About overall playstyle in games and some people...

I read the topic made by mr. "hadoken" ... about Umvc3 (I haven't played it yet)
But...

Why people choose the "cheap win" path instead of playing like it means to be played?

for ie.
FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE.

And in Fighting games in general...
People instead of learning some good moves from list of over one hundred (100) moves...
they are mashing the same buttons or spamming a few, same moves all over again... JUST TO WIN.


Does the playstyIe like in cod or the cheap wins give them satisfaction?


I mean, I don't want to play with them and I just leave the game as soon as I see one playing like that.
Ofcourse it won't do without whining and their beautiful immature language :)

Same in Mario Kart 7. Everyone chooses Maka Wuhu course because there's a glitch that everyone and their grandma knows in the off chance that they might get first place. That's just how people are, the easier the better, not many people like putting in the work to get the results.

It's fun to win without putting any effort into it.

To those people it is.I just run around and shoot people.

It's fun to win without putting any effort into it.

To those people it is.I just run around and shoot people.

freedomfreak

Whatever it takes...

Who says there is a way thats "meant to be played" that excludes valid tactics. If an fps offers snipers how is that not "the way it's meant to be played"? If it's in the game it is obviously meant to be there (not talking about exploits or bugs). It says more about the unwillingness to adapt with whining about "cheapness" than it does about purity of play. If in a fighting game you are getting your tail whooped by someone spamming the same few moves you are failing at defending, if you are getting sniped to death in an fps you are failing to properly take cover and/or running and gunning oblivious to your surrounding. Simple answer to tc's question if an action can be performed with similar success with less effort why do it with more? You are not more "pro" than anyone else if you know every move for your best character in a fighting game and actively employ them yet consistently lose to a "spammer", nor are you more "pro" in an fps if you refuse to move your parked ass from your sniper perch or refuse to camp with an smg.

nor are you more "pro" in an fps if you refuse to move your parked ass from your sniper perch or refuse to camp with an smg.

eNT1TY

Yeah you are. You definitely are. You have no clue about progaming in FPSs if you think that :?

Question is, why the f**k is quickscoping in MW3?

At least fix the damn animations or something if they want it to be a feature of the game, it just looks stupid.

Campers, who can stand them? I don't camp but if I'm in a good position and people give me easy kills before I move on, then I will take them.

People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsMatthew-first

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsOverlord93

[QUOTE="eNT1TY"]nor are you more "pro" in an fps if you refuse to move your parked ass from your sniper perch or refuse to camp with an smg.

N30F3N1X

Yeah you are. You definitely are. You have no clue about progaming in FPSs if you think that :?

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsOverlord93

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"]

It's fun to win without putting any effort into it.

To those people it is.I just run around and shoot people.

Matthew-first

Just because your tactics are one dimensional doesn't make you a purist or a "pro". How many fps's have you programmed? And would you pigeon hole roles and limit viability in tactics just because you personally want to encourage YOUR playstyle on others? When and if you do "programming in fps's" i would hope you would cater to multiple approaches to the same problems while still being accommodating to what you perceive as "proper" playstyle via incentives whether through weapon mechanics and what not but still allow the choice to ignore those mechanics viably albeit with reduced effectiveness. So no your cookie cutter approach is not "pro" whatever being "pro" means.eNT1TY

One dimensional? WTF is that even supposed to mean?

And yeah, it does. My "cookie cutter" approach comes from time spent playing Quake and Unreal Tournament. You know, FPSs where pro actually means pro, and camping was unarguably the most laughed at tactic any player could try to do. No wonder it's only effective in slow paced FPSs and stamp-sized maps that CoD is filled of.

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"]

It's fun to win without putting any effort into it.

To those people it is.I just run around and shoot people.

freedomfreak

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"]

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]

It is fun to win... but not this way.

Matthew-first

[QUOTE="eNT1TY"] Just because your tactics are one dimensional doesn't make you a purist or a "pro". How many fps's have you programmed? And would you pigeon hole roles and limit viability in tactics just because you personally want to encourage YOUR playstyle on others? When and if you do "programming in fps's" i would hope you would cater to multiple approaches to the same problems while still being accommodating to what you perceive as "proper" playstyle via incentives whether through weapon mechanics and what not but still allow the choice to ignore those mechanics viably albeit with reduced effectiveness. So no your cookie cutter approach is not "pro" whatever being "pro" means.N30F3N1X

One dimensional? WTF is that even supposed to mean?

