8th generation = Repeat of the 5th Generation

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TheMisterManGuy

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#1 TheMisterManGuy
Member since 2011 • 264 Posts

Have you noticed that this generation has been eerily familiar to the 32/64-bit generation? In case you don't think so, let's look at the consoles.

PlayStation 4 = PlayStation - After being too overly-ambitious with the PlayStation 3, Sony returned the PlayStation brand to it's roots with the PlayStation 4. A big reason the PlayStation succeeded was because it gave developers and gamers EXACTLY what they wanted. A polished, powerful system that was easy to program for. It wasn't so much about innovation or surprising people, it was more about making something for the developers, and allowing them to make what they want, with very few restrictions. All factors that play into the PS4. But critically, Sony was able to capitalize on the competition's poor decisions, luring former fans of competing platforms into their hands. Speaking of which...

Xbox One = Nintendo 64 - Microsoft enjoyed a lot of success with the Xbox 360, being the go to platform for all the big core gamer blockbusters. However, the Xbox One at first, much like the Nintendo 64 initially, seemed like a disaster. The problem with the Nintendo 64 was that Nintendo stubbornly clung to outdated draconian policies including sticking with the expensive and bulky cartridge format. This pissed off developers who at this point, were already fed up with Nintendo's big bully attitude at the time. While Microsoft's plans with the Xbox One weren't developer controlling, they certainly were gamer controlling. Microsoft initially wanted to come in and dictate it's users over where they can play their games, when they can play them, where they can trade them in, who they could share them with, and how they can play them and how long they can play them for.

This pissed off a lot of gamers who were already weary of the XB1 for being more of a TV box than a games console. But much like how the Nintendo 64 succeeded in the West despite it's limitations, the Xbox One eventually gained a following among gamers after Microsoft scrapped it's initial draconic plans. Though it does have all the major blockbusters, as well as some very popular indie titles, and what is perhaps Microsoft's most refined first party output yet, it still lags behind the PS4 in terms of sales and developer support.

Wii U = Sega Saturn - It's amazing how once successful companies, can spiral out of control in only a couple of years. Nintendo enjoyed success with Wii by going after an audience of newcomers, who never really got into gaming before due to the complex nature of modern games. Sega enjoyed success with the Sega Genesis by targeting an edgier, older demographic than the competition with more mature content. The problem with both, was maintaining a long term relationship with those audiences. Sega's string of gimmicky Genesis add-ons, and the botched launch of the Sega Saturn nuked consumer faith in the company, and caused once Genesis fans, to leave the brand. Sega was seen as a fad, a washed up video game icon that succeeded on the novelty of "kewl", only to have their own arrogance destroy their momentum. Similarly, Nintendo's momentum with the Wii was showing it's age with the rise of mobile gaming and Kinect. Rather than adapt to the changing tastes of their consumers, Nintendo instead released the Wii U, a system which nobody, still to this day, can understand.

Both the Sega Saturn and the Wii U share the same problems of being too expensive, too difficult to develop for, and more complicated than they really should've been. Filled with useless technology, broken promises, conflicting priorities, and abysmal (and non-existant) marketing, the Saturn and U were massive slaps in the face to Wii and Genesis owners respectively. Costing their platform holders hundreds (in Sega's case billions) of dollars, and admiration.

Disappointingly as well, neither platform had a true Sonic game, nor a true 3D Mario respectively. The Saturn instead got a bunch of spin-off games, and the Wii U got an upgraded sequel to a 3DS game with co-op. Not exactly what fans were expecting. All is not doom and gloom however. The Saturn hosted a variety of unique first party offerings from Sega such as Virtua Fighter, Burning Rangers, and the cult classic, Nights into Dreams. Nintendo has also put out solid entries into their Award-Winning first party franchises such as Mario Kart, Smash Brothers, and the groundbreaking shooter, Splatoon. And much like how the Sega Saturn built a surprisingly strong lineup of Japanese 3rd party games, The Wii U gained a cult following with Independent developers, getting most of the big names like Shovel Knight, and Minecraft, as well as some unique exclusives like Runbow. Both of these made up for the otherwise non-existent 3rd party support.

