I heard that FFXIII is light on gameplay...?
Would White Knight Chronicles be a better game for a good PS3 RPG?
White Knight Chronicles of FFXIII?
This topic is locked from further discussion.
light on gameplay??-Hoax-considering half the game is watching cutscenes, i think that's a fair assessment.
[QUOTE="-Hoax-"]light on gameplay??frostybananaconsidering half the game is watching cutscenes, i think that's a fair assessment.
Lol, no it's not. I'm about an hour before the last fight, and the cutscenes aren't exactly MSG4 caliber in terms of length. Sure, there's a good amount, but they're mostly short and sweet. "Light on gameplay" is not a fair assessment, as the battle system is so awesomely in-depth and hands on, that you don't even care that you're not running around more. I think I've pressed buttons more times in this game than any FF just from the battles alone, constantly switching paradigms to best suit my current and ever-changing frantic needs. No, light on gameplay does not describe FFXIII.
considering half the game is watching cutscenes, i think that's a fair assessment.[QUOTE="frostybanana"][QUOTE="-Hoax-"]light on gameplay??Khadaj32
Lol, no it's not. I'm about an hour before the last fight, and the cutscenes aren't exactly MSG4 caliber in terms of length. Sure, there's a good amount, but they're mostly short and sweet. "Light on gameplay" is not a fair assessment, as the battle system is so awesomely in-depth and hands on, that you don't even care that you're not running around more. I think I've pressed buttons more times in this game than any FF just from the battles alone, constantly switching paradigms to best suit my current and ever-changing frantic needs. No, light on gameplay does not describe FFXIII.
it's not about the length of the cutscenes, it's the frequency. the fact is you walk for 5-10 minutes fighting battles and then there's another cutscene. when the cutscenes are so frequent that it rivals the time actually spent playing the game, there is a problem. and it is light on gameplay in that regard. this is not about whether the system is fun or whether it's in depth. it's about actually playing the game, and the ratio of gameplay to cutscene is absurd. that being said, i didn't say the gameplay wasn't fun. as far as being hands on, i disagree as well. the game is largely automated and while you do control paradigms and things of that nature, it's not a saving grace for a rather simplistic system that basically tells you what to do for every fight.[QUOTE="Khadaj32"][QUOTE="frostybanana"] considering half the game is watching cutscenes, i think that's a fair assessment.frostybanana
Lol, no it's not. I'm about an hour before the last fight, and the cutscenes aren't exactly MSG4 caliber in terms of length. Sure, there's a good amount, but they're mostly short and sweet. "Light on gameplay" is not a fair assessment, as the battle system is so awesomely in-depth and hands on, that you don't even care that you're not running around more. I think I've pressed buttons more times in this game than any FF just from the battles alone, constantly switching paradigms to best suit my current and ever-changing frantic needs. No, light on gameplay does not describe FFXIII.
it's not about the length of the cutscenes, it's the frequency. the fact is you walk for 5-10 minutes fighting battles and then there's another cutscene. when the cutscenes are so frequent that it rivals the time actually spent playing the game, there is a problem. and it is light on gameplay in that regard. this is not about whether the system is fun or whether it's in depth. it's about actually playing the game, and the ratio of gameplay to cutscene is absurd. that being said, i didn't say the gameplay wasn't fun. as far as being hands on, i disagree as well. the game is largely automated and while you do control paradigms and things of that nature, it's not a saving grace for a rather simplistic system that basically tells you what to do for every fight.The frequency means nothing, as most of them are about 2-3 minutes long, with the longer ones only hitting around 5 minutes at the end of chapters are important story moments.
And how can you disagree with Paradigm being hands on? How far are you? I find the frantic Protection > Evened Odds > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Delta Attack way of frantically switching to the right Paradigm at the right time very involved. And simplistic? How? Is it any more simplistic than pressing the X button a dozen times per fight to have your party members simply attack, then move on? Even controlling all party members and choosing their attacks is far more simplistic than being able to control 3 at the same time with a strategy shift.
