x2900xt outperforming 8800gtx with latest drivers

ok so a friend told me that with the new drivers from ATI the x2900xt outperforms the 8800gtx in many agme and the ones it doesent its like a 5 fps differnece at most. I saw these benchmarks with my own eyes and the only games the 8800 actually has a substantial advantage over the card thats 200 dollars cheaper are the ones that are open GL not DX. anyone have any comments? personally I DO NOT beleive nvidea will sit back and take this, I think they will release even better drivers that put the ati ones to shame because if someone can get same performance for 200 dollars less, why wouldnt they?

This is not totally true. The hd 2900xt has an extremely good value without AA. Put some AA though and it falls behind the Gts.

and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.Deamon321

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

so I take it you guys saw the same benchmarks I did? It didnt really fall that much it was still pretty close and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.Deamon321

sry but no, i wouldnt get that card, i will be waiting fot the geforce series 9 and ati radeon HD3k.

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.THA-TODD-BEAST

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

the cheapest ive ever seen an 8800gts is 350 dollars (not counting the 320mb version) are and Ive seen 2900s for about teh same price on newegg

[QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"]

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.Deamon321

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

the cheapest ive ever seen an 8800gts is 350 dollars (not counting the 320mb version) are and Ive seen 2900s for about teh same price on newegg

Why not count the 320MB version? Performance is identical to the 640MB version unless your monitor is gargantuous.

Let's also not forget how much power the 2900 XT consumes .. I know this is besides the point of overall graphical performance, but add in the cost of a PSU powerful enough to run it and you're spending a pretty penny for what could be a substitute for a winter heater! (Hey, maybe that's a good thing?) :D

[QUOTE="Deamon321"][QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"]

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.THA-TODD-BEAST

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

the cheapest ive ever seen an 8800gts is 350 dollars (not counting the 320mb version) are and Ive seen 2900s for about teh same price on newegg

Why not count the 320MB version? Performance is identical to the 640MB version unless your monitor is gargantuous.

Let's also not forget how much power the 2900 XT consumes .. I know this is besides the point of overall graphical performance, but add in the cost of a PSU powerful enough to run it and you're spending a pretty penny for what could be a substitute for a winter heater! (Hey, maybe that's a good thing?) :D

Unless they consume more than 500 watts I would not complay becuase no1 gets a high end gaming video card without a high end gaming machine witha high end gaming power suply besides didnt the x1950xtx used to take like 450 watts? 50 watts more isnt really that bad. the 8800gts that I have only requires 400 watts but Ihave 680 just in case.

So where are these mysterious benchmarks, and how come no one links to them?ZBoater

they are on anantech i forgot exactly the link sorry but im sure theyll be real easy to find

they are on anantech i forgot exactly the link sorry but im sure theyll be real easy to find

Deamon321

No, they are not. The only things on Anandtech are the articles on the 2900XT and how it compares with the 8800GTS and not at the level of the GTX. Try again. :D

[QUOTE="ZBoater"]So where are these mysterious benchmarks, and how come no one links to them?Deamon321

they are on anantech i forgot exactly the link sorry but im sure theyll be real easy to find

Could you please provide a link? I went to Anandtech and the latest video card article is June 14th, which is about 2 weeks ago. If this was really big news, everyone would know by now that it's outperforming the GTX.

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.THA-TODD-BEAST

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

The HD2900xt can be had at times for $320, plus you get a ~$40 game bundle...
The performance is fine with AA, in most games.
AF doesn't eliminat jaggies, that is AA. Think about what AF stands for...

[QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"][QUOTE="Deamon321"][QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"]

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.Deamon321

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

the cheapest ive ever seen an 8800gts is 350 dollars (not counting the 320mb version) are and Ive seen 2900s for about teh same price on newegg

Why not count the 320MB version? Performance is identical to the 640MB version unless your monitor is gargantuous.

Let's also not forget how much power the 2900 XT consumes .. I know this is besides the point of overall graphical performance, but add in the cost of a PSU powerful enough to run it and you're spending a pretty penny for what could be a substitute for a winter heater! (Hey, maybe that's a good thing?) :D

Unless they consume more than 500 watts I would not complay becuase no1 gets a high end gaming video card without a high end gaming machine witha high end gaming power suply besides didnt the x1950xtx used to take like 450 watts? 50 watts more isnt really that bad. the 8800gts that I have only requires 400 watts but Ihave 680 just in case.

