Are all Western RPGs shooters except Oblivion 4 (which I didn't like)?

Naturally, I'm referring to this gen and this gen only, so topics about Diablo 2, or Morrowind, or whatever I do not want to hear. Also, on consoles, NOT PC systems.

While I have played Fallout 1 and 2 which were okay at least (respective of their ages in the industry) I've yet to know what's so great about the role-playing games of this generation.

Aren't they all shooters? Take Mass Effect. It's a shooter, plain and simple, with rpg elements sown in. In fact, I remember reading ME 2 being even more streamlined as a shooter than the "role-playing" of picking dialogue and minimal story differences that companies like Bioware are so famous for. But that's another story.

Now, there is also Fallout 3. Short of it being a very bland and ugly looking game, both the third person and first person perspectives of combat shooting are annoying. When people say rpg's, I really expect rpg's, not games where I have to wiggle the analog stick around to shoot stuff. I mean I don't like the Call of Duty, Halo, and the billion 'n one shooters on the market to enjoy that type of play (unless there's auto aiming which for a non-gamer like me makes the game more fun to play).

Lastly, there's Dragon Age Origins, which I have yet to play and was sort of maybe interested in, even though the videos make the combat look not very user friendly. However, it's like I haven't yet met a game from companies like Bethesda or Bioware that don't have bugs, glitches or slowdown in their games. Last I checked, this was 2010, not 1999 or 2004 or anything. I don't appreciate elitist gamers calling these games wonderful when for me, even the slightest hindrance can be off putting for a game I'm trying to get into.

Basically, to sum it all up, I really wanted good rpg's this gen (not like I could count on rpg's from Japanese companies to be good) and was under the impression that "WRPGs" were the closest to "action role-playing" as possible, and were fun. But the fun part I have yet to discover.

Will there be any fun action rpg's (or just ones that don't involve battle load times like the games of old) this gen? I suppose hack-and-slash would be what I'm interested in if they involve levels and a random number generator that increases my stats every level or something. Just not shooters please. Unless they feature auto-aiming like GTA 4, I really don't see any fun within them.

EDIT: hmm, on second thought maybe I should just make a new topic about putting Western RPGs on a handheld? I'm a handheld gamer first and foremost, always have been. But the problem is no one on this website actually likes handhelds that much and prefer consoles...

Which may lead to the fact that developers like Bioware and Bethesda won't make a game for the DS or PSP... that's any good (I know only of Sonic Chronicles when Sega employed Bioware to develop a game)

Oh well I give up...

You definately need Demon's Souls...

Just get Dragon Age. It's by far the best RPG around.

Demon Souls is also very good, but less of an RPG and more of an action game with RPG elements, imo.

There's alot of other WPRG out like Risen, divinity 2 etc, they're OK games too.

Check out.

Dragon Age: Origins
Fable 1 and 2
Morrowind (way better then Oblivion)
Witcher

Just to name a few.

Game of the Year 2 ( Mass effect 2 ) you can be a biotic the entire game without any guns, same with being a tech guy.

fallout is the most overated game this gen. Sure its a decent game but its just oblivion with guns.

Fallout 3 and Mass Effect

2 games...

Also, what's Oblivion 4? I was only aware of The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion. :P

So you want a polished action-RPG without guns? I guess Fable and Demon's Souls would fit the bill. Jade Empire SE on PC is still highly playable too. And if you don't mind top down hack and slash there's Titan Quest and Torchlight. FO3 you can play through with melee weapons or using VATS if shooting annoys you.

It hasn't been the best gen for RPGs, but personally I think you're just being too picky. Dragon Age is a great game, so is The Witcher, Mass Effect and Fallout 3. And all of those come with different kind of combat systems so I'm surprised if none of them appeal to you.

Your requirements... some of them stated explicitly by you and others I'm deriving from the rest of your post:

• Console-only
• This gen only
• Action RPG only
• Non-shooter

Let me know if any of these are wrong.

That really doesn't leave much this gen. The only one that has gotten consistent critical acclaim are Dragon Age and Fable 2. That's the only one that seems to fit your rather narrow set of RGS needs. The rest I can think of had lukewarm reception when they released.... like Sacred 2 or Marvel Ultimate Alliance.

Not sure if you'd really like Dragon Age. It's not really an action RPG since you don't have direct control of your character(s). Instead it's a little like KOTOR in that you queue up a set actions.

