To punish Mexico, Trump rocks American stocks, raises prices on American consumers

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/31/us-stock-futures-fall-after-trump-announces-new-tariffs-on-mexico.html

Somehow making goods more expensive in America will solve illegal immigration.

I know why Trump lost billions of dollars in a year. He has no basic understanding of economics.

Illegal immigration is now higher than it was when Obama left office. Good job Trump!!!

Also we are close to reaching the point when majority of illegals are crossing from Canada.

Those caravans sure are scary!!!

This is purely a diversion from the speech Mueller made. However, it’s implications are far more serious.

From now, America is increasingly known as the country that signs trade deals but backs out of them within months.

It is a poor signal to China. Even if China caved in to Trump’s demands (which it will not), Trump will simply raise tariffs again for other reasons.

Trump is also seeking to renegotiate trade deals with Europe, Japan, South Korea and the UK if it leaves the European Union.

Under the Trump administration, he has also backed out of the Paris Agreement on climate change.

It also backed out of the Iran deal, which was signed by Europe, China and Russia.

Iran abided by the terms and conditions of the agreement allowing inspectors (24/7) into their country. It would have prevented Iran from attaining a nuclear weapon.

Donald Trump is hurting America. American farmers are suffering, companies related to solar panels are hurting plus the other industries that support these sectors.

Inflation will surely rise in the US due to these tariffs and therefore all Americans will be poorer as a result.

As each person becomes poorer they spend less and therefore the US economy weakens.

Trump is basically America’s cancer.

Any deal signed by the US under the Trump administration isn't worth the paper it's written on. Not a good look for any country.

I feel sorry for the next president that has to clean up Trumps mess....

I feel like most of the world is just waiting until the elections and hoping the US will be back to normal after this.

@phbz: the United States has lost a lot of respect and status in the world.

It's what happens when people vote for a senile zero experience president

i'm getting really tired of losing tens of thousands of dollars in worth because of this fucking twat president

As long as he's "owning the libtards", who cares, right?

@rmpumper: that's the only thing he can run on in 2020.

He's failed on every single campaign issue he ran on in 2016.

So his plan to stop people from crossing the border looking for work is to increase prices so Mexican companies will make less money and thus lay off workers so they'll have to cross the border looking for work.

How clever of him.

trumps favorite weapon

@Treflis: it just makes goods from Mexico cost more to the consumer. It's doesn't cost Mexico anything unless people stop buying, which we literally can't do.

Our entire auto and manufacturing industry is based on Mexican goods.

Thats why the Chinese tariffs have been such a failure.

China simply stopped buying American goods, and we keep buying Chinese goods. Now our trade deficit with China is the largest in history.

@Nuck81: The only concern is that Trump opened the US to future (even more) radical presidents, since it because obvious that there's a huge chunk of Americans that are completely ok with having him as president. Until him the idea that a big percentage of Americans had fascist tendencies was always countered with the argument that it was just a vocal minority. Now it became clear that it was not and probably others will try to push it further, unless next election voters say a clear no. The advantage of a democracy is that soon he will be gone, unless he wins again and then the message is clear. Specially to Europe, right now between Putin and Trump and their anti EU agenda, it's time to move to on.

But if things return to normal Trump will be nothing but a fart in the wind and rednecks will return to their holes. And let's be honest, while he's terrible he's no Hitler. He's just the symbol of an old way that's diyng.

But for sure I'll miss stuff like "freedom molecules". Surreal.

He's planning to run on healthcare in 2020 :D

I'm tired of all this winning.

You're right. Obama's apology tour and him pretty much shitting on Israel left us in bad standing. Trump is building bridges and friendships again.

@n64dd: you brought up Obama? How boring. Step it up kid

Is that all you have left? trump is eroding confidence in the US. And in the vacuum someone will step up. Are you okay with following the lead of other countries?

That will soon be asked as soon as the 5th Avenue Massacre occurs. I know I bring this up a lot, but that's how f***ed this nation is now.

You trying to become our new Zaryia and become the champ in posting the most pointless threads about Trump?

Something needs to be done about the unfair practice there is with Mexico and other 3rd world countries. and while Tariffs hurt they hurt on both sides and they are a necessary evil so while we in a booming economy may have slight discomfort, the other side will hurt a lot more and it´s just a question of how soon they will buckle not if they will.

@Jacanuk: if you don't like it why did you reply? You have nuck Derangement syndrome?

the USA has dropped from first to third in most competitive economies.

