Assassin's Creed Unity is 900p/30fps on both PS4 & Xbox One

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04dcarraher

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#102 04dcarraher
Member since 2004 • 23858 Posts

@Wasdie:

Multithreading on the 360 was the norm by 2007, now the PS3 yeah devs still had ports only using the PPE and only a few SPE's or none at all while others used all the multithreading ability of Cell. But in general multithreading is not the issue.

These cpu's are hurting the potential performance of the gpus in open areas with alot of cpu orientated workloads with lots of npcs and phyics etc. Once they start offloading tasks to gpu it will help alot for the cpu, however on the other side throwing too much onto the gpu will also eat into the gpu's processing power lowering gpu's ability.

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AM-Gamer

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#103 AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@clyde46: Cpus have little to do with resolution, I feared this would happen especially on third party titles that MS pays for extra marketing.

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ShepardCommandr

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#104 ShepardCommandr
Member since 2013 • 4939 Posts

X1 holding the PS4 back confirmed

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04dcarraher

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#105 04dcarraher
Member since 2004 • 23858 Posts

@AM-Gamer said:

@clyde46: Cpus have little to do with resolution, I feared this would happen especially on third party titles that MS pays for extra marketing.

lol.... cpu's feed the gpu and if most if not all cpu resources are doing other tasks the gpu gets left starving for data hence needing 30 fps standard non linear games

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Chutebox

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#106  Edited By Chutebox  Online
Member since 2007 • 51609 Posts

@04dcarraher said:
@Chutebox said:

@Tighaman said:

I told yall that the ps4 was cpu bound there is not one cpu heavy game running on the system but cows gonna blame it on MS even though they know the xbox has cpu offloading to the cloud. This is Sony fault not Microsoft .

Im going to say it again ps4 will not have big games with lot's of stuff going on or great

WI at 1080p

Ps4 already has a big game with a lot going on...

And just lol at your whole comment

I think he is saying big as in open areas with alot going on screen, But examples like BF4 MP, fps takes a nose dive when alot of action goes on, then ISS framerate without the 30 fps cap fps.... fluctuated with fast camera motion or alot of action going on. Unless the game is a corridor/linear game 60 fps standard with highest fidelity is not possible.

Hehe, I don't expect 60fps to be a standard at all, unless resolution drops.

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#107 highking_kallor
Member since 2014 • 594 Posts

@clyde46 said:

Paging Mr @04dcarraher We have consolites that need educating.

Why you have to call in your bf? Is the info beyond you, leaving you struggling to grasp hence why you need a grown up to come in and explain? Maybe you should just shut it rather than show your ignorance? Or you could do some research and learn something.

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AM-Gamer

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#108  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@04dcarraher: That's for the frames, there is no excuse for the PS4 and X1 to have complete parity when the PS4 has almost 50% more gpu power.

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ReadingRainbow4

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#109  Edited By ReadingRainbow4
Member since 2012 • 18733 Posts

@Wasdie said:

@clyde46 said:

@Wasdie said:

Apparently I was incorrect. The CPUs for the consoles are too weak. Then again there are still a large number of factors. Could be an instance of them not properly utilizing the cores yet. Multithreading is difficult even for seasoned veterans.

Can you explain to this lot how a weak CPU will affect resolution and graphics etc?

The CPU sets up the entire scene before sending it to the GPU for processing. It processes user inputs to figure out where the camera needs to be, processes all of the AI actor data so it knows where to place each AI entity for the scene and what point during their current animation they are doing, sets up the geometry, calculates shadows (this is split between CPU/GPU, but you do need the outlines of the geometry that are set up by the CPU), and basically anything else the scene needs calculated before it can be drawn. Throw enough AI in the scene and that can slow down that backend update rate.

They said the amount of AI actors they have is their biggest bottleneck which isn't too surprising. The AI in Assassin's Creed isn't like the AI in RTSs and whatnot. Each actor is more complex and is under its own control. So while Total War can do 20,000 actors on screen at once even on an older CPU, the way its actually handling that is much different. Here each single actor is its own entity, running its own animations, under its own set of circumstances, probably has its own pathfinding, and can be interacted with by the player or other AI actors.

They probably capped it at 30fps because during the most actor intense scenes they were noticing drops from 60 to lower numbers. In general, framerate drops on console games really suck as you can't really do anything about it. On the PC you can turn down settings or upgrade so framerate drops are more accepted for weaker machines. With consoles you want a rock solid FPS whenever possible. Framerate drops on fixed hardware a lot less acceptable.