Both have their share of technical gaffes, but what game doesn't?

It wouldn't kill some of you to at least read the first part of my post. I can understand low-level users ignoring the topic, but for veterans as well? For shame. Also it is important that you read all that I have to say, so that you can properly formulate a discussion that leads somewhere.

If I wanted to play games on my PC, then I wouldn't bother being here in the first place, as I would be a typical gamer like the rest of you and I'd just game away with difficult video games and annoying mechanics that I wouldn't normally enjoy. Keep in mind: I'm not a veteran game, and do not like playing difficult games, only ones that are accessible and more importantly, fun. I play on consoles and won't ever be using a PC, fully knowing that I'm "missing out" on wonderul graphics, mods, and higher replay value. I still say no thank you.

what character class did you play as in mass effect?

No, and they are way better than JRPGs

You will not like Demon's Souls as it has a pretty steep learning curve. Try Sacred 2. It is not hard and has stats with loot drops and you can play with friends.

On a side note. I personally like the fresh take on RPG's that this generation has begun. How many times can you kill the dragon/save the princess...

Your requirements... some of them stated explicitly by you and others I'm deriving from the rest of your post:

• Console-only
• This gen only
• Action RPG only
• Non-shooter

Let me know if any of these are wrong.

That really doesn't leave much this gen. The only one that has gotten consistent critical acclaim are Dragon Age and Fable 2. That's the only one that seems to fit your rather narrow set of RGS needs. The rest I can think of had lukewarm reception when they released.... like Sacred 2 or Marvel Ultimate Alliance.

Not sure if you'd really like Dragon Age. It's not really an action RPG since you don't have direct control of your character(s). Instead it's a little like KOTOR in that you queue up a set actions.

Both have their share of technical gaffes, but what game doesn't?

VoodooHak

Thank you... I know it seems I'm being rather picky, but again that's only because I'm not a heavy gamer and just want a fun game to play. I mean is there no "definitive rpg" equivalent to last gen and the few that were fun?

This is all coming from the fact that I just finished Final Fantasy 12, and I think I enjoyed it so much that it turned me off from every other game available. Final Fantasy 12 may not have been the action rpg I would like, but it featured absolutely no battle load times, and it wasn't a shooter to boot. That's really all I'm looking for, and does that mean I have to buy a PC or 360 to get it? With the ps3 getting the shaft left and right, and I'm not in a situation or environment that's compatible with a 360... and I don't do PCs, because I'm not knowledgeable in that regard, nor care to be.

I guess maybe that just means I'm not a fan of Western RPGs, period? Now if there was a WRPG for a handheld, say DS or PSP... then we're getting somewhere. I'm a handheld gamer first and foremost after all.

I would like to answer this post with a story of my own, coincidently it involves both Bethesda's Oblivion and Fallout 3.

Before the above mentioned RPG's came out i was used to the Champions of Norrath and Baldurs Gate Dark Alliance type hack n slash RPG games on consoles, and therefore when Oblivion was first released i didn't really understand how the game was played, or even how to properly use the menu or map to fast travel through out the world.

Therefore it was returned mere days after buying it, but that following weekend i happened to visit my brother in law's house, who was a former PC RPG master and now only plays his 360 games, and also bought Oblivion when i did.

He was already 30 plus hours into the game and i watched him play for over 2 hours and let me tell you i got schooled he did things with that game, like weapons repair, fast traveling, joining guilds, doing each guilds quest, discovering forts, old ruins, and caves and looting them free of enemies and treasure, magically healing himself, obtaining artifacts to breathe under water and walk on water, finding such magically enchanted weapons that launched the enemy like 80-ft away when swiping them 2 or 3 times, buying homes in each city, ridding this one haunted manor of all it's ghosts.

I was both amazed and ashamed that i passed this game by, so i immediately went back and got the game again, and picked his brain about certain things, and before you know it i have over 90 hours invested in the game and it's become one of my favorite games of all time.

The exact same story applies to Fallout 3, got it but played it as a shooter and not an RPG, and therefore it was incredibly hard for me to progress or even like the game, so i got rid of it, next time i went to my brother in laws house, i watched him play, found out all that there was to do and what i was doing wrong and i got schooled again, so went back out picked it up and it's of course another of my favorite games of all time.

