Concerning Mass Effect's combat system

I'llstart this thread bluntly.I am tired of people saying that it's not real time. I find it ironic that this game was first bashed for being a "shooter" and now it's being bashed for being "too slow paced" due to recent gameplay videos which were used to show off the RPG elements of the game because it was being bashed as a shooter by the ignorant populace. I have compiled a direct quote from IGN to end this madness and insanity. It starts at the end of page 1 of the article and continues onto page 2.

Page 1: http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/820/820296p1.html

Like its dialogue system, Mass Effect's approach to combat is to give the player layer upon layer of choice while trying to make the mechanisms for making those choices as streamlined as possible. Both systems are based on "wheels" - the dialogue wheel for conversation (more on that later), and the weapon wheel and power wheel for combat.

Page 2: http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/820/820296p2.html

The latter two work like this. When you first round a corner and spot a group of enemies, they'll each sport a red triangle above their heads, signaling that they mean you harm. If you think you can take them down with some simple run-and-gun moves, just squeeze the right trigger and fire away. Your squadmates will follow suit. But if you want or need to be more tactical about the situation, hold down the right bumper to bring up the power wheel.

While the wheel is overlayed, the screen pauses instantly, Matrix-**** You can still see the action and rotate the camera a full 360 degrees while the wheel is up. The power wheel shows each party member and their available powers (special abilities that can damage enemies, sabotage devices, heal party members, etc.), and as you rotate the thumbstick, you'll be able to cycle through the powers available to each party member. When you come across one you like, click the A button to choose it. Repeat the action for each member, and you'll have stacked up a chain of events that will be unleashed when you release the right bumper.

As you choose powers, you can (and should) rotate the camera with the other thumbstick in order to direct the mojo you're choosing onto specific enemies. Powers are effective on their own, but they can also be chained with other party members' powers and weapon attacks for maximum effect. For example, if you direct a Vanguard in your party to lift an enemy into the air with the throw power, you might switch to the weapon wheel and direct a soldier in your party to shoot the helpless critter while it's in the air. What's more, party members react not only to where you tell them to shoot, but also where you intend them to shoot. If you tell a Sentinel in your party to throw an enemy across the room and direct another party member to shoot it, the bullets will follow the enemy on his flight path.

We played our Cmdr. Shepard as an Infiltrator, a ****that mixes some aspects of the Soldier ****with the tech powers of an Engineer. At one point during our Eden Prime shootout, a berserk Geth goon lumbered toward us suddenly at breakneck speed, leveling his weapon and threatening to run us down. Shepard was toting a pistol at the time, so we quickly hit the left bumper to bring up her weapon wheel, pulled out our shotgun and buried a round in his chest at the last minute. We also could have used our overload tech power to quickly shock him into submission, but hey, we panicked.

Although its combat is technically real-time,Mass Effect's hybrid fighting system brings some of the best elements of turn-based, tactical combat to bear on what is essentially a third-person shooter. From what we've seen so far, the system is fairly simple in theory but takes time to fully master (which we didn't in the two short combat segments we were allowed to play). In the build we played, we didn't have the option to use in-game tutorials, but you will, which should make the combat system significantly easier to wrap your brain around.

Movement in Mass Effect feels like a blend of Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter 2, Rainbow Six Vegas and Gears of War, which is to say you have an over-the-shoulder view of your character, you can take cover behind objects by holding the thumbstick toward a wall or object, and you can hold down the A button to run quickly in short bursts before you get fatigued.

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I'll be happy if at least 1 person learns from this. The internet is a tool of knowledge holding all answers, don't make assumptions. Use it to find what you seek >_>

Only n00bs say that... everyone know's they can search for Gameplay video's for a game instead of asking in forums.

BTW: the game looks epic, awsome, fun, interesting, everthing I want from an action RPG.

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

i'm sure you don't have to pause and play every 2 seconds like they did in the videos. they were just trying to show off all the skills that you could use,

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

So you must have hated KOTOR then

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Newnab

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

wow... did you even read the article...

[QUOTE="Newnab"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

it depends on the class you choose. do you want me to find the article talking about classes too?

