sticky mines (a Demo can put many mines near the feet of the firing Heavy before he even has time to move from their blast radius, taking a huge chuck of health all at once, rather than slowly chipping away like the other classes have to.) Snipers are another effective class against Heavy+Medic combos..a fully charged headshot will take down a Heavy instantly, and they're rather easy to pull off since Heavys are basically standing still while firing.

Anyone that says that heavy/medic combos are invincible have obviously never seen a good sniper, a good spy, or a good pyro ambush. Nothing I love more than waiting in the battlements of 2fort waiting for that medic/heavy to come lumbering across the bridge, only to jump down and roast them both.

And as for weapon unlocks, valve has done their best to make them 'alternatives' and not 'upgrades'. Look at the flaregun - I love it, but there are certainly times I found myself wishing I had my shotty.

[QUOTE="fremen_warrior"]

i'm not a fan of leveling up in fps games. I don't want to have to grind for hours just to get a better gun. I want a level playing field where the only determining factor is skill.

This is kind of why I stopped playing TF2 in the first place.

darkmagician06

Thus, why it's such a great and unique game!

I think when not with a medic, the heavy should be a defensive cIass, and to that end I think he should get:

Melee weapon: Bear Hug

The bear hug is a melee attach where the heavy grabs hold of his target and squeezes the life out of him (30 health/second). During the hug, neither the heavy nor his target can move or attack, and the only way to break the hug is either for the target to die or for someone else to kill the heavy. In short, once the heavy has hold of you, you're pretty much dead.

But the hug also serves a second purpose. Although it will not damage ubered players while they are ubered, they can still be hugged and incapacitated. This will give the heavy a third option when facing an ubered player (the current options being run or die).

Shotgun weapon: Stun Gun

The stun gun causes no damage, but will stun a (non ubered) target for 1.5 seconds. While stunned, the target moves and attacks 50% slower.

Primary weapon: Hyper-Gat

The hyper-gat is a variant of the standard gatling gun. The weapon's total damage increases by 5% and its chance to crit increases by 10% for every second the weapon is spinning continuously up to a total of 50% extra damage and 100% inproved chance to crit. The heavy cannot move while firing, but can move while spinning, and the fact that the greatest bonuses come after extended periods of use mean the heavy will likely find himself more stationary than before.

Some or all of the above don't fit in with what Valve wants for the new heavy, but I think they would suit the cIass. I play mostly as heavy (around 92 hours as heavy so far) and although I play 100% of the time with a medic, which skews my opinion of the heavy a little, I think a solo heavy should be a defensive cIass, and I think all three of his new weapons would be effective defensive weapons, while not being overpowering.

Somebody that says that obviously never played against a good Heavy and Medic pair. Pyro and Spy? no chance against a good heavy and a good doctor, only if they manage to get closer (as in right in his face) but a good Heavy will NEVER let that happen. With Sniper I agree, because I play with the Sniper :) maybe I shouldn't have said invincible but anyway it's one of the most powerful ones.DanielDust

Don't get me wrong, I play on pub servers, so I'm probably not seeing the best medics and heavys out there. But a lot of maps (the aforementioned 2fort battlements) have places where pyros can set up unaviodable ambushes. I usually wait until the heavy is past, jump down and scorch the medic, and then go for the heavy. Sometimes I get killed in the process, but the fact is that a heavy advancing on 2fort like that is going to be open to attacks from above, no matter what. And if he is ubered - just air blast the medic away. And even if I do get killed, I've broken up the combo and stalled the advance, which is goal #1.

But I will say this: as a pyro with the flare gun, fighting a heavy at long range is a real bad thing. :)

LOL?

You tried to kill a Heavy with a flare gun? XD

I wouldn't try that on anything except, doctor and spy (snipers have pretty good weapons so no use attracting the wrong targets, engineers bug me with the shotgun and scouts are just to fast to fry) .:P

Oh yeah I did try on a pyro, that had the backburner, so extra life + that on pyros the flames are extinguished faster and I killed him but it was flare gun vs flare gun, otherwise I wouldn't stand a chance

I was hoping some fix for the scout, my second favorite class :\

LOL?

You tried to kill a Heavy with a flare gun? XD

I wouldn't try that on anything except, doctor and spy (snipers have pretty good weapons so no use attracting the wrong targets, engineers bug me with the shotgun and scouts are just to fast to fry) .:P

Oh yeah I did try on a pyro, that had the backburner, so extra life + that on pyros the flames are extinguished faster and I killed him but it was flare gun vs flare gun, otherwise I wouldn't stand a chance

DanielDust

Uhh, why not? The minigun is horrible at long range, and the flare gun can be fired at tremendous range.

Not many would let a fly(pyro) do his business for a few minutes, till he actually does damage, live, but that's just me ;). Of course in this way you can kill snipers, too, but not all snipers aren't skilled enough to escape and kill you.

I think when not with a medic, the heavy should be a defensive cIass, and to that end I think he should get:

Melee weapon: Bear Hug

The bear hug is a melee attach where the heavy grabs hold of his target and squeezes the life out of him (30 health/second). During the hug, neither the heavy nor his target can move or attack, and the only way to break the hug is either for the target to die or for someone else to kill the heavy. In short, once the heavy has hold of you, you're pretty much dead.