And yeah, it does. My "cookie cutter" approach comes from time spent playing Quake and Unreal Tournament. You know, FPSs where pro actually means pro, and camping was unarguably the most laughed at tactic any player could try to do. No wonder it's only effective in slow paced FPSs and stamp-sized maps that CoD is filled of.

:D

They should be more stable and aim before kill... get a good spot or smth... Matthew-first

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"] I agree,although a lot of people prefer the easy way.

freedomfreak

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"]

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]

So, maybe then we should start making games for mentaly deficient people?

One hit kill?
1 punch for each character?

Then it would be veeery easy.

Matthew-first

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]They should be more stable and aim before kill... get a good spot or smth... foxhound_fox

those "cheap" people are playing to win. They've found a tactic that works. They'll continue to use it as long as it continues to work. If you have a problem with it, find a good counter for that tactic.

People play to win. If there are cheap mechanisms in the game than that's the fault of the game itself.

[QUOTE="eNT1TY"] Just because your tactics are one dimensional doesn't make you a purist or a "pro". How many fps's have you programmed? And would you pigeon hole roles and limit viability in tactics just because you personally want to encourage YOUR playstyle on others? When and if you do "programming in fps's" i would hope you would cater to multiple approaches to the same problems while still being accommodating to what you perceive as "proper" playstyle via incentives whether through weapon mechanics and what not but still allow the choice to ignore those mechanics viably albeit with reduced effectiveness. So no your cookie cutter approach is not "pro" whatever being "pro" means.N30F3N1X

One dimensional? WTF is that even supposed to mean?

And yeah, it does. My "cookie cutter" approach comes from time spent playing Quake and Unreal Tournament. You know, FPSs where pro actually means pro, and camping was unarguably the most laughed at tactic any player could try to do. No wonder it's only effective in slow paced FPSs and stamp-sized maps that CoD is filled of.

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsOverlord93

"FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE."

you missed the point though.

it's when people are using a sniper for what you should be using an AR for (or even a shotgun:|). and there are people who use ARs as snipers because the game is exploitable like that.

someone brought up a good point that the connotation of 'hard-scoping' is now seen as a negative thing. That's just how backwards things are getting and the OP really makes a fair point.

those "cheap" people are playing to win. They've found a tactic that works. They'll continue to use it as long as it continues to work. If you have a problem with it, find a good counter for that tactic.

whoozwah

I was playing Marvel Vs. Capcom 2 at an arcade and a kid had a sheet of paper, he never looked just hit the same combo over and over again. Rogue and Sabretooth infinite combo.

That was it, once the internet filtered out fighting style and creativity and everyone used the same information to make the most dominant team it was over.

M vs C 3 even has a training mode that teaches you to do all the cheap combos, it evens thinks up but it makes it very redundant.

[QUOTE="Overlord93"][QUOTE="Matthew-first"]People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsHavocV3

"FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE."

you missed the point though.

it's when people are using a sniper for what you should be using an AR for (or even a shotgun:|). and there are people who use ARs as snipers because the game is exploitable like that.

someone brought up a good point that the connotation of 'hard-scoping' is now seen as a negative thing. That's just how backwards things are getting and the OP really makes a fair point.

I was playing Marvel Vs. Capcom 2 at an arcade and a kid had a sheet of paper, he never looked just hit the same combo over and over again. Rogue and Sabretooth infinite combo.

That was it, once the internet filtered out fighting style and creativity and everyone used the same information to make the most dominant team it was over.

M vs C 3 even has a training mode that teaches you to do all the cheap combos, it evens thinks up but it makes it very redundant.

fadersdream

Then you have been sucking at fps's for over a decade if you were getting camped in quake or ut, then again more than 10 years of embracing the "cookie cutter" approach has conditioned you into not being able to recognize any style against the grain, perhaps that is why you are so against alternative play styles? I played quake and ut too but im not going to pretend that it elevates my opinion above others' when people enjoy playing differently. Play quake live now, it is a much different beast than q3 and traditional tactics usually places you at the bottom half of the table.eNT1TY

WTF? I just said they were laughed at, not that I was victim of camping. Where did you pull that line out of :? ?

And LMAO, "cookie cutter" is just a word you're throwing at me to justify those cheap **** tactics while in fact those are the cookie cutter tactics in the first place. It doesn't get any more retarded than them, stand in one place and wait for someone to pass by and not notice you. How pathetic.