I've heard that WKC was a bit on the easy side as well. FFXIII isn't that hard, but has a bit of a learning curve for it's new set-up.
it's not about the length of the cutscenes, it's the frequency. the fact is you walk for 5-10 minutes fighting battles and then there's another cutscene. when the cutscenes are so frequent that it rivals the time actually spent playing the game, there is a problem. and it is light on gameplay in that regard. this is not about whether the system is fun or whether it's in depth. it's about actually playing the game, and the ratio of gameplay to cutscene is absurd. that being said, i didn't say the gameplay wasn't fun. as far as being hands on, i disagree as well. the game is largely automated and while you do control paradigms and things of that nature, it's not a saving grace for a rather simplistic system that basically tells you what to do for every fight.[QUOTE="frostybanana"][QUOTE="Khadaj32"]
Lol, no it's not. I'm about an hour before the last fight, and the cutscenes aren't exactly MSG4 caliber in terms of length. Sure, there's a good amount, but they're mostly short and sweet. "Light on gameplay" is not a fair assessment, as the battle system is so awesomely in-depth and hands on, that you don't even care that you're not running around more. I think I've pressed buttons more times in this game than any FF just from the battles alone, constantly switching paradigms to best suit my current and ever-changing frantic needs. No, light on gameplay does not describe FFXIII.
Khadaj32
The frequency means nothing, as most of them are about 2-3 minutes long, with the longer ones only hitting around 5 minutes at the end of chapters are important story moments.
And how can you disagree with Paradigm being hands on? How far are you? I find the frantic Protection > Evened Odds > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Delta Attack way of frantically switching to the right Paradigm at the right time very involved. And simplistic? How? Is it any more simplistic than pressing the X button a dozen times per fight to have your party members simply attack, then move on? Even controlling all party members and choosing their attacks is far more simplistic than being able to control 3 at the same time with a strategy shift.
like i said, the frequency of cutscenes means something when it takes over a game. and such is the case.and obviously you don't quite understand what i mean by hands on. consider that paradigms gives all your characters a role and a specific skill list. a synergist is for buffing and debuffing, medic is for heals, commando is for physical damage and so on. in past games you are the one who decides what character would play what role based on their stats (by the way, you have 3 stats the whole game which leaves you out of the loop in terms of stacking) and you PLAY that role during combat. having the computer do everything for you, in my eyes, is simplifying the game. micromanaging is not a nuisance, it's a welcome attribute to the strategy of the game.
i totally understand why it was done. it style-lizes the game, makes it more fast paced. that doesn't change the fact that the computer decides what's best for the party as opposed to you. in that way, the game is dumbed down for a wider range of audience. being fast paced does not = complexity. it just means you have to think quicker, which todays gamers have no trouble doing considering the games that are out nowadays.
not just in combat, but out of combat as well. stacking numbers and abilities that fit to your liking for any boss fights or anything is what you'd call strategy, and that's nonexistent in this game. why? because it was simplified.
oh and i think we can all agree, trash mobs are trash mobs and apart from a few instances, there is no real strategy needed in FF13 or any FF preceding it.
[QUOTE="Khadaj32"][QUOTE="frostybanana"] it's not about the length of the cutscenes, it's the frequency. the fact is you walk for 5-10 minutes fighting battles and then there's another cutscene. when the cutscenes are so frequent that it rivals the time actually spent playing the game, there is a problem. and it is light on gameplay in that regard. this is not about whether the system is fun or whether it's in depth. it's about actually playing the game, and the ratio of gameplay to cutscene is absurd. that being said, i didn't say the gameplay wasn't fun. as far as being hands on, i disagree as well. the game is largely automated and while you do control paradigms and things of that nature, it's not a saving grace for a rather simplistic system that basically tells you what to do for every fight.frostybanana
The frequency means nothing, as most of them are about 2-3 minutes long, with the longer ones only hitting around 5 minutes at the end of chapters are important story moments.
And how can you disagree with Paradigm being hands on? How far are you? I find the frantic Protection > Evened Odds > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Delta Attack way of frantically switching to the right Paradigm at the right time very involved. And simplistic? How? Is it any more simplistic than pressing the X button a dozen times per fight to have your party members simply attack, then move on? Even controlling all party members and choosing their attacks is far more simplistic than being able to control 3 at the same time with a strategy shift.
