Supreme Court sides with religious groups in covid fight

@mrbojangles25: You're on a video game forum. If an opinion bothers you as so, it's time for reflection and stepping away from the keyboard.

I'd say it's more like the Stasi of East Germany. The way he's trying to manipulate families through institutional means is right out of their playbook

…the Stasi often used a method which was really diabolic. It was called "Zersetzung". The word is difficult to translate because it means originally "biodegradation." But actually, it's a quite accurate description. The goal was to destroy secretly the self-confidence of people, damaging their reputation, organizing failures in their work, and by destroying their personal relationships. The Stasi didn't try to arrest every dissident. It preferred to paralyze them, and it could do so because it had access to so much personal information and to so many institutions.

Hubertus Knabe, German historian

"Weapon"

This is to protect everyone else at the school and the relatives of everyone that attends the school. You framing a common sense health precaution as a "weapon" is a terrible thing to do. The school is not harming the parents in any way; the parents (which for the sake of argument lets assume are lucid, self-sustaining and self-determining adults) chose to have gatherings in direct contradiction of all official medical experts, and the school is simply stating that the students are to stay home if that was what happened.

Obviously, it would have been better if the gatherings would not have taken place, but if it did, the school must absolutely protect its students, staff, and community. The parents can still tell their children to lie to the school, and willingly lead to harm to their community; this is the least the school can ask.

Under no circumstances should government ever manipulate children to be used against their parents. These ends do not justify those means. That is an absolutely disgusting idea and anyone who tries to justify that are disgusting people as well. But I do not expect anybody on the left to have a sense of decency.

True but that is not something to brag about.
There is second and third world countries doing better.

Get sick and die, it's what Jesus would do.

no. it seems that you want a one sided court system then. one that not fair or balanced . you want a authoritarian one.

It's almost like you don't even know the SUSPENSION CLAUSE even exists.

Suspension Clause Law and Legal Definition

The suspension clause is a clause in the U.S. Constitution that protects the privilege of the writ of habeas corpus by not allowing to suspend the writ once issued. Likewise, suspension of the writ is permissible only on exceptional cases like rebellion or when it would amount to invasion of public safety. This clause is referred under USCS Const. Art. I, § 9, Cl 2. This clause reads as:

“The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it”.

So, how is Covid an invasion or rebellion exactly?

Activists are neither fair, nor balanced. The job of an SC judge is to uphold the constitution and any judge who votes against it isn't doing their job. This isn't democrat vs republican, they are supposed to be above that and rule by the letter of written law, not by their opinion or feelings. Four judges failed to do that.

ah so now not allow woman to vote or black people . oh and a president for life no term limit and 24 ,25.

you really do .

what your saying is not allow woman or black people, unlimited term limits for prez,taxs at the polls....

you really do like facisim then.

no one and i mean no one will defend what you just said.

You know the Constitution is interpreted by judges. But I mostly wanted to come here and point out the hypocrisy of a trump supporter wrapping themselves in the Constitution after the last four they spent cheering on his attempts at destruction of said laws contained therein.

That doesn't mean judges have full reign to interpret it however they feel like. The constitution is the supreme law of the land, and there's nothing judges can even do about it legally or morally. And there is no hypocrisy here except yours. You know, the side that wants to "re-educate" millions of people, use children against their parents, ban church gatherings, ban guns, and who believe people like Kavanaugh have to prove their innocents when the left fails to prove his guilt. All extremely anti-constitutional and par for the course for the left. So, don't ever make an attempt to lecture me on the constitution, you simply do not have any ground to stand on.

So you would be okay with walking back the second for it's intent.......militia?

I mean, I'm not religious and have only been in churches for a funeral, but this decision seems sound to me. The selection of what is shut down and isn't seems to be based, in many cases, on an axis of "I care about this/don't care about this" rather than any actual notion of essentiality. To the best of my knowledge it's literally the job of the supreme court to prevent this type of arbitrary application of laws. If they want to shut down churches but keep strip clubs, bars, and restaurants open, there is a clear double standard at work.

Frankly, it seems like many people use that same axis for these types of decisions. Some dude sitting in a bar or a strip club is likely saying "Yeah, Church isn't essential" right now. Sadly, I see many of the most judgmental people over Covid indiscretions doing countless things which aren't necessary and, even if ever so slightly, up risk of spread and transmission.

Which is defined by the founders as the whole of the people. We've been over this, I've given you quotes from the founders themselves, things written in the federalist papers that back it, and all of these things are admissible in court when the Supreme Court makes ruling to uphold the constitution. Every time you try to open your mouth and talk on matters of the constitution, your foot goes right in. You lack even the most basic, elementary education on the subject. It's sad.

These people often forget the right to practice your religion as you see fit, believe what you want, to assemble, and free speech are all part of the same amendment in the bill of rights as the right to protest. That means if it WAS possible to shut down peoples rights out of fear, governors could then legally shut down any peaceful protest they choose for the time being. Those same governors made the lame ass reach that those people are exempt from Covid restrictions because they're exercising 1A rights, but seem to fail to realize that's what religious people are doing as well. It's a double standard and as you said, it absolutely targets specific groups because of how that double standard is applied.