There is no single card out there that even takes 450Ws.. or even 300Ws.

The most energy consuming card is the 2900XT, which uses around 250-270Ws I believe.

I'm guessing you got confused from the power supply "requirements" that nVidia and ATi have.

[QUOTE="Deamon321"][QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"][QUOTE="Deamon321"][QUOTE="THA-TODD-BEAST"]

[QUOTE="Deamon321"]and for the value its much better than an 8800gts.Hiryuu_

Not true .. in fact, not even close.

GTS: Less than $300
2900 XT: Usually around $400

Who wants to pay around $400 for a card that can't even withstand performance hits with AA applied? With any new video card, you're going to want to use at least SOME anisotropic filtering to get rid of those jaggies .. and by the time you apply it on the 2900XT, you're at GTS performance-levels and you've spent about $100 more.

the cheapest ive ever seen an 8800gts is 350 dollars (not counting the 320mb version) are and Ive seen 2900s for about teh same price on newegg

Why not count the 320MB version? Performance is identical to the 640MB version unless your monitor is gargantuous.

Let's also not forget how much power the 2900 XT consumes .. I know this is besides the point of overall graphical performance, but add in the cost of a PSU powerful enough to run it and you're spending a pretty penny for what could be a substitute for a winter heater! (Hey, maybe that's a good thing?) :D

Unless they consume more than 500 watts I would not complay becuase no1 gets a high end gaming video card without a high end gaming machine witha high end gaming power suply besides didnt the x1950xtx used to take like 450 watts? 50 watts more isnt really that bad. the 8800gts that I have only requires 400 watts but Ihave 680 just in case.

There is no single card out there that even takes 450Ws.. or even 300Ws.

The most energy consuming card is the 2900XT, which uses around 250-270Ws I believe.

I'm guessing you got confused from the power supply "requirements" that nVidia and ATi have.

oh, looks liek i did. so when u say consumes energy u mean like in the electric bill huh?

There is no single card out there that even takes 450Ws.. or even 300Ws.

The most energy consuming card is the 2900XT, which uses around 250-270Ws I believe.

I'm guessing you got confused from the power supply "requirements" that nVidia and ATi have.Hiryuu_

http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/1115/1/page_1_introduction/index.htmlI

ok finally there it is. enjoy.

Deamon321

Ain't 7.4 old drivers?

http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/1115/1/page_1_introduction/index.htmlI

ok finally there it is. enjoy.

Deamon321

http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/1115/12/page_12_benchmarks_high_quality_aa_and_af/index.html

/thread

AF doesn't eliminat jaggies, that is AA. Think about what AF stands for...

LordEC911

Yes, that was my bad there .. I didn't even catch it when I posted. Obviously I meant anti-aliasing.

All this talk about the x2900xt has made me a little disappointed when I could have gotten a 8800 gts for only $215 on buy.com 3 months ago :(TrailorParkBoy

wow. 200 dolars? why was it so cheap?

http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/1115/12/page_12_benchmarks_high_quality_aa_and_af/index.html

/thread

THA-TODD-BEAST

Catalyst 7.4, HD2900XT 47096tweaktown.com

/you

It was at the time the hype for the new ATI cards was at its highest. Every one thought they were going to be the be all end all of video cards and pwn the 8800's so no one was buying video cards. Retails **** them selves because even they thought the X2900XT was going to render all previous cards obsolete so they panicked and dropped the prices down extremely low but what made it funny was no one purchased them because every one (even nvidia fanboys like my self) thought they were going to be obsolete in a month but that was obviously not the case and the 8800 GTS was and continues to be the best bang for the buck. God we should have jumped on those deals :(TrailorParkBoy

If no one was buying them, how did they sell out TWICE in the one week they were on sale with a rebate?

BTW-HD2900XT

[QUOTE="TrailorParkBoy"]It was at the time the hype for the new ATI cards was at its highest. Every one thought they were going to be the be all end all of video cards and pwn the 8800's so no one was buying video cards. Retails **** them selves because even they thought the X2900XT was going to render all previous cards obsolete so they panicked and dropped the prices down extremely low but what made it funny was no one purchased them because every one (even nvidia fanboys like my self) thought they were going to be obsolete in a month but that was obviously not the case and the 8800 GTS was and continues to be the best bang for the buck. God we should have jumped on those deals :(LordEC911

If no one was buying them, how did they sell out TWICE in the one week they were on sale with a rebate?