Nintendo Switch = Sega Dreamcast - After the failure of the aforementioned consoles, Nintendo and Sega were given a shake up in management, and with their next platforms, were determined to learn from most of their mistakes. The Sega Dreamcast was the complete opposite of the Saturn, it's hardware was simple, and was easy to program for. It had an excellent first year lineup (despite a lackluster launch lineup in Japan), and initially, had a lot of developers on board. It was also ahead of it's time in several aspect such as built-in online play. In addition, it hosted what is regarded by many as a creative renaissance from Sega. The Dreamcast hosted some of the most innovative, strange, offbeat, and down right creative and relentless first party support that no other platform holder has been able to top before or since. Unfortunately, it was too little, too late. Sega's past failings had already dug the company's financial grave, and the company began making new mistakes such as lack of DVD playback, that held the Dreamcast back. Once the PlayStation 2 got a US release date, it was all over for Sega. Gamers and developers preferred to wait for Sony's new, DVD capable machine, and ignored all the amazing things Sega was bringing to the table. What's especially sad, was that Sony didn't really have to do much of anything. They had all the goodwill of gamers from the PlayStation, and all the love and adoration from third parties to go with it. All they had to do was hype up the system like it was the new masaiah, then sit back and start printing money.

While it's too early to determine the fate of the Nintendo Switch, it already looks to be in a better position than it's predecessor. For starters, the Switch seems like a much more attractive, and better designed device than the Wii U, and combines nearly 30 years of Nintendo hardware into one, simple, and accessible package. The system is easy to develop for, forgoing the outdated PowerPC espresso crap, and needlessly complicated GPGPU nonsense of the Wii U, in favor on much simpler hardware courtesy of Nvidia. It's marketing is much more competent, and while it's launch lineup is bare-bones, the lineup for it's first year as a whole looks pretty solid. On top of this, Nintendo seems to be a much ballsier, more experimental developer than they were a few years ago. From bold reinventions of their classics like The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild and Super Mario Oddyssey. To innovative and casual friendly takes on traditionally daunting genres like Splatoon and ARMS. To truly original ideas like 1-2 Switch and Snipperclips. There are some roadblocks such as it's pricing, and uncertain online features, but none of those are able to detract was is perhaps, Nintendo's best idea for a console in years.

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deactivated-5d6bb9cb2ee20

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#2 deactivated-5d6bb9cb2ee20
Member since 2006 • 82724 Posts

Mario 3D World is absolutely a true 3D Mario game. This false narrative really irks me.

That apart, I do enjoy the analogy you have drawn, with the caveat that the Dreamcast was a 6th gen system.

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Ghosts4ever

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#3 Ghosts4ever
Member since 2015 • 26149 Posts

you forgot PC gaming is now becoming like late 90s and early 00s games when Doom just got reboot and System shock is getting reboot and getting Sequel too. plus old school FPS and CRPGs are back now.

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NathanDrakeSwag

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#4 NathanDrakeSwag
Member since 2013 • 17392 Posts

The Xbone wishes it was the N64. That system had so many amazing exclusives.

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silversix_

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#5 silversix_
Member since 2010 • 26347 Posts

But i loved my N64. The thing had quality stuff. What the Bone has? A 4k bluray player and BC. Xbone has nothing on the N64. Its more of an Ouya if anything.

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#6 FireEmblem_Man
Member since 2004 • 20388 Posts

@TheMisterManGuy: Nintendo is far from the same position like Sega. Big difference is that Nintendo knows how to make money, Sega knows how to burn money. So the dreamcast comparison was dumb for a concke that isn't out yet

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darklight4

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#7 darklight4
Member since 2009 • 2094 Posts

N64 had some games that I would put ahead over current games Goldeneye, Orcarina of Time, Mario 64 and Lylat wars/Starfox 64.