Trump's tariffs are making it worse.

https://www.newsweek.com/us-economy-slips-first-third-place-global-competitiveness-ranking-1439659?amp=1&__twitter_impression=true

there's a cost / benefit analysis to be done here which i have not seen from this administration.

you're saying the tariffs will cause "discomfort", a handy euphemism for lower wages, fewer hours, lost jobs, reduced investment, possible push towards economic recession, etc...

what hasn't been made clear is at what cost are the tariffs worth it? it's already been quantified that the tantrum w/ china and now mexico has cost equity markets trillions ( with a T ). estimates are tariffs will have an additional cost of tens of billions in consumer spending losses.

how much is an "unfair practice" in mexico worth in lost jobs / wages / wealth to the us? $100B, $2T? $10T?

Christ alive is this guy a fucking train wreck. We better pray 2020 kicks this dunce onto the curb where he should've remained from the get-go.

What's so moronic about this is that it enacts policy on a goal that isn't even well defined and appears to be entirely arbitrarily decided with no way to actually quantify. Yes, all illegal immigration must STOP. Ok, and who's to decide by what metric that's to be determined? Gee, I have no clue, so let's just slap on tariffs for the hell of it, and keep increasing them until I wake up the next day and decide that this is the new line I'll draw in the sand! Yea, that'll give the appearance of being tough! I don't actually have to do shit except talk tough, enact blanket policy that hurts America, actually will increase the problem of which it's purported to solve, and sit back and have my sycophantic supporters praise my name to the sky because they're too ignorant and dumb to understand the consequences.

This immense stupidity of this makes me suspect this a diversion, another ultimate bluff. The Trump way. Brilliant. But hey, at least it's pissing off the libs!

You're a cartoon.

@MirkoS77: illegal Immigration is worse than now than before Trump took office

Sure there is a C&B to be done and if you look at the cost up until now before Trump, the cost in American jobs and manufacturing plants is already destroying America and Obama made it even worse.

And your "how much question" is stupid, it´s already costing America million if not billions and it´s already cost thousands of jobs

Let´s take an example which we have debated on this forum "Texas and the jobs illegals and legal south Americans take"

Welders and Steel are/is a booming industry and if we look at the wage an avg. an experienced welder can get, around 20-35$ an hour at an average but you can go even higher and of course a bit lower.

But in Texas and in pretty much any state that has a big population of illegals and legal Hispanics, we have a massive problem where if you are a legal American born welder who does not speak Spanish, you are shit out of luck since a lot of companies, of course, would rather hire 100 illegals than 20 legals, and if you are lucky enough to be hired anyways, you have a massive safety risk since most of the people you would with do not speak English, so you have no chance of communicating fast and clear if something goes wrong. Which is what the employers know and why they mostly don´t even hire non-Spanish speaking personal.

And then we, of course, have the wage decrease these people take, they will happily work for 8-10$ an hour and work 10-12-14 hours days and if the company gets raided they pay the fine and pick up 100 more at the local bus station depot because there is plenty to take from.

So this is costing Americans and America thousands of jobs because it´s not just the steel industry it´s happening in almost every industry, and it´s also costing billions in lost wage-income and tax because despite what some Democrats and leftists on this forum want you to believe most do not pay tax and they get paid under the table and a lot is sent back to Mexico,

But let´s turn this question upside down and ask you, what do you suggest we do? are you ok with illegals stealing jobs and money from legal Americans and also are you ok with Americans losing jobs because companies can move in some places a few hours away across the border into Mexico and not only get more workers than they could get in America for a 1/10000th of the wage.

@Jacanuk: I own a business in the oil refinery industry and I can absolutely everything you said about the welders in Texas is 100% false.

There Is work in the permian basis where they are literally hiring anyone that can strike a weld at over $40 an hour regardless of experience.

If you can pass an x-ray you're in. And they are walking the streets handing out fliers to get people to test.

You just stepped into my real.life world, and you have no clue.

Got any facts to back your post up with or do you expect us to just take your word for it?

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/immigration/2018/08/29/north-texas-company-hit-massive-ice-raid-says-labor-shortage-andamericans-not-lining-take-jobs

Load Trail was fined $445,000 in 2014 for employing more than 170 unauthorized immigrants at its plant, according to an ICE report.

@Jacanuk: I have my guys paychecks.

You pulled up one article from 1 company and you think you made a grand point.

You're a clown.

So you have no argument, no facts or evidence to back up your claims.

Got it.

And the last bit, always a clear sign of someone who knows they are wrong when they turn to personal insults when their arguments fail.

Your own link does not support your argument. It supports Nuck's argument.

I will also support Nuck's argument as the very large multinational I work for has the same hiring challenges for skilled technical workers in Texas. I was just in Houston for 3 days this week speaking with many of the senior leaders that work for me and one of the agenda items was workforce and hiring.

I have no idea why you and many others think there are significant issues here related to immigration and employment, when the US is at historically low unemployment levels and a booming economy. There are and always will be minor examples based upon micro regional differences often related to labour mobility and lifestyle choices, etc. But your link is a perfect example of how the reality is the opposite of what you think/state.

