All three systems are flops IMO

Keep in mind that alot of this is pure opinion, so I don't want anyone jumping down my throat. But anyway, here's my reasoning for thinking that none of the systems lived up to their hype.

360-It's harder to pin down why 360 is a flop, but it has more to do with next gen gaming in general and 360 being first out of the gate. I remember reading about the "next gen" systems in magazines and how gaming would be changed forever. But then when the 360 actually dropped, games felt pretty much the same just with more sheen and detail. Sure, 360 has delivered on the online front, but single player experiences aren't really better than they used to be. Games like Halo 3 embody this. Halo 3 had more sheen, more detail, but was ultimately very sameish. There are only a few games which seem to stand out as experiences that go above and beyond what was seen in previous gens in any meaningful way. With current gen gaming, I feel the only huge leap was a graphical one. Everything else has remained pretty much static. The 360, IMO, is a system that plays it safe. It does everything well (besides reliability) and it does its best to make a complete gaming experience, but it comes across as somewhat generic. That's not to say it's bad, because in most areas it has delivered. I'm just saying that for single player experiences, it hasn't altered the landscape in any meaningful way. On top of that, pretty severe hardware issues did a little bit to mar the first next gen experience (though I think cows try to make the RROD issue matter more than it does.) FLOP STATUS: MILD

PS3-I think it should be pretty obvious why I consider PS3 a flop. Between Sony saying "the next gen only starts when we say so" and Sony fans assuring 360 fans that PS3 would blow 360 out of the water in every way and would make 360 look like Xbox 1.5, PS3 had expectations that were virtually impossible to meet. These expectations haunted the PS3 when it became apparent that PS3's beginnings would be extremely rocky and that the PS3 was virtually the same as the 360 as far as graphical capabilities are concerned or atleast similar enough to make the bold claims made by Sony and its fans look silly. PS3's lackluster multiplat performance also raised some eyebrows (for the record, PS3 has definitely improved on the muliplat front). Even to this day, when PS3 has some very formidable titles of the shelf and a couple games that are among the best, it fails to distinguish itself from the 360 enough for any of the hype to be justified. When I look at a 360 game and a PS3 game, I can only see a graphical difference if I nitpick over tiny details. Then, when one takes into account that Blu-Ray has come nowhere close to justifying its hype, it easy to see that PS3 was a case of just too much hype. I'm not saying PS3 is bad, I'm just saying that when something is hyped to the moon, it's bound to flop. And when a company struggles like Sony has this gen, one can hardly say the PS3 has had a great performance. I think that up until recently, being a hardcore cow has been somewhat traumatic. FLOP STATUS: SEVERE

Wii-Why the Wii is a flop is also pretty obvious. The Wii was touted as a revolution and as something that would change the way we think about games. The Wii hasn't come close to achieving this at all. While there Wii games that use the motion sensing to good effect, this hasn't made the games feel different enough to classify the Wii as a revolution. The trouble with the Wii is that is one step forwards and two steps backwards. While the motion controls do have the potential to make games feel much different, the Wii's weak hardware and the throw back quality of most of its games undermines this in quite an extreme way. The fact that the Wii's quality control is just not very good only makes the so-called revolution seem all that much more distant. Also, when a big portion of the Wii's best games are ports, it makes the platform seem mired in the past. Sure, Mario Galaxy seems revolutionary in its on right, but the Wii can't hang its hat on one game and try to tout itself as a revolution. There seems to be a pretty huge sentiment that the Wii has a quality control issue, the motion controls have not justified their hype and that the Wii seems distinctly last genish (That's not to say that 360/PS3 seem all that much different, but the Wii definitely comes across as the most last genish). Perhaps Nintendo will release some games in the future that will make everyone "get it" but right now the Wii is not even a great gaming system much less a revolution. FLOP STATUS: STRONG (I didn't label it as severe, because it has sold so well)

Thoughts?

