Are Nintendo IPs more niche than we think?

Nintendo is known for having some of the most recognizable names in gaming. I doubt there are many gamers who can't tell you what Mario, Zelda, or Pokemon are, even those who don't really consider themselves gamers can recognize Mario and Co. instantly.

But when it comes to brand recognition, it seems only these precious few properties are instantly recognizable to a mass audience. By comparison, titles like Rhythm Heaven, Star Fox, Fire Emblem, Pikmin, even Splatoon, while successful in their own right, are comparatively more niche, and not every gamer is guaranteed to have heard of or played them.

Even Splatoon, Nintendo's first truly break-out new IP since Wii Sports, is a far more popular phenomenon in Japan than it is here in the west (not to say Splatoon isn't popular here, but it's presence in Japan dwarfs it's US presence). On top of that, many children are increasingly being raised on Minecraft, Skylanders, and the deluge of Free to Play titles on iOS and Android. To kids, Mario, simply feels like a well known Video Game icon next to Sonic and Pac-Man, rather than the face of gaming. For older gamers, Call of Duty, The Witcher, Uncharted, and many other AAA franchise are the new faces of modern gaming. Game design has evolved, and a lot of gamers want more from their graphics and presentation these days.

This is what I fear could potentially happen to Nintendo and the Switch. Nintendo has the opportunity to recapture the success and popularity of original Wii and DS, but I fear it may be too little, too late. Nintendo for better or worse, is still making and curating the same types of games and experiences it's been doing since they first entered the gaming industry as an Arcade developer. As a Nintendo fan, that's all fine and good. But can the likes of Pikmin, ARMS, Splatoon, Fire Emblem, etc. be system sellers in the US? Look at the NPD sales for retail games, most of them are dominated by Hollywood-style blockbusters made, not by platform holders, but third party publishers.

It seems like more and more the concept of first party games becomes more and more niche as companies like EA and Ubisoft control the US market. So I just wonder if Nintendo's IPs and philosophies of game design are more niche than we are led to believe.

Not really. We all know where their IP's stand.

A tier: Mario, Zelda, Pokemon

B tier: Kibry, Metroid, Animal Crossing

C tier: Star Fox, F-Zero, Fire Emblem

D tier: Punch-Out, Advanced Wars, Golden Sun

E tier: Custom Robo, Kid Icarus

Ten years ago, before parents gave up and just let their kids play any M rated bullshit that came down the pipe, I'd say no... They were not niche.

Fast forward to today, where I have first grade kids describe missions in GTA to me as well as their K/D ratio In cod?

Nintendo is super niche by comparison.

surprisingly zelda doesn't sell as much as other big nintendo IPs. i remember seeing BOTW has an estimated 60% attach rate among the current switch install base.

it's still a long-shot from niche. there's a large and dedicated nintendo fanbase and a large amount of mainstream consumers who will play mario, zelda, mario kart, smash bros., and pokemon.

@Juub1990: they should do another custom robo...

They sell millions of consoles all on their own, they are decidedly not niche.

Ask someone on the street to name everyone in the original Smash Bros, hell, even Melee and they'd probably nail 80-90% of them. Ask them about any number of Sony or Microsoft franchises? And you'll get funny looks.

The games in bold are niche. Rhythm Heaven and Pikmin are also niche. What else is niche?

Animal Crossing has sold over 30M units across 6 games. That's an average of 5M per game. How is that niche exactly?

Its aimed more towards casuals.

@GameboyTroy: Animal Crossing sells 10 million copies, that's not fucking niche

Which is a gamers way of saying it targests a broader market... which is kind of the opposite of what niche is lmao.

Lol. Casuals are the target audience.

Think really hard and see that these posts don't add up.

So according to GameboyTroy, Justin Bieber is niche because appealing to the mainstream makes something niche by default.

D tier for Punch-Out? Blasphemy!

Mike Tyson's Punch-Out is one of the most iconic games of all time. It is still a part of pop culture today even appearing on The Tonight Show recently and would definitely be recognized and fondly remembered by anybody that is old enough to have grown up during the NES years. The sequels were both pretty great as well. It deserves better than D tier.

The only Nintendo franchises that sell millions are Pokemon, Mario and Zelda.

True but the classic came out 30 years ago. Old-timers still remember it fondly but kids these days don't know what Punch-Out is and in terms of sales and media attention it is definitely below the likes of Fire Emblem these days.

Bieber is more popular than Animal Crossing.

Splatoon too. Also Fire Emblem now. And Animal Crossing. Lets not forget Tomodachi Life either. Nintendogs+Cats where you at? Kirby in the house, woot, woot. Going hard like Donkey Kong.

@iandizion713: none of those are as known as Mario Zelda or Pokemon. so they don't fit in with the topic at hand

About as niche as Mickey Mouse.