When I used to play CoD4 I changed playstile on the go, even halfway through the match, in fact I'm one of the few people you can speak with that actually knows how to play stealth. "Cookie cutter", me :lol:

[QUOTE="HavocV3"]

[QUOTE="Overlord93"] I love these arguments They run around and kill people, they are cheap. The sit still and kill people, they are cheap. What do they have to do to not be cheap? drop their weapons and let your sucky ass kill them?Matthew-first

"FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE."

you missed the point though.

it's when people are using a sniper for what you should be using an AR for (or even a shotgun:|). and there are people who use ARs as snipers because the game is exploitable like that.

someone brought up a good point that the connotation of 'hard-scoping' is now seen as a negative thing. That's just how backwards things are getting and the OP really makes a fair point.

OP = original post, aka the first post in the thread.

[QUOTE="HavocV3"]

[QUOTE="Overlord93"] I love these arguments They run around and kill people, they are cheap. The sit still and kill people, they are cheap. What do they have to do to not be cheap? drop their weapons and let your sucky ass kill them?Matthew-first

"FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE."

you missed the point though.

it's when people are using a sniper for what you should be using an AR for (or even a shotgun:|). and there are people who use ARs as snipers because the game is exploitable like that.

someone brought up a good point that the connotation of 'hard-scoping' is now seen as a negative thing. That's just how backwards things are getting and the OP really makes a fair point.

AR= assault rifle. like an M16 or Ak47

OP= original post/poster. the post we're all replying to:P

[QUOTE="fadersdream"]

I was playing Marvel Vs. Capcom 2 at an arcade and a kid had a sheet of paper, he never looked just hit the same combo over and over again. Rogue and Sabretooth infinite combo.

That was it, once the internet filtered out fighting style and creativity and everyone used the same information to make the most dominant team it was over.

M vs C 3 even has a training mode that teaches you to do all the cheap combos, it evens thinks up but it makes it very redundant.

Matthew-first

Use strategy to adapt to players' different playstyles. It's called being good at a game. Glitching and cheating are totally different from someone playing differently then you.

It's cheap!

It's also pretty much cheating.

.

.

Games that seperate players by rank constantly have the problem of people manipulating the system to play at lower ranks just to get kills on unskilled players.

Halo, COD and Demons Souls suffered highly from this.

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"]

[QUOTE="HavocV3"]

"FPS games...
People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" kills
or
People with machine guns - they sit and camp...
it should be OTHERWISE."

you missed the point though.

it's when people are using a sniper for what you should be using an AR for (or even a shotgun:|). and there are people who use ARs as snipers because the game is exploitable like that.

someone brought up a good point that the connotation of 'hard-scoping' is now seen as a negative thing. That's just how backwards things are getting and the OP really makes a fair point.

HavocV3

AR= assault rifle. like an M16 or Ak47

OP= original post/poster. the post we're all replying to:P

In my opinion if the game is open to cheap moves, then it's sometimes an open flaw in the game design.

It's why traditionally I don't like Soul Calibur or DMC/Bayonetta games too much, because there's little benefit to learning the intricacies of the game play.

Where as in a NG or SF games for example, it definately pays off to learn how to play.

Let me bring up another example. I was playing FN Champion and realised that if I defensively move and stay outside the boxers attack zone and counter everynow and then with a right cross, I can take my opponant apart while he tires himself out punching air. It's clearly a game design flaw, with the a.i in this case.

Like in some of the old Fifa games, you could always score from a specific angles.

If a beat em ups open to button bashing then that's part of the game design and I don't want to play it.

I can't comment on CoD because I don't play online, but there must be counter tactics?

[QUOTE="eNT1TY"] Then you have been sucking at fps's for over a decade if you were getting camped in quake or ut, then again more than 10 years of embracing the "cookie cutter" approach has conditioned you into not being able to recognize any style against the grain, perhaps that is why you are so against alternative play styles? I played quake and ut too but im not going to pretend that it elevates my opinion above others' when people enjoy playing differently. Play quake live now, it is a much different beast than q3 and traditional tactics usually places you at the bottom half of the table.N30F3N1X

WTF? I just said they were laughed at, not that I was victim of camping. Where did you pull that line out of :? ?

And LMAO, "cookie cutter" is just a word you're throwing at me to justify those cheap **** tactics while in fact those are the cookie cutter tactics in the first place. It doesn't get any more retarded than them, stand in one place and wait for someone to pass by and not notice you. How pathetic.

When I used to play CoD4 I changed playstile on the go, even halfway through the match, in fact I'm one of the few people you can speak with that actually knows how to play stealth. "Cookie cutter", me :lol:

[QUOTE="Overlord93"][QUOTE="Matthew-first"]People with snipers - they run around and do "quickscope" killsMatthew-first

Quickscoping has been in games for years, Just because it becomes popular doesn't mean it's suddenly OP. No sniper no matter how good will be able to kill an equally skilled player in close range who has an smg or AR. People who complain about quickscoping are generally bad players. If you get put in a full lobby of snipers you should be happy, snipers are some of the worst guns in the game, players with auto weapons are at a huge advantage.

