Question about HDMI 1.3 and Dolby TRUEHD and DTS-HD

ok so i have a ps3 and a Samsung 1080p tv from last year

anyways i was thinking about getting high def surround system so i was looking into receivers i found

http://www.amazon.com/Onkyo-TX-SR605-Channel-Theater-Receiver/dp/B000OBLARC/ref=cm_lmf_tit_2_rsrsrs0

anyways the receiver supports Dolby TRUEHD and DTS-HD which i want to get so i can really take advantage of the audio features

found in bluray discs

thing is my samsung

http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-LN-S4095D-1080p-LCD-HDTV/dp/B000GDEZLQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1198728229&sr=1-1

Im pretty sure it doesn't support HDMI 1.3 input so im wondering if i do get that receiver along with speakers will i be able to experience TRUEHD or DTS-HD?

so im pretty sure the tv doesnt support HDMI 1.3

do yourself a huge favor and do not buy onkyo..... buy a yamaha receiver. you will pay a little more, and the wattage per channel is lower, but the sound QUALITY is far superior to any other brand on the market.Roland123_basic

BAD advice to tell someone to buy a freakin' yamaha over an onkyo receiver.

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]do yourself a huge favor and do not buy onkyo..... buy a yamaha receiver. you will pay a little more, and the wattage per channel is lower, but the sound QUALITY is far superior to any other brand on the market.ryank285

BAD advice to tell someone to buy a freakin' yamaha over an onkyo receiver.

GOOD advice actually... yamaha makes excellent components. if all you care about is wattage and how loud your sound is... then yamaha is not for you. if you care about clarity and true sounds, yamaha is excellent.

i would never buy an onkyo.... sony... harman kardon... they are all garbage.

[QUOTE="ryank285"]

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]do yourself a huge favor and do not buy onkyo..... buy a yamaha receiver. you will pay a little more, and the wattage per channel is lower, but the sound QUALITY is far superior to any other brand on the market.Roland123_basic

BAD advice to tell someone to buy a freakin' yamaha over an onkyo receiver.

GOOD advice actually... yamaha makes excellent components. if all you care about is wattage and how loud your sound is... then yamaha is not for you. if you care about clarity and true sounds, yamaha is excellent.

i would never buy an onkyo.... sony... harman kardon... they are all garbage.

[QUOTE="ryank285"]

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"]do yourself a huge favor and do not buy onkyo..... buy a yamaha receiver. you will pay a little more, and the wattage per channel is lower, but the sound QUALITY is far superior to any other brand on the market.Roland123_basic

BAD advice to tell someone to buy a freakin' yamaha over an onkyo receiver.

GOOD advice actually... yamaha makes excellent components.

Noooo. No its not. Go with the Onkyo TC. Also, I'm pretty sure the PS3 doesn't use DTS-HD or True-HD. It outputs pure PCM, which is uncompressed and better. Those are an audio compression method mostly for HDDVD since it has less disk space to work with. PS3 does use hdmi 1.3. 1.3 means audio also goes through the cable. Its the 360 Elite that only supports hdmi 1.2, meaning no through hdmi cable sound.

I don't think 1.3 has anything to do with audio, i think it has more to do with better picture quality.ryank285

I think it does. HDMI v1.3 sends both video and audio, and lossless on both.Which means you willenjoy the full sound of Blu-Ray discs with uncompressed (lossless) audio tracks. I think you can still get lossless audio,TRUEHD or DTS-HD, with the optical output on the PS3, but I'm not sure. Check the PS3 manual online - I think it may list the info. Most surround sound systems today have at least optical inputs, if you don't find one with HDMI.

Noooo. No its not. Go with the Onkyo TC. Also, I'm pretty sure the PS3 doesn't use DTS-HD or True-HD. It outputs pure PCM, which is uncompressed and better. Those are an audio compression method mostly for HDDVD since it has less disk space to work with. PS3 does use hdmi 1.3. 1.3 means audio also goes through the cable. Its the 360 Elite that only supports hdmi 1.2, meaning no through hdmi cable sound.

mbrockway

He might be interested in Blu-Ray movies, in which case they (depends on which) do use DTS-HD and TRUEHD sound formats.

Right now, and from what i've been reading about the HDMI chip within the PS3, it will not send the audio Bitstream, only PCM, so the decoding will be done in the PS3, not the receiver, so there is no need for HDMI 1.3, as far as audio goes, only for Deep Color, if that ever gets implemented.