Wow, you're positive :P

Really though, good read. I think the PS3 and 360 are awesome but I can agree with your points. The PS3 isn't quite what we imagined it would be back in 2005. Whereas the 360 is a solid console but doesn't really push any envelopes. As for the Wii........:(

Wow, you're positive :P

Really though, good read. I think the PS3 and 360 are awesome but I can agree with your points. The PS3 isn't quite what we imagined it would be back in 2005. Whereas the 360 is a solid console but doesn't really push any envelopes. As for the Wii........:(

Floppy_Jim

Floppy Jim, there was a time when you were a big PS3 fanboy.  I'll admit, these past months I've enjoyed all of your posts.  :)  I agree w/ you.  The 360 is solid though has some reliablility flaws.  the ps3 isn't what I had hoped for, but it's still good.  And the Wii took a nose dive for me personally this year.

the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"oTHE_FLOPo

You obviously didn't read the post. I said that it was a flop IMO (notice the word IMO) because next gen gaming didn't live up to its promise and 360 was first out the gates. My analysis is not limited to sales, it is about expectations overall. Also, notice I labeled the 360 a "MILD FLOP" and PS3 a "SEVERE FLOP."

[QUOTE="Floppy_Jim"]

Wow, you're positive :P

Really though, good read. I think the PS3 and 360 are awesome but I can agree with your points. The PS3 isn't quite what we imagined it would be back in 2005. Whereas the 360 is a solid console but doesn't really push any envelopes. As for the Wii........:(

Squall18

Floppy Jim, there was a time when you were a big PS3 fanboy.  I'll admit, these past months I've enjoyed all of your posts.  :)  I agree w/ you.  The 360 is solid though has some reliablility flaws.  the ps3 isn't what I had hoped for, but it's still good.  And the Wii took a nose dive for me personally this year.

Thanks :)

I admit, I was quite biased towards the PS3 when I first joined the site. I'd like to think I've become more neutral now, but I'm still biased against the Wii :P

[QUOTE="Floppy_Jim"]

Wow, you're positive :P

Really though, good read. I think the PS3 and 360 are awesome but I can agree with your points. The PS3 isn't quite what we imagined it would be back in 2005. Whereas the 360 is a solid console but doesn't really push any envelopes. As for the Wii........:(

Squall18

Floppy Jim, there was a time when you were a big PS3 fanboy. I'll admit, these past months I've enjoyed all of your posts. :) I agree w/ you. The 360 is solid though has some reliablility flaws. the ps3 isn't what I had hoped for, but it's still good. And the Wii took a nose dive for me personally this year.

I never saw him as a PS3 fanboy, he just comes across as someone who has a slight preference towards the PS3.

When somebody's a fanboy, it is immediately apparent because they are annoying as all hell.

the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"oTHE_FLOPo

[QUOTE="oTHE_FLOPo"]the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"Panther501

And somehow Sony fanboys support their statements logically? Please.

Although I didn't like how my post went over his head, he can easily support his statement. The 360 did indeed grab market share from the PS brand. Also, it can be easily argued that PS3 is a flop. In fact, I think its harder to argue that PS3 isn't a flop. How did PS3 live up to the stratospheric expectations?

[QUOTE="oTHE_FLOPo"]the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"Panther501

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="oTHE_FLOPo"]the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"too_much_eslim

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="oTHE_FLOPo"]the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"Tragic_Kingdom7

And somehow Sony fanboys support their statements logically? Please.

Although I didn't like how my post went over his head, he can easily support his statement. The 360 did indeed grab market share from the PS brand. Also, it can be easily argued that PS3 is a flop. In fact, I think its harder to argue that PS3 isn't a flop. How did PS3 live up to the stratospheric expectations?

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"][QUOTE="Panther501"] on what basis do you make you claim this is why I hate 360 fanboys they make blatent and unsupported statements that have no standing whatsoverPanther501

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="too_much_eslim"] I thought fanboys do that. Not just 360 fanboys. Because I can show you some Nintendo and PS fanboys who do teh same.too_much_eslim

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"][QUOTE="Panther501"] on what basis do you make you claim this is why I hate 360 fanboys they make blatent and unsupported statements that have no standing whatsoverPanther501

I don't trust your judgment if only for the fact that you can't recognize that the market share statement has truth to it and it is easily arguable that the PS3 did not live up to expectations. In the OP, I gave a perfectly good argument as to why the PS3 is a flop.