The whole resolution thing is going to be a business decision from a higher up. Maybe Microsoft doesn't want yet another PS4 game to be 1080p over 900p as they see that as bad press. Maybe some higher up simply doesn't want that bad press either. It's certainly not a CPU related thing. Resolution has much more to do with the GPU and RAM than the CPU.

Thank you for explaining that to Clyde.

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04dcarraher

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#110  Edited By 04dcarraher
Member since 2004 • 23858 Posts
@AM-Gamer said:

@04dcarraher: That's for the frames, there is no excuse for the PS4 and X1 to have complete parity when the PS4 has almost 50% more gpu power.

the PS4 gpu does not have a true .5x more processing power. overall its actually under 40% faster. But yes the PS4 could have done 1080p while X1 only could do 900p.

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clyde46

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#111  Edited By clyde46
Member since 2005 • 49061 Posts

@highking_kallor said:

@clyde46 said:

Paging Mr @04dcarraher We have consolites that need educating.

Why you have to call in your bf? Is the info beyond you, leaving you struggling to grasp hence why you need a grown up to come in and explain? Maybe you should just shut it rather than show your ignorance? Or you could do some research and learn something.

Or maybe I can get someone with a much better understanding about what is going on here to explain things. I make no bones about what I do and don't know and I'm not afraid of having someone with more experience explain it to me etc. So calm your tits man.

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#112  Edited By Tighaman
Member since 2006 • 1038 Posts

@Chutebox: you always got something to say without saying nothing . What game ? Bf4? You don't need much cpu to run it unless you are using bots for some of the people online, the only reason killzone touched 60fps on multiplayer because it didn't need cpu for AI

So what game you talkin about ISS it was very low AI, destruction, low NPC count and still had unlocked framerate

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#113  Edited By Chutebox  Online
Member since 2007 • 51609 Posts

@Tighaman said:

@Chutebox: you always got something to say without saying nothing . What game ? Bf4? You don't need much cpu to run it unless you are using bots for some of the people online, the only reason killzone touched 60fps on multiplayer because it didn't need cpu for AI

So what game you talkin about ISS it was very low AI, destruction, low NPC count and still had unlocked framerate

You might want to reread what you typed.

If you're talking about fps only, then you're right. If you're talking about resolution and things going on screen ech, you're wrong There are extremely intense moments with a shit load going on in the game.

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#114 Chutebox  Online
Member since 2007 • 51609 Posts

@Chutebox said:

@Tighaman said:

@Chutebox: you always got something to say without saying nothing . What game ? Bf4? You don't need much cpu to run it unless you are using bots for some of the people online, the only reason killzone touched 60fps on multiplayer because it didn't need cpu for AI

So what game you talkin about ISS it was very low AI, destruction, low NPC count and still had unlocked framerate

You might want to reread what you typed.

If you're talking about fps only, then you're right. If you're talking about resolution and things going on screen ech, you're wrong There are extremely intense moments with a shit load going on in the game.

And I laughed hard at your cloud comment, because it's done soooo much so far.

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#115  Edited By Gue1
Member since 2004 • 12171 Posts

@04dcarraher said:

@Wasdie:

Multithreading on the 360 was the norm by 2007, now the PS3 yeah devs still had ports only using the PPE and only a few SPE's or none at all while others used all the multithreading ability of Cell. But in general multithreading is not the issue.

These cpu's are hurting the potential performance of the gpus in open areas with alot of cpu orientated workloads with lots of npcs and phyics etc. Once they start offloading tasks to gpu it will help alot for the cpu, however on the other side throwing too much onto the gpu will also eat into the gpu's processing power lowering gpu's ability.

you're confused. The Cell had no multi-threading and using the SPE's was an obligation because the RSX was weak and the PPE alone couldn't handle everything. At least not handle the same amount of computation that the 360's tri-core could.

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#116  Edited By 04dcarraher
Member since 2004 • 23858 Posts
@Gue1 said:

@04dcarraher said:

@Wasdie:

Multithreading on the 360 was the norm by 2007, now the PS3 yeah devs still had ports only using the PPE and only a few SPE's or none at all while others used all the multithreading ability of Cell. But in general multithreading is not the issue.

These cpu's are hurting the potential performance of the gpus in open areas with alot of cpu orientated workloads with lots of npcs and phyics etc. Once they start offloading tasks to gpu it will help alot for the cpu, however on the other side throwing too much onto the gpu will also eat into the gpu's processing power lowering gpu's ability.

you're confused. The Cell had no multi-threading and using the SPE's was an obligation because the RSX was weak and the PPE alone couldn't handle everything alone.