like i said, the frequency of cutscenes means something when it takes over a game. and such is they case. and obviously you don't quite understand what i mean by hands on. consider that paradigms gives all your characters a role and a specific skill list. a synergist is for buffing and debuffing, medic is for heals, commando is for physical damage and so on. in past games you are the one who decides what character would play what role based on their stats (by the way, you have 3 stats the whole game which leaves you out of the loop in terms of stacking) and you PLAY that role during combat. having the computer do everything for you, in my eyes, is simplifying the game. micromanaging is not a nuisance, it's a welcome attribute to the strategy of the game. i totally understand why it was done. it style-lizes the game, makes it more fast paced. that doesn't change the fact that the computer decides what's best for the party as opposed to you. in that way, the game is dumbed down for a wider range of audience. being fast paced does not = complexity. it just means you have to think quicker, which todays gamers have no trouble doing considering the games that are out nowadays. not just in combat, but out of combat as well. stacking numbers and abilities that fit to your liking for any boss fights or anything is what you'd call strategy, and that's nonexistent in this game. why? because it was simplified.Ehhh, I gotta disagree. I would say FFXII's combat was simplistic, once you got the hang of Gambits. Then you can just wander around the countryside, allowing your party to act accordingly to preset strategies made in the menu beforehand. You really don't need to differ from that, only taking manual control of the party if something nasty happens (your healer dies or gets silenced) and the like.
FFXIII is different, though. In a genre that's evolving with a party-approach in mind, particularly with the amount of MMO's being released, controlling a party based on archetype is a fresh step for a solo game. And XIII does it really well, by not being oversimplistic. The stats may be simplistic, but I really don't want an FF game with 12 different stats that need careful thought for stacking percentages. 6 archetypes is more than enough to give it fresh strategy, while still maintaining the small group trying to save the world feel of Final Fantasy.
The combat is not simplistic, as the later fights demonstrate. Yes, the computer takes control of the specific actions, but its your strategy that instigates it. And it's ever-changing, unlike XII. Saying that they did it for solely more action based combat sounds more like Resonance of Fate than FFXIII, to be honest. I find it very hands on when you're against a badass beastie that takes a while to stagger, therefore requiring constant shifts to buff, debuff, heal, heal with a tank, cautiously attack, and launching an all-out attack, all while keeping the mobs' chain gauge in mind, and that's what I find interesting, and very hands-on. Maybe not technically "hands-on", but more "mind-on", cause let's face it, this is really the first Final Fantasy where your mind is constantly working in a fight, beyond "Oh hey, that thing is weak against Ice. *Blizzard*" Sorry, that's not strategy or complexity, just because you're controlling the action of your party casting Blizzard.
like i said, the frequency of cutscenes means something when it takes over a game. and such is they case. and obviously you don't quite understand what i mean by hands on. consider that paradigms gives all your characters a role and a specific skill list. a synergist is for buffing and debuffing, medic is for heals, commando is for physical damage and so on. in past games you are the one who decides what character would play what role based on their stats (by the way, you have 3 stats the whole game which leaves you out of the loop in terms of stacking) and you PLAY that role during combat. having the computer do everything for you, in my eyes, is simplifying the game. micromanaging is not a nuisance, it's a welcome attribute to the strategy of the game. i totally understand why it was done. it style-lizes the game, makes it more fast paced. that doesn't change the fact that the computer decides what's best for the party as opposed to you. in that way, the game is dumbed down for a wider range of audience. being fast paced does not = complexity. it just means you have to think quicker, which todays gamers have no trouble doing considering the games that are out nowadays. not just in combat, but out of combat as well. stacking numbers and abilities that fit to your liking for any boss fights or anything is what you'd call strategy, and that's nonexistent in this game. why? because it was simplified.[QUOTE="frostybanana"][QUOTE="Khadaj32"]
The frequency means nothing, as most of them are about 2-3 minutes long, with the longer ones only hitting around 5 minutes at the end of chapters are important story moments.
And how can you disagree with Paradigm being hands on? How far are you? I find the frantic Protection > Evened Odds > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Relentless Assault > Combat Clinic > Delta Attack way of frantically switching to the right Paradigm at the right time very involved. And simplistic? How? Is it any more simplistic than pressing the X button a dozen times per fight to have your party members simply attack, then move on? Even controlling all party members and choosing their attacks is far more simplistic than being able to control 3 at the same time with a strategy shift.
Khadaj32
Ehhh, I gotta disagree. I would say FFXII's combat was simplistic, once you got the hang of Gambits. Then you can just wander around the countryside, allowing your party to act accordingly to preset strategies made in the menu beforehand. You really don't need to differ from that, only taking manual control of the party if something nasty happens (your healer dies or gets silenced) and the like.