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Telekill

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#9 Telekill
Member since 2003 • 12061 Posts

Pretty good analogy. I hope the best for the Switch but it does feel like Nintendo's Dreamcast. That said, I count Dreamcast as being in the PS2 gen.

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#10 PSP107
Member since 2007 • 18981 Posts

@TheMisterManGuy:

How dare you insult PS1(And N64), PS4/Xone sucks compared to PS1.

PS4/Xone is not even better than 360/PS3 and that's saying something because those systems sucked to compared to the 5th generation.

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#11  Edited By GarGx1
Member since 2011 • 10934 Posts

PS4's success is at the hands of MS's complete failure with the Xbox One. 3.5 years in and the exclusive games are largely lacklustre unless you're a Japanese game fan and even then that's only come about this year.

Sony have Microsoft to thank for helping them stay afloat.

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#12  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 20659 Posts

It could really be compared to almost any generation:

Gen 2 - Atari 2600 gets a mid-gen upgrade, with the Atari 5200. PS4 and XB1 get mid-gen upgrades, with the Pro and Scorpio.

Gen 3 - NES/PS4 trumps the weaker SG-1000/XB1, so Sega/Microsoft release a more powerful mid-gen upgrade, the SMS/Scorpio, yet still get trumped by the NES/PS4 overall, but manage to beat it in certain regions, like America/Europe.

Gen 4 - PC Engine and Mega Drive get mid-gen upgrades, with the Turbo CD and Sega CD/32X. PS4 and XB1 get mid-gen upgrades, with the Pro and Scorpio.

Gen 5 - Sony win the battle against Sega/Microsoft early on by destroying them at E3, by waiting to see what Sega/Microsoft do and responding with a $100 cheaper price tag:

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Epak_

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#13 Epak_
Member since 2004 • 11911 Posts

@NathanDrakeSwag said:

The Xbone wishes it was the N64. That system had so many amazing exclusives.

Yeah, I find this crap insulting.

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deactivated-5d1e44cf96229

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#14  Edited By deactivated-5d1e44cf96229
Member since 2015 • 2814 Posts

My initial response when reading the title of this thread was no way is the 8th generation anything like the 5th generation. The 5th generation is probably my favorite generation ever in gaming and the 8th generation doesn't come close to it's greatness.

But after reading your post, I must say that you make some very good analogies that I have to agree with for the most part.

Of course there are some big differences as well and it's the differences that make the 5th generation much more special to me. For example, the Xbox One nor any of the 8th gen consoles can match the amazing exclusives that the N64 had, the systems all had more unique identities from each other back in the 5th generation, and there was much more innovation back in the 5th generation than there is now.

As for the Dreamcast/Switch analogy, I hope that the Nintendo Switch ends up being just as fun, unique, and innovative as the Dreamcast was, but that it doesn't ultimately suffer the same faith as the Dreamcast of being a great console that unfortunately doesn't get the sales that it deserves.

I also must say that I take issue whenever someone says that Super Mario 3D World is not a true 3D Mario game. It's an excellent game and it doesn't deserve to be treated like it's some kind of spinoff that doesn't measure up to the mainline series. Not only does it measure up to the other 3D Mario games, but in my opinion Super Mario 3D World is the best 3D Mario game of all time and as a fan, I was very happy with the 3D Mario game that Nintendo delivered on the Wii U.

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#15 TheMisterManGuy
Member since 2011 • 264 Posts

@storm_of_swords: I don't mean to imply that 3D World is a bad game by any means. It's certainly a game that's worth making. The problem was that it's not the flagship Mario or proof of concept the Wii U needed at the time.

Having a fairly safe sequel to a linear 3DS game with the only mechanical difference being a cat suit and co-op as the only 3D Mario on the system gives the impression Nintendo has lost their ambition, and was running out of ideas. So it's not about whether it was a good or bad game, it's about what the Wii U needed to gain traction, and 3D World, as good as it was, wasn't enough.