The Wii did exactly what it was supposed to.  It is by no means a flop.

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="too_much_eslim"] I thought fanboys do that. Not just 360 fanboys. Because I can show you some Nintendo and PS fanboys who do teh same.Tragic_Kingdom7

I don't trust your judgment if only for the fact that you can't recognize that the market share statement has truth to it and it is easily arguable that the PS3 did not live up to expectations. In the OP, I gave a perfectly good argument as to why the PS3 is a flop.

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"][QUOTE="Panther501"] i find it more common among 360 fanboysPanther501

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"][QUOTE="Panther501"] i find it more common among 360 fanboysPanther501

Well, Sony fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of brand loyalty, which is rather baseless. It seems that Microsoft fanboys seem to use data in their arguments more often even if they spin that data sometimes. Also, Sony fans seem to argue more using the future and Microsoft fans seem to argue more using the present. Lastly, Sony fanboys talk about "betrayal" and "it just feels right on PS consoles" while MS fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of the realities of business.

Those are a few of the reasons that I honestly see more illogical arguments coming from cows.

i find it more common among 360 fanboysPanther501

I don't trust your judgment if only for the fact that you can't recognize that the market share statement has truth to it and it is easily arguable that the PS3 did not live up to expectations. In the OP, I gave a perfectly good argument as to why the PS3 is a flop.

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="too_much_eslim"] I find it more common amongst PS 3 fanboys. too_much_eslim

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="too_much_eslim"] I find it more common amongst PS 3 fanboys. Tragic_Kingdom7

Well, Sony fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of brand loyalty, which is rather baseless. It seems that Microsoft fanboys seem to use data in their arguments more often even if they spin that data sometimes. Also, Sony fans seem to argue more using the future and Microsoft fans seem to argue more using the present. Lastly, Sony fanboys talk about "betrayal" and "it just feels right on PS consoles" while MS fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of the realities of business.

Those are a few of the reasons that I honestly see more illogical arguments coming from cows.

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"][QUOTE="Panther501"] how so?Panther501

[QUOTE="Tragic_Kingdom7"]

[QUOTE="Panther501"] i find it more common among 360 fanboysPanther501

I don't trust your judgment if only for the fact that you can't recognize that the market share statement has truth to it and it is easily arguable that the PS3 did not live up to expectations. In the OP, I gave a perfectly good argument as to why the PS3 is a flop.

If this is your reasoning, why didn't you attack the premise behind my entire thread?

[QUOTE="Panther501"][QUOTE="Tragic_Kingdom7"]

 

I don't trust your judgment if only for the fact that you can't recognize that the market share statement has truth to it and it is easily arguable that the PS3 did not live up to expectations. In the OP, I gave a perfectly good argument as to why the PS3 is a flop.

 

Tragic_Kingdom7

If this is your reasoning, why didn't you attack the premise behind my entire thread?

[QUOTE="Tragic_Kingdom7"]

[QUOTE="Panther501"] how so?too_much_eslim

Well, Sony fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of brand loyalty, which is rather baseless. It seems that Microsoft fanboys seem to use data in their arguments more often even if they spin that data sometimes. Also, Sony fans seem to argue more using the future and Microsoft fans seem to argue more using the present. Lastly, Sony fanboys talk about "betrayal" and "it just feels right on PS consoles" while MS fanboys tend to argue from the perspective of the realities of business.

Those are a few of the reasons that I honestly see more illogical arguments coming from cows.

I definitely agree. Some of the 360 fanboys in System Wars are among the most awful fanboys. I'm just stating a trend I see when looking at the arguing patterns of both camps of fanboys. I definitely notice a "brand loyalty" theme going on with the hardcore cows.

But like you two said, this is off topic and probably inflammatory. That being said, these are my honest observations.

the 360 grabbing market share from the PS brand is a flop?....Wow! man do you even know what a flop is? I'll give you a hint it starts with the letter "P" and ends wit the number "3"oTHE_FLOPo

cause i just didPanther501

You only attacked the premise of my thread because you wanted to defend the PS3 against a lemming. If you had come into the thread and attacked the premise in regards to all three consoles, you would seem more genuine.

Again: if this is your reasoning, why didn't you call the whole thread baseless and unsupported?