FFXIII is different, though. In a genre that's evolving with a party-approach in mind, particularly with the amount of MMO's being released, controlling a party based on archetype is a fresh step for a solo game. And XIII does it really well, by not being oversimplistic. The stats may be simplistic, but I really don't want an FF game with 12 different stats that need careful thought for stacking percentages. 6 archetypes is more than enough to give it fresh strategy, while still maintaining the small group trying to save the world feel of Final Fantasy.
The combat is not simplistic, as the later fights demonstrate. Yes, the computer takes control of the specific actions, but its your strategy that instigates it. And it's ever-changing, unlike XII. Saying that they did it for solely more action based combat sounds more like Resonance of Fate than FFXIII, to be honest. I find it very hands on when you're against a badass beastie that takes a while to stagger, therefore requiring constant shifts to buff, debuff, heal, heal with a tank, cautiously attack, and launching an all-out attack, all while keeping the mobs' chain gauge in mind, and that's what I find interesting, and very hands-on. Maybe not technically "hands-on", but more "mind-on", cause let's face it, this is really the first Final Fantasy where your mind is constantly working in a fight, beyond "Oh hey, that thing is weak against Ice. *Blizzard*" Sorry, that's not strategy or complexity, just because you're controlling the action of your party casting Blizzard.
i think you're generalizing the strategy a bit for past FFs. it's bit more than, oh you're weak against blizzard so i'll cast that. it's more like casting reflect in a battle because you know the boss casts zombie, and then proceeding to throw all your potions at the boss. why is that better than what FF13 does? because you actually have to think of that. the computer never tells you what to do, nor does it automatically give you the magic ability reflect. it's all based on you and how you can think of a way to beat the boss. and that's not the ONLY way to beat the boss. and i didn't like FF12, i should mention. i thought it was boring and the combat system, while inventive, wasn't slick or style-lized enough. and i thought the story was piss-poor. generalizing a certain classes that buff or heal or attack isn't inventive at all. and borrowing elements from mmos is just downright lazy. while they wouldn't just take ALL of the strategy out and making the game ridiculously easy, the fact is it's fairly easy to make group compositions and switch between them based on your needs. another thing is you don't have to worry about outside variables such as MP. you can cure and debuff and all that good stuff all you want. again, they didn't want a largely complex system to appeal to a larger fanbase that they felt didn't want to have to micromanage. and that's fine, but from a RPGers standpoint, I think it's a shame.[QUOTE="Khadaj32"][QUOTE="frostybanana"] like i said, the frequency of cutscenes means something when it takes over a game. and such is they case. and obviously you don't quite understand what i mean by hands on. consider that paradigms gives all your characters a role and a specific skill list. a synergist is for buffing and debuffing, medic is for heals, commando is for physical damage and so on. in past games you are the one who decides what character would play what role based on their stats (by the way, you have 3 stats the whole game which leaves you out of the loop in terms of stacking) and you PLAY that role during combat. having the computer do everything for you, in my eyes, is simplifying the game. micromanaging is not a nuisance, it's a welcome attribute to the strategy of the game. i totally understand why it was done. it style-lizes the game, makes it more fast paced. that doesn't change the fact that the computer decides what's best for the party as opposed to you. in that way, the game is dumbed down for a wider range of audience. being fast paced does not = complexity. it just means you have to think quicker, which todays gamers have no trouble doing considering the games that are out nowadays. not just in combat, but out of combat as well. stacking numbers and abilities that fit to your liking for any boss fights or anything is what you'd call strategy, and that's nonexistent in this game. why? because it was simplified.frostybanana
Ehhh, I gotta disagree. I would say FFXII's combat was simplistic, once you got the hang of Gambits. Then you can just wander around the countryside, allowing your party to act accordingly to preset strategies made in the menu beforehand. You really don't need to differ from that, only taking manual control of the party if something nasty happens (your healer dies or gets silenced) and the like.
FFXIII is different, though. In a genre that's evolving with a party-approach in mind, particularly with the amount of MMO's being released, controlling a party based on archetype is a fresh step for a solo game. And XIII does it really well, by not being oversimplistic. The stats may be simplistic, but I really don't want an FF game with 12 different stats that need careful thought for stacking percentages. 6 archetypes is more than enough to give it fresh strategy, while still maintaining the small group trying to save the world feel of Final Fantasy.