I'll be happy if at least 1 person learns from this. The internet is a tool of knowledge holding all answers, don't make assumptions. Use it to find what you seek >_>skelebull3000

So, plays like a regular western RPG where you can (if you choose) pause to select magics or attacks for the entire party.

My hype for the game just went up.

How long is it?

do you want me to find the article talking about classes too?skelebull3000

o.O Who ever says Mass Effect's combat system sucks...must suck at strategy type shooters. :) I can't wait,ME looks to have one of the best combat systems of any game in recent memory.

[QUOTE="Newnab"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

Nope, it's about options.

Same thing in KOTOR, only once did I ever do the whole, pause and set up my characters attack stuff.

The rest of the time I just rolled with it.

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.kcpp2b

So you must have hated KOTOR then

funny u should say that because i DESPISE KOTOR. Im not saying that ME is gonna be a bad game. I just think that if its anything like KOTOR i wouldnt touch it with a 20 ft. pole. Its not my type of game. Im not saying KOTOR isnt a good game, its getting good reviews all around and alot of people seem to luv it, so im guessing its really that good. But to me, I can not stand it at all. The combination of Star Wars (i hate Star Wars), boring "pause-play" mechanics, and the criminally boring cut scenes where people just stand around like morons and talk for hours really kill the game for me.

[QUOTE="skelebull3000"] I'll be happy if at least 1 person learns from this. The internet is a tool of knowledge holding all answers, don't make assumptions. Use it to find what you seek >_>Jandurin

So, plays like a regular western RPG where you can (if you choose) pause to select magics or attacks for the entire party.

My hype for the game just went up.

How long is it?

I can't give you an exact number for that since most of what I've read is complete speculation and devs usually make the length of the game longer than it is. I can give you this quote though.

IGN AU: Let's start with a biggie. What is the total number of explorable planets in the final build?

Chris Priestly: To be honest, I don't know the exact final number - and it depends on what you mean by explorable. In terms of the total number of celestial bodies, shall we call it, that you can visit in Mass Effect, the number is somewhere around 240 to 250. Of those, not all of them are explorable. It would be like visiting Jupiter here in our solar system; there's just nothing to do when you get there! Wow, you found a great big gas giant! If you tried to land on it, you would die instantly because the atmosphere is corrosive... so not everything you can land on. Some things you just look at and leave. Other times we have subplots where you can recover gases and strange minerals and that kind of thing - where you can do some scanning for materials.

Then there are those that are fully explorable, that are smaller and you can do on foot and some that are so large that you need to get into the Mako - the combination ATV tank that you get to use. Again, you're looking at somewhere around 20 to 30 full-sized, plot driven planets where you're going to have to explore around.

[QUOTE="Newnab"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

You can survive enemy encounters with simple commen sense!... take cover, expose the weakspots then destroy.

The "pause-play" is simply to make things more stratigic and to make flanking far more easier.

If you dont like a game for this reason I really think your just a pathetic kill all dont think about what happens to me gamer and plays GeOW, Halo games non stop.

If your a tactical shooter/RPG fan your going to love it and already can see it as a great feature to the combat.

[QUOTE="kcpp2b"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.-Serpahim-

So you must have hated KOTOR then

funny u should say that because i DESPISE KOTOR. Im not saying that ME is gonna be a bad game. I just think that if its anything like KOTOR i wouldnt touch it with a 20 ft. pole. Its not my type of game. Im not saying KOTOR isnt a good game, its getting good reviews all around and alot of people seem to luv it, so im guessing its really that good. But to me, I can not stand it at all. The combination of Star Wars (i hate Star Wars), boring "pause-play" mechanics, and the criminally boring cut scenes where people just stand around like morons and talk for hours really kill the game for me.

KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

Again, you're looking at somewhere around 20 to 30 full-sized, plot driven planets where you're going to have to explore around.skelebull3000

KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

Newnab

[QUOTE="skelebull3000"]do you want me to find the article talking about classes too?Jandurin

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox360/rpg/masseffect/news.html?sid=6178928&page=1

The last thing you'll do is pick from one of six classes in the game, three pure and three hybrid, which determine your fighter type. The three pure classes have three major traits that they'll evolve as they gain experience. Soldiers offer improved health, the ability to use all weapon types, and start with the ability to use medium armor with the option to specialize in heavy armor. Engineers are able to use an "omni tool" that allows them to decrypt security systems, repair or modify tech equipment, disrupt enemy weapons or shields, as well as heal their squad. Adepts rely on the unique "biotic" powers that let them lift or throw objects, shield their squad, and disable or destroy enemies.

The three hybrid classes essentially mix elements of the primary three. Infiltrators combine soldier and engineer abilities. Sentinels combine engineer and adept abilities. Finally, vanguards combine soldier and adept abilities. While you'll be able to develop the abilities of the different sets to their most advanced levels, which is same as the pure classes, the trade-off is that some of the classes just won't have access to some of the specific higher level abilities you'd only get in a pure class.

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Practically, with a soldier you just shoot th entire time whilst when you use the adept or enginner you have to use the "wheel" to activate your powers. I heard that you could also assign some powers to certain buttons but I'm not sure. This game lets you choose how you want to play.

Vanguard sounds like the class for me. Fighter/Mage.

[QUOTE="skelebull3000"]Again, you're looking at somewhere around 20 to 30 full-sized, plot driven planets where you're going to have to explore around.Jandurin

Unfortunately I always epose myself to the spoilers in the articles although they're not that bad. :P The place where you get the worst spoilers is when something is recently released and somebody posts the ending without placing a *SPOILERS* sticker on the title. That's when I completely shut ff bthe intenert to protect me from the spoilers. I did the same thing until I beat Halo 3 xD

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"][QUOTE="Newnab"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.sadikovic

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

You can survive enemy encounters with simple commen sense!... take cover, expose the weakspots then destroy.

The "pause-play" is simply to make things more stratigic and to make flanking far more easier.

If you dont like a game for this reason I really think your just a pathetic kill all dont think about what happens to me gamer and plays GeOW, Halo games non stop.

If your a tactical shooter/RPG fan your going to love it and already can see it as a great feature to the combat.

Baurus_1 asI remember Brother's in arms also had the same "pause and play" mechanics and people loved it especial tactical players... from what the reviewers say about that feature>>>>>your fanboyish sad opinion to hate a game that gives you combat choices the "snoozefest" isnt neccecary.

Assassins Creed looks a lot more fun.Baurus_1

AC= stealth action

ME=action/RPG

AC=set in past

ME=set in future

The fact that you even bother trying to compare them is beyond me. They're both completely different xD. They will also be the best games of the year IMO since I'm getting both ;)

Whoever says anything flatout bad against this game is a fanboy. It looks excellent. Even if it's not your type of game, then just say that and move along. Mass Effect is the console game to own this year.BioShockOwnz

[QUOTE="Newnab"]KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

Jandurin

"One of the best" ;)

[QUOTE="skelebull3000"]Again, you're looking at somewhere around 20 to 30 full-sized, plot driven planets where you're going to have to explore around.Jandurin

I wouldn't worry too much about looking around for Mass Effect news, there arebarely any spoilers about.

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Whoever says anything flatout bad against this game is a fanboy. It looks excellent. Even if it's not your type of game, then just say that and move along. Mass Effect is the console game to own this year.Jandurin

Yeah, I'm personally more excited for SMG. I guess it brings back the kid in me, lol. I loved the old days when I used to go over to my buddies house and we'd play his N64. The game of choice was Mario 64. I had a Playstation. :( Anyways, SMG looks to bring back the Mario gameplay that made Mario 64 so special and add new twists. I played the demo at Gamestop and the level design is just pure genious.

SMG, Mass Effect, and Crysis are the top dogs this year for sure. Uncharted is looking very good too. Everyone has a good game to play this year. :)

I played the demo at Gamestop and the level design is just pure genious. BioShockOwnz

But, SMG was great fun for the time I played. My Gamestop has the full game, too. I should go and continue my game :lol:.