Why ? because these games are not mere mindless hack and slash or point and shoot games, they force you to use strategy and think of how and what you need to do to acquire a new skill or attribute to level up both your character and your arsenal in order to be able to progress, and the fact that the enjoyable progressive game time is nearly endless makes these games thee most valuable games you'll ever play.

So before you go knit picking about framerate slow downs or the necessary bland gray setting of a post apocalyptic world, first realize that games that have such vast and massive worlds as this require time to load and have slower framerates because of their size, but it doesn't deter from the gameplay in anyway, the reviews speak for themselves and if they don't i'll be happy to shout from the roof tops about how great both these games are.

[QUOTE="VoodooHak"]

Your requirements... some of them stated explicitly by you and others I'm deriving from the rest of your post:

• Console-only
• This gen only
• Action RPG only
• Non-shooter

Let me know if any of these are wrong.

That really doesn't leave much this gen. The only one that has gotten consistent critical acclaim are Dragon Age and Fable 2. That's the only one that seems to fit your rather narrow set of RPG needs. The rest I can think of had lukewarm reception when they released.... like Sacred 2 or Marvel Ultimate Alliance.

Not sure if you'd really like Dragon Age. It's not really an action RPG since you don't have direct control of your character(s). Instead it's a little like KOTOR in that you queue up a set actions.

Both have their share of technical gaffes, but what game doesn't?

thattotally

Thank you... I know it seems I'm being rather picky, but again that's only because I'm not a heavy gamer and just want a fun game to play. I mean is there no "definitive rpg" equivalent to last gen and the few that were fun?

This is all coming from the fact that I just finished Final Fantasy 12, and I think I enjoyed it so much that it turned me off from every other game available. Final Fantasy 12 may not have been the action rpg I would like, but it featured absolutely no battle load times, and it wasn't a shooter to boot. That's really all I'm looking for, and does that mean I have to buy a PC or 360 to get it? With the ps3 getting the shaft left and right, and I'm not in a situation or environment that's compatible with a 360... and I don't do PCs, because I'm not knowledgeable in that regard, nor care to be.

I guess maybe that just means I'm not a fan of Western RPGs, period? Now if there was a WRPG for a handheld, say DS or PSP... then we're getting somewhere. I'm a handheld gamer first and foremost after all.

There's a few on DS. I really liked Mario & Luigi Partners in Time and Phantom Hourglass. Then again, they're both Japanese, but still action rather than turn-based.

The good ones on PSP are predominantly turn-based JRPGs so you may be out of luck there.

However, since you liked FF12 both platforms have a bunch of Final Fantasy games on them if you haven't already checked them out.

You definately need Demon's Souls...

trollop_scat

. I personally like the fresh take on RPG's that this generation has begun. How many times can you kill the dragon/save the princess...

T_0_D

what games nthis gen are you referring to that have a fresh take on the RPG genre?

Sticking with console RPGs that aren't shooters excluding oblivion, the western developed games I can think of off the top of my head are Dragon Age: Origins, Sacred 2, Fable 2, Two Worlds and Rise of the Argonauts...

keep in mind these are all high fantasy games. The more sci-fi centric focus on more recent games like Mass Effect and the forthcoming alpha protocol are a great change of pace if you ask me. I hardly think all WRPGs are shooters... You have mass effect which is primarily shooter, Fallout 3 which can be played like a shooter (but is not designed around this). What else is there?

[QUOTE="T_0_D"]

. I personally like the fresh take on RPG's that this generation has begun. How many times can you kill the dragon/save the princess...

Kandlegoat

what games nthis gen are you referring to that have a fresh take on the RPG genre?

There's a few on DS. I really liked Mario & Luigi Partners in Time and Phantom Hourglass. Then again, they're both Japanese, but still action rather than turn-based.

The good ones on PSP are predominantly turn-based JRPGs so you may be out of luck there.

However, since you liked FF12 both platforms have a bunch of Final Fantasy games on them if you haven't already checked them out.

VoodooHak

No, I mean western rpg's, not exceptionally great games that I already have. Heh as a handheld gamer, do you really think I would forget to buy the Mario and Luigi rpg's :) ?

I already know the games available for the psp and DS, however I started thinking about the The Elder Scrolls game that was dropped for the psp, and how the handhelds don't receive that kind of support from those two wrpg companies.

So you point out that a WRPG isn't a shooter, but then put it down anyway as not being a game for you.

Sorry but this thread fails, go cry somewhere else.

Also ideally, I'd like the games to be on ps3...