Yes the Cell had multithreading.... devs did offload cpu workloads to specific SPE's.... Using more then one processor for tasks/code is multithreading. The Cell handled physics, animation updates, particle systems, sound and other gpu tasks as well. Multithreading was needed and was used... or you wouldnt have had those good looking games that ran good as well because if they only had the PPE doing all the work that the 360's triple core was doing it would have been impossible to run those games.

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#117 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

The Xbox One shackling the PS4 to its level of mediocrity.

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#118 mjorh
Member since 2011 • 6749 Posts

"We were quickly bottlenecked" !

Man this is an utter frustration for so called "next-gen" !

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#119 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 22688 Posts

Ohhhh noooooo!!!!! It's only 900p?!?!? That means I can't play it then... it's just ruined now!

Some people need to get a life, seriously.

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#120  Edited By Gue1
Member since 2004 • 12171 Posts

@04dcarraher said:
@Gue1 said:

@04dcarraher said:

@Wasdie:

Multithreading on the 360 was the norm by 2007, now the PS3 yeah devs still had ports only using the PPE and only a few SPE's or none at all while others used all the multithreading ability of Cell. But in general multithreading is not the issue.

These cpu's are hurting the potential performance of the gpus in open areas with alot of cpu orientated workloads with lots of npcs and phyics etc. Once they start offloading tasks to gpu it will help alot for the cpu, however on the other side throwing too much onto the gpu will also eat into the gpu's processing power lowering gpu's ability.

you're confused. The Cell had no multi-threading and using the SPE's was an obligation because the RSX was weak and the PPE alone couldn't handle everything alone.

Yes the Cell had multithreading.... devs did offload cpu workloads to specific SPE's. the term multithreading "by which a single set of code can be used by several processors at different stages of execution".... The Cell handled physics, animation updates, particle systems, sound and other gpu tasks as well. Multithreading was needed and was used... or you wouldnt have had those good looking games that ran good as well because if they only had the PPE doing all the work that the 360's triple core was doing it would have been impossible to run those games.

my bad, my bad, I'm wrong. I confused multi with hyper threading, sorry. You're right.

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#121  Edited By misterpmedia
Member since 2013 • 6209 Posts

gaf keeps delivering.

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#122 emgesp
Member since 2004 • 7849 Posts

PS4's Custom GPGPU features is there to help the weak CPU. How come developers aren't taking advantage of it?

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04dcarraher

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#123  Edited By 04dcarraher
Member since 2004 • 23858 Posts

@Gue1 said:

@04dcarraher said:
@Gue1 said:

@04dcarraher said:

@Wasdie:

Multithreading on the 360 was the norm by 2007, now the PS3 yeah devs still had ports only using the PPE and only a few SPE's or none at all while others used all the multithreading ability of Cell. But in general multithreading is not the issue.

These cpu's are hurting the potential performance of the gpus in open areas with alot of cpu orientated workloads with lots of npcs and phyics etc. Once they start offloading tasks to gpu it will help alot for the cpu, however on the other side throwing too much onto the gpu will also eat into the gpu's processing power lowering gpu's ability.

you're confused. The Cell had no multi-threading and using the SPE's was an obligation because the RSX was weak and the PPE alone couldn't handle everything alone.

Yes the Cell had multithreading.... devs did offload cpu workloads to specific SPE's. the term multithreading "by which a single set of code can be used by several processors at different stages of execution".... The Cell handled physics, animation updates, particle systems, sound and other gpu tasks as well. Multithreading was needed and was used... or you wouldnt have had those good looking games that ran good as well because if they only had the PPE doing all the work that the 360's triple core was doing it would have been impossible to run those games.

my bad, my bad, I'm wrong. I confused multi with hyper threading, sorry. You're right.

no problem, but HT is multithreading too, but it splits the physical core's cpu cycles to process another thread of code/task. With the sheer amount of processing power behind intel's icores HT for multithreading isnt an issue, hence the reason why AMD's eight cores still fall behind with games and apps that make use of 8 threads"multithreading" vs i7's.

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#125 PhazonBlazer
Member since 2007 • 12013 Posts

Palm, apply directly to the face.

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#126 NFJSupreme
Member since 2005 • 6605 Posts

@emgesp: those resources are probably being used for rendering. It's a watered down 7870 inside the ps4 it's not like the ps4 just has all this extra power just laying around not being used. There is no 290x in there. Gpgpu might sound nice but it requires extra resources. If the gpu is already being taxed it's not going to be a solution to a weak cpu.

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#127 mjorh
Member since 2011 • 6749 Posts

@hrt_rulz01 said:

Ohhhh noooooo!!!!! It's only 900p?!?!? That means I can't play it then... it's just ruined now!