Currently the PS3 cannot decode DTS-HD MA, though they are supposed to be working with DTS to get the decoding implemented, no idea when, if ever though.

As far as the Yamaha vs. Onkyo. Yamaha generally runs closer to its rated power than an Onkyo, HK is usually much more truthful with their wattage ratings than either Yamaha or Onkyo. Also wattage has to be doubled for a 3 db gain, so a receiver putting out 100 watts will only be 3 db louder than a receiver putting out 50 watts through the same speakers, and the majority of your listening will be at less than 1 watt output, unless you have inefficient speakers.

There also appears to be some confusion on HDMI specs. HDMI 1.1 will send both audio and video. HDMI 1.2 will allow SACD multi channel audio to be passed, HDMI allows bitsreaming of HD AUDIO and deep color, these are due to bandwith increases of each fo the versions. So only HDMI 1.1 is needed to send both audio and video to a receiver, if it is in PCM form.

From the HDMI website HDMI.org: HDMI supports standard, enhanced, or high-definition video, plus multi-channel digital audio on a single cable. It transmits all ATSC HDTV standards and supports 8-channel, 192kHz, uncompressed digital audio and all currently-available compressed formats (such as Dolby Digital and DTS), HDMI 1.3 adds additional support for new lossless digital audio formats Dolby® TrueHD and DTS-HD Master AudioTM with bandwidth to spare to accommodate future enhancements and requirements.

Yup, just did a google. The PS3 does support True HD, it DOES NOT support 7.1 channel DTS-HD.

"This system does not support output from the DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. DTS-HD 7.1Ch audio is output from a 5.1 or lower channel. "

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/PS3/GettingStarted/default.html

Just do a text search to find it.

Bitstream IS an audio option. Its in the menu. It says something about the main audio of a movie possibly not working though.

Right now, and from what i've been reading about the HDMI chip within the PS3, it will not send the audio Bitstream, only PCM, so the decoding will be done in the PS3, not the receiver, so there is no need for HDMI 1.3, as far as audio goes, only for Deep Color, if that ever gets implemented.

Currently the PS3 cannot decode DTS-HD MA, though they are supposed to be working with DTS to get the decoding implemented, no idea when, if ever though.

j2lawson

Are you sure? There are bitstream options in the sound setup menu. And some of the newer BD movies are coming out with Dolby TRUEHD and DTS-HD. I haven't heard of any problems of the PS3 playing these. I don't know if any are out yet with DTS-HD, but I think the new Die Hard has Dolby HD.

Yup, just did a google. The PS3 does support True HD, it DOES NOT support 7.1 channel DTS-HD.

"This system does not support output from the DTS-HD 7.1 Ch. DTS-HD 7.1Ch audio is output from a 5.1 or lower channel. "

mbrockway

That's not so bad for now - at least it will still play DTS-HD via a 5.1 channel. Hopefully Sony will update for a full 7.1 channel via HDMI.

I own the Onkyo 605, and love it. The Yamaha is very good as well, but the guy who said one is better than the other is obviously biased. CNet gave the Onkyo 605, which is comparable to the Yamaha 661 a better rating... if that has any relevance. Each has their +'s and -'s. Anyhow, I did a ton of research on the subject and here's whatI can tell you...

The Onkyo 605 does have the ability to accept and/or decode all of the HD-Audio Codecs (Uncompressed PCM is prevalent on blu-rays, but True HD and DTS-MA/HD are there as well). However, all that is a moot point when it comes to the PS3. The PS3 sends the LPCM as it is, or decodes Dolby True HD into LPCM and sends it as that. The receiver will not be doing the decoding... so it is really only necessary to have an HDMI receiver that can accept LPCM.