I mean after hearing about how great this game "KOTOR" was and made by Bioware, I always wanted to try it. But the fact that it was PC only and never released for the ps2? I can't respect or care for a developer that just takes the easy way out and develop for easier platforms. Am I wrong in that regard?

Also ideally, I'd like the games to be on ps3...

I mean after hearing about how great this game "KOTOR" was and made by Bioware, I always wanted to try it. But the fact that it was PC only and never released for the ps2? I can't respect or care for a developer that just takes the easy way out and develop for easier platforms. Am I wrong in that regard?

thattotally

Also ideally, I'd like the games to be on ps3...

I mean after hearing about how great this game "KOTOR" was and made by Bioware, I always wanted to try it. But the fact that it was PC only and never released for the ps2? I can't respect or care for a developer that just takes the easy way out and develop for easier platforms. Am I wrong in that regard?

thattotally

[QUOTE="VoodooHak"]

Your requirements... some of them stated explicitly by you and others I'm deriving from the rest of your post:

• Console-only
• This gen only
• Action RPG only
• Non-shooter

Let me know if any of these are wrong.

That really doesn't leave much this gen. The only one that has gotten consistent critical acclaim are Dragon Age and Fable 2. That's the only one that seems to fit your rather narrow set of RGS needs. The rest I can think of had lukewarm reception when they released.... like Sacred 2 or Marvel Ultimate Alliance.

Not sure if you'd really like Dragon Age. It's not really an action RPG since you don't have direct control of your character(s). Instead it's a little like KOTOR in that you queue up a set actions.

Both have their share of technical gaffes, but what game doesn't?

thattotally

Thank you... I know it seems I'm being rather picky, but again that's only because I'm not a heavy gamer and just want a fun game to play. I mean is there no "definitive rpg" equivalent to last gen and the few that were fun?

This is all coming from the fact that I just finished Final Fantasy 12, and I think I enjoyed it so much that it turned me off from every other game available. Final Fantasy 12 may not have been the action rpg I would like, but it featured absolutely no battle load times, and it wasn't a shooter to boot. That's really all I'm looking for, and does that mean I have to buy a PC or 360 to get it? With the ps3 getting the shaft left and right, and I'm not in a situation or environment that's compatible with a 360... and I don't do PCs, because I'm not knowledgeable in that regard, nor care to be.

I guess maybe that just means I'm not a fan of Western RPGs, period? Now if there was a WRPG for a handheld, say DS or PSP... then we're getting somewhere. I'm a handheld gamer first and foremost after all.

I understand YOU want fun when you play but i REALLY enjoy games like Demons Souls and Risen that have steep but rewarding learning curves. Whats to say games like that are not fun? Your statement is annoying to be fair.

Oh and i would consider any FF game a step towards challenging if you play them without abusing and attempt to kill everything in the world, if you find that fun you will probably like most other RPGS Oh and the PSP has a Western .. RPG on it called Dungeons and Dragons it seems very good as well look it up. < I know its a D&D game i just can not remember the title properly it should be easy enough to find tho.

fable 2 is your kind of game it seems.

dragon age.

Now, there is also Fallout 3. Short of it being a very bland and ugly looking game, both the third person and first person perspectives of combat shooting are annoying. When people say rpg's, I really expect rpg's, not games where I have to wiggle the analog stick around to shoot stuff. I mean I don't like the Call of Duty, Halo, and the billion 'n one shooters on the market to enjoy that type of play (unless there's auto aiming which for a non-gamer like me makes the game more fun to play).

thattotally

Now, I get it, you don't like Fallout 3, but saying you have to "wiggle the analog sticks around to shoot stuff" is way off. I've played the game extensively. Gotten the platinum, played through most of the expansions, etc., and I pretty much never play it like a shooter. I use the VATS system to kill everything, and it works pretty much exactly like killing things in Fallout 1 and 2 did. Pull up the menu, select the target, and let the game do the shooting for you. You mention auto-aim? VATS takes it to the next level, with auto-aim, auto-shoot. Even if you run out of AP, you can use vats to auto-aim, bring it up, select a target, then exit the menu, and shoot. You will still be lined up. If your problem is that you don't like FPS gameplay, then you were just playing the game wrong. If your problem is really that you don't want a modern or futuristic setting, and want your RPGs to be strictly fantasy based, well good luck. Not even Final Fantasy can help you there, since most of them have sci-fi and technology mixed in.