But the hug also serves a second purpose. Although it will not damage ubered players while they are ubered, they can still be hugged and incapacitated. This will give the heavy a third option when facing an ubered player (the current options being run or die).

fatshodan

THIS is a great idea, especially the second purpose!!! but i don't know if a slow-moving heavy will ever get close enough to bear hug someone...

[QUOTE="fremen_warrior"]

i'm not a fan of leveling up in fps games. I don't want to have to grind for hours just to get a better gun. I want a level playing field where the only determining factor is skill.

This is kind of why I stopped playing TF2 in the first place.

darkmagician06

In my mind if there's unlockable content that you have to get unlocked that gives you an advantage, then it's a leveling system. When you have people grinding acheivements just so they can unlock new weapons that doesn't suggest to me a level playing field.

As far as teamwork. Maybe I've been playing on the wrong servers, but I've experienced way more teamwork in games like Day of Defeat and Red Orchestrah than in TF2.

[QUOTE="darkmagician06"][QUOTE="fremen_warrior"]

i'm not a fan of leveling up in fps games. I don't want to have to grind for hours just to get a better gun. I want a level playing field where the only determining factor is skill.

This is kind of why I stopped playing TF2 in the first place.

fremen_warrior

In my mind if there's unlockable content that you have to get unlocked that gives you an advantage, then it's a leveling system. When you have people grinding acheivements just so they can unlock new weapons that doesn't suggest to me a level playing field.

As far as teamwork. Maybe I've been playing on the wrong servers, but I've experienced way more teamwork in games like Day of Defeat and Red Orchestrah than in TF2.

But that's just the thing, the new equipment doesnt give any advantages, they just give different styles of play.

Uhh, why not? The minigun is horrible at long range, and the flare gun can be fired at tremendous range.

TheGTAvaccine

Well, if the heavy has a medic with him, the flare gun won't even harm him - in fact, I sometimes deliberartely encourage pyros to flare me so uber charges faster (and most of them oblige).

I can usually seriously hurt pyros across the distance of the 2fort bridge without a medic - not usually enough to kill them outright (without crits) but always enough to force them to retreat inside. Pyros just don't have enough health to take on a heavy toe to toe.

[QUOTE="TheGTAvaccine"]

Uhh, why not? The minigun is horrible at long range, and the flare gun can be fired at tremendous range.

fatshodan

Well, if the heavy has a medic with him, the flare gun won't even harm him - in fact, I sometimes deliberartely encourage pyros to flare me so uber charges faster (and most of them oblige).

I can usually seriously hurt pyros across the distance of the 2fort bridge without a medic - not usually enough to kill them outright (without crits) but always enough to force them to retreat inside. Pyros just don't have enough health to take on a heavy toe to toe.

Hehe, that's why as a Pyro, I aim the flares at the Medics first, and then the Heavies.

Hehe, that's why as a Pyro, I aim the flares at the Medics first, and then the Heavies.

TheGTAvaccine

I suppose it very much depends on the players involved, but my regular medic (one of the best players I have ever known) rarely gets flared - he hides behind me, and even if he does get hit it won't kill him. He isn't really representative of the typical medic on a pub, though. I've played with some real idiots.

Somebody that says that obviously never played against a good Heavy and Medic pair. Pyro and Spy? no chance against a good heavy and a good doctor, only if they manage to get closer (as in right in his face) but a good Heavy will NEVER let that happen. With Sniper I agree, because I play with the Sniper :) maybe I shouldn't have said invincible but anyway it's one of the most powerful ones.DanielDust

"A Pyro has no chance against a good heavy and a good doctor?" In what situation?

Charging them head-on when they're aware of his presence, obviously, he has no chance at all. No class does, except for another Heavy+Medic team.

Any good Pyro obviously won't do that, though. He'll try to find a way to get behind them, and ambush while they're engaged with another player (a Heavy will rarely turn around to check for ambushers while engaging someone.)

With the Backburner, a Pyro can often drop a Heavy+Medic team before they even realize they're being attacked from behind.

LOL?

You tried to kill a Heavy with a flare gun? XD

I wouldn't try that on anything except, doctor and spy (snipers have pretty good weapons so no use attracting the wrong targets, engineers bug me with the shotgun and scouts are just to fast to fry) .:P

Oh yeah I did try on a pyro, that had the backburner, so extra life + that on pyros the flames are extinguished faster and I killed him but it was flare gun vs flare gun, otherwise I wouldn't stand a chance

DanielDust

:P Yeah, not my best idea. It was in that long sewer tunnel under 2fort, and I was the only one against a heavy, an engie and a soldier. I was just trying to keep them from rushing up by taking pot shots and ducking away. I couldn't do a thing to the heavy, but I did take out the engie! :D I died sooo many times in that exchange. But it was the tunnel on my side, so I could respawn and get down there quick enough to hold them back.

The nice thing about the new weapons is that they aren't really upgrades since they make compromises, generally no crits. I will say the backburner feels a little overpowered...

The update I look forward to most is the Engineer. This update has the most potential to enhance or break the game.

I love TF2. Its so fun to play and all the characters are balanced so well.

Heavy and Medic are also my two favourite classes, so this is good news.

Grr...I wanted new Spy stuff.. :(