The PS3 canNOT decode DTS-MA/HD,NOR can it send it to the receiver to decode. In fact, when I had done my research last April, there were NO players that could send the DTS-MA signal... which means there was no way that you would get the DTS-MA audio codec. Now I believe since that time there are a couple of high end Blu-ray players that can send the DTS-MA signal, but it is still very rare. What the PS3 does do is extract a DTS Core which is better sounding than anything found on a DVD, but not quite up to par with Uncompressed PCM soundtracks and Dolby True HD. It does sound very good though from experience. Really, the actual utilization of DTS-MA audio is not here at this moment in time. It is not clear if the PS3 can be upgraded via a firmware update to be able to send the DTS-MA strea to a receiver to decode. It will take HDMI 1.3 to do that, which the PS3 has... but that doesn't necessarily mean the PS3 will be able to do so. DTS-MA is not one of the audio formats that the PS3 can decode (all others you will see the trademarkson your PS3, ie Dolby, Dolby True HD, DTS)

In that price range... the Yamaha 661 does have a clear advantage in that it can apply post processing / IIx to ANY 5.1 sources and turn it into 7.1 surround sound. The Onkyo 605 can not do this to the high def LPCM signals that the PS3 sends for the high def audio codecs. So for any of the "HD" audio found on blu-rays, you are going to get 5.1 even if you have a 7.1 set-up.

The problem with the Yamaha 661 is it's not quite as user friendly, and that it has had problems of resetting certain settings that one may want to calibrate. That can be a pain since the Yamaha does not have an on screen menu display via HDMI. A lot of people have reported that they have to set certain things up every time they turn their receiver on and off. But that being said, it's better suited for those who want 7.1 sound than the Onkyo.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me, and I'll try my best to answer. A great place to go for some answers is www.avsforum.com

I own the Onkyo 605, and love it. The Yamaha is very good as well, but the guy who said one is better than the other is obviously biased. CNet gave the Onkyo 605, which is comparable to the Yamaha 661 a better rating... if that has any relevance. Each has their +'s and -'s. Anyhow, I did a ton of research on the subject and here's whatI can tell you...

The Onkyo 605 does have the ability to accept and/or decode all of the HD-Audio Codecs (Uncompressed PCM is prevalent on blu-rays, but True HD and DTS-MA/HD are there as well). However, all that is a moot point when it comes to the PS3. The PS3 sends the LPCM as it is, or decodes Dolby True HD into LPCM and sends it as that. The receiver will not be doing the decoding... so it is really only necessary to have an HDMI receiver that can accept LPCM.

The PS3 canNOT decode DTS-MA/HD,NOR can it send it to the receiver to decode. In fact, when I had done my research last April, there were NO players that could send the DTS-MA signal... which means there was no way that you would get the DTS-MA audio codec. Now I believe since that time there are a couple of high end Blu-ray players that can send the DTS-MA signal, but it is still very rare. What the PS3 does do is extract a DTS Core which is better sounding than anything found on a DVD, but not quite up to par with Uncompressed PCM soundtracks and Dolby True HD. It does sound very good though from experience. Really, the actual utilization of DTS-MA audio is not here at this moment in time. It is not clear if the PS3 can be upgraded via a firmware update to be able to send the DTS-MA strea to a receiver to decode. It will take HDMI 1.3 to do that, which the PS3 has... but that doesn't necessarily mean the PS3 will be able to do so. DTS-MA is not one of the audio formats that the PS3 can decode (all others you will see the trademarkson your PS3, ie Dolby, Dolby True HD, DTS)

In that price range... the Yamaha 661 does have a clear advantage in that it can apply post processing / IIx to ANY 5.1 sources and turn it into 7.1 surround sound. The Onkyo 605 can not do this to the high def LPCM signals that the PS3 sends for the high def audio codecs. So for any of the "HD" audio found on blu-rays, you are going to get 5.1 even if you have a 7.1 set-up.

The problem with the Yamaha 661 is it's not quite as user friendly, and that it has had problems of resetting certain settings that one may want to calibrate. That can be a pain since the Yamaha does not have an on screen menu display via HDMI. A lot of people have reported that they have to set certain things up every time they turn their receiver on and off. But that being said, it's better suited for those who want 7.1 sound than the Onkyo.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me, and I'll try my best to answer. A great place to go for some answers is www.avsforum.com

jshigashi

Duuuuuuuuude, i know you are just trying to be helpful but my god, you have ALOT of time on your hands.

[QUOTE="jshigashi"]

I own the Onkyo 605, and love it. The Yamaha is very good as well, but the guy who said one is better than the other is obviously biased. CNet gave the Onkyo 605, which is comparable to the Yamaha 661 a better rating... if that has any relevance. Each has their +'s and -'s. Anyhow, I did a ton of research on the subject and here's whatI can tell you...