[QUOTE="Matthew-first"][QUOTE="Overlord93"] I love these arguments They run around and kill people, they are cheap. The sit still and kill people, they are cheap. What do they have to do to not be cheap? drop their weapons and let your sucky ass kill them?Overlord93

Quickscoping has been in games for years, Just because it becomes popular doesn't mean it's suddenly OP. No sniper no matter how good will be able to kill an equally skilled player in close range who has an smg or AR. People who complain about quickscoping are generally bad players. If you get put in a full lobby of snipers you should be happy, snipers are some of the worst guns in the game, players with auto weapons are at a huge advantage.

Whereas as other weapons such as SMG is limited in power and accuracy at range. Shotguns do nothing at long/medium range and are inconsistent.

Quickscoping allows snipers to be effective at close range; more reliable than a shotgun at close range; and still have their COD super range effectiveness. Quickscoping needs to be more dynamic, more of a risk, not just mark the centre of your HD TV with something and aim down sights for a millisecond.

To me that sounds wrong.

It does make it OP because it makes snipers good for all occasions.

Whereas as other weapons such as SMG is limited in power and accuracy at range. Shotguns do nothing at long/medium range and are inconsistent.

Quickscoping allows snipers to be effective at close range; more reliable than a shotgun at close range; and still have their COD super range effectiveness. Quickscoping needs to be more dynamic, more of a risk, not just mark the centre of your HD TV with something and aim down sights for a millisecond.

To me that sounds wrong.

SaltyMeatballs

Seems pretty balanced to me, especially in a game with significantly more close range segments than long range :/

[QUOTE="freedomfreak"]

It's fun to win without putting any effort into it.

To those people it is.I just run around and shoot people.

Matthew-first

[QUOTE="SaltyMeatballs"]It does make it OP because it makes snipers good for all occasions.

Whereas as other weapons such as SMG is limited in power and accuracy at range. Shotguns do nothing at long/medium range and are inconsistent.

Quickscoping allows snipers to be effective at close range; more reliable than a shotgun at close range; and still have their COD super range effectiveness. Quickscoping needs to be more dynamic, more of a risk, not just mark the centre of your HD TV with something and aim down sights for a millisecond.

To me that sounds wrong.

Overlord93

Seems pretty balanced to me, especially in a game with significantly more close range segments than long range :/

If that's what you think, fair enough, let's agree to disagree because I will stick with what I said.

[QUOTE="Overlord93"]

[QUOTE="SaltyMeatballs"]It does make it OP because it makes snipers good for all occasions.

Whereas as other weapons such as SMG is limited in power and accuracy at range. Shotguns do nothing at long/medium range and are inconsistent.

Quickscoping allows snipers to be effective at close range; more reliable than a shotgun at close range; and still have their COD super range effectiveness. Quickscoping needs to be more dynamic, more of a risk, not just mark the centre of your HD TV with something and aim down sights for a millisecond.

To me that sounds wrong.

SaltyMeatballs

Seems pretty balanced to me, especially in a game with significantly more close range segments than long range :/

If that's what you think, fair enough, let's agree to disagree because I will stick with what I said.

Whatever it takes...

Renegade_Fury

This.

Umad I spam move in fightin games? Try and stop it.

Umad about quickscopes? Shoot em first.

You do what you gotta do to win.

[QUOTE="Renegade_Fury"]

Whatever it takes...

MLBknights58

This.

Umad I spam move in fightin games? Try and stop it.

Umad about quickscopes? Shoot em first.

You do what you gotta do to win.

.

Personally I'm not bothered by the doing it, I'm bothered that eventually everyone does it the same. Everyone carries the same gun, hides in the same place and manipulates the same exploit. Then the community dies and only the worst of the worst are left and a game I loved is no longer fun.

.

Team Fortress 2 skywalkers I'm looking at you.

are you mad that fighting games are struggling to survive? are you mad that FPS multiplayer has become filled with other twitchy 15 year olds? I usually do win, and I still get annoyed by this crap.

.

Personally I'm not bothered by the doing it, I'm bothered that eventually everyone does it the same. Everyone carries the same gun, hides in the same place and manipulates the same exploit. Then the community dies and only the worst of the worst are left and a game I loved is no longer fun.

.

Team Fortress 2 skywalkers I'm looking at you.

fadersdream