Some people need to get a life, seriously.

It's not about being able to play it or sth , It's about the advancement . Gaming industry needs to develop in every aspect ....

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#128  Edited By HaloinventedFPS
Member since 2010 • 4738 Posts

Didn't Ubisoft claim 1080p/60fps for the PS4 version?

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#129  Edited By finalstar2007
Member since 2008 • 27952 Posts

Eh im not the kind of gamer that see small differences in graphics i'll still get this game for the co-op on PS4 later next year.

Now i hope Square Enix will not drop the graphics for FF15 on PS4 because of X1's weaker hardware or that would really suck, i just want that game to be perfect.

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#130 sailor232
Member since 2003 • 6880 Posts

I bet the game will still sell over 3 million copies, this is why they can come straight out and say these things. Everyone is all talk until release date, then they feed Ubisoft money.

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#131 NFJSupreme
Member since 2005 • 6605 Posts

@mjorh: um the advancements are there. The game us available at 1080p or greater if you like. You just have to have an adequate pc.

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#132  Edited By mikhail
Member since 2003 • 2697 Posts

@finalstar2007 said:

Eh im not the kind of gamer that see small differences in graphics i'll still get this game for the co-op on PS4 later next year.

Now i hope Square Enix will not drop the graphics for FF15 on PS4 because of X1's weaker hardware or that would really suck, i just want that game to be perfect.

So you don't see small differences in graphics, but you also care about graphics??? What?

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#133  Edited By finalstar2007
Member since 2008 • 27952 Posts

@mikhail said:

@finalstar2007 said:

Eh im not the kind of gamer that see small differences in graphics i'll still get this game for the co-op on PS4 later next year.

Now i hope Square Enix will not drop the graphics for FF15 on PS4 because of X1's weaker hardware or that would really suck, i just want that game to be perfect.

So you don't see small differences in graphics, but you also care about graphics??? What?

As i said i want FF15 to be perfect.

I wont notice anything even if they drop the graphics down lol

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#134  Edited By mikhail
Member since 2003 • 2697 Posts

@finalstar2007: I don't know why you would start talking about Final Fantasy in a Unity comparison thread...but alright.

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#135  Edited By tonitorsi
Member since 2006 • 8692 Posts

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#136  Edited By santoron
Member since 2006 • 8584 Posts

I'm glad ubisoft's foot in mouth quote is getting so much play around the net. Shining a light on anti-consumer practices like this is the only way to make devs think twice about bowing to pressure from MS to pretend their machine matches up.

Can't wait to hear Phil Spencer's thoughts on this one...

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#137 tormentos
Member since 2003 • 33795 Posts

@deadline-zero0 said:

@Nike_Air said:

Could you imagine ? The PC version is also getting the 900p / 30 FPS cap to avoid all the debates and stuff!

You can't capp it, similar to 30fps. There's always ways around it. The issue is that it isn't optmized for it. And 30fps locked games on pc is mostly lazy devs, not parity because companies are fighting.

Honestly, this shit just proves why having settings options, including resolution, on consoles would be best thing. Locked resolution in 2014. Fucking pathetic.

There wasn't one for NFS it was capped at 30 and the speed hack actually turned the game into a Benny hill ending like sequence.

Loading Video...

@04dcarraher said:

@Wasdie said:

Apparently I was incorrect. The CPUs for the consoles are too weak. Then again there are still a large number of factors. Could be an instance of them not properly utilizing the cores yet. Multithreading is difficult even for seasoned veterans.

Can you explain to this lot how a weak CPU will affect resolution and graphics etc?

Wasdie come on man.... multithreading on consoles has been standard and been going on since 2007. Its no different on these new consoles they are using all six cores available for the games, because they have too.... so they can get by. These Jaguar cpu's are only at 1.6 ghz and their performance per clock are equal to slightly better the AMD old Athlon x2's from 2006. So imagine a 1.6 ghz six core Athlon X2 with modern features. Trying to do ai, physics, audio, and feed a gpu that is 6x faster then any 2006 era cpu had to feed before. Which is why their looking into gpgpu tasks to off load typical cpu jobs (like physics) where the gpu has the spare processing to allow the cpu to free up its resources for other things.

CPU Load

  • 60 AI characters
  • 940 entities, 300 active
  • 8200 physics objects (1500 key-framed, 6700 static)
  • 500 particle systems
  • 120 sound voices
  • 110 ray casts
  • 1000 jobs per frame

What the PS4 CPU was doing on a launch game Killzone SF.