The Onkyo 605 does have the ability to accept and/or decode all of the HD-Audio Codecs (Uncompressed PCM is prevalent on blu-rays, but True HD and DTS-MA/HD are there as well). However, all that is a moot point when it comes to the PS3. The PS3 sends the LPCM as it is, or decodes Dolby True HD into LPCM and sends it as that. The receiver will not be doing the decoding... so it is really only necessary to have an HDMI receiver that can accept LPCM.

The PS3 canNOT decode DTS-MA/HD,NOR can it send it to the receiver to decode. In fact, when I had done my research last April, there were NO players that could send the DTS-MA signal... which means there was no way that you would get the DTS-MA audio codec. Now I believe since that time there are a couple of high end Blu-ray players that can send the DTS-MA signal, but it is still very rare. What the PS3 does do is extract a DTS Core which is better sounding than anything found on a DVD, but not quite up to par with Uncompressed PCM soundtracks and Dolby True HD. It does sound very good though from experience. Really, the actual utilization of DTS-MA audio is not here at this moment in time. It is not clear if the PS3 can be upgraded via a firmware update to be able to send the DTS-MA strea to a receiver to decode. It will take HDMI 1.3 to do that, which the PS3 has... but that doesn't necessarily mean the PS3 will be able to do so. DTS-MA is not one of the audio formats that the PS3 can decode (all others you will see the trademarkson your PS3, ie Dolby, Dolby True HD, DTS)

In that price range... the Yamaha 661 does have a clear advantage in that it can apply post processing / IIx to ANY 5.1 sources and turn it into 7.1 surround sound. The Onkyo 605 can not do this to the high def LPCM signals that the PS3 sends for the high def audio codecs. So for any of the "HD" audio found on blu-rays, you are going to get 5.1 even if you have a 7.1 set-up.

The problem with the Yamaha 661 is it's not quite as user friendly, and that it has had problems of resetting certain settings that one may want to calibrate. That can be a pain since the Yamaha does not have an on screen menu display via HDMI. A lot of people have reported that they have to set certain things up every time they turn their receiver on and off. But that being said, it's better suited for those who want 7.1 sound than the Onkyo.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me, and I'll try my best to answer. A great place to go for some answers is www.avsforum.com

ryank285

Duuuuuuuuude, i know you are just trying to be helpful but my god, you have ALOT of time on your hands.

thanks to the miracle called the internet that probably only took 15minutes to research...

and my point still stands Yamaha > Onkyo

yamaha has been the only brand of receivers that i have been able to trust for true sound and flexibility in terms of connections and sound options.

[QUOTE="ryank285"][QUOTE="jshigashi"]

I own the Onkyo 605, and love it. The Yamaha is very good as well, but the guy who said one is better than the other is obviously biased. CNet gave the Onkyo 605, which is comparable to the Yamaha 661 a better rating... if that has any relevance. Each has their +'s and -'s. Anyhow, I did a ton of research on the subject and here's whatI can tell you...

The Onkyo 605 does have the ability to accept and/or decode all of the HD-Audio Codecs (Uncompressed PCM is prevalent on blu-rays, but True HD and DTS-MA/HD are there as well). However, all that is a moot point when it comes to the PS3. The PS3 sends the LPCM as it is, or decodes Dolby True HD into LPCM and sends it as that. The receiver will not be doing the decoding... so it is really only necessary to have an HDMI receiver that can accept LPCM.

The PS3 canNOT decode DTS-MA/HD,NOR can it send it to the receiver to decode. In fact, when I had done my research last April, there were NO players that could send the DTS-MA signal... which means there was no way that you would get the DTS-MA audio codec. Now I believe since that time there are a couple of high end Blu-ray players that can send the DTS-MA signal, but it is still very rare. What the PS3 does do is extract a DTS Core which is better sounding than anything found on a DVD, but not quite up to par with Uncompressed PCM soundtracks and Dolby True HD. It does sound very good though from experience. Really, the actual utilization of DTS-MA audio is not here at this moment in time. It is not clear if the PS3 can be upgraded via a firmware update to be able to send the DTS-MA strea to a receiver to decode. It will take HDMI 1.3 to do that, which the PS3 has... but that doesn't necessarily mean the PS3 will be able to do so. DTS-MA is not one of the audio formats that the PS3 can decode (all others you will see the trademarkson your PS3, ie Dolby, Dolby True HD, DTS)

In that price range... the Yamaha 661 does have a clear advantage in that it can apply post processing / IIx to ANY 5.1 sources and turn it into 7.1 surround sound. The Onkyo 605 can not do this to the high def LPCM signals that the PS3 sends for the high def audio codecs. So for any of the "HD" audio found on blu-rays, you are going to get 5.1 even if you have a 7.1 set-up.