Just take away there tax exempt status if any church decides to open. Watch them all stay closed when you mess with money.

Does that include bars, restaurants, and gyms having penalties for opening?

I mean less religious people is a good thing.

Anyone who thinks government has the right to, and should shut down church services over Covid had better be consistent to apply that standard equally, and call for the shutting down of peaceful protest as well.

All those places already pay taxes. And this ruling is only about churches so what are you talking about?

Less bigots is better.

What didn't you understand about penalties?

Religion can have the same effect on people. Your statement no one gets COVID by going out and getting a bottle of tequila or a few grams of cannabis is false. Do you have a source? Seems you only agree with things being open that you agree with. Also as long as they socially distance in the church and wear a mask shouldn't that be enough. Seems you are okay with people doing this in riots and protest.

Supreme court was 100% correct on this ruling.

That's the originalist view, isn't it?

@LJS9502_basic: People in general.

My point

Your head

If we cannot have religious entities open then we can't have bars/restaurants open. FYI the cases we have are indeed shown to be from the latter. You have to be fair even in a pandemic. I don't care if the churches etc have to be closed for awhile but the same sure as hell should apply to bars, restaurants, salons, gyms etc.

So tell me, what religion do bars and restaurants belong to exactly? You do understand the freedom of religion is in the constitution, right? You know, the thing you only pretend to care about when it's convenient for you to lie about it?

Do you really think you have a firm understanding of American voting laws of the time? Do you really want to go there?

@horgen: you could say that.

This can't be serious. You have absolutely no clue what I just said but you want to argue it.

You think everything should be closed down with no exceptions, that's not a secret, you've said it. You're attempting to use some restaurants being closed down as an excuse to close down religious services. But one of these is protected by the constitution, the only argument you might be able to make for bars and restaurants is the freedom to assemble. Personally, I don't think any businesses should be shut down, the concept is beyond stupid, and based in fear and emotion, not in any actual fact.

@LJS9502_basic:

My point

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Your sense of humour

@ghost_of_phobos: I wasn't posting any humor.

But gyms and bars have been closed. Restaurants are restricted but can stay open because people need to eat. The Supreme Court just ruled that ny can't close or restrict churches at all. My solution is just say they all have to pay state taxes if they refuse to close. They should be paying taxes anyway.

Everything can't be fair because a grocery store is way different than a church/gym. One is necessary and one isn't.

I asked a yes or no question.

Not true.

Rather a pointless endeavor to engage in discussion with that user. He misrepresents everything you say.

Covid? I was responding to your false statement, just because it was easy.

Opinions don't bother me, and no one has really offended me on here. Outraged, sure, but not offended or taken personally. It's when opinions masquerade as fact, dictate policy, and they impact my life, or the lives of those around me, that I grow a bit concerned. In this specific example, faith would be that opinion.

Abortion laws, anti-vaxxers citing religious reasons, kids dying under their parents' watch (from curable ailments) because their religion forbids certain procedures...these are all things we still debate in this country and it's frankly barbaric. We've had measles outbreaks in the US, and that shit was all but extinct.

It's not so much that religious opinions do great harm, it's more that they prevent great good. My best friend is Catholic, I'm godfather to his son....I see how important religion is on a personal and local level I don't want to take that away from anyone of any faith, but that's as far as it should go: local, and personal.

In my opinion, of course.

Please explain. It sounds like you are saying going to church is as necessary as buying groceries, but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

Bars and gyms aren't closed.

They are where I live. Though, yes, I've heard they are open elsewhere at times.

Maybe that's the issue, too much variation in policy.

They are closed were I live at. I'm unemployed because of it.

That's been the problem from the start. No central government policy. In fact, the central government policy was to ignore it. Politicize it. Breed hate.

Plenty of democrat governors have said Trump doesn't have any such authority. Also the most worst off states are those states that had all those stupid little rules and restrictions that you've convinced yourself would magically be successful if they were forced upon all states. The federal government policy was to let governors tailor a response that they felt was better suited to their own states. But, you knew all of this, I've told you it many times before.

You use a very small strawman to attack religion. Most people who are against abortion are not against it for religious reasons. Most people against vaccines, again, are so not due to religious reasons, and this idea there's a lot of people dying because parents prefer to use prayer than cancer treatments is an extremely rare case. Trying to make it sound like this is what most religious people believe or do is not only extremely prejudice, it's factually incorrect. And no, I'm not religious, just calling out bullcrap where I see it, and am more tolerant towards different beliefs than the left seems to be. Like Cuomo, you're using Covid as an excuse to go after religious people with no valid reason for doing so besides your own bias against them. Most people who do go to a church practice all the precautions that your media has been telling them would keep them safe.

Fair enough, but I felt this way long before COVID.

And I don't need any excuses to show why religion plays too much of a role in American society, politics, and law. Plenty of evidence out there.