But, I must resist, as I should just wait for it to be on my tv. *waits*

[QUOTE="-Serpahim-"][QUOTE="kcpp2b"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Newnab

So you must have hated KOTOR then

funny u should say that because i DESPISE KOTOR. Im not saying that ME is gonna be a bad game. I just think that if its anything like KOTOR i wouldnt touch it with a 20 ft. pole. Its not my type of game. Im not saying KOTOR isnt a good game, its getting good reviews all around and alot of people seem to luv it, so im guessing its really that good. But to me, I can not stand it at all. The combination of Star Wars (i hate Star Wars), boring "pause-play" mechanics, and the criminally boring cut scenes where people just stand around like morons and talk for hours really kill the game for me.

KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

I did listen to what they were saying, but it did it grudgingly (sp?) If KOTOR was a book, i would have thrown it out the window, not because the story is bad but because the presentation is horrible. Its like sumone who has a great idea for a novel, but has no talent in writing. The story in KOTOR was great but the cutscenes made it feel like a chore. The characters are so static throughout all the cutscenes. They dont even gesticulate for crying out loud. Figuring out the story of KOTOR was about as much fun as figuring out the background story of Oblivion through reading all the books in the game. I know I'm being picky but this is a completely biased opinion and sumthing like that really kills the game for me. I wish in addition to the "click-click-click-choice" dialgue they have in KOTOR, the also had some scripted cutscenes of the MGS type. i know they have FMVs but those are so far inbetween that you could easily forget the exist. And ingame > FMVs.

Also, another thing that bothers me about KOTOR is the whole Amesia angle. Amnesia is seriously the most pathetic plot device ever. Any dev that uses Amnesia in a game deserves a slap on the hand. Shame on them. There are other ways to explain things and create an intriguing character without going down the Amnesia route.

And the last thing that bugged me about KOTOR was the lack of emotion. I'm a big fan of Final Fantasy series and MGS series and the one thing these games have in common is that their characters are human. I dont mean it literally, I mean it metaphorically. Through out FFX you got to know Tidus and Yuna and the gang that the ending had a profound effect on you. You actually CARED what happened to the characters. As for MGS, play Snake Eater and play the final boss battle...enough said. On the other hand in KOTOR you are random jedi X doing random Jedi things with your arbitary companions. They could kill off everyone in my crew and i wouldnt so much as care. Your partners in KOTOR are about as likeable as the mercenaries you can hire in Guild Wars. And your character isnt all that deep either but thats far more forgiveable due to the open ended gameplay. But still, KOTOR games lack emotion.

Personally, Mario Shunshine and all the spin-offs ruined the franchise for me. *sigh* I'll never look at that plumber the same way. As a matter of fact, mario was my second "punching bag" in SSBM after jigglypuff xD

EDIT: GS is getting rid of my spaces XD

And the last thing that bugged me about KOTOR was the lack of emotion. I'm a big fan of Final Fantasy series and MGS series and the one thing these games have in common is that their characters are human. I dont mean it literally, I mean it metaphorically. Through out FFX you got to know Tidus and Yuna and the gang that the ending had a profound effect on you. You actually CARED what happened to the characters. -Serpahim-

I wanted them all to die in FFX. Which at least made me like the ending (which I really didn't like) for one reason.

[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Newnab"]KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

Newnab

"One of the best" ;)

Planescape Torment is in a different league than Mass Effect. Planescape Torment was one of the best RPGs ever made.

[QUOTE="Newnab"][QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Newnab"]KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

Baurus_1

"One of the best" ;)

Planescape Torment is in a different league than Mass Effect. Planescape Torment was one of the best RPGs ever made.

How do you know if Mass Effect hasn't even been released. Besides, why do you hate mass effectso much? Did it steal your dog when you were a young boy?

[QUOTE="Newnab"][QUOTE="-Serpahim-"][QUOTE="kcpp2b"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.-Serpahim-

So you must have hated KOTOR then

funny u should say that because i DESPISE KOTOR. Im not saying that ME is gonna be a bad game. I just think that if its anything like KOTOR i wouldnt touch it with a 20 ft. pole. Its not my type of game. Im not saying KOTOR isnt a good game, its getting good reviews all around and alot of people seem to luv it, so im guessing its really that good. But to me, I can not stand it at all. The combination of Star Wars (i hate Star Wars), boring "pause-play" mechanics, and the criminally boring cut scenes where people just stand around like morons and talk for hours really kill the game for me.

KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

I did listen to what they were saying, but it did it grudgingly (sp?) If KOTOR was a book, i would have thrown it out the window, not because the story is bad but because the presentation is horrible. Its like sumone who has a great idea for a novel, but has no talent in writing. The story in KOTOR was great but the cutscenes made it feel like a chore. The characters are so static throughout all the cutscenes. They dont even gesticulate for crying out loud. Figuring out the story of KOTOR was about as much fun as figuring out the background story of Oblivion through reading all the books in the game. I know I'm being picky but this is a completely biased opinion and sumthing like that really kills the game for me. I wish in addition to the "click-click-click-choice" dialgue they have in KOTOR, the also had some scripted cutscenes of the MGS type. i know they have FMVs but those are so far inbetween that you could easily forget the exist. And ingame > FMVs.

Also, another thing that bothers me about KOTOR is the whole Amesia angle. Amnesia is seriously the most pathetic plot device ever. Any dev that uses Amnesia in a game deserves a slap on the hand. Shame on them. There are other ways to explain things and create an intriguing character without going down the Amnesia route.

And the last thing that bugged me about KOTOR was the lack of emotion. I'm a big fan of Final Fantasy series and MGS series and the one thing these games have in common is that their characters are human. I dont mean it literally, I mean it metaphorically. Through out FFX you got to know Tidus and Yuna and the gang that the ending had a profound effect on you. You actually CARED what happened to the characters. As for MGS, play Snake Eater and play the final boss battle...enough said. On the other hand in KOTOR you are random jedi X doing random Jedi things with your arbitary companions. They could kill off everyone in my crew and i wouldnt so much as care. Your partners in KOTOR are about as likeable as the mercenaries you can hire in Guild Wars. And your character isnt all that deep either but thats far more forgiveable due to the open ended gameplay. But still, KOTOR games lack emotion.

Ok. Couldn't possibly disagree more. Like I said. I take it you didn't complete the game? Because almost everything the characters say is very carefully worded. Which ties into the story and plot twist for which this game has it's fame. And that's also the thing with the amnesia, it is fully explained, makes sense, is relevant, and necessary for the story. It's not just so you can create anyone. Infact it's quite the opposite, you're a very specific amnesiac... And it isn't typical amnesia, not by a long shot. What did you think of Bioshock? That had Amnesia of sorts, too. But when it makes sense and is explained and integral to the story there is nothing wrong with amnesia in stories. You don't go and watch Memento then say in the first five minutes "Amnesia? What a cop out!" and walk out, do you?

Like I say, you play the game, you take an interest in what the characters have to say (Which is far from reading all the books in the atrocious Oblivion) and you're justly rewarded with an awesome story and overall RPG.

I loved the characters, and they definitely had emotion to me. When I killed Jolee, when I learnt about Juhani's childhood, when I did the despicable and made Zaalbar kill his 14 year old best friend, those were far more emotional and cool scenes than depicted in Guild Wars, and actually, in most of the games you mention and like.

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"][QUOTE="Newnab"][QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Newnab"]KOTOR was one of the best games of last gen.

And one of the best WRPG's ever.

Really is a phenomenal game, it's a shame you can't look past the combat, and LISTEN to what the characters are saying (It's all relevant) because it's an awesome experience.

skelebull3000

"One of the best" ;)

Planescape Torment is in a different league than Mass Effect. Planescape Torment was one of the best RPGs ever made.

How do you know if Mass Effect hasn't even been released. Besides, why do you hate mass effectso much? Did it steal your dog when you were a young boy?

I don't hate Mass Effect, I just think it's overrated.