The combat is not simplistic, as the later fights demonstrate. Yes, the computer takes control of the specific actions, but its your strategy that instigates it. And it's ever-changing, unlike XII. Saying that they did it for solely more action based combat sounds more like Resonance of Fate than FFXIII, to be honest. I find it very hands on when you're against a badass beastie that takes a while to stagger, therefore requiring constant shifts to buff, debuff, heal, heal with a tank, cautiously attack, and launching an all-out attack, all while keeping the mobs' chain gauge in mind, and that's what I find interesting, and very hands-on. Maybe not technically "hands-on", but more "mind-on", cause let's face it, this is really the first Final Fantasy where your mind is constantly working in a fight, beyond "Oh hey, that thing is weak against Ice. *Blizzard*" Sorry, that's not strategy or complexity, just because you're controlling the action of your party casting Blizzard.
i think you're generalizing the strategy a bit for past FFs. it's bit more than, oh you're weak against blizzard so i'll cast that. it's more like casting reflect in a battle because you know the boss casts zombie, and then proceeding to throw all your potions at the boss. why is that better than what FF13 does? because you actually have to think of that. the computer never tells you what to do, nor does it automatically give you the magic ability reflect. it's all based on you and how you can think of a way to beat the boss. and that's not the ONLY way to beat the boss. and i didn't like FF12, i should mention. i thought it was boring and the combat system, while inventive, wasn't slick or style-lized enough. and i thought the story was piss-poor. generalizing a certain classes that buff or heal or attack isn't inventive at all. and borrowing elements from mmos is just downright lazy. while they wouldn't just take ALL of the strategy out and making the game ridiculously easy, the fact is it's fairly easy to make group compositions and switch between them based on your needs. another thing is you don't have to worry about outside variables such as MP. you can cure and debuff and all that good stuff all you want. again, they didn't want a largely complex system to appeal to a larger fanbase that they felt didn't want to have to micromanage. and that's fine, but from a RPGers standpoint, I think it's a shame.You mentioned the lack of the MP variable. Can you imagine XIII's combat with MP? I mean, thank god they took it out. Sure, an infinite mana pool simplifies the battles to the point where you only have to worry about your health bars, the mobs, and the chain gauge, and it's a fresh change. The Reflect > Potion strat may have to come from the player, but it isn't exactly original. How any times have we seen:
Reflect/Zombie > Pots/Cure, or the almighty Phoenix Down KO
Exploiting elemental weakness to do insane amounts of damage (XIII has elemental weakness, but it doesn't win a fight for you)
Dispel > Attack > Dispel when rebuffs are cast
Status Attacks. A frenzy of removing them from the party (Ochu, Malboro) Now, FFXIII makes it interesting by requiring you to remove them while maintaining a chain gauge. If you approach the fights for efficient DPS, then how you handle your parties welfare while maintaining a chan gauge is very important, and often difficult to determine. Combat Clinic is a lifesaver, but it often means a reset chain gauge, unless you're quick, or the enemy is slow. I just find it interesting to manage the party correctly while still retaining the upper hand in battle. I suppose it's just a matter of opinion; in-depth and strategic, or shallow and predictable. All I know is that I look forward to getting into a battle when I pop XIII into my PS3, and I really haven't had that feeling from an RPG in a long time.
Oh, um, right. The topic. FFXIII. White Knight Chronicles is decent, and while it has a nifty online mode, it utterly collapses on itself once it turns into a grindfest of the same mission hundreds (literally) of times, just to improve your Guild Rank to take on more missions. Unfortunately, the trophies pretty much demand this, so trophy hunters might wanna steer clear of WKC. I think it did a great job as potential for the series, if Level 5 fix the problems for the sequel while adding in a few much-needed aspects, WKC2 has the potential to be fantastic.
However...they still should have just made Rogue Galaxy 2 or a straight up Dark Cloud 3.