The problem with the Yamaha 661 is it's not quite as user friendly, and that it has had problems of resetting certain settings that one may want to calibrate. That can be a pain since the Yamaha does not have an on screen menu display via HDMI. A lot of people have reported that they have to set certain things up every time they turn their receiver on and off. But that being said, it's better suited for those who want 7.1 sound than the Onkyo.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me, and I'll try my best to answer. A great place to go for some answers is www.avsforum.com

Roland123_basic

Duuuuuuuuude, i know you are just trying to be helpful but my god, you have ALOT of time on your hands.

thanks to the miracle called the internet that probably only took 15minutes to research...

and my point still stands Yamaha > Onkyo

yamaha has been the only brand of receivers that i have been able to trust for true sound and flexibility in terms of connections and sound options.

Actually, it took be all about of 5 minutes to write because I type fast and it was all from memory.

[QUOTE="Roland123_basic"][QUOTE="ryank285"][QUOTE="jshigashi"]

I own the Onkyo 605, and love it. The Yamaha is very good as well, but the guy who said one is better than the other is obviously biased. CNet gave the Onkyo 605, which is comparable to the Yamaha 661 a better rating... if that has any relevance. Each has their +'s and -'s. Anyhow, I did a ton of research on the subject and here's whatI can tell you...

The Onkyo 605 does have the ability to accept and/or decode all of the HD-Audio Codecs (Uncompressed PCM is prevalent on blu-rays, but True HD and DTS-MA/HD are there as well). However, all that is a moot point when it comes to the PS3. The PS3 sends the LPCM as it is, or decodes Dolby True HD into LPCM and sends it as that. The receiver will not be doing the decoding... so it is really only necessary to have an HDMI receiver that can accept LPCM.

The PS3 canNOT decode DTS-MA/HD,NOR can it send it to the receiver to decode. In fact, when I had done my research last April, there were NO players that could send the DTS-MA signal... which means there was no way that you would get the DTS-MA audio codec. Now I believe since that time there are a couple of high end Blu-ray players that can send the DTS-MA signal, but it is still very rare. What the PS3 does do is extract a DTS Core which is better sounding than anything found on a DVD, but not quite up to par with Uncompressed PCM soundtracks and Dolby True HD. It does sound very good though from experience. Really, the actual utilization of DTS-MA audio is not here at this moment in time. It is not clear if the PS3 can be upgraded via a firmware update to be able to send the DTS-MA strea to a receiver to decode. It will take HDMI 1.3 to do that, which the PS3 has... but that doesn't necessarily mean the PS3 will be able to do so. DTS-MA is not one of the audio formats that the PS3 can decode (all others you will see the trademarkson your PS3, ie Dolby, Dolby True HD, DTS)

In that price range... the Yamaha 661 does have a clear advantage in that it can apply post processing / IIx to ANY 5.1 sources and turn it into 7.1 surround sound. The Onkyo 605 can not do this to the high def LPCM signals that the PS3 sends for the high def audio codecs. So for any of the "HD" audio found on blu-rays, you are going to get 5.1 even if you have a 7.1 set-up.

The problem with the Yamaha 661 is it's not quite as user friendly, and that it has had problems of resetting certain settings that one may want to calibrate. That can be a pain since the Yamaha does not have an on screen menu display via HDMI. A lot of people have reported that they have to set certain things up every time they turn their receiver on and off. But that being said, it's better suited for those who want 7.1 sound than the Onkyo.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me, and I'll try my best to answer. A great place to go for some answers is www.avsforum.com

jshigashi

Duuuuuuuuude, i know you are just trying to be helpful but my god, you have ALOT of time on your hands.

thanks to the miracle called the internet that probably only took 15minutes to research...

and my point still stands Yamaha > Onkyo

yamaha has been the only brand of receivers that i have been able to trust for true sound and flexibility in terms of connections and sound options.

Actually, it took be all about of 5 minutes to write because I type fast and it was all from memory.

You got it bad...