I don't hate Mass Effect, I just think it's overrated.Baurus_1

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]I don't hate Mass Effect, I just think it's overrated.Jandurin

WARNING: MY POST CONTAINS KOTOR(2) AND MGS3 SPOILERS

Ok. Couldn't possibly disagree more. Like I said. I take it you didn't complete the game? Because almost everything the characters say is very carefully worded. Which ties into the story and plot twist for which this game has it's fame. And that's also the thing with the amnesia, it is fully explained, makes sense, is relevant, and necessary for the story. It's not just so you can create anyone. Infact it's quite the opposite, you're a very specific amnesiac... And it isn't typical amnesia, not by a long shot. What did you think of Bioshock? That had Amnesia of sorts, too. But when it makes sense and is explained and integral to the story there is nothing wrong with amnesia in stories. You don't go and watch Memento then say in the first five minutes "Amnesia? What a cop out!" and walk out, do you?

Havent played Bioshock yet. I have the game but my PC cant handle it till i upgrade it :P And im in africa atm, so i cant get my hands on the X360 version. And I agree that its not your standard amnesia, but you cant deny that amnesia was used as a convienent way to explain why your character who happens to be a Jedi cant do anything. I have beat the game and found out the ending of how you are actually Darth Revan (or was it Malak?) to be wuite intriguing. I thought it was a good twist. But then came KOTOR 2. I found the story to feel like a modified KOTOR. I mean the whole thing with finding out that Kreia (or wat ever her name is) is Sith lord was so similar to you finding out u r a sith lord...completely uninspired.

Like I say, you play the game, you take an interest in what the characters have to say (Which is far from reading all the books in the atrocious Oblivion) and you're justly rewarded with an awesome story and overall RPG.

I agree that i may have overexaggerated when i compared it to Oblivion. Its in no manner that boring, but at the same time, you have to admit that the cut scenes are pretty stale even though the dialog may be intriguing. I mean a little gesticulation would have gone a long way towards conveying emotion.

I loved the characters, and they definitely had emotion to me. When I killed Jolee, when I learnt about Juhani's childhood, when I did the despicable and made Zaalbar kill his 14 year old best friend, those were far more emotional and cool scenes than depicted in Guild Wars, and actually, in most of the games you mention and like.

As I mentioned above, the lack of animations and actions with the characters really undermines any emotion they story may have had. Its alot easier to relate to sumone like Kratos who shouts, aruges, is disobediant, and moves like a brute. We can all relate to the boss as we see her actions towards naked snake. Her reluctance to kill him, and the sad expression on her face everytime she faces snake. I dont feel the same about KOTOR characters. I just feels like im listening to a taped conversation with sum multiple choice questions at the end. And I have to say that I have never heard a person who has played FFX and MGS3 and not commented on its emotional impact. Those games have more emotion than 99% of the games out there. And there is no way that KOTOR has more emotion than Final Fantasy X and Metal Gear Solid 3. In Final Fantasy X Tidus and Yuna fall in love with one another but they are seperated when Tidus true nature is revealed. I mean seeing Yuna cry in that last FMV was heart breaking :cry: As for MGS3, that final scene where you are fighting The Boss in plane filled with White Roses (or sum other white flower :P) was just beautiful. And the way Kojima makes you manually pull the trigger for the kill shot was just beautiful. And then the revalation that The Boss was not a traitor, but actually a hero adds even more to her character and helps us understand why Big Boss is so "evil." After MGS3, it becomes hard to see Big Boss as the arbitrary bad guy. I think those games are leagues beyond KOTOR when it comes to emotion and story.

Newnab with my comments

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Your opinion is your own, but this is an RPG *NEWSFLASH* RPGs are pause-play as a genre so you can't blame BIoware for that.

Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

you didn't even read the post did you? you can go run and gun OR pause-play. it looks just like graw.

[QUOTE="Newnab"]

[QUOTE="Baurus_1"]Whatever.......pause-play-pause-play looks boring. Graphics are great though.Baurus_1

Then don't pause for the strategic options.

Nobody forces you to.

You can just play it like a cross between Gears of War/Phantasy Star and just run around shooting, you know.

My guess is your character won't live very long if you just run around shooting, therefore they included the boring pause-play-pause-play-pause-play snoozefest.

wow dude you suck... they included it for the people who liked kotor...