i think you're generalizing the strategy a bit for past FFs. it's bit more than, oh you're weak against blizzard so i'll cast that. it's more like casting reflect in a battle because you know the boss casts zombie, and then proceeding to throw all your potions at the boss. why is that better than what FF13 does? because you actually have to think of that. the computer never tells you what to do, nor does it automatically give you the magic ability reflect. it's all based on you and how you can think of a way to beat the boss. and that's not the ONLY way to beat the boss. and i didn't like FF12, i should mention. i thought it was boring and the combat system, while inventive, wasn't slick or style-lized enough. and i thought the story was piss-poor. generalizing a certain classes that buff or heal or attack isn't inventive at all. and borrowing elements from mmos is just downright lazy. while they wouldn't just take ALL of the strategy out and making the game ridiculously easy, the fact is it's fairly easy to make group compositions and switch between them based on your needs. another thing is you don't have to worry about outside variables such as MP. you can cure and debuff and all that good stuff all you want. again, they didn't want a largely complex system to appeal to a larger fanbase that they felt didn't want to have to micromanage. and that's fine, but from a RPGers standpoint, I think it's a shame.[QUOTE="frostybanana"][QUOTE="Khadaj32"]
Ehhh, I gotta disagree. I would say FFXII's combat was simplistic, once you got the hang of Gambits. Then you can just wander around the countryside, allowing your party to act accordingly to preset strategies made in the menu beforehand. You really don't need to differ from that, only taking manual control of the party if something nasty happens (your healer dies or gets silenced) and the like.
FFXIII is different, though. In a genre that's evolving with a party-approach in mind, particularly with the amount of MMO's being released, controlling a party based on archetype is a fresh step for a solo game. And XIII does it really well, by not being oversimplistic. The stats may be simplistic, but I really don't want an FF game with 12 different stats that need careful thought for stacking percentages. 6 archetypes is more than enough to give it fresh strategy, while still maintaining the small group trying to save the world feel of Final Fantasy.
The combat is not simplistic, as the later fights demonstrate. Yes, the computer takes control of the specific actions, but its your strategy that instigates it. And it's ever-changing, unlike XII. Saying that they did it for solely more action based combat sounds more like Resonance of Fate than FFXIII, to be honest. I find it very hands on when you're against a badass beastie that takes a while to stagger, therefore requiring constant shifts to buff, debuff, heal, heal with a tank, cautiously attack, and launching an all-out attack, all while keeping the mobs' chain gauge in mind, and that's what I find interesting, and very hands-on. Maybe not technically "hands-on", but more "mind-on", cause let's face it, this is really the first Final Fantasy where your mind is constantly working in a fight, beyond "Oh hey, that thing is weak against Ice. *Blizzard*" Sorry, that's not strategy or complexity, just because you're controlling the action of your party casting Blizzard.
Khadaj32
You mentioned the lack of the MP variable. Can you imagine XIII's combat with MP? I mean, thank god they took it out. Sure, an infinite mana pool simplifies the battles to the point where you only have to worry about your health bars, the mobs, and the chain gauge, and it's a fresh change. The Reflect > Potion strat may have to come from the player, but it isn't exactly original. How any times have we seen:
Reflect/Zombie > Pots/Cure, or the almighty Phoenix Down KO
Exploiting elemental weakness to do insane amounts of damage (XIII has elemental weakness, but it doesn't win a fight for you)
Dispel > Attack > Dispel when rebuffs are cast
Status Attacks. A frenzy of removing them from the party (Ochu, Malboro) Now, FFXIII makes it interesting by requiring you to remove them while maintaining a chain gauge. If you approach the fights for efficient DPS, then how you handle your parties welfare while maintaining a chan gauge is very important, and often difficult to determine. Combat Clinic is a lifesaver, but it often means a reset chain gauge, unless you're quick, or the enemy is slow. I just find it interesting to manage the party correctly while still retaining the upper hand in battle. I suppose it's just a matter of opinion; in-depth and strategic, or shallow and predictable. All I know is that I look forward to getting into a battle when I pop XIII into my PS3, and I really haven't had that feeling from an RPG in a long time.
Oh, um, right. The topic. FFXIII. White Knight Chronicles is decent, and while it has a nifty online mode, it utterly collapses on itself once it turns into a grindfest of the same mission hundreds (literally) of times, just to improve your Guild Rank to take on more missions. Unfortunately, the trophies pretty much demand this, so trophy hunters might wanna steer clear of WKC. I think it did a great job as potential for the series, if Level 5 fix the problems for the sequel while adding in a few much-needed aspects, WKC2 has the potential to be fantastic.