This was on launch now by that time the final devkit wasn't on hand so the CPU was even doing sounds,so i don't believe Ubisoft crap they are giving 2 conflicting version here.

On 1 they claim they on purpose have parity between both versions to avoid arguments about superior versions.

And on the other they blame the CPU for lower resolution when that is a job of the GPU.

If you have a weak CPU and a strong GPU it will be the frames what suffer not the resolution.

This game was hold back on purpose this is the same company who downgraded Watchdogs and advertised the game on PS4 as 1080p 60FPS.

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Chutebox

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#138 Chutebox  Online
Member since 2007 • 51609 Posts

@highking_kallor said:

@clyde46 said:

@highking_kallor said:

@clyde46 said:

Paging Mr @04dcarraher We have consolites that need educating.

Why you have to call in your bf? Is the info beyond you, leaving you struggling to grasp hence why you need a grown up to come in and explain? Maybe you should just shut it rather than show your ignorance? Or you could do some research and learn something.

Or maybe I can get someone with a much better understanding about what is going on here to explain things. I make no bones about what I do and don't know and I'm not afraid of having someone with more experience explain it to me etc. So calm your tits man.

Hey bro its all good if you want to look like a weak minded bitch. No worries.

Forget taking a piss, who took a shit in your cereal?

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JangoWuzHere

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#139  Edited By JangoWuzHere
Member since 2007 • 19032 Posts

There wasn't any parity in the PS2/Xbox and PS3/360 generation. Developers have always tried to make the most out of these consoles. It seems really stupid to make compromises now.

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#140  Edited By mave198
Member since 2004 • 7334 Posts

DAT cloud.

Now the garbage console known as Xbone is actually causing devs to purposely gimp games to avoid internet debating.

TLHBO

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#141 X_CAPCOM_X
Member since 2004 • 9625 Posts

Wow this is awful. I don't even care about assassin's creed, but Microsoft is really doing damage here.

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#143 tormentos
Member since 2003 • 33795 Posts

@TheGuardian03 said:

"We decided to lock them at the same specs to avoid all the debates and stuff,"

They have to be complete morons at least the ones who did the PR,i mean like saying out loud we purposely held back the PS4 will not create even more debates,on neogaf the thread scaled into 50 pages in not time now is at 80...hahaha

I see a 1080p patch incoming rather quick..hahahaa

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#144  Edited By SolidTy
Member since 2005 • 49991 Posts

"Assassin's Creed Senior producer said that the reason boiled down to wanting to "avoid all the debates and stuff."

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lol. Watch out PC version! Ubisoft is doing their part to stop debates!!! lol.

Thank got the benevolent and angelic Ubisoft is taking an active stance to protect us gamers from nasty "graphic debates". I suppose making the best product you can on the available hardware, optimizing, and selling the product isn't as significant as stopping debates, lol.

Ubisoft's job isn't to take a stance on graphic debates...I hope the sales suffer for such absurd logic. I haven't bought an AC in years like COD, I don't care about annualized cookie cutter sequels, but this news is humorous if not infuriating.

I wonder what Ubisoft's political stance is on other humanist issues? Who will Ubisoft vote for President? It's like they are one collective being, doing their best to improve humanity, stopping debates they don't like at the cost of their product. It's so nice to know Daddy Ubisoft is out there protecting us from the harsh realities of scary "graphic debates".

I suppose UBISOFT is also interested in locking PC performance as well to also dampen debates? lol. Yeah right.

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Bigboi500

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#145 Bigboi500
Member since 2007 • 35550 Posts

Thanks, Xbox One. Pre-order cancelled. This title deserves nothing more than a rental.

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#146 PhazonBlazer
Member since 2007 • 12013 Posts

Not even I can defend this one Ubisoft.

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Boddicker

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#148 Boddicker
Member since 2012 • 4458 Posts

Well............I honestly did not see this coming.

I ass-umed the bigger dev's would push the PS4 and X1 to their respective limits. But after this open acknowledgement that the PS4 version was gimped to avoid parity debates...............

My hate was at a mild simmer for Ubisoft, but I was planning on buying Far Cry 4 and Valiant Hearts. Now I'm considering a full on Ubisoft boycott.

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cantloginnow

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#149 cantloginnow
Member since 2013 • 381 Posts

Lol,well get a good PC and leave the weak consoles behind.Both the ps4 and xbox are holding back games.

Lol at the Cows thinking the PS4 is powerful.Sony can get you guys to believe anything,its hilarious and the mob mentality of the Sony drones online blows my mind.

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DarthaPerkinjan

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#150 DarthaPerkinjan
Member since 2005 • 1326 Posts

People still play Assassin's Creed?