@br0kenrabbit: Name calling. I expected nothing less.

You are confused here if you think anything in that link supports Nuck´s random untrue statement.

I even pointed the ICE comment out and that the company itself which is just one of many was clearly full of shit and spun tall tales of only hiring legal Hispanics and paying them absurd high wages

I could also post 100 more links with more and similar proven media stories about illegals but it will be pointless when the other part is clearly just posting their own comments as facts and don´t know that it proves absolute zero.

Trump is making America horrible, so that we're lamer than Mexico so that they won't want to come here.

I have become numb to them you will never be able to get through to them believe me I tried. They will still stick up for Trump even if he takes money out of their pockets it's a cult of personality it's really sad and embarrassing.

sadly that is the mindset of a lot of people.

my best friend is a Trump voter, and this is why he votes for him. I called Trump a "do-nothing president" in front of him and he got a little upset by that; not angry, mind you, just asked me why I feel that way. I said "Well at least if he gets elected a second time, hopefully he will be as useless as the first four years" and my friend didn't really know w hat to say.

This guy, my friend, is a very smart guy. It's not a factor of intelligence when it comes to Trump voters--I think the media has painted them as a bunch of hicks and idiots, and that's not fair or accurate--but a question of how alienated people are by politics, how much they don't want to see the left win. If Hitler, Obama, Biden, or Sanders somehow ran as a GOP candidate, these people would vote for them.

@Jacanuk: I believe your comment that illegal immigrants do take away jobs and it can make a local market unbearable.

I have seen and read this in many parts of the world. It happens in the construction business in the UK.

In China, there are illegal immigrants from Myanmar in some areas, there are also North Koreans in other areas.

They are always willing to undercut the wage causing unemployment.

HOWEVER, the problem is actually the local companies themselves who are behaving unethically by hiring illegal workers.

What is needed is stronger regulation, inspections and ethical business.

I want to use China as an example. The west still thinks there is child labour. In fact, it has largely been wiped out due to monetary fines and imprisonment.

Of course it still exists in remote areas with small outfits, China is a huge country like the US. But if there is a sufficient deterrent it will make a difference.

From your comments and since you are a business owner I think you want to stop illegal immigrants from taking away jobs. You are in the position to set good ethical standards.

I wish you good luck!

Honestly at this point what else is there to do? Trump supporters literally ignore any facts about the president that don't fit their view. What else is there left to do? You simply cannot fight that level of ignorance. There's a big different between ignorance by lack of information, which can be fixed, and ignorance by choosing to not believe facts right in front of your face. There's no fighting that kind of ignorance and that's where America is at right now.

It has been brought up before, but I guess I will say it again. Companies that chooses to hire illegal immigrants needs to pay more than what they saved by hiring these illegal immigrants. All from fines reaching 9 digits and more, to jailing the ones responsible (even if those people now work for another company) to ban the owners of said company from doing anything in that business branch again.

The current system works as intended.

If you want to blame someone blame congress. Neither Republican or Democrat controlled congress and fought every attempt to secure the borders or change the immigration laws. If you really want to do something contact your congressman and tell them to get off their dead ass and do something about the immigration laws and secure the border. I have.

Immigration laws have been changed. If you really want to do something go after the industry.......ie those businesses that hire undocumented individuals.

Again, from his point of view this is not a stupid move in the short term. It forces Mexico to do something, and either way it will be an incentive for companies to move out of Mexico to the USA.

I'm not saying it's a great idea, but it is true that for what he wants to achieve it's not that stupid, right?

I agree that trading with the USA has gotten a different meaning after all the tariffs he raised. I wouldn't be surprised if all this hurts the USA trading position in the long run.

I think it's important for democrats to have a plan for immigration. Because Trump can easily show/make it look like a serious problem for the USA. He is counting on his opposition to deny that there is such a thing as too much (illegal) immigration for a state/country to handle. You will need to have a reassuring answer (not based on denial) as a candidate.

@KungfuKitten: Trump hasn't done anything about illegal immigration except for dick waving.

He is going to run on the exact same issue in 2020, proposing the same exact solutions that did nothing the first four years.

He has no real solution other than using it as a fear monger tool.

Did you also complain about our 211 trillion dollar deficit too?

@Nuck81: You own a oil company but spend your free time posting political nonsense on a video game site?

@joshrmeyer: We all have our reasons for being part of the community. Mine is to gain a better understanding and root out my cognitive dissonance. What's yours? Surely it's not merely that you have nothing else worth doing, right?

@joshrmeyer: who said I own an oil company?

I've been a member of the forum for almost 15 years. A lot can change in a person's life in that time.

We can only 100% agree on that and like in the other threads about this, companies are getting off way to easy for hiring and helping to destroy the free wage-market here.