BTW-HD2900XT

Buy.com is really good from my experience. I picked up my PSU from them for $89.99 and it came in 2 days.

buy.com is a little bit of a shady retailer imo and for all we know they only had a couple in stock. but I can guarantee if we all had time machines and could go back we would have all gone and jumped on that deal or at least me and alot of the people I know would have.TrailorParkBoy

I remember close to 2 dozen people getting them at Anandtech.com and Hardforums.com and I know at least 3 people got them from this forum.

They sold a probably close to a hundred of them, it not more.

Lord, can you please answer on my question?? Please. What is the problem of 2900XT that when AA is on it falls behind GTS. IS this really only driver issue or is there something else behind??domke13

Only people that know that answer are employed by AMD.
I think Eric Demers, lead architect of R600, had an interview with a site, can't remember which one, and stated that the R600 was meant to run AA on the shaders. He states that "older" games will not benefit from this new design but future games will.

I'm a bit tired at the moment and going to go to bed. I'll do some research tomorrow and try to get a full answer.

here's REAL link

http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1123/ati_catalyst_7_6_performance_analysis/index.html

http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1122/1/page_1_introduction/index.html

first is 7.5 - 7.6 improvements and second 7.5 bechmarks I believe

[QUOTE="domke13"]Lord, can you please answer on my question?? Please. What is the problem of 2900XT that when AA is on it falls behind GTS. IS this really only driver issue or is there something else behind??LordEC911

Only people that know that answer is the people at AMD.
I think Eric Demers, lead architect of R600, had an interview with a site, can't remember which one, and stated that the R600 was meant to run AA on the shaders. He states that "older" games will not benefit from this new design but future games will.

I'm a bit tired at the moment and going to go to bed. I'll do some research tomorrow and try to get a full answer.

Ok.Thanks.

well, the HD2900XT is outperforming the gtx in 3dmark. Honestly the card has the best price/performance ratio.

Sorry for double posting. This is what i read on forums form a guy who is prgraming graphics engines, and he is an expert. HE knows all the stuff about GPUs. Here is what he sad about programable tesselationandprogramableAA:

"This teselator on R600 is transformed from 360 and is partly programable, which makes it completely useless for DX10.1 (which will again have new shaders especialy for that stuff).

Same goes for programable AA."

He also sad many other things (which i am not in a mood to translate) to which i belive, cause they seem VERY possible so i think he is not lying. Basicly from what he sad R600 isnt as futureproof cause of teselation because DX10.1 will need new sahders for that, also that programable AA isnt much futureproof.

And please dont ban me. I didnt say that. I only posted what a guy whit big knowledge about GPUs sad.

I've posted from other forums before and I never got banned:|

Its 5 A.M.(pacific) Post the explanation before I go to sleep.

I've posted from other forums before and I never got banned:|

Its 5 A.M.(pacific) Post the explanation before I go to sleep.

_eDdySON_

Explanation of what??? I am really not in a mood to translate all now. I will probably do it later.

Can he prove he is what he says? He could be 10yr old lolskinnypete91

I am totally sure that he can prove it. He IS an expert. He also wrote graphics code. He wrote usual code and wrote optimal code for R600.

He is expert. You can see that thorugh his posts. He explains all stuff why is it like that, and why not the other way.

I find out some very useful informations from him. He also told that R600 and all other chips (except G80) has VLIW instructions(very long instruction word)and why that isnt great

He wrote typical case which driver sees each time you run any game:

dp3 r0.w, r1, r1

rsq r0.w, r0.w

mul r1, r0.w, r10

Dont ask me what that means. Thats why he is an expert.

He wrote 1 page why G80 is better core (dont ask me why, and dont ask me to translate. If you dont belive me fine, i just say what i read).

He wrote that ATis biggest problem is that it is soo late whit R600 and that whole DX10 code is written whit G80 in mind just cause it was on market before.

All in all he knows what hes saying and i belive him.

I knew this would happen as 3d mark '06 does not lie.

I can do that too:

dq6 f3,e, r2, r2

:|

Unless he's a developer, an AMD/NVIDIA employee or is a proper tech analyst he won't have much here say or reliability.

Also, if he thinks VLIW are bad in all cases, then he is grossly misinformed.