After Awakening, Fire Emblem is now in the B close to A territory.

The point is none of those are niche, they all sell millions. Splatoon almost sold 5million on a dead console, what the **** you smokin bro.

No shit? lol

Of course he's more popular than Animal Crossing, he's more popular than just about any game in existence.

I'm not comparing popularity between an entertainer and a game. I'm pointing out how weird your logic is here.

This seems to be true.

And yet even Big Rigs is better than Beiber :)

Well it depends on the game.

Zelda clearly is borderline indie, but 1-2-Switch is AAAA like GTA.

And?

Animal Crossing sells about 8-10 million units. Super Smash Bros. sells about 10 million units. Ditto Mario Kart.

Fire Emblem has sold an average of 2.5 million units for the last two entries. Splatoon sold 5 million with its first entry. Metroid sells about 2 million units on average.

The question is- are these franchises niche? Anything that's selling 2 million or above is not niche. It was an asinine argument when Xbox fans tried to use it against Bloodborne and Dark Souls. It's an asinine argument now.

@iandizion713: splatoon was a new IP and a shooter, a first for Nintendo, on a console that got like 1 new game every 3 months. I would hope it would sell millions it had nothing against it.

@jcrame10: What about all the other games that didnt sell a million then?

@charizard1605: would your be more likely to know who pikachu is or the villager? And do you know the name of the character that is my avatar on here?

@iandizion713: what games are those? Didn't most of the wii u titles hit the million mark?

So if your definition of 'not niche' is 'average person recognizes character,' then these are the only non niche games ever made, going by mainstream recognition:

• Mario
• Zelda
• Pokemon
• Pac-Man
• Sonic
• GTA
• Call of Duty
• Skyrim
• Angry Birds
• Minecraft
• World of Warcraft
• Halo

Are we agreed on this?

Uncharted is niche confirmed.

@jcrame10: Thats cause your Fire Emblem character is niche. Go ask people who Roy, Ike, Lucina, etc are. You cant expect people to know Stefan.

@charizard1605: I would add in god of war, gears of war and forza but yep for the most part seems spot on.

Take out GTA, CoD, Skyrim, and WoW.

Maybe leave in WoW as the art style alone is incredibly recognizable. Subtract the others you listed though, I agree. And maybe add in Street Fighter 2 strictly for Ryu and Chun Li.

The average person neither knows Kratos nor God of War; ditto Gears of War. Ditto Forza. Something like Tomb Raider or Gran Turismo would be better suited over either of those.

But okay, if that's the definition you are using, then the entire video game industry is niche. That's not the definition I am using. I am saying, within the parameters of the video game industry being what it is, are Nintendo IPs niche? More are not than are.

Also, if character recognition is used to denote whether something is niche or not, you can't forget Kirby, Donkey Kong, and Yoshi either- since character recognition is strictly the criteria you are using here.

Pokemon Go's success blew the question out of the water.

The average person on the street absolutely has heard of Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, and Skyrim, however, subtracting those from the list seems very... well, inaccurate to me. Of course, Call of Duty and GTA don't have iconic characters associated with them (Skyrim at least has the Dohvahkiin), so there is that.

I forgot, but I would throw in Final Fantasy on that list, too.

None of those are instantly recognizable to non-gamers.

If Nintendo games sell millions of copies, much more than most Microsoft and Sony's first-party titles and most third-party titles, then how can they be "niche" titles?

Most people would not know Uncharted, most Sony franchises are niche because they don''t build them up into decade long blockbusters that define their brand. Gran Turismo and God of War are exceptions to the rule.

I like Roy but no one gives a shit about him besides Melee fans. Hes not even that popular within the FE community. And there is no Fire Emblem character that is at the level of Mario, Sonic, Zelda, Pokemon, etc. Ike is the most popular but i doubt many outside of the FE/Smash community would know him.

GTA, CoD, WoW all huge. Every parent feared GTA in the early 00s and every parent now accepts that their 10 year old is in love with CoD. WoW, there was a movie based on it.

Speaking of movies, yes Tomb Raider and Resident Evil definitely should be on the list. Gran Turismo was another good one I missed as well.

Yes, the average person has heard of CoD, GTA, and Skyrim. But would they instantly recognize them when they see a character from those IPs?

They would recognize the brand- the logo, the colors, the font style, etc. All of those franchises have widespread brand recognition.

@jcrame10: Who cares though. Hardly any characters in gaming are as popular as Mario. In the Nintendo world, theyre popular. And thats all that matters.

@charizard1605:

Yeah I suppose it comes down to if we're talking about an actual IP, or just the characters themselves. But yeah, everyone knows GTA and CoD, and while average joe may not know what Elder Scrolls is, they'd have a good chance of knowing what Skyrim is.

Your criteria was about recognizable characters, mate.