However...they still should have just made Rogue Galaxy 2 or a straight up Dark Cloud 3.
well note that i've never called it a bad game. the system was designed so random battles would be less tedious without sacrificing too much of the strategy, something I feel like they missed on. i attack it's faults because it irritates me when people call it the best FF ever and things along those lines, because it's not. in fact i probably wouldn't place it in the top 5 because as a total RPG, it's lacking those vital RPG elements that old school players wanted, and in that way, it's a bit of a letdown. but then again, i really shouldn't have expected much because i haven't like an FF since Final Fantasy 10. which is notably when Squaresoft became Square-Enix but that's a topic for another day. oh and i like FF13 but i don't love it. it's a solid 8.5 to me because the battle system, while i think it's pretty simplified is actually pretty fun.[QUOTE="Khadaj32"][QUOTE="frostybanana"] i think you're generalizing the strategy a bit for past FFs. it's bit more than, oh you're weak against blizzard so i'll cast that. it's more like casting reflect in a battle because you know the boss casts zombie, and then proceeding to throw all your potions at the boss. why is that better than what FF13 does? because you actually have to think of that. the computer never tells you what to do, nor does it automatically give you the magic ability reflect. it's all based on you and how you can think of a way to beat the boss. and that's not the ONLY way to beat the boss. and i didn't like FF12, i should mention. i thought it was boring and the combat system, while inventive, wasn't slick or style-lized enough. and i thought the story was piss-poor. generalizing a certain classes that buff or heal or attack isn't inventive at all. and borrowing elements from mmos is just downright lazy. while they wouldn't just take ALL of the strategy out and making the game ridiculously easy, the fact is it's fairly easy to make group compositions and switch between them based on your needs. another thing is you don't have to worry about outside variables such as MP. you can cure and debuff and all that good stuff all you want. again, they didn't want a largely complex system to appeal to a larger fanbase that they felt didn't want to have to micromanage. and that's fine, but from a RPGers standpoint, I think it's a shame.frostybanana
You mentioned the lack of the MP variable. Can you imagine XIII's combat with MP? I mean, thank god they took it out. Sure, an infinite mana pool simplifies the battles to the point where you only have to worry about your health bars, the mobs, and the chain gauge, and it's a fresh change. The Reflect > Potion strat may have to come from the player, but it isn't exactly original. How any times have we seen:
Reflect/Zombie > Pots/Cure, or the almighty Phoenix Down KO
Exploiting elemental weakness to do insane amounts of damage (XIII has elemental weakness, but it doesn't win a fight for you)
Dispel > Attack > Dispel when rebuffs are cast
Status Attacks. A frenzy of removing them from the party (Ochu, Malboro) Now, FFXIII makes it interesting by requiring you to remove them while maintaining a chain gauge. If you approach the fights for efficient DPS, then how you handle your parties welfare while maintaining a chan gauge is very important, and often difficult to determine. Combat Clinic is a lifesaver, but it often means a reset chain gauge, unless you're quick, or the enemy is slow. I just find it interesting to manage the party correctly while still retaining the upper hand in battle. I suppose it's just a matter of opinion; in-depth and strategic, or shallow and predictable. All I know is that I look forward to getting into a battle when I pop XIII into my PS3, and I really haven't had that feeling from an RPG in a long time.
Oh, um, right. The topic. FFXIII. White Knight Chronicles is decent, and while it has a nifty online mode, it utterly collapses on itself once it turns into a grindfest of the same mission hundreds (literally) of times, just to improve your Guild Rank to take on more missions. Unfortunately, the trophies pretty much demand this, so trophy hunters might wanna steer clear of WKC. I think it did a great job as potential for the series, if Level 5 fix the problems for the sequel while adding in a few much-needed aspects, WKC2 has the potential to be fantastic.
However...they still should have just made Rogue Galaxy 2 or a straight up Dark Cloud 3.
well note that i've never called it a bad game. the system was designed so random battles would be less tedious without sacrificing too much of the strategy, something I feel like they missed on. i attack it's faults because it irritates me when people call it the best FF ever and things along those lines, because it's not. in fact i probably wouldn't place it in the top 5 because as a total RPG, it's lacking those vital RPG elements that old school players wanted, and in that way, it's a bit of a letdown. but then again, i really shouldn't have expected much because i haven't like an FF since Final Fantasy 10. which is notably when Squaresoft became Square-Enix but that's a topic for another day. oh and i like FF13 but i don't love it. it's a solid 8.5 to me because the battle system, while i think it's pretty simplified is actually pretty fun.Oh, it's not the best Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy VI still holds that place in my heart for me. I've enjoyed them all, X, XII, and XIII included, but none have touched the magic that was VI.
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