Well done, TC... and well written too. The current generation of consoles (with the exception of the Wii) is all about dabbling with high-definition graphics, and anyone who buys into it expecting more, is going to feel disappointed...67gt500

Thanks for the compliments.

[QUOTE="Panther501"] cause i just didTragic_Kingdom7

You only attacked the premise of my thread because you wanted to defend the PS3 against a lemming. If you had come into the thread and attacked the premise in regards to all three consoles, you would seem more genuine.

Again: if this is your reasoning, why didn't you call the whole thread baseless and unsupported?

But anyway, here's my reasoning for thinking that none of the systems lived up to their hype.

360-It's harder to pin down why 360 is a flop, but it has more to do with next gen gaming in general and 360 being first out of the gate. I remember reading about the "next gen" systems in magazines and how gaming would be changed forever. But then when the 360 actually dropped, games felt pretty much the same just with more sheen and detail. Sure, 360 has delivered on the online front, but single player experiences aren't really better than they used to be. Games like Halo 3 embody this. Halo 3 had more sheen, more detail, but was ultimately very sameish. There are only a few games which seem to stand out as experiences that go above and beyond what was seen in previous gens in any meaningful way. With current gen gaming, the only huge leap was a graphical one. Everything else has remained pretty much static. The 360 is a system that plays it safe. It does everything well (besides reliability) and it does its best to make a complete gaming experience, but it comes across as somewhat generic. That's not to say it's bad, because in most areas it has delivered. But for single player experiences, it hasn't altered the landscape in any meaningful way. On top of that, pretty severe hardware issues did a little bit to mar the first next gen experience. FLOP STATUS: MILD

PS3-I think it should be pretty obvious why I consider PS3 a flop. Between Sony saying "the next gen only starts when we say so" and Sony fans assuring 360 fans that PS3 would blow 360 out of the water in every way and would make 360 look like Xbox 1.5, PS3 had expectations that were virtually impossible to meet. These expectations haunted the PS3 when it became apparent that PS3's beginnings would be extremely rocky and that the PS3 was virtually the same as the 360 as far as graphical capabilities are concerned or at least similar enough to make the bold claims made by Sony and its fans look silly. PS3's lackluster multiplat performance also raised some eyebrows in the beginning, but has improved as of this writing. Even to this day, when PS3 has some very formidable titles of the shelf and a couple games that are among the best, it fails to distinguish itself from the 360 enough for any of the hype to be justified. When I look at a 360 game and a PS3 game, I can only see a graphical difference if I nitpick over tiny details. Then, when one takes into account that Blu-Ray has come nowhere close to justifying its hype, it easy to see that PS3 was a case of just too much hype. PS3 is not bad, it's just that when something is hyped to the moon, it's bound to flop. And when a company struggles like Sony has this gen, one can hardly say the PS3 has had a great performance. up until recently, being a hardcore cow has been somewhat traumatic. FLOP STATUS: SEVERE

Wii-Why the Wii is a flop is also pretty obvious. The Wii was touted as a revolution and as something that would change the way we think about games. The Wii hasn't come close to achieving this at all. While there Wii games that use the motion sensing to good effect, this hasn't made the games feel different enough to classify the Wii as a revolution. The trouble with the Wii is that is one step forwards and two steps backwards. While the motion controls do have the potential to make games feel much different, the Wii's weak hardware and the throw back quality of most of its games undermines this in quite an extreme way. The fact that the Wii's quality control is just not very good only makes the so-called revolution seem all that much more distant. Also, when a big portion of the Wii's best games are ports, it makes the platform seem mired in the past. Sure, Mario Galaxy seems revolutionary in its on right, but the Wii can't hang its hat on one game and try to tout itself as a revolution. There seems to be a pretty huge sentiment that the Wii has a quality control issue, the motion controls have not justified their hype and that the Wii seems distinctly last genish, supposedly even moreso than the other two consoles, and that's saying something. Perhaps Nintendo will release some games in the future that will make everyone "get it" but right now the Wii is not even a great gaming system much less a revolution. FLOP STATUS: STRONG (selling so well has lessened the impact)

Thoughts?

Tragic_Kingdom7